Pitak Siam Rally Security A Major Headache For Thai Govt

[PoorSucker]

Several inflammatory posts and responses removed.

[Hugo6]

What with people having the audacity to question the actions of the ruling party, and the Government's attempts to stop that happening, it is small wonder the ruling party have no time to consider the good of Thailand.

We won the election - full stop.

Unfortunately democratic Goverment is what happens between elections.

I, like many, hope the rally passes peacefully. However, given the ruling party's jitters about anything akin to criticism, things may not turn out that way.

When will Thailand be on the government's agenda, let alone the main part?

haven't watched the news for the last year and a half?

[jayboy]

jayboy, on 2012-11-17 21:45:18, said:

To be honest I'm more concerned with truth, intelligence,wit and good judgement than the good esteem of a bunch of not very well educated oldsters.

You know fellers I really like it when some young whipper snapper feller comes along thet is sooooooooo much smarter in book learnin than the rest of usuns not very well edgurcated oldsters, i guess he means us old timers. It sure is a good thang usuns can get edgercated from this here jayboy feller. I wonder if he is one of them there rocket siences fellers from NASER and did us good by sending them there other fellers to the moon? Me and Ma seed that on tv. That was a good un and made us proud.

I don't really no much bout intellergence and have no idee what wit is but I do know this. jaboy it looks like you have got way above your rasin little feller and exposed yooself fer what you really are.

Anyways keep them cards and letters comin and we'll get one of them edgurcated fellers to read um fer us.

Delighted to have been of assistance.Meanwhile back in the real world, a tweet just in:

"Obama is proud to be standing beside democratically elected Thai leader, Ouch..Pitak Siam"

I'm guessing that those with a headache now are the anti democratic coup mongerers of Pitak Siam.Talk about bad timing.

[rubl]

"Obama is proud to be standing beside democratically elected Thai leader, Ouch..Pitak Siam"

I'm guessing that those with a headache now are the anti democratic coup mongerers of Pitak Siam.Talk about bad timing.

A bit off topic, but that makes you wonder what Pres. Obama will say in the next two countries he'll be visiting. Tomorrow Myanmar, I think ?

[waza]

"Obama is proud to be standing beside democratically elected Thai leader, Ouch..Pitak Siam"

I'm guessing that those with a headache now are the anti democratic coup mongerers of Pitak Siam.Talk about bad timing.

A bit off topic, but that makes you wonder what Pres. Obama will say in the next two countries he'll be visiting. Tomorrow Myanmar, I think ?

PHNOM PENH: The US President, Barack Obama, has started a three-country tour of Asia, hailing the US alliance with Thailand as key to its commitment to deepen economic and security ties to the region...............Mr Obama held talks with Ms Yingluck, whose government has been given a behind-the-scenes role to help reduce tensions between China and four member states of the Association of South-East Asian Nations over territorial disputes in the South China Sea.

Read more: http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/world/obama-support-for-thai-leadership-20121118-29k8b.html#ixzz2CaBesKLv

Mr Obama will on Monday make a historic visit to Burma where he will endorse dramatic reforms under way as the country emerges from 50 years of repressive military rule. On Tuesday Mr Obama will be in the Cambodian capital, Phnom Penh, attending the East Asian Summit,

[Buchholz]

A bit off topic, but that makes you wonder what Pres. Obama will say in the next two countries he'll be visiting. Tomorrow Myanmar, I think ?

The visit to Thailand, less than 18 hours long,

The Telegraph

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/barackobama/9686149/Barack-Obama-visits-Buddhist-temple-in-Thailand.html

.

[Noistar]

What with people having the audacity to question the actions of the ruling party, and the Government's attempts to stop that happening, it is small wonder the ruling party have no time to consider the good of Thailand.

We won the election - full stop.

Unfortunately democratic Goverment is what happens between elections.

I, like many, hope the rally passes peacefully. However, given the ruling party's jitters about anything akin to criticism, things may not turn out that way.

When will Thailand be on the government's agenda, let alone the main part?

haven't watched the news for the last year and a half?

I've been looking for substance, not window dressing.

Populist policies which satisfy (part of) the ruling party's election mandate, do not equate to policies intended to promote the better future of Thailand - IMHO.

I will continue to monitor the news through various media. Hopefully the next year will see more than the ruling party forcing their version of 'reconciliation' on the country.

[Buchholz]

Things might really be hotting up a lot more than many farang realise. The headline of today's Thai Rath (the largest selling newspaper) has the following interesting headline:

" Khwanchai (member of anti govt group) Reveals the Mob's (his mob that is) Plan:

Arrest the PM!.......Burn the Parliament Building!.......... Seize Govt House!!

Create the Conditions for a Coup!

Provoke the Reds to Gather Their Forces for an Attack!"

Thought some of you might find this interesting. Nothing newsworthy of course in the English language press......as usual.

Red Shirt Leader Kwanchai up to his old antics...

Thai Rath (article in Thai) - November 17, 2012

http://www.thairath....t/region/306759

Red Shirt Leader Kwanchai has announced plans to hold a Red Shirt rally in front of the provincial hall in Udon Thani on Nov. 24, one day before the Pitak Siam rally in Bangkok.

Kwanchai said he was expecting 50,000 Red Shirts to the rally in Udon and that Red Shirt Leader Jatuporn as well as a number of former Banned TRT bigwigs would be attending.

.

Edited November 22, 2012 by Scott

[Pimay1]

Things might really be hotting up a lot more than many farang realise. The headline of today's Thai Rath (the largest selling newspaper) has the following interesting headline:

" Khwanchai (member of anti govt group) Reveals the Mob's (his mob that is) Plan:

Arrest the PM!.......Burn the Parliament Building!.......... Seize Govt House!!

Create the Conditions for a Coup!

Provoke the Reds to Gather Their Forces for an Attack!"

Thought some of you might find this interesting. Nothing newsworthy of course in the English language press......as usual.

Red Shirt Leader Kwanchai up to his old antics...

Thai Rath (article in Thai) - November 17, 2012

http://www.thairath....t/region/306759

Red Shirt Leader Kwanchai has announced plans to hold a Red Shirt rally in front of the provincial hall in Udon Thani on Nov. 24, one day before the Pitak Siam rally in Bangkok.

Kwanchai said he was expecting 50,000 Red Shirts to the rally in Udon and that Red Shirt Leader Jatuporn as well as a number of former Banned TRT bigwigs would be attending.

.

I wonder if this maniac Kwanchai and his peaceful red mob will burn down Udon Thani city hall...................AGAIN?

Edited November 22, 2012 by Scott

[cdnvic]

Removed an unattributed news item that the poster knew full well was against the rules.

[Hugo6]

What with people having the audacity to question the actions of the ruling party, and the Government's attempts to stop that happening, it is small wonder the ruling party have no time to consider the good of Thailand.

We won the election - full stop.

Unfortunately democratic Goverment is what happens between elections.

I, like many, hope the rally passes peacefully. However, given the ruling party's jitters about anything akin to criticism, things may not turn out that way.

When will Thailand be on the government's agenda, let alone the main part?

haven't watched the news for the last year and a half?

I've been looking for substance, not window dressing.

Populist policies which satisfy (part of) the ruling party's election mandate, do not equate to policies intended to promote the better future of Thailand - IMHO.

I will continue to monitor the news through various media. Hopefully the next year will see more than the ruling party forcing their version of 'reconciliation' on the country.

call it window dressing.

others call it policy.

so far the entire policy has been about "thailand"

so there.

[hellodolly]

"The question is, what is frightening the government so badly? Has the government received some sort of signal?"

A strong show of force in numbers from the protestors will put the Governments mandate in question. It will show the poor peformance, myopic view and lack of follow through with their promises from the PTP has lost them a lot of support.

Getting 50,000 people protesting doesn't change a mandate gained from 15,000,000 voters.

It does highlight the poor performance and other issues with this government though.

No it dosen't but it can change the view of 15,000,000 voters. I believe that is what the government is afraid of. Yes they have a mandate that will not change but the fact is when are they going to deliver on there mandate.

Edit

It just occurred to me I wonder if 50,000 police officer's will be able to control the red shirts. So far they don't have a good record at that. In 2010 they found it hard to do hiding in their closets

Edited November 19, 2012 by hellodolly

[waza]

What with people having the audacity to question the actions of the ruling party, and the Government's attempts to stop that happening, it is small wonder the ruling party have no time to consider the good of Thailand.

We won the election - full stop.

Unfortunately democratic Goverment is what happens between elections.

I, like many, hope the rally passes peacefully. However, given the ruling party's jitters about anything akin to criticism, things may not turn out that way.

When will Thailand be on the government's agenda, let alone the main part?

haven't watched the news for the last year and a half?

I've been looking for substance, not window dressing.

Populist policies which satisfy (part of) the ruling party's election mandate, do not equate to policies intended to promote the better future of Thailand - IMHO.

I will continue to monitor the news through various media. Hopefully the next year will see more than the ruling party forcing their version of 'reconciliation' on the country.

call it window dressing.

others call it policy.

so far the entire policy has been about "thailand"

so there.

Actually the whole policy has been about Thaksin.

ner ner

[Buchholz]

Red Shirt Leader Suporn Atthawong said yesterday that while Pitak Siam holds its rally on Saturday the red shirts would hold a parallel gathering in Bangkok's suburban areas but they would not get close to the Royal Plaza protest.

However, he threatened to mobilise red shirts from around the country within 24 hours - as many as 200,000 from Bangkok within two hours - to "protect the democratically elected government", if necessary.

Suporn, now a Deputy Secretary-General to the Prime Minister, said Thaksin told the red shirts to be ready for possible unrest due to the Pitak Siam rally.

The Nation - November 20, 2012

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/politics/Former-aide-says-Prem-not-linked-to-Pitak-Siam-ral-30194634.html

[Noistar]

What with people having the audacity to question the actions of the ruling party, and the Government's attempts to stop that happening, it is small wonder the ruling party have no time to consider the good of Thailand.

We won the election - full stop.

Unfortunately democratic Goverment is what happens between elections.

I, like many, hope the rally passes peacefully. However, given the ruling party's jitters about anything akin to criticism, things may not turn out that way.

When will Thailand be on the government's agenda, let alone the main part?

haven't watched the news for the last year and a half?

I've been looking for substance, not window dressing.

Populist policies which satisfy (part of) the ruling party's election mandate, do not equate to policies intended to promote the better future of Thailand - IMHO.

I will continue to monitor the news through various media. Hopefully the next year will see more than the ruling party forcing their version of 'reconciliation' on the country.

call it window dressing.

others call it policy.

so far the entire policy has been about "thailand"

so there.

And there our opinions will have to differ.

You won't convince me of your viewpoint and I doubt I will succeed in convincing you of mine.

Enforced 'reconciliation', while policy, is unlikely to be in the best interests of Thailand - IMHO.

Certainly it's 'about' Thailand. Every Government policy of any Government will have an impact on Thailand. It's whether or not Thailand benefits from the impact which remains to be seen

[Hugo6]

haven't watched the news for the last year and a half?

I've been looking for substance, not window dressing.

Populist policies which satisfy (part of) the ruling party's election mandate, do not equate to policies intended to promote the better future of Thailand - IMHO.

I will continue to monitor the news through various media. Hopefully the next year will see more than the ruling party forcing their version of 'reconciliation' on the country.

call it window dressing.

others call it policy.

so far the entire policy has been about "thailand"

so there.

Actually the whole policy has been about Thaksin.

ner ner

i guess that "ner ner" means you're just joking.

cause it's so obviously untrue that it would otherwise just be a stupid statement.

[Hugo6]

haven't watched the news for the last year and a half?

I've been looking for substance, not window dressing.

Populist policies which satisfy (part of) the ruling party's election mandate, do not equate to policies intended to promote the better future of Thailand - IMHO.

I will continue to monitor the news through various media. Hopefully the next year will see more than the ruling party forcing their version of 'reconciliation' on the country.

call it window dressing.

others call it policy.

so far the entire policy has been about "thailand"

so there.

And there our opinions will have to differ.

You won't convince me of your viewpoint and I doubt I will succeed in convincing you of mine.

Enforced 'reconciliation', while policy, is unlikely to be in the best interests of Thailand - IMHO.

Certainly it's 'about' Thailand. Every Government policy of any Government will have an impact on Thailand. It's whether or not Thailand benefits from the impact which remains to be seen

since when is "enforced reconciliation" a populist policy?

a whole lot of populist policies from their election promises have been implemented or are being implemented and some thai people might even consider that they benefit from them.

and the whole nonsense about charter changes and amnesty started when? After a whole host of populist policies were implemented, women's fund, minimum wage, new car deal, - even the much hated rice policy. the charter and amnesty came after all that crap.

It's not all about thaksin, no matter what the nay-sayers want to believe. but to be clear, the amnesty & charter changes were also an election promise. The thai people knew what they were voting for.

[Buchholz]

I've been looking for substance, not window dressing.

Populist policies which satisfy (part of) the ruling party's election mandate, do not equate to policies intended to promote the better future of Thailand - IMHO.

I will continue to monitor the news through various media. Hopefully the next year will see more than the ruling party forcing their version of 'reconciliation' on the country.

call it window dressing.

others call it policy.

so far the entire policy has been about "thailand"

so there.

And there our opinions will have to differ.

You won't convince me of your viewpoint and I doubt I will succeed in convincing you of mine.

Enforced 'reconciliation', while policy, is unlikely to be in the best interests of Thailand - IMHO.

Certainly it's 'about' Thailand. Every Government policy of any Government will have an impact on Thailand. It's whether or not Thailand benefits from the impact which remains to be seen

since when is "enforced reconciliation" a populist policy?

a whole lot of populist policies from their election promises have been implemented or are being implemented and some thai people might even consider that they benefit from them.

and the whole nonsense about charter changes and amnesty started when? After a whole host of populist policies were implemented, women's fund, minimum wage, new car deal, - even the much hated rice policy. the charter and amnesty came after all that crap.

The "whole nonsense about charter changes and amnesty" started years before Yingluck's populist policies. They began back when Yingluck was a barely-known, token-head of her brother's monopolistic telecom company.

They began with Samak (AKA Thaksin, ver. 2.0) which predated Yingluck (AKA Thaksin, ver. 4.0) by a significant amount of time.

.

[jayboy]

The other paper reports an ABAC poll stating 94% Bangkokians object to the forthcoming Siam Pitak rally.

[rubl]

The other newspaper also mentions that the Constitutional Court has accepted petitions to order Pitak Siam to call off their rally. Petitions were filed by former senator Ruangkrai Leekijwattana, Pheu Thai Party member Singthong Buachum and lawyer Nuengdin Wimuttinant. The petitions cited Section 68 of the constitution.

In another democratic event Surachet Chaikosol, an Ayutthaya-based red shirt leader and adviser to Transport Minister Chatchart Sittipan has paid for and erected some billboards with a nice image of our PM and k. Thaksin. It seems he signed with "my family is red".

A major headache.

BTW the article, mentioned by our esteemed member jayboy, with the ABAC poll which was reported on the 28th of October, doesn't have 94% of the Bangkok respondents being against the Saturday rally. It's more that percentage against a coup. Actually it seems 62.6% thought political rallies were a good and normal practice in a democracy while 37.4% disagreed, reasoning they could bring about unrest.

[OzMick]

The other paper reports an ABAC poll stating 94% Bangkokians object to the forthcoming Siam Pitak rally.

If you ever watched Yes Minister/PM you should know that poll always get the results desired. By framing the questions the right way, the answers can be steered as easily as sheep by a trained dog.

"Are you in favour of the upcoming political rally likely to cause traffic chaos, interfere with public transport, and which could erupt into violence that may lead to civil war?"

[philw]

The other paper reports an ABAC poll stating 94% Bangkokians object to the forthcoming Siam Pitak rally.

If you ever watched Yes Minister/PM you should know that poll always get the results desired. By framing the questions the right way, the answers can be steered as easily as sheep by a trained dog.

"Are you in favour of the upcoming political rally likely to cause traffic chaos, interfere with public transport, and which could erupt into violence that may lead to civil war?"

Yes.

[rubl]

The other paper reports an ABAC poll stating 94% Bangkokians object to the forthcoming Siam Pitak rally.

If you ever watched Yes Minister/PM you should know that poll always get the results desired. By framing the questions the right way, the answers can be steered as easily as sheep by a trained dog.

"Are you in favour of the upcoming political rally likely to cause traffic chaos, interfere with public transport, and which could erupt into violence that may lead to civil war?"

Yes.

"How can a coincidence be improper, Minister? Impropriety postulates intention, which coincidence precludes."

[Hugo6]

The other paper reports an ABAC poll stating 94% Bangkokians object to the forthcoming Siam Pitak rally.

then it'll be hard for them to get a million people there.

[Noistar]

since when is "enforced reconciliation" a populist policy?

a whole lot of populist policies from their election promises have been implemented or are being implemented and some thai people might even consider that they benefit from them.

and the whole nonsense about charter changes and amnesty started when? After a whole host of populist policies were implemented, women's fund, minimum wage, new car deal, - even the much hated rice policy. the charter and amnesty came after all that crap.

It's not all about thaksin, no matter what the nay-sayers want to believe. but to be clear, the amnesty & charter changes were also an election promise. The thai people knew what they were voting for.

You seem to be confirming my comments about 'window dressing' without looking at how the present 'Democratic' government is actually governing Thailand.

However, firstly I must take issue with "The Thai people knew what they were voting for". I would like to consider myself educated and I'm sure I'm not alone in the electorate of a mature Democracy, when I can't profess to knowing the entire election mandate of each political party. However, the political parties are taken to task by an independent media, so any potentially damaging pledges are identified and are then in the public domain. By weighing up the identified pledges, an educated decision can be made.

Without criticising the Thai people, I would observe that the average Thai is, IMHO, unlikely to be as discerning.

I don't know how many of the electorate in Chiang Mai province would actually be aware of the Constitution, let alone what changing it would potentially unleash. I base this on the limited number of people I know, so perhaps my 'sample' cannot be considered meaningful.

You may have inadvertently labelled the ruling party's achievements as 'crap'.

Is the new car deal intended to help with congested traffic in major cities? Perhaps not the most well-thought-out policy.

I would add the PC tablets for P1 and M1 students. I am not aware that the education system wanted this gift. The Thai education system is in need of reform, IMHO, before technology should even be considered. I am led to believe that the education system, far from embracing this gift, are struggling to find a beneficial use for it.

Far better to move teaching from "sit down, open your books, listen, look at the blackboard and don't (dare to) ask me questions (as I might not know the answer and I'll show myself up)".

Then we come to the actual governing of the country which I believe you feel is directed at benefitting Thailand. Correct me if I'm wrong in that belief.

I believe the ruling party are driven by ideology, not benefit to Thailand. Their unwillingness to defend their policies by debate in parliament, a figurehead PM who makes statements but seems unable to face parliament to defend her statements, does not seem to indicate a party which is driven by democracy.

Wiping the slate clean from the past is not a recipe for stability today. It is, IMHO, a recipe for repeating the past.

Edited November 22, 2012 by Noistar

[jayboy]

The other paper reports an ABAC poll stating 94% Bangkokians object to the forthcoming Siam Pitak rally.

If you ever watched Yes Minister/PM you should know that poll always get the results desired. By framing the questions the right way, the answers can be steered as easily as sheep by a trained dog.

"Are you in favour of the upcoming political rally likely to cause traffic chaos, interfere with public transport, and which could erupt into violence that may lead to civil war?"

I have sympathy for your view and am generally sceptical about ABAC polls, their weaknesses often compounded by poor reporting in the English language newspapers.

They, in the absence of polls with a track record and sound methodology, remain a useful pointer not much else.

As for the 94% figure my earlier post was an entirely accurate summary of the other paper report (though perhaps inevitably I was accused of making it up).I made no claim on the accuracy of that report.My gut instinct in fact is that support for the rally is much higher than the low number the 94% figure suggests.

[jayboy]

The other newspaper also mentions that the Constitutional Court has accepted petitions to order Pitak Siam to call off their rally. Petitions were filed by former senator Ruangkrai Leekijwattana, Pheu Thai Party member Singthong Buachum and lawyer Nuengdin Wimuttinant. The petitions cited Section 68 of the constitution.

In another democratic event Surachet Chaikosol, an Ayutthaya-based red shirt leader and adviser to Transport Minister Chatchart Sittipan has paid for and erected some billboards with a nice image of our PM and k. Thaksin. It seems he signed with "my family is red".

A major headache.

BTW the article, mentioned by our esteemed member jayboy, with the ABAC poll which was reported on the 28th of October, doesn't have 94% of the Bangkok respondents being against the Saturday rally. It's more that percentage against a coup. Actually it seems 62.6% thought political rallies were a good and normal practice in a democracy while 37.4% disagreed, reasoning they could bring about unrest.

It would have been useful if you had made it clear that my post mentioning the 94% figure was completely accurate based on the other paper November article (the one I was referring to) which you were kind enough to pm me.

Edited November 22, 2012 by jayboy

[hellodolly]

The other paper reports an ABAC poll stating 94% Bangkokians object to the forthcoming Siam Pitak rally.

Is that another typical Thai pole where you pick the answer and then go looking for the people who will agree to it.

Given the education level in this country I can understand the Thai's falling for it.

But foreigners who have watched them here for 6 months just laugh at the polls taken in the hub of polls proving what you want them to prove.

[hellodolly]

Just reread part of the article and spotted this little jewel.

"Before the group's first rally on October 28, it was dismissed as being likely to draw only a small number of people. But more than 10,000 showed up, dealing a slap in the face to intelligence officers."

I would have thought it showed the lack of intelligence in the intelligence officers.

Amazing how history changes at first it was 20,000 people now it is over 10,000 people I was always tought tat 20,000 was more than 10,000. Give them a year and it will be a lot of people.

[rubl]

The other newspaper also mentions that the Constitutional Court has accepted petitions to order Pitak Siam to call off their rally. Petitions were filed by former senator Ruangkrai Leekijwattana, Pheu Thai Party member Singthong Buachum and lawyer Nuengdin Wimuttinant. The petitions cited Section 68 of the constitution.

In another democratic event Surachet Chaikosol, an Ayutthaya-based red shirt leader and adviser to Transport Minister Chatchart Sittipan has paid for and erected some billboards with a nice image of our PM and k. Thaksin. It seems he signed with "my family is red".

A major headache.

BTW the article, mentioned by our esteemed member jayboy, with the ABAC poll which was reported on the 28th of October, doesn't have 94% of the Bangkok respondents being against the Saturday rally. It's more that percentage against a coup. Actually it seems 62.6% thought political rallies were a good and normal practice in a democracy while 37.4% disagreed, reasoning they could bring about unrest.

It would have been useful if you had made it clear that my post mentioning the 94% figure was completely accurate based on the other paper November article (the one I was referring to) which you were kind enough to pm me.

An interesting misunderstanding, dear jayboy. You referred to what someone said about the ABAC poll, I referred to the description of the poll. Just a different approach