Nisa Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 (edited) Todays chaos inside Parliament: [media=] [/media] What must those young policemen thing of those that 'lead' the country. Seems the police were there as a matter of routine, what a way to run a parliament. That looked like a vote, does anyone know what it was? I didn't notice the first time watching but you can see them in the wings starting to assemble (a number already hiding behind the wall) right from the time the video started. It does seem kind of interesting they assembled so quickly unless it was clear prior to the video things would likely or at least might get out of control. Looks to be about 2 dozen of them on hand. Certainly makes sense to have a lot of security in and around the building with protesters but just odd they were able to foresee a situation like this. Excuse my ignorance being from the US but are these all member of the parliament (not the public) and their staff in this chamber. If so, it does strike me as odd the number of police and their being able to foresee this happening. I've seen similar stuff in other parliament nations and know they get pretty testy, even in England but don't personally recall this kind of thing happening before in Thailand in recent memory where the police would be ready so quickly to act on rioting members of parliament. Edited May 31, 2012 by Nisa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GentlemanJim Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 Todays chaos inside Parliament: [media=] [/media] What must those young policemen thing of those that 'lead' the country. Seems the police were there as a matter of routine, what a way to run a parliament. That looked like a vote, does anyone know what it was? I didn't notice the first time watching but you can see them in the wings starting to assemble (a number already hiding behind the wall) right from the time the video started. It does seem kind of interesting they assembled so quickly unless it was clear prior to the video things would likely or at least might get out of control. Looks to be about 2 dozen of them on hand. Certainly makes sense to have a lot of security in and around the building with protesters but just odd they were able to foresee a situation like this. Excuse my ignorance being from the US but are these all member of the parliament (not the public) and their staff in this chamber. If so, it does strike me as odd the number of police and their being able to foresee this happening. I've seen similar stuff in other parliament nations and know they get pretty testy, even in England but don't personally recall this kind of thing happening before in Thailand in recent memory where the police would be ready so quickly to act on rioting members of parliament. Well I have never heard of police intervening in the UK Parliament, has it ever happened in Congress? Regardless of how much shouting and ranting was going on yesterday it was not violent and in the House of Parliament, basically as long as it is not violent anything goes verbally and the House is in the end always self policing MP's in the wrong. To see the Police move in so quickly is quite shocking, and then they move completely along the front of the second set of steps. The Police were intimidating the Politicians from saying their piece, and it is their constitutional and democratic right to do so. So now we have the security forces assisting the Speaker and PTP to keep order in the house when the opposition have every right to get very angry. Miracle Thailand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buchholz Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 looks as if reasonableness won out.... for today, anyway... House meeting adjourned The House meeting was adjourned at 1 pm Thursday pending a discussion among the House Speaker and chairs of 35 House standing panels as to whether the four reconciliation bills need to be first endorsed by the prime minister. Deputy House Speaker Charoen Chankomol said the meeting would be adjourned pending a decision from the discussion. House Speaker Somsak Kiartsuranon held the discussion after Democrat MPs said the bills were related to financial affairs and needed to be first endorsed by the prime minister. The "related to financial affairs" aspect comes about because if the reconciliation bill is approved, 46 Billion Baht would need to be withdrawn from the National Treasury and given to Thaksin. Before a bill that involves state expenditures can be debated, it needs to be endorsed by the PM and Yingluck has not endorsed this bill. . Translated from Khun Korn's Facebook: As I mentioned earlier, the "Amnesty Bill" deals with large amounts of money and therefore in fact also falls under the category of being a "financial law." Financial laws must by proposed to parliament by the PM, the PM alone. The PM must be the one to ask parliament to use good tax-payers' money to hand 46 billion baht to Khun Thaksin, money that was previously confiscated by the courts. The PM is refusing to come to parliament because she too has interest in this bill - 900 million baht's worth. The House Speaker yesterday refused to listen nor reason with the opposition, that is why there was so much commotion in parliament yesterday. Such disorderly conduct should never happen in parliament, but we passionately believe that the Amnesty Bill presents a clear threat to Thailand's democracy and we are ready to oppose a house speaker that is self-serving and stubborn. Let's start by stop calling this Bill a Reconciliation Bill, this Bill is divisive and self-serving to Khun Thaksin's financial interests. The Bill will white-wash too many corruption cases and it will only set a dangerous precedent. Thank you for that. Korn clarifies even further what was in the other paper's article. I had forgotten about the Yingluck factor in the 46 Billion Baht; with nearly One Billion Baht of that money belonging to her. . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buchholz Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 Yingluck pleads for peaceful debate Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra Thursday insisted she viewed reconciliation as a legislative issue, distancing herself from the fracas between Democrat and Pheu Thai MPs. "I just want to ask for the cooperation of all MPs to abide by the rules, because the House is a venerated institution," she said in reference to the unruly incidents on Wednesday and yesterday inside the House chamber. Yingluck said all sides should debate the bill in accordance with legislative procedure instead of assuming the outcome before vetting the draft provisions. -- The Nation 2012-05-31 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buchholz Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 (edited) looks as if reasonableness won out.... for today, anyway... House meeting adjourned The House meeting was adjourned at 1 pm Thursday pending a discussion among the House Speaker and chairs of 35 House standing panels as to whether the four reconciliation bills need to be first endorsed by the prime minister. Deputy House Speaker Charoen Chankomol said the meeting would be adjourned pending a decision from the discussion. House Speaker Somsak Kiartsuranon held the discussion after Democrat MPs said the bills were related to financial affairs and needed to be first endorsed by the prime minister. The "related to financial affairs" aspect comes about because if the reconciliation bill is approved, 46 Billion Baht would need to be withdrawn from the National Treasury and given to Thaksin. Before a bill that involves state expenditures can be debated, it needs to be endorsed by the PM and Yingluck has not endorsed this bill. . Translated from Khun Korn's Facebook: As I mentioned earlier, the "Amnesty Bill" deals with large amounts of money and therefore in fact also falls under the category of being a "financial law." Financial laws must by proposed to parliament by the PM, the PM alone. The PM must be the one to ask parliament to use good tax-payers' money to hand 46 billion baht to Khun Thaksin, money that was previously confiscated by the courts. The PM is refusing to come to parliament because she too has interest in this bill - 900 million baht's worth. The House Speaker yesterday refused to listen nor reason with the opposition, that is why there was so much commotion in parliament yesterday. Such disorderly conduct should never happen in parliament, but we passionately believe that the Amnesty Bill presents a clear threat to Thailand's democracy and we are ready to oppose a house speaker that is self-serving and stubborn. Let's start by stop calling this Bill a Reconciliation Bill, this Bill is divisive and self-serving to Khun Thaksin's financial interests. The Bill will white-wash too many corruption cases and it will only set a dangerous precedent. Thank you for that. Korn clarifies even further what was in the other paper's article. I had forgotten about the Yingluck factor in the 46 Billion Baht; with nearly One Billion Baht of that money belonging to her. somehow, the 46 Billion Baht is not financially-related... House panels' chairs decide reconciliation bills not financially-related draft law The meeting of the House speaker and standing House panel's chairs voted 22:1 to allow the House to deliberate the four reconciliation bills without endorsement from the prime minister. After five hours of discussion, the meeting voted that the bills were not financially-related draft law. Before the voting, Democrat MPs, who chair certain panels, staged a walkout, leaving only Shane Thuaugsuban in the meeting. Shane voted that the bills required endorsement from the prime minister before they could be deliberated. -- The Nation 2012-05-31 Edited May 31, 2012 by Buchholz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nisa Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 (edited) Government Brawls from around the world .. and no police in sight. [media=]http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=U3DHKni1mu8[/media] (some are not in Parliament but most are in legislative meetings but beats posting a ton of separate videos) Without knowing more, it would seem this Thai incident was staged / had planning. Haven't noticed if it has made international headlines, as these usually do, but this may have been the intention. Despite countries like the US who support this government, I doubt they will not apply pressure when it comes to returning Thaksin which will certainly cause problems .. possibly much worse than anything in recent history. Edited May 31, 2012 by Nisa 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buchholz Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 Thai house in uproar as rivalries resurface THAILAND faces new political turbulence as the government speeds up plans for a reconciliation bill widely seen as a way of allowing divisive former prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra to return home from exile. Bitter divisions have resurfaced as thousands of yellow shirt opponents of the legislation return to the streets and former top MPs loyal to Thaksin prepare to re-enter the political arena after a five-year ban. Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra yesterday spoke in favour of her ruling party's efforts to pass the law that may exonerate her brother, saying a solution to the country's political divide will lead to stability. Efforts to reconcile will improve the ''stability of the country'', she said. In the most chaotic scenes in parliament in memory, opposition Democrat Party MP Thana Chirawinit approached house speaker Somsak Kiatsuranont when he called for a vote to move the four-part reconciliation legislation to the top of parliament's agenda. ''Is there a Dubai stamp on the hammer [you are holding] … are you serving someone?'' Mr Thana screamed. Read more: http://www.smh.com.a...l#ixzz1wSIvJKNx Sydney Morning Herald - June 1, 2012 . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kimamey Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 I think that for the Thaksin lovers something needs to be made quite clear. Whilst they defend and apologise for criminals and would support an amnesty for their dearly beloved and his thugs, Jatuporn, Arisman etc etc, they seem to think that those of us who dislike Thaksin would protect Democrat criminals in the same way. Nothing could be further from the truth. As far as I am concerned ANY MP who has broken the law (and many have done so seriously), should be tried by a court of law and if found guilty punished to the full extent of the law and lose their position of privilege. I don't care what party they are from. When MP's make themselves above the law of the land then we are definitely sliding down the slippery slope. Yingluck said today she had a mandate from the people. The people who voted for her did not give her that mandate to make her priority putting MP's above the law. The amnesty seems to have been given more priority than the constitution, and to a nation the constitution should be more important, and neither amnesty or constitution should be even be considered before the Government have tended to the more immediate problems affecting the country and its people. Quite true. No double standards as someone once said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kimamey Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 Seen it this morning on the thai tv...was quite entertaining, at least for him! Sure. He's neither Pheu Thai nor Democrat. Seems they've sorted out the camera phones in Parliament issue, though. There was no porno shown on the big screen the whole time. . Yes what happened about the porno? I thought they had all the evidence and were going to name the person responsible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gand Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 The "related to financial affairs" aspect comes about because if the reconciliation bill is approved, 46 Billion Baht would need to be withdrawn from the National Treasury and given to Thaksin. Before a bill that involves state expenditures can be debated, it needs to be endorsed by the PM and Yingluck has not endorsed this bill. . Translated from Khun Korn's Facebook: As I mentioned earlier, the "Amnesty Bill" deals with large amounts of money and therefore in fact also falls under the category of being a "financial law." Financial laws must by proposed to parliament by the PM, the PM alone. The PM must be the one to ask parliament to use good tax-payers' money to hand 46 billion baht to Khun Thaksin, money that was previously confiscated by the courts. The PM is refusing to come to parliament because she too has interest in this bill - 900 million baht's worth. The House Speaker yesterday refused to listen nor reason with the opposition, that is why there was so much commotion in parliament yesterday. Such disorderly conduct should never happen in parliament, but we passionately believe that the Amnesty Bill presents a clear threat to Thailand's democracy and we are ready to oppose a house speaker that is self-serving and stubborn. Let's start by stop calling this Bill a Reconciliation Bill, this Bill is divisive and self-serving to Khun Thaksin's financial interests. The Bill will white-wash too many corruption cases and it will only set a dangerous precedent. Thank you for that. Korn clarifies even further what was in the other paper's article. I had forgotten about the Yingluck factor in the 46 Billion Baht; with nearly One Billion Baht of that money belonging to her. somehow, the 46 Billion Baht is not financially-related... House panels' chairs decide reconciliation bills not financially-related draft law The meeting of the House speaker and standing House panel's chairs voted 22:1 to allow the House to deliberate the four reconciliation bills without endorsement from the prime minister. After five hours of discussion, the meeting voted that the bills were not financially-related draft law. Before the voting, Democrat MPs, who chair certain panels, staged a walkout, leaving only Shane Thuaugsuban in the meeting. Shane voted that the bills required endorsement from the prime minister before they could be deliberated. -- The Nation 2012-05-31 The fix is in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GentlemanJim Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 I think there is going to be a HUGE fight soon, and it won't be in the House, it will be in the streets, amongst the people. This bill is the very antithesis of 'Reconciliation' and things are going to get very very bad. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
volk666 Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 Very very bad for whom? As far as proponents of this bill are concerned, they are not losing anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thaddeus Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 Very very bad for whom? As far as proponents of this bill are concerned, they are not losing anything. Yes they are. Sorry, my bad, they didn't have any credibility in the first place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rubl Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 Yingluck said all sides should debate the bill in accordance with legislative procedure instead of assuming the outcome before vetting the draft provisions. With a majority in parliament this government has shown that it's good to assume the outcome and try to fight it. Waiting till it's decided is something I've only heard from some members here who truly believe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pakorn7 Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 Seen it this morning on the thai tv...was quite entertaining, at least for him! Sure. He's neither Pheu Thai nor Democrat. Seems they've sorted out the camera phones in Parliament issue, though. There was no porno shown on the big screen the whole time. . Yes what happened about the porno? I thought they had all the evidence and were going to name the person responsible. And the Yingluck sex scandal at the VIP room of the Four Seasons Duck Restaurant with a married man? Where's the clip that Blue Sky Channel promised? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thaddeus Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 Seen it this morning on the thai tv...was quite entertaining, at least for him! Sure. He's neither Pheu Thai nor Democrat. Seems they've sorted out the camera phones in Parliament issue, though. There was no porno shown on the big screen the whole time. . Yes what happened about the porno? I thought they had all the evidence and were going to name the person responsible. And the Yingluck sex scandal at the VIP room of the Four Seasons Duck Restaurant with a married man? Where's the clip that Blue Sky Channel promised? May as well do it, others do. Link please. The only references I can find about her esteemed omnipotence and ducks, are ones that mention she once ran over some, or her tactic for avoiding questions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rubl Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 Well, very democratically it has been voted upon and decided that these 'reconciliation bills' are not financially related bills. Probably therefore not needing the PM's endorsement. Thailand Live Thursday 31st of May #50 "Posted Yesterday, 17:04 House panels' chairs decide reconciliation bills not financially-related draft law The Nation BANGKOK: - The meeting of the House speaker and standing House panel's chairs voted 22:1 to allow the House to deliberate the four reconciliation bills without endorsement from the prime minister. After five hours of discussion, the meeting voted that the bills were not financially-related draft law. Before the voting, Democrat MPs, who chair certain panels, staged a walkout, leaving only Shane Thuaugsuban in the meeting. Shane voted that the bills required endorsement from the prime minister before they could be deliberated." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daboyz1 Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 Are they sure that's a clip from Parliament? Similar footage was on Wrestlemania's Battle Royal. Except Wrestlemania is better scripted and less confusing. One thing is clear. We are back to 2008 as if nothing has been learned from last time. And more of the same act as the Samak-Somchai Thaksin-Puppet governments. So logically the other side will make similar moves, until violence breaks out. The only questions remain: 1 ) What has Thaksin learned from last time, about how to deal with in your face opposition that, yet again, will not tolerate his maneuvers? 2 ) How far can the army be pushed this time, and why, if it is farther this time? 3 ) Will the police try to control PAD as they did last time, minus a wild card SaeDang to act behind the scenes? 4 ) how far and how fast will this escalate? It's all so sad. #2 is a very good question? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buchholz Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 Seen it this morning on the thai tv...was quite entertaining, at least for him! Sure. He's neither Pheu Thai nor Democrat. Seems they've sorted out the camera phones in Parliament issue, though. There was no porno shown on the big screen the whole time. . Yes what happened about the porno? I thought they had all the evidence and were going to name the person responsible. And the Yingluck sex scandal at the VIP room of the Four Seasons Duck Restaurant with a married man? Where's the clip that Blue Sky Channel promised? It was stolen and is being doctored by Voice TV before it airs. . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
webfact Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 related topic: Thai parliament chaos over reconciliation debate Full story: http://www.thaivisa....liation-debate/ //CLOSED// Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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