How Many Condos Can I Buy?

[RaysFan]

I'm a young American moving to Bangkok trying to figure out ways to gain a steady income. An idea I have is to buy 7 or 8 1,000,000 baht condos and rent them out. Can I do this as a non Thai? Ive been trying to find rules and regulations but having no luck. Thanks.

[shepsel]

Technically, you would be creating a job for yourself and it is considered working, and would have to ask an immigration specialist on what type of visa you would need so that you won't be living here without the correct visa.

[ggold]

At 1,000,000 a condo, that is basically a studio appartment. Well you might earn a livable monthly income on those seven condo's, if you don't have an expensive life style? But don't bank on being able to sell out quickly, it could take years, and there will always be cheaper condo's new built. Basically IMHO your throwing you money away. Don't invest unless you can afford to loose it all.

Good luck, your going to need it I think!

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[ThaiBob]

if you can do 10M you could qualify for an investment visa.

[monty]

Technically, you would be creating a job for yourself and it is considered working, and would have to ask an immigration specialist on what type of visa you would need so that you won't be living here without the correct visa.

Not necesarely. Owning them and letting an outside management company handle the work does not require a work permit.

You'd still be liable for taxes though...

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[davejones]

There is a guy on here that does something similar,but with cheaper condos and it seems to work fine for him. How do you plan to get a visa to stay here if you don't have a job. Sounds like it could be a bit risky buying so many properties if you can't get a visa to stay here long-term. Also, you have to choose the condos very carefully, as many buildings have lots of empty condos. I've seen condos that have been empty for years, so beware. It's not as easy as buying an condo and waiting for the cash to roll in. You could easily lose a lot of money if you don't know what you're doing.

[trogers]

Technically, you would be creating a job for yourself and it is considered working, and would have to ask an immigration specialist on what type of visa you would need so that you won't be living here without the correct visa.

Not necesarely. Owning them and letting an outside management company handle the work does not require a work permit.

You'd still be liable for taxes though...

Sent from my GT-I9001 using Thaivisa Connect App

That's right. No work permit is required for foreign investors. Work permit is required only if a foreigner wants to work in Thailand. Taxes are payable on investment income.

And there is no limit on the amount you want to remit from overseas for investment in Thailand. But what makes you think you can live on rental income from just an investment of Bt 8 million?

Edited September 12, 2012 by trogers

[warapat]

Make sure you keep your bank transfer records to show you sent the money into Thailand so when the time comes to sell, you will be able to take your money out of Thailand.

Edited September 12, 2012 by warapat

[davejones]

How much do you need to live on? That will determine whether this will work or not.

[RaysFan]

How much do you need to live on? That will determine whether this will work or not.

I will be moving to BKK in a few months, and I will be living there for a few months before I do anything... I am pretty sure I can live comfortably off of 45,000 a month as I dont plan on partying my money away... What do you guys think? How much do you guys live off of?

[trogers]

How much do you need to live on? That will determine whether this will work or not.

I will be moving to BKK in a few months, and I will be living there for a few months before I do anything... I am pretty sure I can live comfortably off of 45,000 a month as I dont plan on partying my money away... What do you guys think? How much do you guys live off of?

You will need to double your investment amount.

[davejones]

How much do you need to live on? That will determine whether this will work or not.

I will be moving to BKK in a few months, and I will be living there for a few months before I do anything... I am pretty sure I can live comfortably off of 45,000 a month as I dont plan on partying my money away... What do you guys think? How much do you guys live off of?

People live on all sorts of different amounts, from 20k to 200K+. It depends on what sort of lifestyle you want. 45K gets me by with rent on top of that. But that doesn't include new clothes, holidays, car repairs, etc, which are on top of my 45k/month. Probably 100-120K or more when I take everything into account. Even though some things are incredibly cheap, the money goes quickly. 45k/month is only 1500/day.

[Khun Jean]

The trick to make it work is that you should should not buy with your feeling but with your calculator. and have lots of patience so you can pick up that bargain.

If you can get around 8% roi, it should be ok.

8% will give you around 5000 baht spending money with the rest as a reserve for repairs and for when the condo is empty.

7-8 million baht will give you max 40.000 baht a month.

This is all best case!

40.000 baht is i think not enough to be able to live a comfortable lifestyle, unless you go out of bangkok and go 'local' without any insurances.

If it will be your only source of income i think it is not enough.

A visa will be another concern, depending on your age, married with a thai etc it could be very difficult or even impossible to stay here long time.

Do you have skills? If so, it might be better to find a job.

Don't start buying anything until you are here at least 6 months.

You first need to know if a 'bargain' is really a bargain.

Edited September 12, 2012 by Khun Jean

[trogers]

If you can get around 8% roi, it should be ok.

8% will give you around 5000 baht spending money with the rest as a reserve for repairs and for when the condo is empty.

7-8 million baht will give you max 40.000 baht a month.

This is all best case!

Let's not confuse gross rental yield with ROI. Return on investment (ROI) = rental yield + capital appreciation.

Studio units of 25-33 sqm are in oversupply and if you are lucky to rent a unit out, gross rental yield is around 5% or less. Expect net rental yield not to exceed 3.5% taking into consideration vacancy periods, agent's fee, common fees, and sinking fund for repairs.

This is especially so for condo units located from Onnut and beyond. There are no condo units of Bt 1 million price range nearer than Onnut.

[Paul888]

I think the OP was just asking whether there was a limit to the number of condos a farang can buy, not whether we think his idea is a good one which we cannot answer, as (like him also at this stage) we do not where he will buy these condos, how he will present them for rent and how lucky he will be.

Personally, I think if he takes time to study the real estate markets and chooses well, he could have a chance - certainly moe chance than a guy who arrives here without an idea, or without 7 to 8 million.

Good luck. Do your research yourself. Don't rely on the opinion of others.

[trogers]

I think the OP was just asking whether there was a limit to the number of condos a farang can buy, not whether we think his idea is a good one which we cannot answer, as (like him also at this stage) we do not where he will buy these condos, how he will present them for rent and how lucky he will be.

Personally, I think if he takes time to study the real estate markets and chooses well, he could have a chance - certainly moe chance than a guy who arrives here without an idea, or without 7 to 8 million.

Good luck. Do your research yourself. Don't rely on the opinion of others.

It would have worked if he bought during 2007-2008 as it is working for me from my 5 condo units, 2 acquired under distress sales.

But the property cycle is now too far into a bubble, with high prices and low rental yields. My estimate for the next bubble burst and buying opportunity is 2015-2016.

[aussiebebe]

In answer to the OP, there's no limit I know of on the number of condos a foreigner can buy in Thailand. My sum experience is that I've owned just one condo and the only advice I could pass on is to first investigate how much tax you pay when you sell a condo! If you're doing buy-to-let as an investment you'll see that ROI doesn't take sales tax into account.

[starship]

Hi.

I would recommend you to consider buying one or two quality condos rather than eight. Studios are abundant in Bangkok and as suggested, plenty are empty i'm sure. If you do consider this route they have to be near the skytrain or you probably should forget it as this is what the target market wants and there will be plenty of others that offer this. The reason i suggest less properties is that there is an oversupply of condos in the 1-3 million range and as the old saying goes "quality always sells". I would urge you to consider the fact that if you have eight condos dotted around the place its going to be a lot of effort to collect rent - if there is any, or fees to an agent for arranging this. At the very bottom end of the market the demand is strong and constant in the 2-5000 range but these properties which typical sell for around 400,000 are normally in bad shape and near impossible to sell but could provide a good income and best to get all units in one block to keep it simple. Bear in mind the 49%/51% foreign ownership rule though.

You mention condos in the 1 million price range which i believe you would be looking at second hand units in the Prakanong area onwards. Prices in the last five years or so have gone upwards a lot for new builds as land and building costs have increased and you are now paying 2.5 million on average for a studio in the far end of sukhumvit, much more for lower suk and other areas. I know there are some cheaper places but these are in the minority or well out of the city.

Buying secondhand can offer good value but as mentioned they can be potentially difficult to sell. One of the main reasons for this is that Thai's like newbuilds and once the condo is too small for them they like buying a house on a moobaan (gated community) not generally a bigger condo. However, you are probably more likely to sell a secondhand property to a foreigner who is used to buying older properties and sees the value in getting much more for his money than a shiny new one.

Additionally, as well pointed out by another member you need to consider sale taxes when you sell in Thailand which are quite high and i believe have recently gone up from a reduction. One property would probably work out cheaper if you had to sell it rather than eight and the same applies in terms of buying.

Of course only having one or two versus eight you have to weigh up the risks of not having tenants and rent. Still, I would suggest buying a quality larger condo in the Thonglor/Lower Sukhumvit area and trying to get a steady tenant. Additionally, a quality condo in a good location and near the skytrain should hold and probably increase its value where as second hand ones tend not to increase or can devalue.

Something for you to think about anyway. Good luck.

[davejones]

Hi.

I would recommend you to consider buying one or two quality condos rather than eight. Studios are abundant in Bangkok and as suggested, plenty are empty i'm sure. If you do consider this route they have to be near the skytrain or you probably should forget it as this is what the target market wants and there will be plenty of others that offer this. The reason i suggest less properties is that there is an oversupply of condos in the 1-3 million range and as the old saying goes "quality always sells". I would urge you to consider the fact that if you have eight condos dotted around the place its going to be a lot of effort to collect rent - if there is any, or fees to an agent for arranging this. At the very bottom end of the market the demand is strong and constant in the 2-5000 range but these properties which typical sell for around 400,000 are normally in bad shape and near impossible to sell but could provide a good income and best to get all units in one block to keep it simple. Bear in mind the 49%/51% foreign ownership rule though.

You mention condos in the 1 million price range which i believe you would be looking at second hand units in the Prakanong area onwards. Prices in the last five years or so have gone upwards a lot for new builds as land and building costs have increased and you are now paying 2.5 million on average for a studio in the far end of sukhumvit, much more for lower suk and other areas. I know there are some cheaper places but these are in the minority or well out of the city.

Buying secondhand can offer good value but as mentioned they can be potentially difficult to sell. One of the main reasons for this is that Thai's like newbuilds and once the condo is too small for them they like buying a house on a moobaan (gated community) not generally a bigger condo. However, you are probably more likely to sell a secondhand property to a foreigner who is used to buying older properties and sees the value in getting much more for his money than a shiny new one.

Additionally, as well pointed out by another member you need to consider sale taxes when you sell in Thailand which are quite high and i believe have recently gone up from a reduction. One property would probably work out cheaper if you had to sell it rather than eight and the same applies in terms of buying.

Of course only having one or two versus eight you have to weigh up the risks of not having tenants and rent. Still, I would suggest buying a quality larger condo in the Thonglor/Lower Sukhumvit area and trying to get a steady tenant. Additionally, a quality condo in a good location and near the skytrain should hold and probably increase its value where as second hand ones tend not to increase or can devalue.

Something for you to think about anyway. Good luck.

That's pretty good advice. One thing I'd add though is that there is definitely demand for condos even if they are away from BTS. Most people in Bangkok drive and never use the BTS, so being near to it is irrelevant to them. They would prefer it to be near major roads. It all depends who your target market is.

[mrbojangles]

One off topic and unnecessary post removed. Please keep to the topic people.

[trogers]

Buying secondhand can offer good value but as mentioned they can be potentially difficult to sell. One of the main reasons for this is that Thai's like newbuilds and once the condo is too small for them they like buying a house on a moobaan (gated community) not generally a bigger condo.

After last year's flood with Bangkok being inundated by water from the North, the younger generation of Thais may change from this way of thoughts. Most houses within their budget after selling their small condo unit will be located outside the flood barriers of the city.

[SlyAnimal]

Why do you want to buy condos in Thailand so that you can live off the rental income?

Instead, why don't you buy condos/houses/whatever in your home country and live off the income from them?

That way you know the market better, you can move the money easier, finance would be easier if you need it, you have more options on what you can buy and in general it'd simply be safer (unless you're from say Syria lol)

Although tax rates in Thailand are quite favorable I guess, but the potential for the THB to drop is dangerous for if you want to sell up later, while longterm you'd probably expect the euro/pound/usd to rise as they recover from the financial crisis

[davejones]

Why do you want to buy condos in Thailand so that you can live off the rental income?

Instead, why don't you buy condos/houses/whatever in your home country and live off the income from them?

That way you know the market better, you can move the money easier, finance would be easier if you need it, you have more options on what you can buy and in general it'd simply be safer (unless you're from say Syria lol)

Although tax rates in Thailand are quite favorable I guess, but the potential for the THB to drop is dangerous for if you want to sell up later, while longterm you'd probably expect the euro/pound/usd to rise as they recover from the financial crisis

This depends where you plan to live long-term. If the plan is to stay in Thailand, then it makes sense to invest here, as income will be in Thai Baht, and there won't be any worries about exchange rate. If you invest in USA, for example, your income in baht could drop suddenly (or slowly over the years) and this might not suit you.

But if you're planning to return to your home country in a few years, then investing there makes more sense.

But it all depends on the OP's long-term intentions. Maybe invest 50% in each if you're not sure.

[trogers]

Why do you want to buy condos in Thailand so that you can live off the rental income?

Instead, why don't you buy condos/houses/whatever in your home country and live off the income from them?

That way you know the market better, you can move the money easier, finance would be easier if you need it, you have more options on what you can buy and in general it'd simply be safer (unless you're from say Syria lol)

Although tax rates in Thailand are quite favorable I guess, but the potential for the THB to drop is dangerous for if you want to sell up later, while longterm you'd probably expect the euro/pound/usd to rise as they recover from the financial crisis

Different people have different reasons. But the main reason is to retire here in Thailand. And the second reason is the cost of entry for investment. What will Bt 20m get you in HK, Singapore and London? Do not forget the need to accommodate yourself at the same time you invest.

[bdw]

your throwing you money away. Don't invest unless you can afford to loose it all.

Yes, you are throwing money away, & letting it all hang loose.

[trogers]

your throwing you money away. Don't invest unless you can afford to loose it all.

Yes, you are throwing money away, & letting it all hang loose.

The same can be asked of pensioners in some developed countries...

[JeffreyMcCollum]

Technically, you would be creating a job for yourself and it is considered working, and would have to ask an immigration specialist on what type of visa you would need so that you won't be living here without the correct visa.

Wearing clothes would be creating a job for myself and doing laundry is considered working . . .

Rubish, He is making an investment that the government is all for, He is even given specail privleges from BOI and a specail Visa to stay here

[trogers]

Technically, you would be creating a job for yourself and it is considered working, and would have to ask an immigration specialist on what type of visa you would need so that you won't be living here without the correct visa.

Wearing clothes would be creating a job for myself and doing laundry is considered working . . .

Rubish, He is making an investment that the government is all for, He is even given specail privleges from BOI and a specail Visa to stay here

I have said that such an interpretation of Labour laws will have all tourists arrested because they bathe themselves daily instead of using the services of turkish baths, depriving Thais of their vocations.

[davejones]

your throwing you money away. Don't invest unless you can afford to loose it all.

Yes, you are throwing money away, & letting it all hang loose.

These are the sort of quotes I often hear from people too frightened or too poor to invest.

[JeffreyMcCollum]

This Post seems to be a HUB of mis information

First off you can buy as many as you want. as long as you can pay for them, Remember you have fees and upkeep as well as furnishing them usually. . I have (had) 10 at one point. but know others with more.

Have you been to Thailand before ? and why Bangkok ?

I purchased lower cost (working class) condos in the 500,000 Bt range in one resort area, I would fix them up, rent them out for 10,000 - 45,000 Bt a month as well as sell if I got a good offer, I have never lost money, but once or twice broke even, If you include the rental income I guess I did fine all in all. Never had a problem selling my condos when I needed but I was realistic about the pricing and sold them quickly, Unlike some who think they need double or triple the money and just let them sit, that also cost youmoney

Look around at areas you want to live in. I would not personally do BKK or the area I did before becasue my taste has changed. It is best if your near to over see things, Just a few weeks ago a friend in CM found a 2 bed 2 bath condo for under 400,000 bt needing a little work from and expat eger to move back home. He did 200,000 bt. more of work on it and now is set to rent it out at just under 20,000 a month. So deals are out there you just need to look and keep your eyes open, Banks also have repos they sell on the cheep you can get.

Check into BOI (board of investment) they have many wonderful programs and visa's they give out. But really a visa is not an issue if you really want to live here.

I do suggest starting with lower end condos, build some experance with property in Thailand, I have moved on to homes, And even though as I am sure you have seen, many say you can not buy in your name, that too is rubbish, BOI has programs as well as some builder like Land and home and Alpine (or is it alps ?) that have specail agreements with the government to do just that.

I have been doing this for about 10 years here in Thailand, Live an OK life, enjoy living here, My family of 3 can live on 20,000 a month but feel most comfortable at 30,000 bt but we live north in Chaing mai where things just cost much lower than BKK or resort areas of Thailand, I don't drink, smoke or do night life either that is a big savings over some of my friends

Don't worry about getting your hands dirty and doing a little work

Chok Dee (oh, learning a little Thai help a lot too)