Resolved: Thais Are The Cutest People On The Planet: Discuss

[Jingthing]

Any 'man' that uses the word 'cute' should be strung up.

You might want to nuke Japan (again) then ...

Edited April 18, 2012 by Jingthing

[aneliane]

It is... In the one thread you expained how you were subjected ro racism from Thai people. But if this is how you look upon ALL Thai women then gal... The comments you got, you only have yourself to blame.

I'm sorry you are getting confused here.

Taking an opinion about Cute Culture aestheticism in this country which refers to a fraction of the population and does not in any shape or form implies any kind of moral judgement of any sort on my behalf, and then inferring a so-called vision on ALL Thai women is argumentatively wrong if not dishonest.

[KeyserSoze01]

Had you said that Thailand has the cutest girls on the planet, I might have agreed with you. I find nothing cute about Thai males.

I guess you're right. No cuteness to see here!

Perhaps this thread should be moved to the gay forum.

[maxme]

It is... In the one thread you expained how you were subjected ro racism from Thai people. But if this is how you look upon ALL Thai women then gal... The comments you got, you only have yourself to blame.

I'm sorry you are getting confused here.

Taking an opinion about Cute Culture aestheticism in this country which refers to a fraction of the population and does not in any shape or form implies any kind of moral judgement of any sort on my behalf, and then inferring a so-called vision on ALL Thai women is argumentatively wrong if not dishonest.

Perhaps or that you put everyone into a homogeneous group when asked if Thai girls were cute. You didn't exactly specify which group of girls it was thus the easy drawn conclusion that it doesn't matter, they are all the same. Next time it would help if toy specified, because I can as easily draw from your country. Though that would be like sinking to your level.

[maxme]

Aneliane, perhaps it's because you put everyone into a homogeneous group when asked if Thai girls were cute. You didn't exactly specify which group of girls it was thus the easy drawn conclusion was that it didn't matter, they are all the same. Next time it would help if you specified, because I could as easily draw examples from your country and put them on display behind bars with a few bananas at their side and claim them to be the French standard model of a woman.Though that would be like sinking to your level I guess.

Edited April 18, 2012 by maxme

[Zatoichi]

If I had known this would degrade into sex chat about Thai ladies I would have never opened the thread! CUTE. PEOPLE. Nothing about sex. Nothing only about females. Get a grip.

Well I guess you wouldn't, your gay. And we do have a grip, on our sexuality. When you ask a straight guy here about what he thinks is "cute" the answers are gonna be about girls. Not a whole lot of brain to figure that one out. On that note, I also think Phillipena's can be pretty cute too, more so than out right sexy.

[ObsessiveAddict]

I would say thais, yes.

I heard from a pro who believes Madagascar women to be the cutest.

[arthurwait]

It is... In the one thread you expained how you were subjected ro racism from Thai people. But if this is how you look upon ALL Thai women then gal... The comments you got, you only have yourself to blame.

I'm sorry you are getting confused here.

Taking an opinion about Cute Culture aestheticism in this country which refers to a fraction of the population and does not in any shape or form implies any kind of moral judgement of any sort on my behalf, and then inferring a so-called vision on ALL Thai women is argumentatively wrong if not dishonest.

The 'cute' girls follow Korean and Japanese trends.

You look down at the girls for not being able to afford your western clothes just cheaper versions and for not being as good at fashion, whatever <deleted> you called it. Is it any wonder the poor people you meet don't like you ? Sorry it must be racism hey ?

Oh and trap means your mouth as if you didn't know.

[aneliane]

Aneliane, perhaps it's because you put everyone into a homogeneous group when asked if Thai girls were cute. You didn't exactly specify which group of girls it was thus the easy drawn conclusion was that it didn't matter, they are all the same. Next time it would help if you specified, because I could as easily draw examples from your country and put them on display behind bars with a few bananas at their side and claim them to be the French standard model of a woman.Though that would be like sinking to your level I guess.

WOW

I am not sure what bananas have to do with anything or what I did or said to upset you, to the point that you think I am down to some "level", or even how many "levels" they are, but I sense I must be at the lowest one in your book,for some unknown reason

I gave my opinion of what I thought Thai Cute Culture was.

End of the story

Oh yeah, - we eat bananas in France too ......was it your question ?

[maxme]

Aneliane, perhaps it's because you put everyone into a homogeneous group when asked if Thai girls were cute. You didn't exactly specify which group of girls it was thus the easy drawn conclusion was that it didn't matter, they are all the same. Next time it would help if you specified, because I could as easily draw examples from your country and put them on display behind bars with a few bananas at their side and claim them to be the French standard model of a woman.Though that would be like sinking to your level I guess.

WOW

I am not sure what bananas have to do with anything or what I did or said to upset you, to the point that you think I am down to some "level", or even how many "levels" they are, but I sense I must be at the lowest one in your book,for some unknown reason

I gave my opinion of what I thought Thai Cute Culture was.

End of the story

Oh yeah, - we eat bananas in France too ......was it your question ?

Nah more like what happens to women who don't shave their armpits for several years and then I'll think you know the answer.

[aneliane]

It is... In the one thread you expained how you were subjected ro racism from Thai people. But if this is how you look upon ALL Thai women then gal... The comments you got, you only have yourself to blame.

I'm sorry you are getting confused here.

Taking an opinion about Cute Culture aestheticism in this country which refers to a fraction of the population and does not in any shape or form implies any kind of moral judgement of any sort on my behalf, and then inferring a so-called vision on ALL Thai women is argumentatively wrong if not dishonest.

The 'cute' girls follow Korean and Japanese trends.

You look down at the girls for not being able to afford your western clothes just cheaper versions and for not being as good at fashion, whatever <deleted> you called it. Is it any wonder the poor people you meet don't like you ? Sorry it must be racism hey ?

Oh and trap means your mouth as if you didn't know.

Why the aggressiveness ?

Did I say I looked down upon anyone ?

I questioned the Cute Culture here.

You don't seem to have much fashion understanding

Getting the cheaper version of western FASHION (not clothes) is here not in a million years a lack money, it's a cultural choice.

Young Thai girls prefer buying cheap new clothes copied by Thai fashion students who just ripped off the latest catwalk models every week, and make them with the crappiest fabric than buying one good piece that will last them longer.

It's unecofriendly, therefore more like farangs, so they tell everyone how much clothes they buy and throw.

Their money is spent on getting the latest mobile every month, wear winter clothes in 40 deg temperature (That say "I work in an aircon office"), impossible high heels that say " I only travel by taxi" and these dolled up girls look down on people who don't run in the same category and can't afford these items like burmese maids

All these are for Thai people, their way to gain fashion Kudos

[Jingthing]

If I had known this would degrade into sex chat about Thai ladies I would have never opened the thread! CUTE. PEOPLE. Nothing about sex. Nothing only about females. Get a grip.

Well I guess you wouldn't, your gay. And we do have a grip, on our sexuality. When you ask a straight guy here about what he thinks is "cute" the answers are gonna be about girls. Not a whole lot of brain to figure that one out. On that note, I also think Phillipena's can be pretty cute too, more so than out right sexy.

Yeah, I get what you are saying, but you aren't getting that the topic was not intended to be about sexual attractiveness, per se. I realize cuteness and sexual attractiveness sometimes go together, but by no means all the time.

[aneliane]

End of the story

Oh yeah, - we eat bananas in France too ......was it your question ?

Nah more like what happens to women who don't shave their armpits for several years and then I'll think you know the answer.

Don't know, honestly thought they were german

[brit1984]

End of the story

Oh yeah, - we eat bananas in France too ......was it your question ?

Nah more like what happens to women who don't shave their armpits for several years and then I'll think you know the answer.

Don't know, honestly thought they were german

Aneliane... do you realise you are quite good at trolling?

[Ulysses G.]

Young Thai girls prefer buying cheap new clothes copied by Thai fashion students who just ripped off the latest catwalk models every week, and make them with the crappiest fabric than buying one good piece that will last them longer.

They are not doing too badly compared to many of the Westerners that I see visiting Thailand.

Edited April 18, 2012 by Ulysses G.

[Koratpat]

If I had known this would degrade into sex chat about Thai ladies I would have never opened the thread! CUTE. PEOPLE. Nothing about sex. Nothing only about females. Get a grip.

Well I guess you wouldn't, your gay. And we do have a grip, on our sexuality. When you ask a straight guy here about what he thinks is "cute" the answers are gonna be about girls. Not a whole lot of brain to figure that one out. On that note, I also think Phillipena's can be pretty cute too, more so than out right sexy.

[Koratpat]

It is... In the one thread you expained how you were subjected ro racism from Thai people. But if this is how you look upon ALL Thai women then gal... The comments you got, you only have yourself to blame.

I'm sorry you are getting confused here.

Taking an opinion about Cute Culture aestheticism in this country which refers to a fraction of the population and does not in any shape or form implies any kind of moral judgement of any sort on my behalf, and then inferring a so-called vision on ALL Thai women is argumentatively wrong if not dishonest.

The 'cute' girls follow Korean and Japanese trends.

You look down at the girls for not being able to afford your western clothes just cheaper versions and for not being as good at fashion, whatever <deleted> you called it. Is it any wonder the poor people you meet don't like you ? Sorry it must be racism hey ?

Oh and trap means your mouth as if you didn't know.

Why the aggressiveness ?

Did I say I looked down upon anyone ?

I questioned the Cute Culture here.

You don't seem to have much fashion understanding

Getting the cheaper version of western FASHION (not clothes) is here not in a million years a lack money, it's a cultural choice.

Young Thai girls prefer buying cheap new clothes copied by Thai fashion students who just ripped off the latest catwalk models every week, and make them with the crappiest fabric than buying one good piece that will last them longer.

It's unecofriendly, therefore more like farangs, so they tell everyone how much clothes they buy and throw.

Their money is spent on getting the latest mobile every month, wear winter clothes in 40 deg temperature (That say "I work in an aircon office"), impossible high heels that say " I only travel by taxi" and these dolled up girls look down on people who don't run in the same category and can't afford these items like burmese maids

All these are for Thai people, their way to gain fashion Kudos

We quite like the cuteness of Thai girls. The cutest thing about them is that they NEVER use words like unecofriendly.

[aneliane]

We quite like the cuteness of Thai girls. The cutest thing about them is that they NEVER use words like unecofriendly.

Yep I know, that's exactly why I am in this country !

Edited April 19, 2012 by aneliane

[kerryk]

We quite like the cuteness of Thai girls. The cutest thing about them is that they NEVER use words like unecofriendly.

Yep I know, that's exactly why I am in this country !

I am sure it is my fault but wouldn't the opposite be true? You don't like Thai women why would you be here?

[aneliane]

We quite like the cuteness of Thai girls. The cutest thing about them is that they NEVER use words like unecofriendly.

Yep I know, that's exactly why I am in this country !

I am sure it is my fault but wouldn't the opposite be true? You don't like Thai women why would you be here?

Who said I don't like Thai women ?

[kerryk]

We quite like the cuteness of Thai girls. The cutest thing about them is that they NEVER use words like unecofriendly.

Yep I know, that's exactly why I am in this country !

I am sure it is my fault but wouldn't the opposite be true? You don't like Thai women why would you be here?

Who said I don't like Thai women ?

You wrote and I quote,"Young Thai girls prefer buying cheap new clothes copied by Thai fashion students who just ripped off the latest catwalk models every week, and make them with the crappiest fabric than buying one good piece that will last them longer.

It's unecofriendly, therefore more like farangs, so they tell everyone how much clothes they buy and throw.

Their money is spent on getting the latest mobile every month, wear winter clothes in 40 deg temperature (That say "I work in an aircon office"), impossible high heels that say " I only travel by taxi" and these dolled up girls look down on people who don't run in the same category and can't afford these items like burmese maids

All these are for Thai people, their way to gain fashion Kudos"

That is dislike in anyones book. Kind of like a cat clawing a mouse as it dies.

[aneliane]

You wrote and I quote,"Young Thai girls prefer buying cheap new clothes copied by Thai fashion students who just ripped off the latest catwalk models every week, and make them with the crappiest fabric than buying one good piece that will last them longer.

It's unecofriendly, therefore more like farangs, so they tell everyone how much clothes they buy and throw.

Their money is spent on getting the latest mobile every month, wear winter clothes in 40 deg temperature (That say "I work in an aircon office"), impossible high heels that say " I only travel by taxi" and these dolled up girls look down on people who don't run in the same category and can't afford these items like burmese maids

All these are for Thai people, their way to gain fashion Kudos"

That is dislike in anyones book. Kind of like a cat clawing a mouse as it dies.

a/ it was about ONE aspect of a specific category of Thai women, it does not mean I don't like them,or worse that I don't like Thai women.

I don't like my friend calling me late at night, or wearing wearing horrid perfume. But he's still my friend and I like him.

b/ I adore Thai women for giving me such a free and hassle free life here, I am very thankful that they attract all the men who like their women "NEVER pronouncing words like 'unecofriendly'". It is very relaxing and liberating.

Edited April 19, 2012 by aneliane

[kerryk]

You wrote and I quote,"Young Thai girls prefer buying cheap new clothes copied by Thai fashion students who just ripped off the latest catwalk models every week, and make them with the crappiest fabric than buying one good piece that will last them longer.

It's unecofriendly, therefore more like farangs, so they tell everyone how much clothes they buy and throw.

Their money is spent on getting the latest mobile every month, wear winter clothes in 40 deg temperature (That say "I work in an aircon office"), impossible high heels that say " I only travel by taxi" and these dolled up girls look down on people who don't run in the same category and can't afford these items like burmese maids

All these are for Thai people, their way to gain fashion Kudos"

That is dislike in anyones book. Kind of like a cat clawing a mouse as it dies.

a/ it was about ONE aspect of a specific category of Thai women, it does not mean I don't like them,or worse that I don't like Thai women.

I don't like my friend calling me late at night, or wearing wearing horrid perfume. But he's still my friend and I like him.

b/ I adore Thai women for giving me such a free and hassle free life here, I am very thankful that they attract all the men who like their women "NEVER pronouncing words like 'unecofriendly'". It is very relaxing and liberating.

It doesn't take a weatherman to tell which way the wind is blowing. Quote, you again, “I am very thankful that they attract all the men who like their women” The venom drips from your fingers as you type.

[aneliane]

You wrote and I quote,"Young Thai girls prefer buying cheap new clothes copied by Thai fashion students who just ripped off the latest catwalk models every week, and make them with the crappiest fabric than buying one good piece that will last them longer.

It's unecofriendly, therefore more like farangs, so they tell everyone how much clothes they buy and throw.

Their money is spent on getting the latest mobile every month, wear winter clothes in 40 deg temperature (That say "I work in an aircon office"), impossible high heels that say " I only travel by taxi" and these dolled up girls look down on people who don't run in the same category and can't afford these items like burmese maids

All these are for Thai people, their way to gain fashion Kudos"

That is dislike in anyones book. Kind of like a cat clawing a mouse as it dies.

a/ it was about ONE aspect of a specific category of Thai women, it does not mean I don't like them,or worse that I don't like Thai women.

I don't like my friend calling me late at night, or wearing wearing horrid perfume. But he's still my friend and I like him.

b/ I adore Thai women for giving me such a free and hassle free life here, I am very thankful that they attract all the men who like their women "NEVER pronouncing words like 'unecofriendly'". It is very relaxing and liberating.

It doesn't take a weatherman to tell which way the wind is blowing. Quote, you again, “I am very thankful that they attract all the men who like their women” The venom drips from your fingers as you type.

You read "thankful", you translate "venom", I think there is no convincing you.... Someone here has issues ...

Do I need to ?

No!

nevermind what you think of me.....I know what I think,and that's most important

Edited April 19, 2012 by aneliane

[arthurwait]

Why the aggressiveness ?

Did I say I looked down upon anyone ?

I questioned the Cute Culture here.

You don't seem to have much fashion understanding

Getting the cheaper version of western FASHION (not clothes) is here not in a million years a lack money, it's a cultural choice.

Young Thai girls prefer buying cheap new clothes copied by Thai fashion students who just ripped off the latest catwalk models every week, and make them with the crappiest fabric than buying one good piece that will last them longer.

It's unecofriendly, therefore more like farangs, so they tell everyone how much clothes they buy and throw.

Their money is spent on getting the latest mobile every month, wear winter clothes in 40 deg temperature (That say "I work in an aircon office"), impossible high heels that say " I only travel by taxi" and these dolled up girls look down on people who don't run in the same category and can't afford these items like burmese maids

All these are for Thai people, their way to gain fashion Kudos

100% utter rubbish from start to finish.

Why am I feeding the troll ?

[xthAi76s]

aneliane

Does have a point. Fashion sense here is how you'd expect it in any 3rd world country that is heavily concerned about face. It's quite poorly done, tacky and usually concerns itself with how to inflate perceived status. Very tacky. Ever been to Shanghai? It's like that. Wearing some expensive brand labels from head to toe to inflate status. Thais seem to do this but with less money even than the moneyed Chinese, with poorer fabrics, and knock-offs that make them look quite silly to anyone who has lived in a REAL chic city -- Seoul, Tokyo, Paris, New York, LA.

It's just like the purchasing of all these average BMWs and MERCs. Just for face. No true style sense of their own. They could care less. They want to create an image (even it's a poor one).

In Thai, it is called "srang paap" which means "to create a picture". Like most other things in this laidback beach-like nation, the picture is more important than anything else. It's why Thais are rather good at design but poor in engineering. Good at copying latest fashion but poor at understanding that some of true style is the quality of fabrics and the fit etc.

Sorry, but aneliane is correct.

[thaibeachlovers]

aneliane

Does have a point. Fashion sense here is how you'd expect it in any 3rd world country that is heavily concerned about face. It's quite poorly done, tacky and usually concerns itself with how to inflate perceived status. Very tacky. Ever been to Shanghai? It's like that. Wearing some expensive brand labels from head to toe to inflate status. Thais seem to do this but with less money even than the moneyed Chinese, with poorer fabrics, and knock-offs that make them look quite silly to anyone who has lived in a REAL chic city -- Seoul, Tokyo, Paris, New York, LA.

It's just like the purchasing of all these average BMWs and MERCs. Just for face. No true style sense of their own. They could care less. They want to create an image (even it's a poor one).

In Thai, it is called "srang paap" which means "to create a picture". Like most other things in this laidback beach-like nation, the picture is more important than anything else. It's why Thais are rather good at design but poor in engineering. Good at copying latest fashion but poor at understanding that some of true style is the quality of fabrics and the fit etc.

Sorry, but aneliane is correct.

If you're concerned about Thai women's fashions, be grateful that it's now and not 15 years ago, when the clothing was really bad. In comparison, IMO, the stuff they wear now is pretty good.

[aneliane]

aneliane

Does have a point. Fashion sense here is how you'd expect it in any 3rd world country that is heavily concerned about face. It's quite poorly done, tacky and usually concerns itself with how to inflate perceived status. Very tacky. Ever been to Shanghai? It's like that. Wearing some expensive brand labels from head to toe to inflate status. Thais seem to do this but with less money even than the moneyed Chinese, with poorer fabrics, and knock-offs that make them look quite silly to anyone who has lived in a REAL chic city -- Seoul, Tokyo, Paris, New York, LA.

It's just like the purchasing of all these average BMWs and MERCs. Just for face. No true style sense of their own. They could care less. They want to create an image (even it's a poor one).

In Thai, it is called "srang paap" which means "to create a picture". Like most other things in this laidback beach-like nation, the picture is more important than anything else. It's why Thais are rather good at design but poor in engineering. Good at copying latest fashion but poor at understanding that some of true style is the quality of fabrics and the fit etc.

Sorry, but aneliane is correct.

If you're concerned about Thai women's fashions, be grateful that it's now and not 15 years ago, when the clothing was really bad. In comparison, IMO, the stuff they wear now is pretty good.

I think the opposite, when I came here first in 2000, women had real Thai style elegance, some women were still wearing traditional Thai clothes, not the one you see now like the Karen women in Kao san Rd who wear horrid-green plastic slippers, cheap western style shorts and quickly slap on their karen hat to sell you a hammock.

Some stalls in Chatuchat were selling some traditional outfit with great fabrics with a modern design, but now they all been replaced by fake aromatherapy shops

I was amazed by the simplicity and the sheer quality of the clothes. And most important they looked distinctively Thai.

Nowadays, it's difficult to difference a young Thai from let's say a Taiwanese, or Korean.

They all wear the same cheap nylon copies and are all dolled up and trying to look like Japanese girls in cheaper version

Edited April 19, 2012 by aneliane

[xthAi76s]

aneliane

Does have a point. Fashion sense here is how you'd expect it in any 3rd world country that is heavily concerned about face. It's quite poorly done, tacky and usually concerns itself with how to inflate perceived status. Very tacky. Ever been to Shanghai? It's like that. Wearing some expensive brand labels from head to toe to inflate status. Thais seem to do this but with less money even than the moneyed Chinese, with poorer fabrics, and knock-offs that make them look quite silly to anyone who has lived in a REAL chic city -- Seoul, Tokyo, Paris, New York, LA.

It's just like the purchasing of all these average BMWs and MERCs. Just for face. No true style sense of their own. They could care less. They want to create an image (even it's a poor one).

In Thai, it is called "srang paap" which means "to create a picture". Like most other things in this laidback beach-like nation, the picture is more important than anything else. It's why Thais are rather good at design but poor in engineering. Good at copying latest fashion but poor at understanding that some of true style is the quality of fabrics and the fit etc.

Sorry, but aneliane is correct.

If you're concerned about Thai women's fashions, be grateful that it's now and not 15 years ago, when the clothing was really bad. In comparison, IMO, the stuff they wear now is pretty good.

I think the opposite, when I came here first in 2000, women had real Thai style elegance, some women were still wearing traditional Thai clothes, not the one you see now like the Karen women in Kao san Rd who wear horrid-green plastic slippers, cheap western style shorts and quickly slap on their karen hat to sell you a hammock.

Some stalls in Chatuchat were selling some traditional outfit with great fabrics with a modern design, but now they all been replaced by fake aromatherapy shops

I was amazed by the simplicity and the sheer quality of the clothes. And most important they looked distinctively Thai.

Nowadays, it's difficult to difference a young Thai from let's say a Taiwanese, or Korean.

They all wear the same cheap nylon copies and are all dolled up and trying to look like Japanese girls in cheaper version

Exactly. Traditional Thai clothing is not only beautiful, it was often made with rather luxurious fabrics (like silk and linen) and it was rather appropriate for the climate. It's like the beautiful traditional Thai homes and living quarters. They were gorgeous, smartly built for this hot @ss climate and done in wonderful hardwoods that, to this day, are highly regarded around the world. They are increasingly being replaced with cheaper, Western-style homes or very poorly constructed/designed condos (aka: ovens). They are losing their way in this regard by poorly copying the West and rich East Asia (Korea, Japan, China).

Edited April 19, 2012 by xthAi76s

[arthurwait]

aneliane

Does have a point. Fashion sense here is how you'd expect it in any 3rd world country that is heavily concerned about face. It's quite poorly done, tacky and usually concerns itself with how to inflate perceived status. Very tacky. Ever been to Shanghai? It's like that. Wearing some expensive brand labels from head to toe to inflate status. Thais seem to do this but with less money even than the moneyed Chinese, with poorer fabrics, and knock-offs that make them look quite silly to anyone who has lived in a REAL chic city -- Seoul, Tokyo, Paris, New York, LA.

It's just like the purchasing of all these average BMWs and MERCs. Just for face. No true style sense of their own. They could care less. They want to create an image (even it's a poor one).

In Thai, it is called "srang paap" which means "to create a picture". Like most other things in this laidback beach-like nation, the picture is more important than anything else. It's why Thais are rather good at design but poor in engineering. Good at copying latest fashion but poor at understanding that some of true style is the quality of fabrics and the fit etc.

Sorry, but aneliane is correct.

Both my wife and brother in law have shops in Platinum and have a clothes factory the quality of fabric is chosen on cost due to most people not being able to afford the retail price on more expensive fabrics. It's about the money people have it's not cultural as Aneliene states.

Do you and Aneliene really believe that these girls that are into fashion would be shopping in Platinum and markets (which is what the majority of girls have to as most earn 20K/month or under) if they could afford to buy designer clothes at Paragon prices instead like the wealthy/rich girls do ?

As said before the 'cute' girls and many others follow Japanese and Korean treands not western. They have different tastes and styles , why are they wrong just because they aren't the same as western tastes ?

Is being so concerned about fashion and thinking yours is better than others not about face too ?

For someone who started a thread about living on little money and not wanting to be like the farangs spending money on western things it does seem strange that now she seems to be concerned about the quality of peoples clothes.

There are plenty of Thais who understand fit, cutting clothes , style etc, but there is a lot more that don't just the same as every country when there is range of people wearing and making them. When the expensive clothes are often made for western figures and then imported here they won't fit thin Asian girls well.

The fit of clothes will get better just like everything does with better education and training. It's easy to sit in judgement of others when you've had a western education.