Trembly Posted November 6, 2012 Share Posted November 6, 2012 I think alot of the negativity stems seemingly from the fact that to "legally" work here unless employed by a foreign Corporation , you have to fulfill the criteria of performing a skill/trade that a Thai is not capable of , therefore not denying a native of an employment opportunity . Essentially ,teaching English and working as a Dive-master currently meet these req's and therefore provide options for some people to stay here longer than they otherwise would be able (which I don't see as a bad thing ). Most ex-pats on the forum will be acquainted with someone who falls into this category of "non-career "teacher with a TEFL certificate ,who openly admit that they are just going through the motions . Teacher training in the UK ; 4-6 years ? TEFL training ...4-6 weeks ! Qualified ,experienced teachers normally do get the respect they deserve ..others don't because of this stigma and abuse/opportunism ...depending on your standpoint . You can complete a PGCE which gives you Qualified Teacher Status in the UK within a year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigJohnnyBKK Posted November 6, 2012 Share Posted November 6, 2012 You can complete a PGCE which gives you Qualified Teacher Status in the UK within a year. Wow, didn't realize that; presumably post-graduate or can it be done concurrently with a non-Ed bachelor's? But likely won't get a decent job in a real int'l school without the work experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacktrip Posted November 6, 2012 Share Posted November 6, 2012 (edited) english teaching here is a visa mill, it does not inspire a lot of confidence in the skills of the teacher for one thing. Edited November 6, 2012 by jacktrip Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trembly Posted November 6, 2012 Share Posted November 6, 2012 (edited) You can complete a PGCE which gives you Qualified Teacher Status in the UK within a year. Wow, didn't realize that; presumably post-graduate or can it be done concurrently with a non-Ed bachelor's? But likely won't get a decent job in a real int'l school without the work experience. It's post-grad because you can't commence PGCE training without a bachelor's in the subject that you will teach, or one that is closely related. Edited November 6, 2012 by Trembly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
farang000999 Posted November 6, 2012 Share Posted November 6, 2012 When I first came to Thailand in 2004 there did not seem to be a whole lot of young farang in the country. That has really changed. Now so many jobs are tech related and done from home and the number of international schools and demand for young farang teachers have risen. When I first came to Thailand I encountered quite a few of these middle aged and broke types who would gleefully tell you about their escapades while you remained silent and avoided eye contact hoping they would stop. Teaching seemed to be the only way they could afford to remain in the country. There are still plenty of these types around I imagine but I don't seem to run into them as often. The type of farang in Thailand over the last 8 years has become more upscale for a lack of better words. I think the Peter Pan types have moved into Cambodia as it fits them better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tfc Posted November 6, 2012 Share Posted November 6, 2012 The only negative thing I have to say about English teachers is that I really didn't enjoy the experience of being one 13 years ago. I had plenty of admiration for the teachers around me that did it well though. As for me I felt sorry for the students that I taught which is why I gave it up. Good money back then but that was Vietnam. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chonburiram Posted November 6, 2012 Share Posted November 6, 2012 What happened to the generation who was chanting that classic? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigJohnnyBKK Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 It's post-grad because you can't commence PGCE training without a bachelor's in the subject that you will teach, or one that is closely related. So for a high school student wanting to become a primary teacher just getting a B.Ed would be the way to go. . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigJohnnyBKK Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 What happened to the generation who was chanting that classic? They ended up flipping burgers down at mickey D's while the well-paying jobs were sent overseas to places where people never stopped valuing education. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chiangmaikelly Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 Why? Because of stereotypical posts like the following, " Because many people(NOT ALL) on this forum are very unhappy with their lives. They live here for any of several reasons. They didn't plan for the future and in a small village in Thailand is the only place they can afford to live. 2) They couldn't find a woman in their own country, so they come here and use their money to get and keep a woman and she and her family are a constant drain on his finances. 3) Some people are just hateful and bitter and criticize anything and everything they can. And there are some people on this forum that can only feel good about themselves if they are belittling someone else." There is just no excuse for an adult to post something like that especially when posting about negative stereotyping. I think teaching is a great profession and have the utmost respect for many teachers just not some of the ones posting in this thread. I wasn't stereotyping. I didn't say old men living in Chiang Mai. I said many of the people. This is wide open young, old, rich or poor, sorry it's not a stereotype. I hope I am able to sleep tonight with the knowledge that you don't respect me, because that means so much to me. The comment was made, "I think if we heard this kind of snobbery towards teachers from someone working in say Morgan Stanley in BKK, it would be slightly more understandable. It tends to eminate mostly from older guys, "i`v e lived hear so long I`m nearly a local" types, usually shacked up in a sleepy village with a girl half their age." You're comment, “Truer words have never been spoken. “ True. I agreed with another members. You and this cowboy member aren't usually on here posting negative things about teachers. Usually most of your post are informative. This was by no means an attack at you. If it doesn't apply to you then you shouldn't take it to heart. Because actually reading your post and comments over the years I had an amount of respect for your opinions. I have never met anyone who has anything negative to say about teachers, hookers, fat old guys or people from any country or ethnicity. The only people I have ever heard complain is on Thai Visa. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigJohnnyBKK Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 I have never met anyone who has anything negative to say about teachers, hookers, fat old guys or people from any country or ethnicity. The only people I have ever heard complain is on Thai Visa. You should get out more. Not to seek such negativity per se, but if you were to talk to a wide range of visitors and residents here more frequently a pretty large percentage of people will express less-than-neutral views on one or more of those topics. Doesn't make them bad people of course, but pretty normal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chiangmaikelly Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 I have never met anyone who has anything negative to say about teachers, hookers, fat old guys or people from any country or ethnicity. The only people I have ever heard complain is on Thai Visa. You should get out more. Not to seek such negativity per se, but if you were to talk to a wide range of visitors and residents here more frequently a pretty large percentage of people will express less-than-neutral views on one or more of those topics. Doesn't make them bad people of course, but pretty normal. I live in Rayong. I have heard Rayong is the friendliest town in Thailand. Everyone has a job and money. No one begging on streets and few tourists. I know a lot of teachers and business people. Everyone is happy. I wouldn't go to Bangkok unless I had to, Phuket - never happen, Pattaya only to eat or see a show and Chiang Mai I'll be back if they figure out how to get rid of the aiery fairy people and smoke. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StreetCowboy Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 ... I have never met anyone who has anything negative to say about teachers, hookers, fat old guys or people from any country or ethnicity. The only people I have ever heard complain is on Thai Visa. Maybe you need a hearing aid. I SAID "MAYBE YOU ..." SC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigJohnnyBKK Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 I live in Rayong. I have heard Rayong is the friendliest town in Thailand. Everyone has a job and money. No one begging on streets and few tourists. I know a lot of teachers and business people. Everyone is happy. I wouldn't go to Bangkok unless I had to, Phuket - never happen, Pattaya only to eat or see a show and Chiang Mai I'll be back if they figure out how to get rid of the aiery fairy people and smoke. Lucky fellow, and agree other than I don't mind CM and BKK's not that bad, more of a big city boy myself, and it's certainly the place for me to try to maximize my income in supporting me & my dependents. Wish there were as many wealthy potential customers in a place with less traffic and pollution, but that's the way it is here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxme Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 (edited) Many are not really qualified, oh but we all know you don't have to be to be a great teacher right. Many do it just as a way to stay and enjoy themselves here and do not really care much about what they are actually doing, and in some cases that is more harm than good. They will tell you how much the School and kids love them but then move onto another one within a few months, or even weeks. If they were doing a good job how come the Thai kids are so poor in English, sure the education system is to blame, but then 'teachers' with crappy qualifications and the wrong motives hardly help matters. There are some good ones, but far more bad 'uns. Get serious it's a more of a complicated issue than that. The main problem is not the teachers. The demands for being a teacher are just plain silly. They want you to have a bachelor or a master degree and then they will pay you 20 000 for the bother, nevermind it could be 6 days a week, 11 hours a day but they think they compensate you fairly for this kind of job. What kind of mongrel would buy that... not many and that's the reason some of the institutes started to hire non-native speakers with no demand on degree but teacher experience instead. Some of these flat out lie about their experiences and their references are never checked. Once you get in there are other issues... cooperating with the Thai staff and the company's or institute's curriculum. If we are not talking about backpackers here then give a thought to what it means to only make 15-20 k a month and not having Non-O visa and the fact that you cannot really own anything here. Now I personally don't like some of the companies that been popping up on Khao San Road and such but your generalization of teachers is quite disturbing and not really sticking to the facts of reality. Edited November 7, 2012 by maxme Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Eff1n2ret Posted November 7, 2012 Popular Post Share Posted November 7, 2012 I think alot of the negativity stems seemingly from the fact that to "legally" work here unless employed by a foreign Corporation , you have to fulfill the criteria of performing a skill/trade that a Thai is not capable of , therefore not denying a native of an employment opportunity . Essentially ,teaching English and working as a Dive-master currently meet these req's and therefore provide options for some people to stay here longer than they otherwise would be able (which I don't see as a bad thing ). Most ex-pats on the forum will be acquainted with someone who falls into this category of "non-career "teacher with a TEFL certificate ,who openly admit that they are just going through the motions . Teacher training in the UK ; 4-6 years ? TEFL training ...4-6 weeks ! Qualified ,experienced teachers normally do get the respect they deserve ..others don't because of this stigma and abuse/opportunism ...depending on your standpoint . Unfortunately the stereotype is reinforced by a few "English teachers" who have posted on this Forum with poor grammar and syntax, and who commit the usual solecisms such as "it's" rather than "its", "there" when it should be "their", and so on - not worthy of comment in general, but those who claim the language as their profession are devaluing it for all, and deserve the criticism they get. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chiangmaikelly Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 I live in Rayong. I have heard Rayong is the friendliest town in Thailand. Everyone has a job and money. No one begging on streets and few tourists. I know a lot of teachers and business people. Everyone is happy. I wouldn't go to Bangkok unless I had to, Phuket - never happen, Pattaya only to eat or see a show and Chiang Mai I'll be back if they figure out how to get rid of the aiery fairy people and smoke. Lucky fellow, and agree other than I don't mind CM and BKK's not that bad, more of a big city boy myself, and it's certainly the place for me to try to maximize my income in supporting me & my dependents. Wish there were as many wealthy potential customers in a place with less traffic and pollution, but that's the way it is here. A lot of work around here. Engineers mostly; at least the ones I know. Rayong doesn't have much of a big city feel more suburban mall type of place. Beach close by and good shopping and restaurants but certainly no Bangkok. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxme Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 I think alot of the negativity stems seemingly from the fact that to "legally" work here unless employed by a foreign Corporation , you have to fulfill the criteria of performing a skill/trade that a Thai is not capable of , therefore not denying a native of an employment opportunity . Essentially ,teaching English and working as a Dive-master currently meet these req's and therefore provide options for some people to stay here longer than they otherwise would be able (which I don't see as a bad thing ). Most ex-pats on the forum will be acquainted with someone who falls into this category of "non-career "teacher with a TEFL certificate ,who openly admit that they are just going through the motions . Teacher training in the UK ; 4-6 years ? TEFL training ...4-6 weeks ! Qualified ,experienced teachers normally do get the respect they deserve ..others don't because of this stigma and abuse/opportunism ...depending on your standpoint . Unfortunately the stereotype is reinforced by a few "English teachers" who have posted on this Forum with poor grammar and syntax, and who commit the usual solecisms such as "it's" rather than "its", "there" when it should be "their", and so on - not worthy of comment in general, but those who claim the language as their profession are devaluing it for all, and deserve the criticism they get. Well luckily enough the Thais are considered grammar experts and do not need foreigners for that kind of job. That said, I've met a lot of Aussies, Brits and Americans who do not know even the slightest what grammar is. So who is more qualified in your case? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThaiRich Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 I think alot of the negativity stems seemingly from the fact that to "legally" work here unless employed by a foreign Corporation , you have to fulfill the criteria of performing a skill/trade that a Thai is not capable of , therefore not denying a native of an employment opportunity . Essentially ,teaching English and working as a Dive-master currently meet these req's and therefore provide options for some people to stay here longer than they otherwise would be able (which I don't see as a bad thing ). Most ex-pats on the forum will be acquainted with someone who falls into this category of "non-career "teacher with a TEFL certificate ,who openly admit that they are just going through the motions . Teacher training in the UK ; 4-6 years ? TEFL training ...4-6 weeks ! Qualified ,experienced teachers normally do get the respect they deserve ..others don't because of this stigma and abuse/opportunism ...depending on your standpoint . Unfortunately the stereotype is reinforced by a few "English teachers" who have posted on this Forum with poor grammar and syntax, and who commit the usual solecisms such as "it's" rather than "its", "there" when it should be "their", and so on - not worthy of comment in general, but those who claim the language as their profession are devaluing it for all, and deserve the criticism they get. I thought the grammar police weren't allowed in this forum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eff1n2ret Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 I thought the grammar police weren't allowed in this forum. In general, I agree, but English teachers who can't write good English are fair game, because they devalue the honoured profession of teaching. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tinfoilhat Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 a restaurant owner told me he dont like backpackers and teachers. btw he seems to be offended at me for ordering a promotion meal with just mineral water instead of the typical sugary beverages or alcohol and he is assuming me to be either a backpacker or a teacher. eventually i got really pissed off and did a stupid move by giving him a 1000 baht note for a 200 baht meal and asked him to keep the change showed him Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chonabot Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 (edited) I thought the grammar police weren't allowed in this forum. In general, I agree, but English teachers who can't write good English are fair game, because they devalue the honoured profession of teaching. Many Thai English teachers at my school are 'grammar-tastic'. But holding a basic conversation in English is often beyond them. Most of them understand that the value of a NES teacher is not confined to memorising syntax/grammar - thankfully. I think one needs a certain talent and a lot of patience to be able to teach a class of 60 children 5 times per day - so far grammar hasn't been an issue for me Edited November 7, 2012 by chonabot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mancub Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 Some of the negativity that the OP will have encountered will have originated from those who, recently qualified and with the best intentions and,having secured employment with a Thai Government school, quickly have their enthusiasm stifled by both the students laclk of desire to learn and indiscipline ,and the school's own indifference to such .. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StreetCowboy Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 I think alot of the negativity stems seemingly from the fact that to "legally" work here unless employed by a foreign Corporation , you have to fulfill the criteria of performing a skill/trade that a Thai is not capable of , therefore not denying a native of an employment opportunity . Essentially ,teaching English and working as a Dive-master currently meet these req's and therefore provide options for some people to stay here longer than they otherwise would be able (which I don't see as a bad thing ). Most ex-pats on the forum will be acquainted with someone who falls into this category of "non-career "teacher with a TEFL certificate ,who openly admit that they are just going through the motions . Teacher training in the UK ; 4-6 years ? TEFL training ...4-6 weeks ! Qualified ,experienced teachers normally do get the respect they deserve ..others don't because of this stigma and abuse/opportunism ...depending on your standpoint . Unfortunately the stereotype is reinforced by a few "English teachers" who have posted on this Forum with poor grammar and syntax, and who commit the usual solecisms such as "it's" rather than "its", "there" when it should be "their", and so on - not worthy of comment in general, but those who claim the language as their profession are devaluing it for all, and deserve the criticism they get. I thought the grammar police weren't allowed in this forum. unles theive got a warrent 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Metapod Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 Because many people(NOT ALL) on this forum are very unhappy with their lives. They live here for any of several reasons. They didn't plan for the future and in a small village in Thailand is the only place they can afford to live. 2) They couldn't find a woman in their own country, so they come here and use their money to get and keep a woman and she and her family are a constant drain on his finances. 3) Some people are just hateful and bitter and criticize anything and everything they can. And there are some people on this forum that can only feel good about themselves if they are belittling someone else. The schools don't pay enough to attract qualified teachers. Who is going to spend 4 years in university and be 20k+ in debt, and then take a job teaching English in thailand for 30.000 baht a month? As with most things in life you get what you pay for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeverSure Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 Because many people(NOT ALL) on this forum are very unhappy with their lives. They live here for any of several reasons. They didn't plan for the future and in a small village in Thailand is the only place they can afford to live. 2) They couldn't find a woman in their own country, so they come here and use their money to get and keep a woman and she and her family are a constant drain on his finances. 3) Some people are just hateful and bitter and criticize anything and everything they can. And there are some people on this forum that can only feel good about themselves if they are belittling someone else. The schools don't pay enough to attract qualified teachers. Who is going to spend 4 years in university and be 20k+ in debt, and then take a job teaching English in thailand for 30.000 baht a month? As with most things in life you get what you pay for. I agree. I do know of one exception and that's where actual US English teachers take a 1 or 2 year sabbatical and go to Asia to teach for the cultural experience. It's basically an all-expense-paid immersion into a different culture. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chiangmaikelly Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 Because many people(NOT ALL) on this forum are very unhappy with their lives. They live here for any of several reasons. They didn't plan for the future and in a small village in Thailand is the only place they can afford to live. 2) They couldn't find a woman in their own country, so they come here and use their money to get and keep a woman and she and her family are a constant drain on his finances. 3) Some people are just hateful and bitter and criticize anything and everything they can. And there are some people on this forum that can only feel good about themselves if they are belittling someone else. The schools don't pay enough to attract qualified teachers. Who is going to spend 4 years in university and be 20k+ in debt, and then take a job teaching English in thailand for 30.000 baht a month? As with most things in life you get what you pay for. I guess most Thai English teachers. Only they don't get 30,000 per month. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poanoi Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 Found it! Well found Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxme Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 (edited) Because many people(NOT ALL) on this forum are very unhappy with their lives. They live here for any of several reasons. They didn't plan for the future and in a small village in Thailand is the only place they can afford to live. 2) They couldn't find a woman in their own country, so they come here and use their money to get and keep a woman and she and her family are a constant drain on his finances. 3) Some people are just hateful and bitter and criticize anything and everything they can. And there are some people on this forum that can only feel good about themselves if they are belittling someone else. The schools don't pay enough to attract qualified teachers. Who is going to spend 4 years in university and be 20k+ in debt, and then take a job teaching English in thailand for 30.000 baht a month? As with most things in life you get what you pay for. I guess most Thai English teachers. Only they don't get 30,000 per month. True but then how good at the subject are they and do they have to pay for visa or deal with work permits? Regarding other subjects such as Thai, Math and Physics is way too low and I do sympathize with them. Edited November 7, 2012 by maxme Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeavyDrinker Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 I find it amusing to read some of the indignation here from teachers as though they came here on some great vocation or are fulfilling some work of great altruism. Most of you came here simply for the reasons the majority of people come - the women, the climate, the culture, whatever - and teaching offered you the only option of staying. From some of the self-important nonsense I've read here is it any wonder you suffer from a negative image? I especially liked the part about how it's only the old boys in a shack in Issan who treat teachers with contempt. Believe me it isn't. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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