Renting An Office.. Do You Need Work Permit?

[saengsureeya]

Thanks for the reply

All work I am doing is for Australia only..

I do not do anything here for Thai companies and therefore do not get paid anything from here..

Its the same when I go and stay in Singapore where I have a small office..

So does that still apply that I need a work permit?

You ask 2 questions in one: Do you need a WP in order to rent an office? Answer: NO. Unless the landlord asks for it, but there is no law asking for a WP if you're going to rent some kind of space meant to work in.

Do you need a WP if you work IN Thailand for an Australian (or any other country) company? Answer: Yes.

My remark: If you do not need an office, don't rent one. It only attracts attention. Officially you do need a WP, but if you work from home, you don't advertise and you don't display any activity referring to labor, there won't be anyone bothered.

I know, this is an illegal advise, but the moderators know as much as any other person, that it is reality.

[nietzche]

umm... I don't know but I can tell you one thing, many of the people that have money to travel keep working on their companies, they are not exactly stealing dishwashing jobs from ya...

Like I said, show me ONE example of someone who works from the net, with a company in their home country (nothing about Thailand) that has ever gotten in trouble for keep doing their thang while travelling in Thailand. Simple.

I don't think anyone would ever care, in a million years, if someone was say from France, and they did work for a French company online.. Or someone was penning their travel articles to sell... it isn't of a concern to Thailand, be realistic, you just envious of someone that has work like this.

So If someone is traveling on business to Thailand, and they continue to send company emails and work from their hotel room, do they need work permits too?

If I owned a company registered in the U.S. and I continued to run my company while here in Thailand, would I need a work permit?

If I owned shares in a U.S. corporation and I continued to earn dividend income while running it over the phone would I need a work permit here also?

If I owned an apartment back in the U.S. and I was receiving rental income from tenants while over here, would I need a work permit? What if I was actively managing the tenants myself remotely?

Where does the line begin, and where does it end? Can anyone prove work has been carried out? The only way would be to check my U.S. tax returns or emails. Both are off limits.

[Soutpeel]

So If someone is traveling on business to Thailand, and they continue to send company emails and work from their hotel room, do they need work permits too?

If I owned a company registered in the U.S. and I continued to run my company while here in Thailand, would I need a work permit?

If I owned shares in a U.S. corporation and I continued to earn dividend income while running it over the phone would I need a work permit here also?

If I owned an apartment back in the U.S. and I was receiving rental income from tenants while over here, would I need a work permit? What if I was actively managing the tenants myself remotely?

Where does the line begin, and where does it end? Can anyone prove work has been carried out? The only way would be to check my U.S. tax returns or emails. Both are off limits.

1. No you dont...a Non-imm B is ok....the rational is very simple, somebody intends visiting on business and leaving again to another country, they are not claiming residence in Thailand, which is what a lot of "on-liners" do

2. Yes if you were living in Thailand and claiming "residency" in Thailand, if a truely a tourist then no

3. No WP required

4. first part of question..not required, second part Yes WP required

BTW tax returns or money paid or not has nothing to do with it...

Under Item 1..if the person concerned was doing business with a Thai entity, the person could easy aquire a temporary WP anyway which would be good for 2 weeks

[DrTuner]

1. No you dont...a Non-imm B is ok....the rational is very simple, somebody intends visiting on business and leaving again to another country, they are not claiming residence in Thailand, which is what a lot of "on-liners" do

Actually .. wasn't there a thread couple of months ago, where it was mentioned the immigration (or was it labor ?) writes non-b visas (WP's ?) for people visiting Thailand for trade fairs, etc ?

EDIT: Ah yes this is how it works..

http://www.doingbusinessthailand.com/thailand-visa-and-work-permit/thailand-visas/thailand-short-term-business-trip-do-you-need-a-work-permit.html

"Indeed Thai Labor law work definition is very broad and consists of exercising any activity whereby one exerts energy or uses knowledge, whether or not in consideration for wages or other benefits relating to business deemed as work under the law. It furthermore covers any work-related activity, either permanently or temporarily.

Applying for a proper work permit is not a solution that is suitable for people that comes for short business trip in Thailand.

There is a solution. Indeed, the Alien Working Act contains a provision that allows foreigners intending to stay in the Kingdom for a short period of time to notify the necessity and urgency of their work to the Department of Employment instead of applying for an ordinary work permit.

The advantage of this notification is that it is very quick to process (from a few days to a few hours).

The drawback is that this option is only available to those that come to perform “necessary and urgent” work. Furthermore the foreign person will be allowed to stay to perform such work 15 days per entry only, inclusive of weekends and holidays."

Ought to be here in the Act then: http://www.thailawforum.com/database1/Alien-Working-Act.html

[Soutpeel]

1. No you dont...a Non-imm B is ok....the rational is very simple, somebody intends visiting on business and leaving again to another country, they are not claiming residence in Thailand, which is what a lot of "on-liners" do

Actually .. wasn't there a thread couple of months ago, where it was mentioned the immigration (or was it labor ?) writes non-b visas (WP's ?) for people visiting Thailand for trade fairs, etc ?

EDIT: Ah yes this is how it works..

http://www.doingbusi...ork-permit.html

"Indeed Thai Labor law work definition is very broad and consists of exercising any activity whereby one exerts energy or uses knowledge, whether or not in consideration for wages or other benefits relating to business deemed as work under the law. It furthermore covers any work-related activity, either permanently or temporarily.

Applying for a proper work permit is not a solution that is suitable for people that comes for short business trip in Thailand.

There is a solution. Indeed, the Alien Working Act contains a provision that allows foreigners intending to stay in the Kingdom for a short period of time to notify the necessity and urgency of their work to the Department of Employment instead of applying for an ordinary work permit.

The advantage of this notification is that it is very quick to process (from a few days to a few hours).

The drawback is that this option is only available to those that come to perform “necessary and urgent” work. Furthermore the foreign person will be allowed to stay to perform such work 15 days per entry only, inclusive of weekends and holidays."

Ought to be here in the Act then: http://www.thailawfo...orking-Act.html

Yeap your correct...look at my post and the comment written in italic at the bottom, same thing...but for a temporary WP to be issued the person concerned needs a Non-imm visa , and infers a "B" to be issued the temporary WP, as far as I understand it a temporary WP...it doesnt replace the visa requirement and yes they are issued very quickly...

[DrTuner]

A non-imm B, to get one you'll need invitation from a Thai company ? How does that work if you're f.ex. a sales rep working for a US company, looking for sales leads ?

Pardon for the highjack, but I think the office thingy is clear already: it's a neon sign over your head saying "No work permit".

[Soutpeel]

A non-imm B, to get one you'll need invitation from a Thai company ? How does that work if you're f.ex. a sales rep working for a US company, looking for sales leads ?

Pardon for the highjack, but I think the office thingy is clear already: it's a neon sign over your head saying "No work permit".

You would still need an invitation from a Thai entity, company, legal office....etc...if in the example you gave someone turned up in Thailand on say tourist visa and started touting for business with various Thai companies, would think they are leaving themselves open to problems here.

The current understanding I have, if one is looking a doing possiblites of doing business in Thailand a Non-imm B is sufficient and a WP is not required. ie someone flies in for Business meetings/marketing etc. An example I was given one was as follows:

Company X sends a salesman to Thailand to look at doing some work for a Thai company, while meetings going on, no contract etc signed, everything is happy on a Non-imm B, once the company signs a contract with the Thai company and lets say for example they need to send personel to Thailand to do the work, these personnel would need both Non-imm B & WP while in Thailand

[DrTuner]

The laws are seemingly from a time when people still traveled on elephants and telecommunications was sending someone running through the jungle. The problem is, they may use the archaic rules at their discretion. The usual story is one farang snitching on another out of revenge, competition, jealousy and so on.

I really, really hope full ASEAN implementation will cause changes in the Alien Working Act and it (and immigration's rules) will be updated to accommodate the increased mobility and possibility of remote work. Not holding my breath there. Although the provisions seem to be there on the work permit application form already (freelance/foreign company).

[Vale Tudo]

1. No you dont...a Non-imm B is ok....the rational is very simple, somebody intends visiting on business and leaving again to another country, they are not claiming residence in Thailand, which is what a lot of "on-liners" do

Actually .. wasn't there a thread couple of months ago, where it was mentioned the immigration (or was it labor ?) writes non-b visas (WP's ?) for people visiting Thailand for trade fairs, etc ?

EDIT: Ah yes this is how it works..

http://www.doingbusi...ork-permit.html

"Indeed Thai Labor law work definition is very broad and consists of exercising any activity whereby one exerts energy or uses knowledge, whether or not in consideration for wages or other benefits relating to business deemed as work under the law. It furthermore covers any work-related activity, either permanently or temporarily.

Applying for a proper work permit is not a solution that is suitable for people that comes for short business trip in Thailand.

There is a solution. Indeed, the Alien Working Act contains a provision that allows foreigners intending to stay in the Kingdom for a short period of time to notify the necessity and urgency of their work to the Department of Employment instead of applying for an ordinary work permit.

The advantage of this notification is that it is very quick to process (from a few days to a few hours).

The drawback is that this option is only available to those that come to perform “necessary and urgent” work. Furthermore the foreign person will be allowed to stay to perform such work 15 days per entry only, inclusive of weekends and holidays."

Ought to be here in the Act then: http://www.thailawfo...orking-Act.html

Yeap your correct...look at my post and the comment written in italic at the bottom, same thing...but for a temporary WP to be issued the person concerned needs a Non-imm visa , and infers a "B" to be issued the temporary WP, as far as I understand it a temporary WP...it doesnt replace the visa requirement and yes they are issued very quickly...

So,to sum up :

Archaic,ridiculously complicated and weighted down with reams of unecessary bureaucracy and paperwork and therefore not worth the hassle!

[Soutpeel]

The laws are seemingly from a time when people still traveled on elephants and telecommunications was sending someone running through the jungle. The problem is, they may use the archaic rules at their discretion. The usual story is one farang snitching on another out of revenge, competition, jealousy and so on.

I really, really hope full ASEAN implementation will cause changes in the Alien Working Act and it (and immigration's rules) will be updated to accommodate the increased mobility and possibility of remote work. Not holding my breath there. Although the provisions seem to be there on the work permit application form already (freelance/foreign company).

The full Asean thing may cause changes to the working act, but it will only benefit only those holding ASEAN passports, would suspect it nothing will change for "western" passport holders

[Soutpeel]

1. No you dont...a Non-imm B is ok....the rational is very simple, somebody intends visiting on business and leaving again to another country, they are not claiming residence in Thailand, which is what a lot of "on-liners" do

Actually .. wasn't there a thread couple of months ago, where it was mentioned the immigration (or was it labor ?) writes non-b visas (WP's ?) for people visiting Thailand for trade fairs, etc ?

EDIT: Ah yes this is how it works..

http://www.doingbusi...ork-permit.html

"Indeed Thai Labor law work definition is very broad and consists of exercising any activity whereby one exerts energy or uses knowledge, whether or not in consideration for wages or other benefits relating to business deemed as work under the law. It furthermore covers any work-related activity, either permanently or temporarily.

Applying for a proper work permit is not a solution that is suitable for people that comes for short business trip in Thailand.

There is a solution. Indeed, the Alien Working Act contains a provision that allows foreigners intending to stay in the Kingdom for a short period of time to notify the necessity and urgency of their work to the Department of Employment instead of applying for an ordinary work permit.

The advantage of this notification is that it is very quick to process (from a few days to a few hours).

The drawback is that this option is only available to those that come to perform “necessary and urgent” work. Furthermore the foreign person will be allowed to stay to perform such work 15 days per entry only, inclusive of weekends and holidays."

Ought to be here in the Act then: http://www.thailawfo...orking-Act.html

Yeap your correct...look at my post and the comment written in italic at the bottom, same thing...but for a temporary WP to be issued the person concerned needs a Non-imm visa , and infers a "B" to be issued the temporary WP, as far as I understand it a temporary WP...it doesnt replace the visa requirement and yes they are issued very quickly...

Archaic,ridiculously complicated and weighted down with reams of unecessary bureaucracy and paperwork and therefore not worth the hassle!

To be honest Thailand is one of the easier countries, go an try and get to permission to work legally in US as a foreigner, I have been through it, far more bureaucracy, paper and cost...you are into thousands of dollars, would suspect the UK is the same.

I agreed the rules here are bit convoluted, but once you understand the system a bit, pretty easy and not that expensive or difficult