Bravo Mike Posted February 5, 2006 Share Posted February 5, 2006 Hello ladies, this is my first venture into your forum area so I hope that I am not intruding but I have a sensitive question to ask. I am a 42 yo Australian guy and am due to marry my 31 yo Thai gf soon.My question is this, we have been in a totally plutonic relationship and will remain this way until the marriage.She is a university educated lady with strong family values and is still a virgin, we have had no sexual contact at all.I have never been in this situation before and to be honest I dont really know how I should approach our future sex life.We have not discussed this matter as yet but I am interested to hear your opinions on how to encourage her to fully enjoy and explore the intimate side of our impending marriage.Given that she is very shy and has strong Thai values I want to ensure that I approach this matter in a way that makes her happy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jezchesters Posted February 6, 2006 Share Posted February 6, 2006 Hello ladies, this is my first venture into your forum area so I hope that I am not intruding but I have a sensitive question to ask.I am a 42 yo Australian guy and am due to marry my 31 yo Thai gf soon.My question is this, we have been in a totally plutonic relationship and will remain this way until the marriage.She is a university educated lady with strong family values and is still a virgin, we have had no sexual contact at all.I have never been in this situation before and to be honest I dont really know how I should approach our future sex life.We have not discussed this matter as yet but I am interested to hear your opinions on how to encourage her to fully enjoy and explore the intimate side of our impending marriage.Given that she is very shy and has strong Thai values I want to ensure that I approach this matter in a way that makes her happy Hi Mike! This is also my first post in this section of the forum - welcome! I really don't want to tread on anyone's toes here, but I really think you are in a unique situation. I have lived in Europe, East Africa, and several countries in SE Asia - really don't want to sound like a know-it-all here - but I have encountered many different religions and cultures, all of which I try to empathise with... However, I have yet to come across - in any situation - a culture/religion where it is normal to be a virgin at the age of 31... I am not saying that this is abnormal, I am merely observing thatthe situation you seem to find yourself in has nothing to do with cultural values... Again, I apologise for intruding on this section of the forum, but I would like to pose one question: Your relationship so far has been platonic. Does this mean that you have never kissed? Or anything further along the wide range between kissing and consumating a marriage? I think that therein lies the answer - and please, regular contributors to this section of the forum, correct me if I'm wrong, becuase this is a totally male perspective on the situation... Mike! I hope all goes well for you in the forthcoming matrimony - seriously! I just think that should you be comfortable with this situation, you would be asking your future wife these questions, rather than posting your doubts on a forum... Just my opinion and, good luck! Jez Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cdnvic Posted February 6, 2006 Share Posted February 6, 2006 My wife has had friends as old as 38 come to her asking questions about what happens after they get married because they have never been sexual yet. It's getting less common, but its not at all unheared of in Thailand. cv Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LaoPo Posted February 6, 2006 Share Posted February 6, 2006 However, I have yet to come across - in any situation - a culture/religion where it is normal to be a virgin at the age of 31...Jez Hello Jez....second time I'm answering to one of your posts... To the above: China!!! Although not 'normal' there are many, many girls/ladies well into their 30's and forties who are still virgin. My wife is Chinese and she knows quite a few of them in her friends' and family circles. Sad but true. Also, it is considered very normal in China that these girls/ladies still live with their parents....not quite a 'healthy' situation for them in order to find a partner LaoPo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taxexile Posted February 6, 2006 Share Posted February 6, 2006 I am not saying that this is abnormal, I am merely observing thatthe situation you seem to find yourself in has nothing to do with cultural values... it has everything to do with cultural values. thai culture encourages women to refrain from sex until marriage , that these days fewer and fewer women uphold those cultural values does not change those traditional values. whether holding out until marriage is down to a respect for tradition or down to feelings of sexual guilt is another matter entirely. my wife also knows chinese thais in their forties who are still unmarried and virgins , or at least they claim to be virgins , thai women are much less laddish and boastful about their sex lives than western women. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gisele Posted February 6, 2006 Share Posted February 6, 2006 However, I have yet to come across - in any situation - a culture/religion where it is normal to be a virgin at the age of 31... Jez Hello Jez....second time I'm answering to one of your posts... To the above: China!!! Although not 'normal' there are many, many girls/ladies well into their 30's and forties who are still virgin. My wife is Chinese and she knows quite a few of them in her friends' and family circles. Sad but true. Also, it is considered very normal in China that these girls/ladies still live with their parents....not quite a 'healthy' situation for them in order to find a partner LaoPo ]Quite true, I lived in China 5 years and had several friends ask me what they should expect. And this from women and also men. It's not as if there's alot of places they can go to be private. They live with the parents and there's always a relative at home, often the grandmom. They have no car, there's no motels. In Beijing, they go to the park, stake out the most private bench they can find. there they hug and smooch, that's it. All the benches are taken at 5pm until sunset. It's cute. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dara Posted February 7, 2006 Share Posted February 7, 2006 However, I have yet to come across - in any situation - a culture/religion where it is normal to be a virgin at the age of 31...I am not saying that this is abnormal, I am merely observing thatthe situation you seem to find yourself in has nothing to do with cultural values... It is common enough for Thai girls from conservative families to remain virgins until they are married, no matter how old, and therefore OP's situation is not abnormal at all. Thai culture is rather complex when it comes to sexual matters- lots of standards and practices for lots of people even in the same social strata. The sexual revolution for the younger generations seemed to have come with the widespread of sexually explicit media of recent decades - perhaps in the near future, it would be abnormal to find Thai virgins over the age of 15, but it doesn't seem so just now... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sbk Posted February 7, 2006 Share Posted February 7, 2006 I'm with Dara on this one, at least where I live; good girls don't and if you do then you'd better get married or be labeled a slut. If a local girl is not a virgin when she marries then most likely she lost it to the man who became her husband. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlyingDutchman Posted February 7, 2006 Share Posted February 7, 2006 WOW ! ... virgin, living with parents and over 40 ?! They must be 'winkeldochters' then, as we call them here in Holland (the Netherlands). Translated it's 'store-daughters' ... it means unsellable/unable to sell items ... In other words : ugly woman . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cdnvic Posted February 7, 2006 Share Posted February 7, 2006 WOW ! ... virgin, living with parents and over 40 ?!They must be 'winkeldochters' then, as we call them here in Holland (the Netherlands). Translated it's 'store-daughters' ... it means unsellable/unable to sell items ... In other words : ugly woman . Or perhaps they just kept meeting men that they considered were unworthy. cv Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlyingDutchman Posted February 7, 2006 Share Posted February 7, 2006 Or perhaps they just kept meeting men that they considered were unworthy. cv Or perhaps they are lesbians that do not get out of the closet because of their intolerate family Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Polly Posted February 7, 2006 Share Posted February 7, 2006 Or perhaps they think that ugly white brothel creepers who think that because they have a choice, they must be ugly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlyingDutchman Posted February 7, 2006 Share Posted February 7, 2006 Or perhaps they think that ugly white brothel creepers who think that because they have a choice, they must be ugly. Luckely I'm not any of these . I never went to a brothel (well, never scr*w*d paying money ...) and 'tastes may be different', but ugly is nòt my middle name ... ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Polly Posted February 7, 2006 Share Posted February 7, 2006 Well of course not. You are all 'hamsum man' aren't you? This is a ladies forum, so keep your insults to yourself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LaoPo Posted February 7, 2006 Share Posted February 7, 2006 (edited) WOW ! ... virgin, living with parents and over 40 ?!They must be 'winkeldochters' then, as we call them here in Holland (the Netherlands). Translated it's 'store-daughters' ... it means unsellable/unable to sell items ... In other words : ugly woman . Your remarks show you still have a lot to learn in Asia ....it's a completely wrong assumption you made here, and insulting. LaoPo Edited February 7, 2006 by LaoPo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlyingDutchman Posted February 7, 2006 Share Posted February 7, 2006 Well of course not. You are all 'hamsum man' aren't you? This is a ladies forum, so keep your insults to yourself. Mr.Churchill once said : 'Melady, I'm drunk now; but sober tomorrow ... you will still be ugly'. Why can't it be as I said ? Maybe they are ugly, or lesbians or even frigid ? And afraid of men ? It is not normal for a woman to stay virgin after 40. The change of getting a [healthy] child will be reduced very, vèry much ... We in Holland got virgins the age of 85, but these are nons in duty of their lord; I'm not talking about these women. I'm talking about regular women. For sure I will not be involved with a virgin the age of 40. This is my opinion, not an insult. And why they remain virgin; that's their choice (and I say not always their own ...). WOW ! ... virgin, living with parents and over 40 ?! They must be 'winkeldochters' then, as we call them here in Holland (the Netherlands). Translated it's 'store-daughters' ... it means unsellable/unable to sell items ... In other words : ugly woman . Your remarks show you still have a lot to learn in Asia ....it's a completely wrong assumption you made here, and insulting. LaoPo Insulting ? ... read the above ... It's not normal for a regular woman. A woman should bare children, not as a duty, but as nature made it that way. They are wasting their woman lives, as for my opinion. And I am only trying to find out, why they waste their femanine lives. It's no insult. If someone is ugly, they will have least possibility's to gain a suitible spouse. Man or woman ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jai Dee Posted February 7, 2006 Share Posted February 7, 2006 Although the OP has not been back, his subject was posted in the Ladies Forum. If you guys are going to post here too, please read the Ladies Forum Rules and give some thought to what you are going to say, and consider if it adds value to the subject or not, before you post again. Clearly, some of you have not read them, so please do so... before you respond again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bravo Mike Posted February 7, 2006 Author Share Posted February 7, 2006 Your comments are neither welcome or required on this subject Mr Flying Dutchman. Your insensitive remarks are far removed from my original question regarding how to approach this matter that I have brought into the ladies area for their opinions, not for your narrow minded view of the asian position on the matter. I am more than happy to respect the choice of women in regard to their body and how they choose to deal with it, as stated before I am just concerned about how to approach the subject so I can be confident that we will have a happy relationship and share the physical side as well as the mental side of our forth coming life together. I understand the initial shyness and dont want to scare her away from enjoying herself and being a willing partner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlyingDutchman Posted February 7, 2006 Share Posted February 7, 2006 Although the OP has not been back, his subject was posted in the Ladies Forum.If you guys are going to post here too, please read the Ladies Forum Rules and give some thought to what you are going to say, and consider if it adds value to the subject or not, before you post again. Clearly, some of you have not read them, so please do so... before you respond again. ... I didn't mean to insult women and surely nòt Bravo Mike's future wife. I would be signing a paper when my future wife would be a virgin; so, Bravo Mike : Congratulations ! The MOD's are free to descard my posts. Let me tell you again : I am surprised there seem to be a lot of women (especially in China) over 40 which are virgin. This is very unusual in the Arab world (marriage) en quite unusual in the Western world (boy-friends). There is a saying in Holland ('winkeldochters'), which I expressed here. Ànd I expressed my opinion about a female, wanting to marry, but is due 40 ... That is not a right age to get married for a woman. I realy don't care, if/when they don't, I'm just surprised. If someone feels insulted; I'm sorry, I just expressed my 'Western feelings' [gotto learn the face more ...] upon the '40 yo.+ virgins', but I remain my standpoint that, whèn these women wànts to marry [and wannah have children], they are a little late ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meadish_sweetball Posted February 7, 2006 Share Posted February 7, 2006 Flying Dutchman, The most commonly found reason women are still unmarried in Thailand at a relatively high age, is because they are highly educated and want to choose a professional career. Many Thai men are not happy to marry such women, because they are primarily looking for homemakers or err... love makers, with which they would normally not formalize any ties. It is hardly a unique cultural trait of Thailand that many men do not feel comfortable with women who are more highly educated and more successful in their working life then their boyfriend/prospective husband. Therefore you will find many women in this situation looking for Western husbands, as it *might* be easier (or at any rate thought to be easier) to find a foreign man who is ready to accept a working woman, or indeed, marry a woman who is past 30. I think Thailand is changing in this respect, but the trend seems to suggest the above anyway. It is of course true that in some cases it is due to lesbianism, but hardly in the majority of cases. It is best to be careful with applying assumptions based on other cultures on Thailand. As for sex, it is true that virginity until marriage is the cultural norm, but it seems to be eroded very quickly, at least in the cities as far as I can see. Finally back on topic (sorry for not being a lady, but here are my thoughts anyway, take them or leave them): My personal suspicion is that if everything else in the OPs relationship seems good, he will not have any problems on the sexual side either. Some traditional women are more than willing to explore their sexuality once the formality of marriage is over and done with. My general feeling is you may want to introduce your ideas gradually and not play out the entire Kama Sutra from the start, and if the love and desire is truly there, then surely the sexual side should follow... You may need to take the lead in the beginning, but with encouragement and playfulness I am sure you'll be able to get a good groove goin'.. Good luck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlyingDutchman Posted February 7, 2006 Share Posted February 7, 2006 Flying Dutchman, The most commonly found reason women are still unmarried in Thailand at a relatively high age, is because they are highly educated and want to choose a professional career. ... Finally back on topic (sorry for not being a lady, but here are my thoughts anyway, take them or leave them): ... Good luck! THX for your reply meadish_sweetball. It's quite the same all over the world (even in Arab country's; I've chatted with highly educated women in the "strict Muslim world" which felt old at 27, not married, but not willing to marry "this moron Muslim"). Due to the reply of meadish_sweetball, I say "Sorry" for the 2nd time. Best of wishes to the '40+ virgin', maybe I'm still a Western moron. On topic : Bravo Mike, I'm not a woman; but making love is naturally born in most of us. Man or woman. Just be gentil and romantic. Be a 'knight in white armour' and respect your wife. Be patient in your desires concentrate on her desires and ... well just await . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sbk Posted February 8, 2006 Share Posted February 8, 2006 Flying Dutchman, First off, the OP's fiancee is 31, not 40 so lets just drop the whole 40 year old virgin discussion shall we? And as for the idea that a woman's purpose in life is to have children, well, that is your opinion only so that does not make it the only valid opinion, OK? The topic at hand is about a man who wants to know if 1) his future wife is complying to her country's norm (she is) not Europe, not the Middle East. and 2) how to deal with that. The answer to 2) is easy enough, I doubt she is a virgin because she is afraid of sex or a lesbian but because she is complying to societal and family norms that she believes to be valid. Virgin doesn't mean frigid. Gently, carefully and lots of explanations will help. Too many men rush into sex thinking it is about themselves and fail to remember that their partner is an active participant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bravo Mike Posted February 8, 2006 Author Share Posted February 8, 2006 Thanks sbk, you are quite right and I am more than happy with 'stlye' of waiting for the right guy. I have never slept with a Thai lady never mind a virgin.Ive read so many different articles about thai girls not willing or wanting to enjoy lovemaking that it has driven me to post in this forum. The reasons always state that the girls find it difficult to relax in bed due to the negative pressures forced on them by family and society in general. Is this true? I will endeavour to my best in this regard and I don’t have a single minded focus to sex as it is best enjoyed when both partners have an interest and a willingness to share and experiment with each other. I think good sex it only possible when your mind allows your body to relax and be comfortable with lovemaking. It is the mindset of Thai women that I am trying to understand so please let me know how to approach this. I want my future wife to enjoy all aspects of our relationship and of course this includes wanting her to have a positive and healthy appetite foe sex It is the female opinion that I am after so thanks for your input Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dr_Pat_Pong Posted February 18, 2006 Share Posted February 18, 2006 WOW ! ... virgin, living with parents and over 40 ?!They must be 'winkeldochters' then, as we call them here in Holland (the Netherlands). Translated it's 'store-daughters' ... it means unsellable/unable to sell items ... In other words : ugly woman . You really are somethin' else aren't you Dutchie ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TBWG Posted February 19, 2006 Share Posted February 19, 2006 Although the OP has not been back, his subject was posted in the Ladies Forum. If you guys are going to post here too, please read the Ladies Forum Rules and give some thought to what you are going to say, and consider if it adds value to the subject or not, before you post again. Clearly, some of you have not read them, so please do so... before you respond again. ... I didn't mean to insult women and surely nòt Bravo Mike's future wife. I would be signing a paper when my future wife would be a virgin; so, Bravo Mike : Congratulations ! The MOD's are free to descard my posts. Let me tell you again : I am surprised there seem to be a lot of women (especially in China) over 40 which are virgin. This is very unusual in the Arab world (marriage) en quite unusual in the Western world (boy-friends). There is a saying in Holland ('winkeldochters'), which I expressed here. Ànd I expressed my opinion about a female, wanting to marry, but is due 40 ... That is not a right age to get married for a woman. I realy don't care, if/when they don't, I'm just surprised. If someone feels insulted; I'm sorry, I just expressed my 'Western feelings' [gotto learn the face more ...] upon the '40 yo.+ virgins', but I remain my standpoint that, whèn these women wànts to marry [and wannah have children], they are a little late ... Wow Flying Dutchman ...for someone who has only been a member for a couple of weeks you certainly get up a lot of peoples nose's. For non brits that means he p****s them off!! TBWG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sbk Posted February 20, 2006 Share Posted February 20, 2006 Although the OP has not been back, his subject was posted in the Ladies Forum. If you guys are going to post here too, please read the Ladies Forum Rules and give some thought to what you are going to say, and consider if it adds value to the subject or not, before you post again. Clearly, some of you have not read them, so please do so... before you respond again. ... I didn't mean to insult women and surely nòt Bravo Mike's future wife. I would be signing a paper when my future wife would be a virgin; so, Bravo Mike : Congratulations ! The MOD's are free to descard my posts. Let me tell you again : I am surprised there seem to be a lot of women (especially in China) over 40 which are virgin. This is very unusual in the Arab world (marriage) en quite unusual in the Western world (boy-friends). There is a saying in Holland ('winkeldochters'), which I expressed here. Ànd I expressed my opinion about a female, wanting to marry, but is due 40 ... That is not a right age to get married for a woman. I realy don't care, if/when they don't, I'm just surprised. If someone feels insulted; I'm sorry, I just expressed my 'Western feelings' [gotto learn the face more ...] upon the '40 yo.+ virgins', but I remain my standpoint that, whèn these women wànts to marry [and wannah have children], they are a little late ... Wow Flying Dutchman ...for someone who has only been a member for a couple of weeks you certainly get up a lot of peoples nose's. For non brits that means he p****s them off!! TBWG Don't encourage him, I think he has said quite enough already in this forum, don't you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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