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[The Pundit]

Being someone who owns no property,has no work permit and scuttles off to the border every 2-3 months to pay off The Thai Consulate,in order to scuttle back across the border and continue where he left off?

It seems to me that the way the laws are set up here,without a work permit and business visa you cannot open a bank account,buy any sort of transport car or motorbike,it's rather a self-fulfilling prophecy that you'll just end up with the lowest common denominator generally!

Should you decide to go down the route of capitalisation of a Thai company and buying a work permit for an extortionate fee,you will then be told you must employ a certain amount of native workers decided upon by the officials.

Surely this just stymies the newly minted business right from the starts?It's like shackling you with a ball and chain as you're waiting in the starting blocks for the green light and how many cups of tea can you drink in a day,made by your new and untrained workforce anway?

I believe a lot of bar owners cannot even go behind their own bar,how ridiculous!It really does seem the least open to doing business anywhere in South-East Asia in Thailand from what I've seen,something that will only get worse as time goes on and Burma and ASEAN in general open up more!

Surely there has to be a massive shake up in Government thinking on these issues sooner rather than later,it seems like a great big ticking timebomb to me,primed to go off in the not too distant future!

[SiameseCurios]

It seems to me that the way the laws are set up here,without a work permit and business visa you cannot open a bank account,buy any sort of transport car or motorbike,it's rather a self-fulfilling prophecy that you'll just end up with the lowest common denominator generally!

You've got it all wrong.

Learn the laws. Abide by the laws. Then figure out how to get things done. Thousands of farangs do.

It's not rocket science. Your post just says that you have much to learn.

[smokie36]

Don't open a bar ThePundit, its probably the only sensible advice I'll ever offer you.

[The Pundit]

It seems to me that the way the laws are set up here,without a work permit and business visa you cannot open a bank account,buy any sort of transport car or motorbike,it's rather a self-fulfilling prophecy that you'll just end up with the lowest common denominator generally!

You've got it all wrong.

Learn the laws. Abide by the laws. Then figure out how to get things done. Thousands of farangs do.

It's not rocket science. Your post just says that you have much to learn.

Not really,I'm just telling the way the law is set out,I DIDN'T say that it actually works like that in practice but I've also had the benefit of living in other South-East Asian countries to be able to make a comparison.It's not favourable to the laws of employment,or obtaining business visas in Thailand,believe me!

[SiameseCurios]

It seems to me that the way the laws are set up here,without a work permit and business visa you cannot open a bank account,buy any sort of transport car or motorbike,it's rather a self-fulfilling prophecy that you'll just end up with the lowest common denominator generally!

You've got it all wrong.

Learn the laws. Abide by the laws. Then figure out how to get things done. Thousands of farangs do.

It's not rocket science. Your post just says that you have much to learn.

Not really,I'm just telling the way the law is set out,I DIDN'T say that it actually works like that in practice but I've also had the benefit of living in other South-East Asian countries to be able to make a comparison.It's not favourable to the laws of employment,or obtaining business visas in Thailand,believe me!

Fair point.

Sure, the set up here is not always easy to understand. It may or may not be less "user friendly" than in other countries in the region.

But it is nonetheless navigable.

Try not to be deterred by the apparent complexities and silly bureaucracy.

Edited November 21, 2012 by SiameseCurios

[MAJIC]

It seems to me that the way the laws are set up here,without a work permit and business visa you cannot open a bank account,buy any sort of transport car or motorbike,it's rather a self-fulfilling prophecy that you'll just end up with the lowest common denominator generally!

You've got it all wrong.

Learn the laws. Abide by the laws. Then figure out how to get things done. Thousands of farangs do.

It's not rocket science. Your post just says that you have much to learn.

You forgot to point out: 1. you can open a Bank Account without a Work Permit or Business visa,and 2. you can buy a Vehicle if you have at least a OA Visa,and 3. with a OA VISA you can buy Rent a house on a 30 year lease,in your name,after which it goes back to a Thai,whose name is on the lease document.Well at least it's better than nothing!

Before someone pulls me up,yes if you live long enough,you can have a second term of 30 years lease.

Edited November 21, 2012 by MAJIC

[loong]

without a work permit and business visa you cannot open a bank account,buy any sort of transport car or motorbike

Wrong, wrong and wrong.

I've never had a work permit or business visa, yet I have opened 2 bank accounts in Thailand.

Most people here on non immigrant O visa extensions have never had a work permit or business visa. For the retirement extension, they need to show 800,000 Bt in a Thai bank account. How do you think that is possible if they never had a work permit or business visa?

Buying a vehicle is not straightforward, but definitely possible.

[Riley'sLife]

Firstly, Thailand is for Thais. It is not the aim of the Thai gov to facilitate the take over of assets or business opportunities by foreigners. If you haven't already grasped that concept you really do have a great deal to learn.

Foreigners are, in my experience, made more than welcome in Thailand, especially if they spend their money here. Contrary to popular belief by many expats, Thailand doesn't actually need your presence for the country to prosper.

Living here is not about changing Thailand, (although many things could be changed for the benefit of the Thai people if they actually had the collective will to address the problems) ; living here is about adapting to the way life is here and taking advantage of the positive aspects rather than constantly bleating about the minor irritations.

Life is way too short. Enjoy the positives. If it is beyond your ability to adapt here, maybe there are better places for you to be, but moaning about not being able to open a bank account, or own a vehicle, just illustrated your lack of knowledge and perhaps indicate why you find it difficult to live here.

Any ticking "time bomb" in Thailand is not linked to the inability of expats to do business here, but rather to social/political issues that the Thai people have to face.

If you think Thailand is restrictive for expats, I think you should re-assess. Myanmar will not be a free-for-all, and will be more restrictive for expats than Thailand.

I do wish expats would open their eyes and realise that they are not the centre of the universe, but just a very tiny cog in the wheel, that would not be missed.

[poanoi]

For your own peace, move to Sihanookville, Cambodia.

I know i would if i hadn't been stuck in a loop of helping a gf becoming self-sufficient

with no end on horizon

[GuestHouse]

What's all this 'going to and from the boarder every 2-3 months' all about?

[endure]

Firstly, Thailand is for Thais. It is not the aim of the Thai gov to facilitate the take over of assets or business opportunities by foreigners. If you haven't already grasped that concept you really do have a great deal to learn.

Foreigners are, in my experience, made more than welcome in Thailand, especially if they spend their money here. Contrary to popular belief by many expats, Thailand doesn't actually need your presence for the country to prosper.

Living here is not about changing Thailand, (although many things could be changed for the benefit of the Thai people if they actually had the collective will to address the problems) ; living here is about adapting to the way life is here and taking advantage of the positive aspects rather than constantly bleating about the minor irritations.

Life is way too short. Enjoy the positives. If it is beyond your ability to adapt here, maybe there are better places for you to be, but moaning about not being able to open a bank account, or own a vehicle, just illustrated your lack of knowledge and perhaps indicate why you find it difficult to live here.

Any ticking "time bomb" in Thailand is not linked to the inability of expats to do business here, but rather to social/political issues that the Thai people have to face.

If you think Thailand is restrictive for expats, I think you should re-assess. Myanmar will not be a free-for-all, and will be more restrictive for expats than Thailand.

I do wish expats would open their eyes and realise that they are not the centre of the universe, but just a very tiny cog in the wheel, that would not be missed.

[Chittychangchang]

All we need now is a post from Brodie and we've got the hatrick, someones bored.

BTW business and bar in the same paragraph, LMAO.

[dave2]

re.

I've never had a work permit or business visa, yet I have opened 2 bank accounts in Thailand.

nor me ! .. and ive got 6 bank accounts , own a bike and havnt

left thailand for years coz i use the 800 thousand method as well : )

shame the op didnt do his homework before posting : (

dave2

[chiangmaikelly]

re.

I've never had a work permit or business visa, yet I have opened 2 bank accounts in Thailand.

nor me ! .. and ive got 6 bank accounts , own a bike and havnt

left thailand for years coz i use the 800 thousand method as well : )

shame the op didnt do his homework before posting : (

dave2

I think you have pretty well established the fact that the OP has never been to Thailand. I have 4 bank accounts, and have not left Thailand in 10 years. Oh ya and a truck and motorcycle.

[Sharp]

Firstly, Thailand is for Thais. It is not the aim of the Thai gov to facilitate the take over of assets or business opportunities by foreigners. If you haven't already grasped that concept you really do have a great deal to learn.

Foreigners are, in my experience, made more than welcome in Thailand, especially if they spend their money here. Contrary to popular belief by many expats, Thailand doesn't actually need your presence for the country to prosper.

Living here is not about changing Thailand, (although many things could be changed for the benefit of the Thai people if they actually had the collective will to address the problems) ; living here is about adapting to the way life is here and taking advantage of the positive aspects rather than constantly bleating about the minor irritations.

Life is way too short. Enjoy the positives. If it is beyond your ability to adapt here, maybe there are better places for you to be, but moaning about not being able to open a bank account, or own a vehicle, just illustrated your lack of knowledge and perhaps indicate why you find it difficult to live here.

Any ticking "time bomb" in Thailand is not linked to the inability of expats to do business here, but rather to social/political issues that the Thai people have to face.

If you think Thailand is restrictive for expats, I think you should re-assess. Myanmar will not be a free-for-all, and will be more restrictive for expats than Thailand.

I do wish expats would open their eyes and realise that they are not the centre of the universe, but just a very tiny cog in the wheel, that would not be missed.

Spot on my man ....sometimes Thailand sucks in its ways but show me somewhere that doesn't been coming here over 20 yrs livin here over 10 so I think that's says it all IMHO.

Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa app

[Sharp]

Oh yeah I think the key to living in Thailand is patients and carful navigation ...

Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa app

[Tywais]

Contrary to popular belief by many expats, Thailand doesn't actually need your presence for the country to prosper.

Based on these GDP stats I would say it may not need it but it would certainly slow it down.

Source - WTTC (pdf)

[NanLaew]

I think you have pretty well established the fact that the OP has never been to Thailand. I have 4 bank accounts, and have not left Thailand in 10 years. Oh ya and a truck and motorcycle.

I have cars, bikes, bank accounts and rental contracts as well but never leaving Thailand in 10 years???!!!

Why do you punish yourself so?

[NanLaew]

Oh yeah I think the key to living in Thailand is patients and carful navigation ...

Sent from my iPad using ThaiVisa app

Umm.... any particular hospital you recommend? Or mobile GPS even?

[NanLaew]

OK, there's a lot of real 'residents' here that are either working, doing the retirement thing or just married with kids and therefore maybe NOT your stereotypical expat that the OP is referring to. I would wager that for every 1 of the 'residents' that are living here under some variation of the the above, there must be 10 'tourists' that are doing border runs (not boarder GH!) whilst the eke out an existence in LOS. As 'tourists', they rent rooms while they 'work online' and therefore fall below the radar if using purely visa classification as any guide to their actual domicile and working status.

In that regard, maybe the Thai Immigration laws are robust enough with hurdles sufficiently high to deter the less ardent and slightly dodgy whilst not being insurmountable for those with honest intentions and the ability to meet the criteria and file the paperwork needed to work, retire and otherwise stay here legally for the longer term.

[chiangmaikelly]

I think you have pretty well established the fact that the OP has never been to Thailand. I have 4 bank accounts, and have not left Thailand in 10 years. Oh ya and a truck and motorcycle.

I have cars, bikes, bank accounts and rental contracts as well but never leaving Thailand in 10 years???!!!

Why do you punish yourself so?

I don't think having everything I need and/or want qualifies as punishment. If you don't; go someplace where you do. If you can't find that place. Well keep looking... Experience and travel does wonders for the mind and soul. Maybe when you are older.....

[Riley'sLife]

Contrary to popular belief by many expats, Thailand doesn't actually need your presence for the country to prosper.

Based on these GDP stats I would say it may not need it but it would certainly slow it down.

Source - WTTC (pdf)

A good point, BUT...unfortunately your GDP stats make reference to Tourism, not contribution to GDP by expats.

No definition of “Expat” that I am aware of would encompass tourists. To be an expat there must be an element of living/residential status that I am certain the majority included in the GDP figures would not represent. The OP is complaining of his treatment as an expat, not as a tourist (notwithstanding the fact that he appears to be bending the immigration rules by doing visa-runs to top up his tourist visa status!! ..a point which I find ironic as well as amusing).

The wider point I am making is that too many expats seem to believe that Thailand “owes” them something by virtue of their very presence here. We expats are not essential for the country to prosper.

[dave111223]

What's all this 'going to and from the boarder every 2-3 months' all about?

I second that question. I though the ability to do a perpetual tourist visa with border runs was a closed long ago?

[poanoi]

Perpetual tourist visa with border runs lift the expats into tourist contribution of GDP

[The Pundit]

re.

I've never had a work permit or business visa, yet I have opened 2 bank accounts in Thailand.

nor me ! .. and ive got 6 bank accounts , own a bike and havnt

left thailand for years coz i use the 800 thousand method as well : )

shame the op didnt do his homework before posting : (

dave2

I think you have pretty well established the fact that the OP has never been to Thailand. I have 4 bank accounts, and have not left Thailand in 10 years. Oh ya and a truck and motorcycle.

You seem to think putting logs on a fire 30 years ago makes you Thai,I think that shows how much you know!I'm assuming you must be fluent in the Thai language after 10 years here,would I be right?

[The Pundit]

Firstly, Thailand is for Thais. It is not the aim of the Thai gov to facilitate the take over of assets or business opportunities by foreigners. If you haven't already grasped that concept you really do have a great deal to learn.

Foreigners are, in my experience, made more than welcome in Thailand, especially if they spend their money here. Contrary to popular belief by many expats, Thailand doesn't actually need your presence for the country to prosper.

Living here is not about changing Thailand, (although many things could be changed for the benefit of the Thai people if they actually had the collective will to address the problems) ; living here is about adapting to the way life is here and taking advantage of the positive aspects rather than constantly bleating about the minor irritations.

Life is way too short. Enjoy the positives. If it is beyond your ability to adapt here, maybe there are better places for you to be, but moaning about not being able to open a bank account, or own a vehicle, just illustrated your lack of knowledge and perhaps indicate why you find it difficult to live here.

Any ticking "time bomb" in Thailand is not linked to the inability of expats to do business here, but rather to social/political issues that the Thai people have to face.

If you think Thailand is restrictive for expats, I think you should re-assess. Myanmar will not be a free-for-all, and will be more restrictive for expats than Thailand.

I do wish expats would open their eyes and realise that they are not the centre of the universe, but just a very tiny cog in the wheel, that would not be missed.

If Thailand is for Thais what are you doing here,you are NOT Thai?

I think you've missed the point somewhat spectacularly here,if your borders are open at all why not make it easier for foreigners to do business in your country to facilitate FDI (Foreign Direct Investment)?

Western nations like any of the G7 or G20 countries bend over backwards to do so but you say Thailand doesn't need it?America does and they're the world's largest economy,how do you explain that?The BRIC nations,who are the most up and coming developing nations (read WAY ahead of Thailand) are falling over themselves to attract such investment of funds but Thailand doesn't need it,why do they advertise exactly the opposite on channels like CNBC then in that case on a daily basis?

Just another clueless fool rattling on about Thailand for the Thais while laughingly putting himself somewhere where in any Thai's mind he will never,ever be...on the Thai side of the fence!

Edited November 22, 2012 by The Pundit

[chiangmaikelly]

re.

I've never had a work permit or business visa, yet I have opened 2 bank accounts in Thailand.

nor me ! .. and ive got 6 bank accounts , own a bike and havnt

left thailand for years coz i use the 800 thousand method as well : )

shame the op didnt do his homework before posting : (

dave2

I think you have pretty well established the fact that the OP has never been to Thailand. I have 4 bank accounts, and have not left Thailand in 10 years. Oh ya and a truck and motorcycle.

You seem to think putting logs on a fire 30 years ago makes you Thai,I think that shows how much you know!I'm assuming you must be fluent in the Thai language after 10 years here,would I be right?

Attacking my credibilty does not disprove the fact that your lack of knowledge of Thailand most likely comes from the fact you have never spent any time in Thailand. Sorry fellow but anyone who had even vacationed here would know one can open a bank account or buy a motorcycle in your own name without a work permit.

Edited November 22, 2012 by chiangmaikelly

[Orac]

What's all this 'going to and from the boarder every 2-3 months' all about?

I second that question. I though the ability to do a perpetual tourist visa with border runs was a closed long ago?

I am sure there are a few like me that do border runs. I have a 1 year O visa (marriage) so do the runs every 3 months. I could have gone the extension route but, since my wife is still registered as living in her village, and the hoops immigration want you to jump through it is just as easy to do the runs when I have not been near a border for a while. In a few years, when I reach 50, I will no doubt get a retirement visa with extensions.

[true blue]

pundit,give it up your simplistic view how they operate for business and basic necessities in los is laughable,grow up, your just annoying posters,with your lack of knowledge of every day events here.khow jia.

Edited November 22, 2012 by true blue

[soomak]

Firstly, Thailand is for Thais. It is not the aim of the Thai gov to facilitate the take over of assets or business opportunities by foreigners. If you haven't already grasped that concept you really do have a great deal to learn.

Foreigners are, in my experience, made more than welcome in Thailand, especially if they spend their money here. Contrary to popular belief by many expats, Thailand doesn't actually need your presence for the country to prosper.

Anyone can buy land in the US and many other countries.

Anyone can own a company in the US and many other countries.

Working legally is the only thing where Thailand is on par with most countries I know - it is difficult to obtain a work visa almost anywhere.

Thailand is definitely over protective of it's citizens, IMO the main reason is that they cannot compete with foreigners on many levels.

However the ASEAN treaty in 2015 will mean they will have to compete with Filipinos, Malaysians and even Burmese with much better English skills, and probably better work ethics.

Protectionism can only work to a certain extent... we live in a global society / economy.

Edited November 22, 2012 by soomak