Three Foreigners Killed In Road Accident

[justaskdan]

I agree with everything I have read here and I refuse to get into a minivan or a bus. I drove from Phuket to Surin for Christmas and I was surprised. When it was good it was very good and when it was bad it was very bad. The trucks never stop and I spend a day next to small shop on the highway that fixes tires and he was busy 24 hours a day and that's just one little tire stop off the highway. I was driving a 4x4 and I got a flat as well. Even where there are two lane roads it is dangerous because the trucks use one and people driving between 90-140k use the other and with all the access roads it is a recipe for disaster. We only saw two disasters (one dead) but I counted 2000 close calls and 1000 displays of stupidity. The worst thing was is I have an 8 month old baby and with the truck it is a death trap for a baby. Even the smallest accident would kill her. No baby seat and airbags. So in that way I feel just as stupid and some of the motorists I witnessed and I am going to trade vehicles so that I can make it safer for my daughter.

[Fore Man]

My two cents...I asked a young 23-year old Thai graduate student with western manners and ideals why Thai drivers always seem to be so aggressive here, and take unncessary risks. He told me simply: "In Thailand, male drivers of almost any age have a 'me first' attitude. They can be decent, friendly people outside of a car, but they morph into a half-man/half-ape when they are placed behind the wheel. He told me that a lot of this is simply the need to demonstrate their machismo, and for others it runs deeper than simple hormones at work. In those other cases, it is a matter of 'now I am rich enough to own a real car, and by Buddha I am going to show the rest of you peons how important I am now'. The thought of being patient never enters their pea-brain mind. And road rage and absolutely downright unsafe driving ensues.

How many of you have been passed on a mountain road, with no passing lane, by an idiotic Thai driver who can't possibly be aware of what is lurking around the blind curve head? Could be a lorry or it a bus for all they know. What scares me more is that by taking such chances, they endanger the rest of us who are trying to be safe. Because if a lorry or a bus, or even another car zooms around the curve, the passing driver will be forced to sharply swerve to the left to avoid a collision, forcing the rest of us to slam on our brakes to avoid a tragedy. We would well end up in a ditch or in a bad collision too.

Folks. this will never change in Thailand. Face it. Most lower class, and may upper class (read, Mercedes) drivers act as if they are nothing more than monkeys who have been handed the keys to a powerful toy. We must simply tolerate these imbeciles, and make allowances in our own driving to accommodate them. When I see an idiot passing on a blind curve, I automatically slow down to allow him the room to cut me off. I'd rather not die or be maimed because of his gross stupidity.

And to the gent from Chiang Mai....I live here too, and trust me these roads are 1,000 percent safer than Pattaya's.

Endeth the sermon.

[JimsKnight]

I've caught the bus the last couple times 'cos I don't like Thai minivan/cab drivers much. The bus drivers are not much better, but I feel a little safer in a bus----at least it won't go under a trailer.

Train would be better still, doesn't run weekends, tho' I don't think.

At the company I work for we actually test the drivers skills and carry out back-ground checks on our minivan drivers. If they step out of line in any way, like having near misses (which is their fault) or reports of falling asleep at the wheel we get rid of them. We pay our van drivers 300 Baht a day plus for work over 11 hours, over time at 70 Baht an hour. All our minivans also have seat-belts fitted to all seats. The typical minivans are toyota HIACE. even with the ram bars fitted they are not strong vehicles (aluminium) unlike VW Caravelles which use steel .

I know it sounds like I am justifying my company over the one who crashed but I think If it was one of my vehicles I'd be wracked with guilt!

[BigSnake]

I for one knows what it was like to ride with a "DRIVER FROM hel_l" When I need a driver, Number one, look his or her in the eye and say no Alcohol, number two no speeding, number three no smoking. Never hurt to keep an eye on him of her for signs of fatigue.

[Soi Oz]

The code of the road here is different. Whereas the general rule in the UK is to give way or move over, here the general feel seems to be drift on through until you can get no further. I've seen some totally crazy manoeuvres here but if you look at the driver you see little or no sign of aggression or excitement, just a sort of going with the flow.

Unfortunately, this doesn't make the crazy manoeuvres any safer. I drive in Bangkok every day and do the "Highway of Death" a couple of times a month on average. The problems are many, but boil down to:

• A total lack of effective law enforcement (i.e. enforcing the things that matter)
  
• Poor driver training / attitude
  
• Speeding
  
• Poor / inadequate roads
  
• Alcohol
  
• Badly maintained vehicles
  

Mix a farmer in his badly maintained and grossly overloaded pickup doing 60, with an erratically driven Camry, impatiently weaving through the traffic at 160, and you have a sure fire recipe for disaster.

I wouldn't be a passenger in a bus on that road for anything, the tour buses are the worst.

[terdsak_12]

I find that the cheaper and crappier the vehicle the worse the driving standard is. Educated Thais with their Benzs and BMWs aren't too bad in my book, they want to preserve their multi million Baht investment. It's the tossers in their Nissan NVs, and idiots in the company pick-up or Van that do my head in.

[Soi Oz]

The Chon Buri to Pattaya road is the worst I have ever seen, basically totally ruined by the mad overloaded speeding lories - I say this as someone who has ridden a small motorcycle along it! They need to upgrade the railway to carry all the freight!

The road is inadequate for the volume of traffic it carries. This is the main road between the Laem Chabang port and Bangkok and environs. In most places it is only two poorly marked lanes which is not enough. The motorway surface is OK, but Sukhumvit is stuffed.

[rossigee]

The scariest thing driving is when you get a bus passing you on the left side at 130km speed.

If a bus was able to pass you on the inside at 130km, you were in the wrong lane. And if that scared you, you weren't paying attention to your rear view mirror, otherwise you would have known it was coming.

If it wasn't you driving, never use that driver/company again. If it was your wife driving, sell the car.

[TRD LOVER]

My job is taking care of the dead and injured in Thailand. Here are some things may want to know. Around 70% of the dead and injured at night have alcohol in their blood.

Driving licences can be bought readily and easily for 500 Thai baht.

Even if a Thai owns a real licence, driving instuction and testing is not only sub-standard but bizzare at times.

Brides to police range from 100 to 300 Thai baht (for Thais).

Drivers are generally underpaid and overworked. "10 wheelers" as they are called here, are often in needless accidents because of driver error. Vans, because of sleep depravation.

Street lighting and vehicle lighting is inadequate and unmonitored. If there are ever campaigns to monitor this, bribes are used to escape more heafty fines.

Roads are sub-standard and down right dangerous! The BKK-Chon buri motorway is one of the worst in the whole country. Thaksin personally said no to a proposed upgrade of this road! This is from the Engineers mouth in charge of the proposal.

Actually more foreigners die on this road and in Pattaya than any other one place in Thailand. The amount of foreigners killed by rented motorcycles in and around Pattaya is scandelous too (no need to have a driving licence, just a passport will do).

Thais are generally nice people, but behind the wheel of a vehicle they become very aggressive and violent because of the stresses of driving in a crazy environment coupled with their inadequate driving skills. Not just aggressive driving, but actual road rage, and the use of weapons and hand-guns at the scenes of accidents is prevelant! Beware.

I love Thailand and thats why I stay and volunteer here but am so sad when the government doesn't accept its responsiblities for all the above!

Man we really need more guys like him... here in Thailand.. My cap/hat is off to you buddy...or mate if you are a Brit or from the land of OZ..or comrade from the Fatherland.. I totally repect people like Mark...

I think the cost of a drivers license is peanuts compared to the west or to Germany.. I believe if the Thai government really want to make money.. REALLY FINE the poo poo out of these big and small company drivers and get them REALLY tested and continue to test 2-3 times a year.. This is a crime what they people do to the foreigners here... we bring MILLIONS of dollars and EUROS to Thailand and we all get treated very badly.. You would think Thailand would get they act together and do the right thing by these lame brained idiots they call cops and the higher ups just raking in on bribes..

I too love Thailand..the county.. but not all these people who can hold two passports, scam you at every business deal...make you life a living hel_l if they want to, and the total disrespect when they are behind a wheel.. I would like that to really change.. I am tired of being a third class person in the areas of repect and 1st class when they want a TIP for nothing done..

PS.. My total respect to the family and friends of all those people killed or injuried.. I lost a wife from a druck driver once and it totally changed my life.. and two wonderfull friends died in a bus crash on that same road in 1976...killing all on that bus..

[Heng]

I think in addition to TEFL, bus/truck/and taxi driving as a career should be added to the list of "occupations open to foreigners."

[AsiaWolfie]

It seems a lot of drivers on the Bangkok-Chonburi motorway think it's a nascar race. The scariest thing driving is when you get a bus passing you on the left side at 130km speed.

This is so sad.

even THAIVISA members do so...... at a much higher speed..... or did u forget the post by someone a couple of days ago, telling he rides at that motorway to chonburi with speed of 180 or so..... so what ???

[BPayette]

It seems a lot of drivers on the Bangkok-Chonburi motorway think it's a nascar race. The scariest thing driving is when you get a bus passing you on the left side at 130km speed.

This is so sad.

Passing on the left side at 130 on the shoulder of the road with a stalled truck in front.

[BlackJack]

Yeah, we use our own driver who has explicit instructions not to drive over 100 AND not to change lanes for no reason at all (a favorite local pastime it seems). Our Toyota Granvia is serviced every 10k kilometers and gets a fresh set of tires every 40k kilometers. There's no reason why anyone can't instruct temporary drivers or hired for a specific trip drivers in the same way. They are working for YOU.

Never a scratch of even a close call. This life's too good to have it come to an end in a ball of twisted metal possibly on fire.

like we say in OZ

its a nice day now watch some Bastar... spoil it

[penzman]

The scariest thing driving is when you get a bus passing you on the left side at 130km speed.

If a bus was able to pass you on the inside at 130km, you were in the wrong lane. And if that scared you, you weren't paying attention to your rear view mirror, otherwise you would have known it was coming.

If it wasn't you driving, never use that driver/company again. If it was your wife driving, sell the car.

Wasn't that bus going way over it's speed limit for the motorway? Cars are allowed 110, not buses.

Bus drivers should be just as responsible as airline pilots when they are responsible for passenger's safety. What makes them so different to be allowed such carelessness?

I had an argument with my wife a few days ago when a bus on the left tried to squeeze us between anoher bus on the right. I started honking and she said I shouldn't do that as most of them carry guns and are working for Kam Nan poh in the Chonburi area. The gun factor is the one thing that keeps me from getting even with these guys but it's as shame that they are allowed to behave like this. I wonder what happens when they do something like this to an off duty policeman or some high ranking govt. offocial, influential hi-so.

[nina_bobo]

Thanks for the informative write up markokang. My husband works in Laem Chabang and we live in Bangna. He makes the daily trip to work and home using this motorway. I get worried sick everytime he is late in coming home. I'm going to share this piece of information with him. You know, it's one thing to strive not to drive when tired or under the influence of alcohol. It's another thing altogether watching out for irresponsible drivers so that your life is not in jeopardy. I am so worried.

[BlackJack]

70% had alcohol in their systems

so i think this is where the problem lays

stop the grog - stop the carnage

but taking grog away from thais is like taking milk from the baby

alcohol - our socially accepted drug of choice

my head hurts thinking about this

mmmmm nearly beer o'clock

[Viper]

Was it that the driver had fallen asleep? Was it due to other inconciderate drivers on the road? Was it due to the fact that Thai's dont have any qualifications to be in charge of such death machines??

Qualifications you ask? I mean a DRIVERS LICENCE to ensure that the opperator is indeed fit and capable of being in charge of such a vehicle that is in the hands of the incapable "A DEATH TRAP"!!

When will the Thai govenment ever start to realise the consequence of road travel without such qualifications and proper maintenance of vehicles and introduct MOT like we have in England. A yearly routine where the vehicle is taken to a registered garage to undertake maintanance routine inspection on brakes, lights, tyres, shocks, bearing, etc etc.......What does Thailand do to ensure proper vehicle maintenance and keep us safe from faulty machinery?

[COBBER]

You only need to look at the long line of totally writen off wrecks on the side of the road at the entrances to the services turn offs on the Chonburi Motorway to see how many seriuos accidents occour.

[Einstein]

It is time that he coverment take action. Thai driving schools are a disastor. The most people who do the exam, have to drive only two times back and drive a circle. The most Thai people who have a license, have no any clue about the danger. They don't look left or right, they just cross the road. No lights, bad breaks are common.

License for motorbike should start from 18 years old and car from 21. Only in phuket every 2/5 day sombody dies in an accident.

Also the coverment should punish the rental services who rent a car or bike to tourists without license.

BUT WHAT IS MORE IMPORTANT, MONEY OR LIVES??????

[BPayette]

My job is taking care of the dead and injured in Thailand. Here are some things may want to know. Around 70% of the dead and injured at night have alcohol in their blood.

Driving licences can be bought readily and easily for 500 Thai baht.

Even if a Thai owns a real licence, driving instuction and testing is not only sub-standard but bizzare at times.

Brides to police range from 100 to 300 Thai baht (for Thais).

Drivers are generally underpaid and overworked. "10 wheelers" as they are called here, are often in needless accidents because of driver error. Vans, because of sleep depravation.

Street lighting and vehicle lighting is inadequate and unmonitored. If there are ever campaigns to monitor this, bribes are used to escape more heafty fines.

Roads are sub-standard and down right dangerous! The BKK-Chon buri motorway is one of the worst in the whole country. Thaksin personally said no to a proposed upgrade of this road! This is from the Engineers mouth in charge of the proposal.

Actually more foreigners die on this road and in Pattaya than any other one place in Thailand. The amount of foreigners killed by rented motorcycles in and around Pattaya is scandelous too (no need to have a driving licence, just a passport will do).

Thais are generally nice people, but behind the wheel of a vehicle they become very aggressive and violent because of the stresses of driving in a crazy environment coupled with their inadequate driving skills. Not just aggressive driving, but actual road rage, and the use of weapons and hand-guns at the scenes of accidents is prevelant! Beware.

I love Thailand and thats why I stay and volunteer here but am so sad when the government doesn't accept its responsiblities for all the above!

There is also a fair percentage of drivers here that drive at night without lights!!! Even the fuel trucks, at night, on an unlit road, going 20km/hr on an 80 kh/hr road.

I see most motorcycles without tailights, and not just old ones, new ones too. I even see brand new BMWs and Merc's (w/red plates) with no tailights.

Can someone out there tell me what the reasoining is behind such a STUPID practice??

I've heard "...I can OK, why I need light...?"

[VanZam]

Also the coverment should punish the rental services who rent a car or bike to tourists without license.

BUT WHAT IS MORE IMPORTANT, MONEY OR LIVES??????

Your home country drivers licence is perfectly valid in Thailand for 1 year.

[Boomee]

Yes another sad case in Thailand,I know we think that there should be tighter laws for this and tighter laws for that but at the end of the day do we want Thailand the same as western countries?mind you,nothing bad happened to me yet.Touch wood

[Crossy]

Your home country drivers licence is perfectly valid in Thailand for 1 year.

This is incorrect (unless the law has changed very recently)! With the exception of a few ASEAN countries all foreigners require an International Driving Permit (IDP) to accompany their national licence. The IDP is valid for a period of 90 days from the person's entry into the Kingdom, the clock resets if you leave and re-enter the country (on your visa run for example).

[Simbo]

Seems to me it was just a driver who fell asleep. Sad but it happens. I'm sure he did not want to die either.

Agreed. It's easy to criticise when one is perfect. I, myself have nearly fallen asleep in thailand, especially on long drives. Something to do with heat and the long, boring stretches of roads here.

Anyone who hasn't experienced drowsyness while driving, has not done much driving here.

Regular stops are the answer. However careful, accidents will happen.

[phuketsiam]

I think in addition to TEFL, bus/truck/and taxi driving as a career should be added to the list of "occupations open to foreigners."

not a bad idea Heng

I used to joke if they banned Thai nationals from driving it would solve congestion and bring the accident/death rate down

not likly tho is it

[richard10365]

I've caught the bus the last couple times 'cos I don't like Thai minivan/cab drivers much. The bus drivers are not much better, but I feel a little safer in a bus----at least it won't go under a trailer.

Train would be better still, doesn't run weekends, tho' I don't think.

At the company I work for we actually test the drivers skills and carry out back-ground checks on our minivan drivers. If they step out of line in any way, like having near misses (which is their fault) or reports of falling asleep at the wheel we get rid of them. We pay our van drivers 300 Baht a day plus for work over 11 hours, over time at 70 Baht an hour. All our minivans also have seat-belts fitted to all seats. The typical minivans are toyota HIACE. even with the ram bars fitted they are not strong vehicles (aluminium) unlike VW Caravelles which use steel .

I know it sounds like I am justifying my company over the one who crashed but I think If it was one of my vehicles I'd be wracked with guilt!

I'm not sure if I am reading this correctly. Are you saying you pay your drivers extra to drive more than 11 hours a day?

Am I the only one who feels that 11 hours driving in one day is grossly excessive?

I can see why you need safe vehicles.

I read somewhere in the states that commercial drivers can only drive for 10 max before they have to rest for at least 8 hours. But you pay your drivers extra to keep on driving.

Dosen't that seem dangerous?

[dezeure]

It seems a lot of drivers on the Bangkok-Chonburi motorway think it's a nascar race. The scariest thing driving is when you get a bus passing you on the left side at 130km speed.

This is so sad.

very true...happened several times already on that highway that I'm driving 130 km/hr and all the sudden a blue bus passes me full speed on the left... In europe busses are limited to 100 km/hr and trucks to 90 km/hr. There are currently talks about reducing the truck speed to 80 km/hr...

[gburns57au]

Lets put some perspective back into this.....

Some have talked about the amount of daily traffic on this road....there will always be accidents on such a heavily used road....Ok this time it was farangs that got killed...but many Thais have lost their lives too...With that amount of traffic accidents are inevitable.

Everybody blames the driver who was also killed....the cause of the accident wasnt fixed but it may have been something other than falling asleep or drink/drugs, after all it was 11 in the morning not night time, It could have been mechanical failure of some sort, Unless we hear something more definate than a Police Officers assumptions, I for one will not judge him....

Minivans, taxis and limos from reputable companies all have their drivers and vehicles licenced....I have travelled that road many times and the worst problem I had was the van lost some luggage due to an unsecured load.....I notice that some effort has been taken to tie down the roof luggage now or to load it in behind the rear seat.

I have never had a bad driver...most speak a bit of english so you can have a chat with them and I usually have a chat in Thai with them too...I have seen some crazy things on the road and most times my drivers have just tutted and eased off the gas a bit...I also ask for a toilet break along the way so the driver can refresh a bit.

And as someone else has said if you suspect your driver has been on the slops or whatever...you can always get out and not get back in. So I lose the money that I paid up front and have to pay for another driver and car....but hey how much is your life worth.

Edited January 24, 2006 by gburns57au

[Lormaak]

This is Thai law:

No driver shall overtake another vehicle from the left-side unless:

a. the vehicle to be overtaken is making a right turn or has given a signal that he is going to make a right turn

b. the roadway is arranged with two or more traffic lanes in the same direction.

...and it is B that causes problems. It is legal here to undertake on a two or three lane road, at any time!! It's crazy, but what we all see as bad driving is actually perfectly legal.

[Donno]

In the west we’re taught to be “aware” on the roads meaning knowing what is going on around you and don’t put yourself in a dangerous position. So when we drive in Thailand we try and drive courteously and are amazed at what the Thai drivers do.

But in Thai culture they believe in fatalism meaning that Budda is looking after them. So they can do as they please on the road as they have divine protection. That is why we see Thai drivers just pull straight out of a street without looking.

To be honest I thought I would try that once and I got to the corner and zap self preservation came in and I had to look to see if it was safe