Schengen Visa For Wife Of Eu National

[beano2274]

Wife and MIL have an appointment at the Italian Embassy tomorrow afternoon, fingers and toes crossed.

Just to recap she has her passports present and old ones, marriage certificate translated and certified by both the MFA and the British Embassy, my passport to prove my nationality and proof of traveling together.

Mother in Law has her passport old and new, proof that she is the mother of my wife translated and certified by the MFA, my passport and proof of traveling together.

Also the application forms and photos.

[beano2274]

Wife informed me that she and her mum will get 1 year visas and can collect them on Wednesday next week.

Well done to the Italian Embassy for knowing the rules and following them.

[cuddleypete]

Great news Beano

[beano2274]

She just told me that there seems to be something about 90 days on the receipt, not sure what this is, maybe allowed to stay for 90 days in the year, but will check, and keep you all informed.

[a99az]

Provided you are not travelling to your home country the provisions of the Directive apply. The effect of the Directive is to give eligible beneficiaries the right to a visa.

This principle is laid down in Article 5 (2) of the Directive. It is interpreted in the Handbook for processing visa applications issued by the European Council on March 19, 2010. Part III of the Handbook deals with family members. It deals with the issue by asking three questions:

Question no 1: Is there an EU citizen from whom the visa applicant can derive any rights? In this case, I presume that is you although you have not stated that you are an EU citizen.

Question no 2: Does the visa applicant fall under the definition of “family member”? Spouse is defined as "core family member"

Question no 3: Does the visa applicant accompany or join the EU citizen?

You only need to establish these three facts. You do not need to provide proof of funds or accommodation or purpose of travel. Nor does your wife require travel insurance. Any such requirement would be an infringement of your right to free movement.

The Directive also provides:

"Member States shall grant such persons every facility to obtain the necessary visas. Such visas shall be issued free of charge as soon as possible and on the basis of an accelerated procedure."

This means that your spouse should be able to walk into the consulate (every facilty), request an appointment and be granted the visa in a period shorter than that which would normally be granted to non-family members.

You should not be required to go to the outsourcing agent who will charge you a fee. (You may use the service if you choose.) However, according to the Handbook for organizing visa sections of 11th June 2010,

4.4. Direct access

Maintaining the possibility for visa applicants to lodge their applications directly at the

consulate instead of via an external service provider implies that there should be a genuine

choice between these two possibilities.

In other words, if you are not given a genuine choice to lodge your visa at the consulate directly the imposition of a service fee is unlawful.

These are your spouse's rights as a core family member of an EU citizen. Insist on them! Otherwise they are worthless.

Just got my wife's visa to Spain as her Spanish ID went out of date last month, "dam it" We got charged 800thb by the service provider (service fee) the visa was free. I wanted to protest this but felt I would be wasting my time here. I will wait until I get to Spain then send a copy of the receipt with a covering letter of complaint, to the relevant department.

[goatfarmer]

The question is, were you given a genuine choice to file at the embassy?

[beano2274]

So just got the visas for wife and MIL, both 1 year less one day, and with 90 days stay permitted.

next step is if I get a longer contract in Europe am looking to take my wife with me, and she will be learning German.

Edited March 22, 2013 by beano2274

[nataliadesandin]

Hi all,

I am Thai, married to Swedish man in koh samui. I never been to Sweden before and didn't apply for residence permit yet and we've plan to go to Greece this April. After I read all the comments from you guys I realize that my visa will be Follow EU spouse and it's free I went to apply at Greece embassy last Wed. after I called them twice and prepared documents they require from us.

So what I had with me that day was.

1) My passport & my husband passport also copied

2) Marriage certificate and copied ( translate to English and got a stamp from MFA )

3) Flight booking ( Bkk - Greece - Stockholm - Bkk ) Duration of my trip was 90 days as I expecting.

4) Schengen visa form for Greece ( I apply for Multiple )

5) Married status of my husband Birth certificate, Tax office, Sweden ( Skatteverket personbevis )

6) My photo 2" 2pcs

7) Invitation letter from sponsor. My husband boss send him email to request my visa to be granted, showing where we gonna stay in Greece

8) My Thai ID card copied

9) Travel insurance for 90 days

The officer ( one Thai lady ) in Greece embassy was polite and informed me to pick up my passport 29/Mar

No interview at all and no need to show bank statement. Will let you guys know soon what kind of Visa I'll got.

Thank you so much for all the information, I am really appreciated.

I need to ask one question from you guys, when I traveling with my husband from Bangkok..Do I really need to show my round trip ticket?? Or I just need only 1 way ticket to Greece... I don't want to be deny to boarding. Please kindly advise ASAP. Kob khun mak mak ka

Again, thank you so much and hope to hear from you guys soon.

Natalia

Edited March 23, 2013 by nataliadesandin

[beano2274]

Natalia

you did not need the insurance it is not required, also the flight bookings are not required.

Since you are going to his home country a few more things might have been required.

You have a valid visa so it does not matter what ticket you show.

Remember if you get a year visa with 90 days, that means 90 days in 180 days, after that the clock starts again and you can spend another 90 days with your husband. However, if going to live there, then there is no need to apply for a visa, you just apply directly for a Residence permit, with the documentation from your husband and yourself.

[nataliadesandin]

Many thx beano2274 for ur prompt reply.

As per our plan, me and my husband will fly out from Bkk - Doha - Greece by Qatar airways in mid of April but I am really scared about the return ticket if airlines counter will ask, Thai immigration officer will ask, Greece immigration officer will ask.!!??

Do I need any document or print out something to show them that I dont need it??

In case someone stop me from check- in or boarding!!

Please please please let me know how and what I should do? I am so confuse bcoz many friends said I will get in trouble!!

And to be honest with you I dont wanna buy a r/ticket either. I will apply for Residence permit ( Sweden ) online soon probably will have an interview at Embassy of Sweden in Athens, Greece.

Again, thanking in advance.

Natalia

[goatfarmer]

Hi all,

I am Thai, married to Swedish man in koh samui. I never been to Sweden before and didn't apply for residence permit yet and we've plan to go to Greece this April. After I read all the comments from you guys I realize that my visa will be Follow EU spouse and it's free I went to apply at Greece embassy last Wed. after I called them twice and prepared documents they require from us.

So what I had with me that day was.

1) My passport & my husband passport also copied

2) Marriage certificate and copied ( translate to English and got a stamp from MFA )

3) Flight booking ( Bkk - Greece - Stockholm - Bkk ) Duration of my trip was 90 days as I expecting.

4) Schengen visa form for Greece ( I apply for Multiple )

5) Married status of my husband Birth certificate, Tax office, Sweden ( Skatteverket personbevis )

6) My photo 2" 2pcs

7) Invitation letter from sponsor. My husband boss send him email to request my visa to be granted, showing where we gonna stay in Greece

8) My Thai ID card copied

9) Travel insurance for 90 days

The officer ( one Thai lady ) in Greece embassy was polite and informed me to pick up my passport 29/Mar

No interview at all and no need to show bank statement. Will let you guys know soon what kind of Visa I'll got.

Thank you so much for all the information, I am really appreciated.

I need to ask one question from you guys, when I traveling with my husband from Bangkok..Do I really need to show my round trip ticket?? Or I just need only 1 way ticket to Greece... I don't want to be deny to boarding. Please kindly advise ASAP. Kob khun mak mak ka

Again, thank you so much and hope to hear from you guys soon.

Natalia

Since your husband is an EU citizen from Sweden and you are going to a country other than his country of citizenship, Greece, you are a beneficiary of the Directive 2004/38/EC, as we have discussed above: http://eur-lex.europa.eu/LexUriServ/LexUriServ.do?uri=CONSLEG:2004L0038:20110616:EN:PDF#zoom=100

All you need to prove is that:

i. you are married to an EU citizen of a country other than Greece - marriage certificate and husband's passport copies;

ii. that you are travelling together - flight bookings

iii. passport photos

iv. passport

You are then entitled to a visa, free of charge, as soon as possible, and on the basis of an accelerated procedure.

The following items are not required by law:

5) Married status of my husband Birth certificate, Tax office, Sweden ( Skatteverket personbevis ) - unnecessary if you supply his passport copy

7) Invitation letter from sponsor. My husband boss send him email to

request my visa to be granted, showing where we gonna stay in Greece - unlawful to require this document

8) My Thai ID card copied - unnecessary

9) Travel insurance for 90 days - unlawful to require this document.

Since you have already applied it's too late to protest about unlawful requirements. (If I take my wife to Greece, as I am contemplating, I might take up the matter with them.)

By law you are only required to show that you are travelling together. Once you are in Greece you are entitled to apply to stay permanently after the initial 90 days. So there can be no requirement of a return ticket.

Edited March 23, 2013 by goatfarmer

[goatfarmer]

Many thx beano2274 for ur prompt reply.

As per our plan, me and my husband will fly out from Bkk - Doha - Greece by Qatar airways in mid of April but I am really scared about the return ticket if airlines counter will ask, Thai immigration officer will ask, Greece immigration officer will ask.!!??

Do I need any document or print out something to show them that I dont need it??

In case someone stop me from check- in or boarding!!

Please please please let me know how and what I should do? I am so confuse bcoz many friends said I will get in trouble!!

And to be honest with you I dont wanna buy a r/ticket either. I will apply for Residence permit ( Sweden ) online soon probably will have an interview at Embassy of Sweden in Athens, Greece.

Again, thanking in advance.

Natalia

You are dealing with an area of the law that too few people understand. You could have trouble simply because the airlines don't know the law and it is too confusing for them. On the other hand, my wife has never been asked by an airline for a return ticket when going to Europe (six or seven times). I doubt you will be asked to show a return ticket. However, in the remote event that you are asked, I suggest you familiarize yourself with Article 7 of the Directive and persuade whoever it is you need to persuade that you are a person within Paragraph (d) of that Article and therefore entitled to stay longer than 90 days and so no return ticket is required.

Article 7

Right of residence for more than three months

1. All Union citizens shall have the right of residence on the territory

of another Member State for a period of longer than three months if

they:

(a) are workers or self-employed persons in the host Member State; or

(b have sufficient resources for themselves and their family members

not to become a burden on the social assistance system of the host

Member State during their period of residence and have compre

hensive sickness insurance cover in the host Member State; or

(c — are enrolled at a private or public establishment, accredited or

financed by the host Member State on the basis of its legislation

or administrative practice, for the principal purpose of following

a course of study, including vocational training; and

▼

C1

2004L0038 — EN — 16.06.2011 — 001.001 — 10

­

— have comprehensive sickness insurance cover in the host

Member State and assure the relevant national authority, by

means of a declaration or by such equivalent means as they

may choose, that they have sufficient resources for themselves

and their family members not to become a burden on the social

assistance system of the host Member State during their period

of residence; or

(d) are family members accompanying or joining a Union citizen who

satisfies the conditions referred to in points (a), (b or (c.

Edited March 23, 2013 by goatfarmer

[nataliadesandin]

Thank you so much goatfarmer!! Really appreciated your help, now I feel more relax.

I feel much happy now and really understand that even Greece embassy officer ( Thai ) she didnt really aware and understand this law. She didn't know what correct document I suppose to give the embassy hihi Just want everything hahaha

I gave all documents as she said so... just bring what I told you! that what she told me on the phone anyway lets see the visa this Friday 29th

I will printout all the above details you gave me, kob khun mak mak ka Have a great day!!

Natalia

[nataliadesandin]

Hi all,

Sorry for late update, first of all I have to thank you to you guys for all kindness. I got Schengen Multi 90 days Tourist visa from Greek embassy ( Gratis ).

We spend almost a week in Greece and moved to Sweden.

After few days in Sweden, my husband and I went to Tax office to register our new address. Few days later we got a letter from Tax office said they can't register me until I have a Residence card. Anyway, we just move here, it doesn't matter.

Also in the same day he took me to Immigration office, applied for a residence and work permit.

We paid 1500SEK fee ( about 150 Euro ) and have to wait for a decision about 10 months hmm....

Two ladies officer advised me that during waiting time for a decision I must return to my home country!! They both asked me if I'm not interest to return to Thailand?? Buhahaha I said not at the moment, I just arrive. Seem like they're not welcome me.

I need your advise again! What do I need to do before my 3 months visa expired? Should I go to Immigration again or......??? Please kindly advise.

Thanking in advance.

Natalia

[7by7]

As your husband is Swedish and you are applying for residence in Sweden, I'm afraid that the EEA regulations don't apply.

These regulations only apply if you and your husband wish to live in an EEA country other than the one of which he is a national.

That is, any EEA country except Sweden.

To live with your husband in Sweden you need to apply under the Swedish immigration rules.

I'm afraid that I have no idea of those; but if the Swedish immigration office says you have to return to Thailand to await the decision on your application, then I guess that's what you will have to do.

[The Learner]

How about going to "live and work in " Norway or Finland?

Do the 3-5 months to qualify for EEA Surinder Singh, then off to Sweden?

I seem to remember my time in Norway, just a few years ago, there was no stopping at the borders between Sweden and Norway, it was all common travel area sort of stuff.

TL

[nataliadesandin]

Thanks so much for your kindness, both of you. Have a wonderful day.

Will update soon.

Natalia

[Arkady]

Just looked into the French embassy, Bangkok, TLS websites. They seem to provide for EU family members not paying the fee and submitting documents mainly relating to their relationship to an EU citizen, rather than reasons to return to Thailand, but what seems to be missing is an accelerated visa procedure and ability to apply direct to the embassy without an appointment. They still talk about applying online for an appointment with TLS. Also they list birth certificate as required by family members of EU citizens which I have never been asked for by other EU embassies even for a non-family member. Anyone had experience of this?

A friend's wife applied via TLS, not knowing the rules and paid the 60 euros and submitted documents covering life story. TLS didn't mention that she could have saved the visa fee and cut down less trees. But I think this is par for the course and what all the EU embassies hope family members will do. Ignorance is bliss or was until I told them they had been conned.

Edited May 21, 2013 by Arkady

[MJCM]

Just looked into the French embassy, Bangkok, TLS websites. They seem to provide for EU family members not paying the fee and submitting documents mainly relating to their relationship to an EU citizen, rather than reasons to return to Thailand, but what seems to be missing is an accelerated visa procedure and ability to apply direct to the embassy without an appointment. They still talk about applying online for an appointment with TLS.

Also they list birth certificate as required by family members of EU citizens which I have never been asked for by other EU embassies even for a non-family member. Anyone had experience of this?

<snip>

Aren't the requirements for birth certificates only there when a minor applies ?? That would be the case when applying in other European Nations.

[Arkady]

Just looked into the French embassy, Bangkok, TLS websites. They seem to provide for EU family members not paying the fee and submitting documents mainly relating to their relationship to an EU citizen, rather than reasons to return to Thailand, but what seems to be missing is an accelerated visa procedure and ability to apply direct to the embassy without an appointment. They still talk about applying online for an appointment with TLS.

Also they list birth certificate as required by family members of EU citizens which I have never been asked for by other EU embassies even for a non-family member. Anyone had experience of this?

<snip>

Aren't the requirements for birth certificates only there when a minor applies ?? That would be the case when applying in other European Nations.

I think you must be right that it would only be required to proof relationship of a minor child to an EU citizen, although that was not mentioned and it looked ambiguous. I suppose a minor child would equally not be asked to produce a marriage certificate that was also on the list.

[Arkady]

I am at the planning stages of a trip. Does anyone know which embassy is in Bkk most user friendly to wives of EU citizens applying for Schengen visas: Holland, Spain or Portugal?

France looks like it is even more of a sod than Germany. I think Beano posted last year that the French allow EU family members to apply through an accelerated process direct at the embassy only on Monday mornings between 10 and 11 by appointment only and they only accpept the first 7. However, this is not mentioned on their website or on TLS's. Not really feeling like donating any euros to that country at the moment.

[josephinebloggs]

The sad fact of the matter is that certain European embassies in Bangkok employ some truly repulsive Thai individuals to work in their visa sections who get a power kick out of trying to treat the spouses of EU nationals using their rights to apply for Schengen visas under the "freedom of movement" provisions as if they are common criminals and prostitutes. The expat embassy staff can't be bothered with these trivial details interrupting their cocktail party hangovers and leave the locally engaged staff to do whatever they feel like, unless some one complains forcibly. Anyway, since these embassies would prefer that everyone applied through the outsource agencies and pay them a fee, they want to make the "freedom of movement" applications as difficult and degrading as possible.

Put better than I ever could.

The UK embassy should be included in this.

[Arkady]

The sad fact of the matter is that certain European embassies in Bangkok employ some truly repulsive Thai individuals to work in their visa sections who get a power kick out of trying to treat the spouses of EU nationals using their rights to apply for Schengen visas under the "freedom of movement" provisions as if they are common criminals and prostitutes. The expat embassy staff can't be bothered with these trivial details interrupting their cocktail party hangovers and leave the locally engaged staff to do whatever they feel like, unless some one complains forcibly. Anyway, since these embassies would prefer that everyone applied through the outsource agencies and pay them a fee, they want to make the "freedom of movement" applications as difficult and degrading as possible.

Put better than I ever could.

The UK embassy should be included in this.

True. The British government is in total violation of the EU's freedom of movement principle vis a vis family members of EU citizens. Unfortunately it gets away with it by not being a party to the Schengen Treaty.

[Arkady]

I have now put in Mrs Arkady's Schengen application with the Spanish. Spain is in fact the country we will spend more days than other Schengen states on our trip. The Spanish Embassy's website no longer has any information about visas which is now only available from VFS. VFS informs that EU spouses need to provide a copy of marriage certiifcate legalised by the embassy of the spouse's country (all embassies seem to require this now) and that they don't need to provide information about employment and economic means or details of accommodation in Schengenland but fails to mention that no visa fees are payable. It is also vague about where to apply, saying that you can apply to the Spanish Embassy direct but need to send them an email for an appointment first and cannot go there without one. God knows how long it would take them to reply in Mananaland, if ever. So that doesn't sound like a great option.

To clarify things I called VFS and someone picked up the phone immediately. "No, your wife can't apply for a Schengen visa at the embassy. She can only apply here." Documents required for the wife of a non-Spanish EU citizen include all the usual employment and bank statement guff, travel insurance etc and there is a 60 euros visa fee. When I said excuse me but I understand that some of those documents are not in fact required and there is no visa fee, she cleared her throat and apologised for her obviously deliberate mistake and confirmed that I was right.

I tried to make an appointment online, which the VFS website said is recommended but not compulsory but their system was screwed up and this wasn't possible. So we just showed up there and luckily there wasn't a big queue. The VFS staffer was friendly and polite but a little clueless. She tried to demand hotel reservations and a visa fee but scuttled off to ask someone and confirmed that neither was necessary. Then came the gotcha. A service fee of B860 for VFS, I argued with her a little and showed the EU directive and manual but she didn't have a clue and firmly believed that Spain is permitted to set its own Schengen visa regulations and fees. There was no one worthwhile arguing with and, of course, we ended up paying the service fee. The Schengen regulations provide a let out to embassies that, if someone opts to forego their right to apply direct to an embassy, they are entitled to charge them normal fees and demand all documents. We didn't exactly opt to forego that right, since we were told the embassy would let us apply to them but I suppose they would just lie about this, if challenged. At least they are permitting EU family members to apply with reduced documentation at VFS and give them a discount on the fee, although it is obvious that they try their best to con people into providing full documentation and paying the 60 euros first. They said the visa would be ready in 15 days (including weekends) which is the upper limit for EU family members in the manual, unless there are problems with the application. This is acceptable in our case but doesn't appear to be the required accelerated process because they have notices up saying it is taking 15 days for everyone, whereas they are required to give EU family members a faster service than others.

Edited June 3, 2013 by Arkady

[Arkady]

Out of curiosity I have revisited the website of the obnoxious German Embassy in Bangkok, even though I have no intention of ever getting Mrs Arkady to apply there again and don't care, if I ever visit that country again or not.

The good news is that they have now added the asterix to question 19 on the application form, so they are no longer illegally asking for the current occupation of EU family members. On the other hand the information they used to have in English informing EU family members of their right to apply to the embassy without an appointment has been scrubbed completely. In fact there seems nothing there in English at all any more - only German and Thai. The German advises EU family members of their right to apply at the embassy without an appointment but strongly recommends that they call for an appointment on the special hot line that costs 9 baht a minute. I couldn't find anything in the German advising about the reduced documentation for EU family members and couldn't find any mention of EU family members in the Thai at all.

[The Learner]

Perhaps the German embassy in Thailand is not up to scratch then.

I can't say the same for the German embassy in Beijing.

We express posted off all our documents for "Shengen visa for spouse of EU citizen"

That was on a Tuesday last week.

On Thursday, they sent us a secure message, to say they were returning the notorised marriage certificate, as it had not been legalised, and they would put the visa application on hold.

We got that notorised marriage document back by express mail on Saturday

On the same Saturday, we express mailed it to agents in Beijing, who would get it into the "Chinese Ministry for Foreign Affairs" on Monday, for signing and authentification.

It will be ready Tuesday we were told.

My wife planned a train trip up to Beijing to the agents office for Tuesday, to hand collect the the legalised document, and then to hand deliver it to the German embassy in Beijing, (hour and a half on subways) which is open in the afternoons from 3:00pm to 4:00pm for additional documents, (08:30 to 09:30 for fresh applications)

Her passport was received back in our apartment yesterday, Friday.

It actually took them just 2 days to issue the visa.

So our experience was a good experience, apart from us not knowing about the notorised marriage document, also needing to be legalised.

We fly out of China on 17th June.

TL