New Regulations On Maids And Child Labour Finally Announced: Thailand

[transam]

Sounds fair to me, apart from the weird rules on sick leave.

Basically 15 two-day paid sick leaves can be taken per year, without the need for any piece of paper.

No paper needed means it's just paid holidays.

Where is the employer protected here? Can he send over a control doctor?

I'd rather see them get a 5 day working week, and get rid if a sick leave system wide open to abuse.

Sent from my GT-I9001 using Thaivisa Connect App

More or less the same rules as UK.

[DocN]

The latest BS Govt populist policy to come into force in January is the 300 Baht a day minimum wage. Already we have changed two sets of maids over this. Ok, will agree, but now will deduct living costs, food and board, etc. Back to what they get today. As for the illegals, I don't mind concurring with these new 'rules' but the maids better have their own papers and they need to fund that themselves. If they can't, nothing changes from today so they may as well drop the whole 'legislation' and let it just move on...

We offer our maids days off, they simply don't take them. They get time to go see parents and their babies as often as they want, no issue our side. We buy them clothes and take them with us when we travel, they get it easy and they get good food. I think a lot of this comes down to expats usually treat them with compassion, but the Thai's really need a lesson - all are born equal, but we cannot choose our circumstances. I don't need these 'rules' to know how to treat people but I am sure some do, which of course, will only cause bitterness and perhaps mistreatment of the maids.

The latest BS Govt populist policy to come into force in January is the 300 Baht a day minimum wage. Already we have changed two sets of maids over this. Ok, will agree, but now will deduct living costs, food and board, etc. Back to what they get today. As for the illegals, I don't mind concurring with these new 'rules' but the maids better have their own papers and they need to fund that themselves. If they can't, nothing changes from today so they may as well drop the whole 'legislation' and let it just move on...

We offer our maids days off, they simply don't take them. They get time to go see parents and their babies as often as they want, no issue our side. We buy them clothes and take them with us when we travel, they get it easy and they get good food. I think a lot of this comes down to expats usually treat them with compassion, but the Thai's really need a lesson - all are born equal, but we cannot choose our circumstances. I don't need these 'rules' to know how to treat people but I am sure some do, which of course, will only cause bitterness and perhaps mistreatment of the maids.

Real humanitarian, aren't you!

Rich enough to have "sets" of maids, but not rich enough to pay them an honest wage?

What about taking care of your palace by yourself and see, if you would like to do all that work for under 300 baht!

Jeez Doc don't take it so personal. What I pay my maids is well above the going rate by the time we add the things they need most including their mobile phones. We also bank for them, transfers to their folks back in Burma, I doubt 'any' farang like yourself would not know anything about. We provide them with clothing and also give them DVD's to watch on their own TV sets as well as medical etc. Considering the Thai's pay opening salary for cops at 7,000 Baht a month and they have to buy their own guns, and I am paying above that - so where are you coming from? Some rich country where minimum salary is USD10 an hour or social security keeps all the populace not wanting to work? Get off your bike mate...

Not a bike in sight, "mate"!

So you are a humanitarian? Good for you!

By the way: this thread is not about the 300 THB wage hike...it is about workers rights!

Hippie- stuff, I know!

But mind you: most of the rules mentioned in the OP are in every work- contract I signed in Thailand so far!

So now they just do for maids, what they did for everybody else before: make some adjustments, to regulate their work-time and -environment!

So...if you would...get of your bike!

[osiboy]

The latest BS Govt populist policy to come into force in January is the 300 Baht a day minimum wage. Already we have changed two sets of maids over this. Ok, will agree, but now will deduct living costs, food and board, etc. Back to what they get today. As for the illegals, I don't mind concurring with these new 'rules' but the maids better have their own papers and they need to fund that themselves. If they can't, nothing changes from today so they may as well drop the whole 'legislation' and let it just move on...

We offer our maids days off, they simply don't take them. They get time to go see parents and their babies as often as they want, no issue our side. We buy them clothes and take them with us when we travel, they get it easy and they get good food. I think a lot of this comes down to expats usually treat them with compassion, but the Thai's really need a lesson - all are born equal, but we cannot choose our circumstances. I don't need these 'rules' to know how to treat people but I am sure some do, which of course, will only cause bitterness and perhaps mistreatment of the maids.

Real humanitarian, aren't you!

Rich enough to have "sets" of maids, but not rich enough to pay them an honest wage?

What about taking care of your palace by yourself and see, if you would like to do all that work for under 300 baht!

And you forget the ugly racist overtone. " I (westerner) don't need these "rules" to know how to treat people " "but the Thai's really need a lesson".

I personally think some people need to learn that the good time of the colonies is over, slavery has been abolished and that a "good master" doesn't and never has existed.

slavery abolished ??,......are you sure ? very near it in most western countries , nowhere near it in the 3rd world !

[trompelemonde]

I think this is an excellent piece of legislation and long overdue, it extends the rights that all other Thai workers have under existing labour laws to maids.

Also, it is a mistake to think that Thai labour laws favour the employer against the employee. They don't, and in my experience here are the most effective and well implemented sets of laws in the land. Be careful with drafing those employment contracts because if a dispute reaches the Thai Labour Courts the employee usually wins!!

[asiawatcher]

I think this is an excellent piece of legislation and long overdue, it extends the rights that all other Thai workers have under existing labour laws to maids.

Also, it is a mistake to think that Thai labour laws favour the employer against the employee. They don't, and in my experience here are the most effective and well implemented sets of laws in the land. Be careful with drafing those employment contracts because if a dispute reaches the Thai Labour Courts the employee usually wins!!

Agree, work for wages here, don't get paid, go to the Labour Ministry, you will be paid... They are very tough.

[asiawatcher]

The latest BS Govt populist policy to come into force in January is the 300 Baht a day minimum wage. Already we have changed two sets of maids over this. Ok, will agree, but now will deduct living costs, food and board, etc. Back to what they get today. As for the illegals, I don't mind concurring with these new 'rules' but the maids better have their own papers and they need to fund that themselves. If they can't, nothing changes from today so they may as well drop the whole 'legislation' and let it just move on...

We offer our maids days off, they simply don't take them. They get time to go see parents and their babies as often as they want, no issue our side. We buy them clothes and take them with us when we travel, they get it easy and they get good food. I think a lot of this comes down to expats usually treat them with compassion, but the Thai's really need a lesson - all are born equal, but we cannot choose our circumstances. I don't need these 'rules' to know how to treat people but I am sure some do, which of course, will only cause bitterness and perhaps mistreatment of the maids.

Real humanitarian, aren't you!

Rich enough to have "sets" of maids, but not rich enough to pay them an honest wage?

What about taking care of your palace by yourself and see, if you would like to do all that work for under 300 baht!

And you forget the ugly racist overtone. " I (westerner) don't need these "rules" to know how to treat people " "but the Thai's really need a lesson".

I personally think some people need to learn that the good time of the colonies is over, slavery has been abolished and that a "good master" doesn't and never has existed.

slavery abolished ??,......are you sure ? very near it in most western countries , nowhere near it in the 3rd world !

It's all relevant. A plate of food off the street 20-40 Baht. West is $10-$20. Horses for courses. If rent here is 2,500 - 3,500 a month for a room for a non live in maid, what would you pay in the west? Maids don't get work contract and are not likely to. The class distinction by the Thai's against the maids is the issue more so than the money factor. If a maid can work, get time off, have a standard of living her village could never offer and gets to bank almost if not all, her wages, gee - what's the issue? Human rights?

[bkk_mike]

I can't understand why people just can't get off their arse and clean their own house.

I could - but having a maid is so cheap that I can pay for the maid for a month with less than I earn in one morning.

i.e. spending my own time cleaning is simply bad time-management

We don't have a full time gardener though. there's a team that come by every few weeks to cut the grass and trim the hedges and trees. They also deal with the occasional snake that turns up. (which I really wouldn't want to do myself).

Agreed - I wouldn't do the work for the amount they're getting, but I'm also not the one agreeing the rates (my wife does all that).

Edited November 14, 2012 by bkk_mike

[Greer]

When I had a maid at home to help look after my three kids, she was treated exactly the same as the rest of the family in that she travelled with us and lived with us, had her own TV and DVD player in her own air-con room etc, and she was paid a rate that put her very close to many office workers. Bearing in mind that it was free room and board, she had virtually no outgoings at all, so 100% of her income was usable by her, for her own needs. We didnt buy clothing for her, but of course things like bedding, towels, toiletries and all were provided in house by us anyway. The main thing is that we all had a very good relationship and the kids looked to her almost as a second mum. If she was sick, she went to the doctor and took the time off as necessary, we always helped with any high expenses that were a problem to afford, but as her salary was pretty high she really needed very little extra from us anyway. We also sent her for driving lessons and I recall at one point she was taking some English lessons as well. We didnt need legislation to tell us how to behave in a normal humane way to people who lived in our home; we could not have even considered treating her differently.

[oops]

I had to delete what I said at first because I know that this site is monitored. But based on what I have seen with a highly influential people who have several children that looked to be half breeds and a bit on the dysfunctional side without any knowledge of what laws are or even if they have been changed.

Based on the way I was treated and listening to them screaming at the maids who seem to be somewhat dysfunctional as did they children ,I cannot see how they can save or help those people in

influential families such as this. These people that were there at this person home seem to all have issues which was a reflection of what is really going on in a house with some deep routed problems regarding abuse, my guess based on what I saw runs along the lines of things we only read about.. I seriously doubt that they could employee people in their right mind " normal help"

Somewhere along the lines of that doctor up country who took it upon himself to kill his help.

Even I was intimidated by this family and hated going to their home knowing that they are the worst type of people that get away with all the things you hear about.. That these people were the sewage of society with lots of money and the freedom to move about the influential world here.

To me it was like the thought of a horror movie, "Opening the black whole" or something of that nature. But I have had several dealings with the wealthy here. It seems like the older generation of these wealthy are uneducated or something but it is like opening the cellar door when meeting some of these people. I had one older wealthy Thai women starting from a sitting position at a formal table get up and start jumping up and down screaming and crying say NO NO NO NO I WON"T DO THAT. We asked a her to lower the rent by 25k or 50k a month in 250,000 baht a month condo with a years contract in a Penthouse type condo that had been vacant for more than two years, well now we know why.

With all this in my head and those are just two examples, Just the other day I saw a Chinese women get out of her car and start pounding on a police officer for doing his job by waving her on for cutting in front of every one that was patiently waiting in traffic to turn. When she tried to push him down by inching her car forward into him with her car , the police officer ended up leaning forward putting his hands on the hood to catch his balance after she nearly knocked him over three times and the police officer still wouldn't move. So she got out of her car still in the middle of the street leaving the car door open actually running around the car to pound on the officers chest. He just stood their, I had to give him credit holding his ground but he should of arrested her for attempted manslaughter for hitting him with her car. However, I am sure he understands how the system here works better than I do. Had he done anything to her, her family might of made his life a living hell and gotten away with it. So, it's nice to know that they passed another law...but enforcing it is another issue

[Dork]

Now back to the subject at hand.

For people involved in buying in Asia, one of the most important thing nowaday when choosing a new supplier is social compliance. And here I can stay that Thailand is lagging behind China.

I've visited a number of small and medium factories in Thailand and while the products they make are of acceptable quality, the working condition would never pass any international social compliance inspection.

The statement that Thailand is lagging behind China in this area I find ludicrous. After 20 years of contract manufacturing in Thailand, the Dickensian factory conditions I see in China can still shock me.

Nevertheless I find (mainly EU led) social compliance schemes that I have been involved with to be arrogantly patronising and completely unwanted by the workers themselves. If the EU wants to come and buy them new toilets, that's fine. But if the EU wants them to be paid less because their employer has to pay for toilets that those cosseted bureaucrats deem appropriate, it's not fine. And in a nutshell, that is what is happening.