Retirement Visa Questions

[Oldfart]

Ok, my 800,000 Baht's in the Bank, I'm over 50, I've been here (on and off) for the last year on a Multiple Entry Non Imm "O" Visa. Looks like I'm ready to apply for a Retirement Visa. TM7 form completed, passport, photo, fee, Bank certification letter will be available when I want it. I'm British and use a UK passport, but haven't lived there for almost 15 years.

Question 1. Do I still have to obtain a letter from the British Embassy saying I want to retire in Thailand?

Question 2. Can I take the cash out of the bank after I get the Retirement Visa, putting it back in later, in time to satisfy the same requirement next year?

Question 3. Is the cash in the bank considered proof of financial status?

Question 4. If I bring in sums well in excess of the 800,000 can these easily be transferred back out of Thailand at a later date if required?

Question 5. My current Visa expires in February, but I will get a further 89 days stay by going on a border run before then. But, must I apply for a Retirement Visa before my current "O" Visa expires?

Question 6. When my current Visa has expired and I have my "permission to stay a further 89 days" stamped in my passport.. is this when I will need a Re-entry Permit if I subsequently wish to exit and re-enter?

I hope one of you experienced guys can help me with this, I’d really appreciate it.

[caughtintheact]

Question 1. Do I still have to obtain a letter from the British Embassy saying I want to retire in Thailand?

Yes

Question 2. Can I take the cash out of the bank after I get the Retirement Visa, putting it back in later, in time to satisfy the same requirement next year?

Yes

Question 3. Is the cash in the bank considered proof of financial status?

Yes (provided that there is proof that it came from abroad. You need either cash in the bank or proof of a retirement pension the equivalent of B65,000 per month or a combination of both (always subject to change))

Question 4. If I bring in sums well in excess of the 800,000 can these easily be transferred back out of Thailand at a later date if required?

Yes, but keep the records showing that you transferred the money in or you will get taxed on income earned here)

Question 5. My current Visa expires in February, but I will get a further 89 days stay by going on a border run before then. But, must I apply for a Retirement Visa before my current "O" Visa expires?

You will be better off applying for a retirement visa as soon as possible so you don't need to make any more visa runs. You don't lose the 89 days, you gain 365 days.

Question 6. When my current Visa has expired and I have my "permission to stay a further 89 days" stamped in my passport.. is this when I will need a Re-entry Permit if I subsequently wish to exit and re-enter?

Same as my reply to question 5

[dr_Pat_Pong]

If you are a regular traveller, get a multiple entry re-entry permit from Immigration at the same time.

[naka]

Hi.

'Caughtintheact' agrees that a letter from an Embassy is required as part of the process of obtaining a retirement visa locally. I have not heard of this requirement and a few mates I've just spoken to who obtained OA's recently have not been asked for this. Only requirements were 800,000+ with bank letter, medical cert. and the usual immigration forms/photocopies. Any other opinions ?

[Oldfart]

Thanks guys.

Yes Naka, the reason I asked about the Embassy letter was because the information on this site about Retirement Visas is a little unclear as to the purpose of the letter.

ie: is it only required if the full 800,000 is not deposited and evidence of monthly income is therefore required to be certified by one's Embassy? (This was my "take" on the requirement).

or because the Thai Gov require this application to be accompanied by a letter from the Embassy saying that one wishes to retire in Thailand. (This is what is stated on this site in the section about Retirement Visa)

If the latter, then a letter from one's Embassy would appear superfluous as the completion of the Visa Application Form itself would presumably inidicate one's wish to retire in Thailand?

I want to get this right, first time, when I apply. Could someone please tell me what this letter should say, if it is required.

Medical Certificate is required too? Thanks, didn't know that.

Nakam, where did your mates apply? Bangkok?

[masterchief]

GOOD EVENING OVER THERE FROM PARKER, AZ. HELP,, I HAVE TRIED TO THINK OF EVERYTHING TO BE DONE AND NOW I NEED HELP. I AM COMING OVER TO RETIRE AND HAVE A MULTI 0A VISA WHAT IS MY NEXT STEP IF ANY PRIOR TO ARRIVAL THE 18TH OF FEB

[caughtintheact]

Naka,

Per my experience, in the pas the letter (or affadxavit0 from the Embassy was required every year. This changed in the past couple of years to where once immigration had such a letter on file, it was no longer necessary to get one except the first time.

This may also depend on the country that the applicant is from.

For Oldfart - the affadavit issued by the Embassy simply states that the applicant wishes to retire in Thailand and has presented proof of income (in the case of a pension). The Embassy has a sample form and the applicant fills it in and then takes an oath that the info is correct in front of a consul. I do not know what the Brit Embassy uses.

My best recommendation is to contact the Embassy directly. They have been issuing letters and affadavits for years and for them it is a routine matter. Hopefully you will get the straight scoop and will not have to depend on opinions.

[masterchief]

THANK YOU I HAVE HAD A COUPLE OF GREAT ANSWERS TO MY QUESTIONS AND HAVE A MUCH BETTER UNDERSTANDING OF WHAT TO EXPECT WITH THE "OA" MULTIPLE JOURNEY VISA. THANK YOU JIM

[dr_Pat_Pong]

Thanks guys.

Yes Naka, the reason I asked about the Embassy letter was because the information on this site about Retirement Visas is a little unclear as to the purpose of the letter.

ie: is it only required if the full 800,000 is not deposited and evidence of monthly income is therefore required to be certified by one's Embassy? (This was my "take" on the requirement).

or because the Thai Gov require this application to be accompanied by a letter from the Embassy saying that one wishes to retire in Thailand. (This is what is stated on this site in the section about Retirement Visa)

If the latter, then a letter from one's Embassy would appear superfluous as the completion of the Visa Application Form itself would presumably inidicate one's wish to retire in Thailand?

I want to get this right, first time, when I apply. Could someone please tell me what this letter should say, if it is required.

Medical Certificate is required too? Thanks, didn't know that.

Nakam, where did your mates apply? Bangkok?

They rarely, if ever, ask for that letter from the Embassy. It obviously is superfluous.

[Roger13]

First some Facts about the Embassy Letter.

The American Embassy call it an Affidavit.

The British Embassy Issue a simple letter.

In May 2003 it cost Bht 1,400

It says:

"This is to certify that Mr ....holder of British

Passport No. ... issued in ... on ...is Recognised

as a British Citizen.

Mr ..... has indicated that he Resides at

[FULL ADDRESS] and there is no information in our

Consular records to the detriment of the applicant.

Mr ... has provided evidence showing that he receives

an Annual Pension of £ ...

The Embassy would be grateful for any assistance

you can provide to Mr ... in his application for an

extension to stay in the Kingdom."

So apart from confirming Pension Income, the letter

does confirm that the Embassy is aware of your being

in the Kingdom and that you have no detrimental Record

with them - also it gives your address that the Embassy

has in their files.

Whether this letter is required if you are just relying

on Bank Deposits and not income - I cannot say.

Normally if you apply to the British Embassy in person

you will be asked to pay the fee and collect the letter

the following day. You can send someone with the

receipt to collect it.

I usually Fax my request to theEmbassy in Advance

- including evidence of my Pension saying I

will produce the Original and pay the Fee,

when I come to collect the Letter in person

- I usually phone first to ensure it is ready for collection.

I hope these facts help someone in their decision making.

Thoughts - as I said previously - the first few

extensions - I was given an initial one month -

and a subsequent 11 months (8 months the first time

- to make one year after First arrival)

What checks are made - address maybe? - local police

station? neighbours? - during this time - I have no idea

- if people with contacts can find out, I would be interested.

I had a different address each time including the last time

when I was give a 12 month extension straight away.

Whether a letter from the Embassy - which

I produced every year might have some bearing for some

applicants on the checking (if any) - or the initial one or two

month extensions is open to conjecture.

For those applying for the first time I would repeat

what I have said before. I do beleive that how you are

treated by Immigration does depend a lot on you.

Your Appearance, your demeanour/attitude/behaviour.

Well dressed, polite, quiet spoken is much appreciated in my opinion.

Hope these thoughts/opinions help also.

Roger

[Ned]

Oldfart

I sorted out a Retirement Visa the other day in Chiang Mai and because I had more than 800,000 in a Thai bank account I didn't need a letter from my embassy certifying that I receive a pension. THe medical certificate had to be from a hospital and not a clinic.

[dr_Pat_Pong]

The medical certificate has always been on the list, but is presently a feature of current requirements.

[Oldfart]

Ned. Thanks for that. What Nationality are you? Was this your first Retirement Visa Application?

Roger13, DrPP,Caughtintheact,Naga, many thanks.

I'll give it a go without the letter sometime in the next few days and let you know how I get on.

[Roger13]

Can I "Borrow" OldFarts thread to pose a question

re my own situation.

Since I started I have always given evidence of

Bank Deposit AND Pension Income.

At my next Extension application I would LIKE

to rely on just Income.

Now personally I think I will probably find it not

straight forward to CHANGE the basis of my application

But has anybody been able to secure an approval on INCOME ALONE?

Roger

[dr_Pat_Pong]

Can I "Borrow" OldFarts thread to pose a question

re my own situation.

Since I started I have always given evidence of

Bank Deposit AND Pension Income.

At my next Extension application I would LIKE

to rely on just Income.

Now personally I think I will probably find it not

straight forward to CHANGE the basis of my application

But has anybody been able to secure an approval on INCOME ALONE?

Roger

There will be some expectation that you have something to fall back on in the case of emergencies.

[naka]

Oldfart.

Several mates have received retirement visa's in both Phuket and Pattaya.

In all cases they had 800,000+ in a local bank. None were asked for a letter so perhaps the letter is only for people who are applying on the basis of a pension.

Let's know how you get on.

[dr_Pat_Pong]

Oldfart.

Several mates have received retirement visa's in both Phuket and Pattaya.

In all cases they had 800,000+ in a local bank. None were asked for a letter so perhaps the letter is only for people who are applying on the basis of a pension.

Let's know how you get on.

Don't let this confuse you..the letter from the bank is an absolute must.

[Roger13]

Can I "Borrow" OldFarts thread to pose a question

re my own situation.

Since I started I have always given evidence of

Bank Deposit AND Pension Income.

At my next Extension application I would LIKE

to rely on just Income.

Now personally I think I will probably find it not

straight forward to CHANGE the basis of my application

But has anybody been able to secure an approval on INCOME ALONE?

Roger

There will be some expectation that you have something to fall back on in the case of emergencies.

Dr P.P.

So are you now of the Opinion that the Option

Capital OR Income is not the case?

It would seem that the Income is irrelevant?

It is the Bank Deposit that clinches the deal ONLY ?

Roger

[caughtintheact]

From my experiences (and those of all my retired friends) with Immigration since 1982, the letter or affadavit is mandatory.....at least the first time one applies for a retirement visa. At one time I was on a dependent visa and had to get it every year. The second year after I received my retirement visa, I was specifically told that I did not need it any more.

Anyone who is applying for a retirement visa for the first time must get it, even if some have gotten away with not presenting it. When the officials want it, and you don't have it, all you are doing is looking for trouble, and the Immigration folks are very good at giving you what you are looking for. The letter is specifically required. IT IS ACTUALLY PROOF OF YOUR RETIREMENT STATUS.

For USA first time retirees, just go get the affadavit rom the Embassy....it is totally painless. The $30 may hurt a bit, but that is immaterial if your objective is to retire here. For others, you should consult with your embassy t determine if a letter is needed, but I am pretty certain that the first time it is mandatory.

Per the website of the Thai Embassy in Los Angeles, here are the requirements for retirement: NOTE: THE BELOW REQUIREMENTS APPLY FOR THOSE APPLYING FOR A RETIREMENT VISA FOR THE FIRST TIME. SOME REQUIREMENTS MAY BE SIMILAR FOR VISA RENEWALS.

"Non-Immigrant Retirement Visa

In regards to foreign nationals (non-Thais) who wish to enter the Kingdom of Thailand as a retired person (Purpose No. VII), on September 11, 2001, the Cabinet has approved the amended regulations on issuing visas for the retired person. These changes and additions are as follow:

1. The minimum age of the applicant is must be at least 50 years old;

2. The applicant must not have any criminal record in Thailand or their home country;

3. The applicant's passport must be valid for at least 1-1/2 more years (18 months);

4. The applicant must be presently residing in their home country. (Note: The Royal Thai Consulate General in Los Angeles will only issue the "O-A" Visa to U.S. citizens. For nationals from other countries they must apply in their home country.);

5. The applicant is no longer required to transfer money into a Thai bank account in Thailand before applying for the visa but must present evidence of available funds such as a current bank statement from the applicant's bank account in the U.S. showing the required amount (submit three copies along with the original bank statement). The amount of money the applicant must have in said account must be at least 800,000 Baht (for current exchange rate information see http://www.bot.or.th ) or the applicant may provide proof of monthly income of no less than 65,000 Baht per month for at least 12 months. (These documents must be certified by a Notary Public - see item 8. below.)

6. The applicant must provide three (3) copies of their certificate of health issued not more than three months earlier. (These must be certified by a Notary Public per item 8. below.)

7. The applicant must provide three (3) copies of a certificate issued by local law enforcement not more than three months earlier verifying the applicant does not have any criminal record in their home country; (These must be certified by a Notary Public per item 8. below.)

8. Evidence as stated in Nos. 5, 6 and 7 above must be certified by a Notary Public;

9. The applicant must complete three (3) application forms and include three (3) recent passport type photographs and must complete one biography form available from the Consulate or from our web site at http://www.thai-la.net;

10. The processing time for the application will be within one week from the date all required documentation is submitted to the Consulate;

11. If the applicant qualifies for the "O-A" Visa, the Consulate will issue a Non-Immigrant "O-A" Visa for a single journey into Thailand for a period up to 90 days (the Consulate is no longer required to forward the required documentation to Thailand for approval before issuing the visa);

12. With the Non-Immigrant "O-A" Visa, the applicant may request a one-year stay (not more than one year) through Thai Immigration at the Bangkok Airport upon arrival in Thailand. However, every 90 days that applicant resides in Thailand they must report to their local Thai Immigration office. If there is not a Thai Immigration office in their immediate locale, they may report to the local Thai Police Department where they live. They may also report by mail but they will need to complete form TM 47 and submit the form with a copy of the picture page of their passport as well as a copy of the page containing the Thai Immigration stamp from their most recent entry into Thailand. For each succeeding application, include a copy of the most recent stamp issued by Thai Immigration the last time they reported. When applying by mail, the applicant must include a return envelope with enough postage for Certified mail. Send required documentation to the Thai Immigration office in Bangkok.

13. If the applicant wishes to remain in Thailand for a period longer than one year, they must report to the Thai Immigration office and must show proof of transfer of funds as stated in No. 2 or a bank book /statement showing at least 800,000 Baht in the account or a letter verifying that the applicant is receiving income not less than 800,000 Baht per year.

14. Please be aware that if you are issued this type of Non-Immigrant "O-A" Visa, you are not permitted to work in Thailand.

If the applicant's spouse wishes to apply for the same type of visa but does not meet all of the requirements such as the age requirement, the spouse of the primary applicant must submit proof of a valid and current marriage to the primary applicant such as a notarized copy of their marriage certificate along with the other required documentation. The spouse must not have any criminal record in Thailand or in his or her home country. [This implies that the spouse needs a police clearance from his or her home town also] When applying to extend their stay in Thailand, the spouse of the primary applicant must also submit a copy of their marriage certificate along with the other required documentation.

http://www.thai-la.net/visa/retire.htm

[caughtintheact]

To clarify the question of capital or income, it can be either one or a combinatgion of both.

1. If you can show that you have 800,000 capital that you have transferred from abroad into a local bank account that's all you need. If you do not have B800,000, then you need to show .....

2. Baht 65,000 per month income from abroad......however....... if you do not meet either of the two criteria above, then......

3. You need a combination of the two that adds up to Baht 800,000 per year. Example:

If someone has Baht 40,000 per month in income, multiply the b40,000 by 12 which is B480,000 per year. This is B320,000 short of B800,000 per year. Therefore you need to show B320,000 in a local bank account each year that you renew the visa.

[Phil Clark]

Could it be that this whole subject suffers from 'Moving Goal Post Syndrome?'

Could it be that different Immigration Offices apply the 'rules' differently?

Could it be that 'rules' vary with the mood of officials?

Could it be that certain self-appointed 'experts' believe they know far more than they do?

Could it be that erroneous advice from the 'knowledgeable' causes people unnecessary grief and makes them incur needless expense?

Here is an Aunt Sally for all you experts out there:

Can a foreigner over the age of 50 with either 800k or proven pension of 65k pm or combination of both get an initial Retirement Visa in the Pattaya Immigration Office in Soi 8 if he is just at the end of his six month triple-entry TOURIST visa. i.e. WITHOUT a Non-Imm 'O'???

The answers to that question should reduce the credibility gap from within which far too much erroneous advice has being offered of late.

So, what say you, 'experts'?

The above, whilst being a tad tongue in cheek, is not a wind-up, it really is a serious question.

I know of a person who applied under the above circumstances this (2004) year.

How did he get on and what was he told, hmmmm?

[dr_Pat_Pong]

Could it be that this whole subject suffers from 'Moving Goal Post Syndrome?'

Could it be that different Immigration Offices apply the 'rules' differently?

Could it be that 'rules' vary with the mood of officials?

Could it be that certain self-appointed 'experts' believe they know far more than they do?

Could it be that erroneous advice from the 'knowledgeable' causes people unnecessary grief and makes them incur needless expense?

Here is an Aunt Sally for all you experts out there:

Can a foreigner over the age of 50 with either 800k or proven pension of 65k pm or combination of both get an initial Retirement Visa in the Pattaya Immigration Office in Soi 8 if he is just at the end of his six month triple-entry TOURIST visa. i.e. WITHOUT a Non-Imm 'O'???

The answers to that question should reduce the credibility gap from within which far too much erroneous advice has being offered of late.

So, what say you, 'experts'?

The above, whilst being a tad tongue in cheek, is not a wind-up, it really is a serious question.

I know of a person who applied under the above circumstances this (2004) year.

How did he get on and what was he told, hmmmm?

If I had been you I MIGHT have been somewhat politer in the question. But you weren't. Nevertheless, I will reply. The rules presently remain unchanged. The lads at Immigration would usually like to see that there is fall back money on hand to look after emergencies.

[dr_Pat_Pong]

To clarify the question of capital or income, it can be either one or a combinatgion of both.

1. If you can show that you have 800,000 capital that you have transferred from abroad into a local bank account that's all you need. If you do not have B800,000, then you need to show .....

2. Baht 65,000 per month income from abroad......however....... if you do not meet either of the two criteria above, then......

3. You need a combination of the two that adds up to Baht 800,000 per year. Example:

If someone has Baht 40,000 per month in income, multiply the b40,000 by 12 which is B480,000 per year. This is B320,000 short of B800,000 per year. Therefore you need to show B320,000 in a local bank account each year that you renew the visa.

Correct...but it changes in July this year.

[lovecam]

Could somebody please help me out. You all mention a medical certificate. If someone is Diabetic would this make any difference with them getting a retirement visa. anyones help would be greatly appreciated.

thanks

[masterchief]

GOOD EVENING OVER THERE FROM PARKER, AZ. HELP,, I HAVE TRIED TO THINK OF EVERYTHING TO BE DONE AND NOW I NEED HELP. I AM COMING OVER TO RETIRE AND HAVE A MULTI 0A VISA WHAT IS MY NEXT STEP IF ANY PRIOR TO ARRIVAL THE 18TH OF FEB

OK FOLKS I HAVE READ WITH INTEREST ALL OF THE TALK ON RETIREMENT VISA'S AND AM HAPPY TO ANNOUNCE THAT THE WIFE AND I HAVE RECEIVED OUR "OA" MULTIPLE JOURNEY VISA'S ... WE HAVE ONLY BEEN TO THAILAND ONCE IN NOV. AND FELL IN LOVE WITH IT WE JUMPED THROUGH SEVERAL HOOPES HERE IN THE STATES BUT AS SOMEONE THERE SAID "KEEP SMILING AND BE POLITE" IT WORKS WE WILL BE ARRIVING FOR RETIREMENT MID FEB04. HAVE A GREAT DAY.

[naka]

Dr. P.P.

My last post to Oldfart was regarding a letter from the Embassy, not from the bank which we know is an absolute necessity.

Naka.

[Roger13]

GOOD EVENING OVER THERE FROM PARKER, AZ. HELP,, I HAVE TRIED TO THINK OF EVERYTHING TO BE DONE AND NOW I NEED HELP. I AM COMING OVER TO RETIRE AND HAVE A MULTI 0A VISA WHAT IS MY NEXT STEP IF ANY PRIOR TO ARRIVAL THE 18TH OF FEB

OK FOLKS I HAVE READ WITH INTEREST ALL OF THE TALK ON RETIREMENT VISA'S AND AM HAPPY TO ANNOUNCE THAT THE WIFE AND I HAVE RECEIVED OUR "OA" MULTIPLE JOURNEY VISA'S ... WE HAVE ONLY BEEN TO THAILAND ONCE IN NOV. AND FELL IN LOVE WITH IT WE JUMPED THROUGH SEVERAL HOOPES HERE IN THE STATES BUT AS SOMEONE THERE SAID "KEEP SMILING AND BE POLITE" IT WORKS WE WILL BE ARRIVING FOR RETIREMENT MID FEB04. HAVE A GREAT DAY.

Master Chef

Please do not SHOUT at us

- it strains my EYES too much !!!

CAPS = SHOUTING

and lower case is much easier to read

Thanks

Roger

[Roger13]

Phil Clark wrote:

Here is an Aunt Sally for all you experts out there:

Can a foreigner over the age of 50 with either 800k or proven pension of 65k pm or combination of both get an initial Retirement Visa in the Pattaya Immigration Office in Soi 8 if he is just at the end of his six month triple-entry TOURIST visa. i.e. WITHOUT a Non-Imm 'O'???

The answers to that question should reduce the credibility gap from within which far too much erroneous advice has being offered of late.

So, what say you, 'experts'?

Phil Clark,

If someone is asking if he can

rely on doing that the answer is a BIG NO !!!

The Rules do not permit that.

You may well have an example where it has happened

but we cannot base advice on that.

We can tell someone it has happened

but it is contrary to the rules.

As I wrote in another thread:

TWO things to bear in mind.

Immigration officers do seem to have a lot of Discretion

which - In MY OPINION - they are ready to use in favour

of well dressed respectful applicants.

Secondly not everything written on this Forum should be

accepted without question. Some disturbed people can post

untruths.

So when someone says they were given something unusual

- they might be a mischievous "Troll" - or they might be a

Lucky / well dressed polite individual.

Roger

[masterchief]

[

Ok folks, the wife and i both have OA multiple journey (s) visa issued from the states the only financial paper work required was a 1099 tax form showing what was earned in 2003 and a ATM print-out showing a bank account here in the US. if anyone would like to use the same firm we did just email us

[caughtintheact]

Dr Pat Pong

Is theJuly 04 increase official yet? I thought I saw that it had been [quietly] dropped.