Who Actually Manages And Control The Day To Day Business Of Condominiums In Thailand

[mascarakatze]

The are condominiums laws (by the supreme court) in Thailand. There are labor laws. There are civil and criminal laws affecting the day to day operations of condominium buildings in Thailand. What actually in the real power structure of running a condominium. In one building at kad suan kaew The juristic manager had members of the committee arrested for trespassing. At a popular condo building on the Ping River the manager came to work, packed his briefcase and resigned. At a night bazaar condo building the entire committee resigned (blissfully) and a new committee was elected (sadly). There are dozens and dozens of condo building under construction, how can they operate successfully with no real guidlines (or are there and they are not followed)

Layers who I have asked say that at the top of the pyramid is the juristic manager and they are only guided by the committee. The committee has only marginal authority and power.

[ARISTIDE]

The juristic manager had members of the committee arrested for trespassing.

Wow what a mess! I've always thought the juristic manager is the top of the food chain. He or she should act on behalf of the committee members supervising the juristic person staffs. But then again there are laws in Thailand that most Thai may not be aware of including me.

Edited January 21, 2013 by ARISTIDE

[mgbcnx]

Don't kid yourself. The manager runs day-to-day affairs, but the power is in the hands of the few Thai majority owners/investors--who appoint the manager, pay no maintenance fees, evade all assessments, ignore elected association committees, and suit themselves entirely. A farang who buys a condominium in Thailand is utterly at the mercy of this establishment.

A case in point... Our condo is installing a new water system, new pipes to every unit. Our manager lamented that there might not be enough money to pay for the project inasmuch as so many absentee owners refuse to pay their maintenance fees and assessment charges. When someone suggested the obvious ("Don't turn on their water; cut off their electricity."), he replied, "Oh, no, cannot! VIPs." .

[hellodolly]

Not a whole lot different than what I had in Canada. I owned a town house and we were run by a committee we elected. Once a year we had an election and every month a business meeting open to all but attended by only the officers on the counsel.

For years I was the treasure and basically ran the day to day things. We had a volunteer handy man and did not have to call some one to come in and change a light bulb. We had bylaws we had to abide by. Any major expenditure had to be approved by the whole membership.

As the treasure I would constantly be reminding people of there late maintenance costs. On occasion call a bill collector. I was responsible for getting bids for major expenditures. If I had taken a lackadaisical attitude towards my responsibilities we would have had the same situation as we see here in many condos. For a well run condo you need active participation of all the members. They don't have to attend all the meetings but when there is some thing important they should all be there.

[justcruisin]

Not a whole lot different than what I had in Canada. I owned a town house and we were run by a committee we elected. Once a year we had an election and every month a business meeting open to all but attended by only the officers on the counsel.

For years I was the treasure and basically ran the day to day things. We had a volunteer handy man and did not have to call some one to come in and change a light bulb. We had bylaws we had to abide by. Any major expenditure had to be approved by the whole membership.

As the treasure I would constantly be reminding people of there late maintenance costs. On occasion call a bill collector. I was responsible for getting bids for major expenditures. If I had taken a lackadaisical attitude towards my responsibilities we would have had the same situation as we see here in many condos. For a well run condo you need active participation of all the members. They don't have to attend all the meetings but when there is some thing important they should all be there.

Spot on remarks Dolly, I have been actively involved in the management of the building I live in for a number of years now. It seems that the western owners are not willing to put in the time to assist the management and as a result work on the building becomes neglected. If there is pro-active management it protects the asset value of our investment.

Often I will assist the staff with guidance on how to tackle a particular project or job. We have also instigated monthly and annual audit of funds to prevent funds being siphoned off.

Usually the Thai owners who are voted onto the committee will come to a couple of meetings then just fade out and not resign or come to meetings, in saying that if the building appears well run the other western committee members will often not care too much about the day to day operations.

[Puwa]

At the risk of stating the obvious, rule of law is not Thailand's strong suit.

[Plastic Brontosaurus]

Condos and committees always an issue IMHO. Not just in Thailand - both in NZ and AU all sorts of issues with the "Body Corporate" managing the building (over there it's commercial - an outside business running the building management). They charge for their services (as one would expect), but then only have the maintenance etc. done by their mates who charge excessive prices, then on top of that take 10% kickback off anyone who does any work in/on the building, push through work that is not required so they can reap more profits, etc.

Bottom line: checking out the building management setup is one of the key issues/influencers of the buying decision in condo buildings; it can make or break the experience living there, the increase or decline in value of the condo, etc. My experience in AU/NZ was almost enough to for ever say "no more condo", however given the convenience of them, I may just be tempted again, after thoroughly checking the management situation (and this being Thailand, also checking who the other owners are - particularly the spread of nationalities). Also remember to check the building for "cost factors": extensive services provision (swimming pools, gyms, large elaborate gardens) as well as the structure itself (many impractical large surfaces that require maintenance such as regular painting, cleaning, repairs etc.): these will significantly add to overall costs, either every month or down the track when major maintenance or repairs are due.

[mcgriffith]

Moved to Real Estate forum, with live link remaining on Chiang Mai.

[cheeryble]

Don't kid yourself. The manager runs day-to-day affairs, but the power is in the hands of the few Thai majority owners/investors--who appoint the manager, pay no maintenance fees, evade all assessments, ignore elected association committees, and suit themselves entirely. A farang who buys a condominium in Thailand is utterly at the mercy of this establishment.

Poppycock.

The Juristic Manager has the power and is only "advised" by the committee.

But if he or she fails to do the committee's bidding or are unsatisfactory they can be removed by a general vote.

If some owners in some buildings allow themselves to be intimidated that's another matter.

You can also console yourself that unless all those unpaid bills you mention are paid up to date your villainous Thai owner will accrue interest at a swingeing 20%pa, and if he doesn't pay cannot sell his condo. This is Thai law and the manager MUST enforce it. The interest is one shining example of an improvement in the law which works.

Condos and committees always an issue IMHO. Not just in Thailand

You've got it PB and HelloDolly.......I have an American friend who says in Los Angeles people go to condo meetings with their lawyer.

Having said that an exacerbating problem is the weak writing of the law here. The Condo Act is entirely a matter for interpretation, if someone says "let's ask a lawyer" tell them it will just be another guess.

You Bronto are also absolutely right about checking management. I always advise people that the power structure in a building is crucial.

Another thing that's struck me is that in a building with say a hundred or more rooms, you are by the laws of chance almost certain to have a sociopath or two who will cause any manner of problems. Don't be surprised by it, expect it and act skilfully to pre-empt their troublemaking.

Edited January 21, 2013 by cheeryble

[Delight]

The official reporting structure of a condo is as follows:

COMMITTEE

MANAGER OF THE JURISITIC PERSON(JPM)

BUILDING MANAGER (OPTIONAL)

INTERNAL AND EXTERNAL SUPPLIERS.

The committee are responsible to the Co –owners.

This detail comes from the Condo. Act.

However this structure is not laid out in such simple terms.

The committee runs the show.

The JPM has authority to take some serious decisions if necessary.

Co –owners have power (conditions apply) to implement meaningful change.

However if the committee, the JPM and the co –owners all take a apathetic stance –then it is likely that the condo will fail

[dave111223]

Don't kid yourself. The manager runs day-to-day affairs, but the power is in the hands of the few Thai majority owners/investors--who appoint the manager, pay no maintenance fees, evade all assessments, ignore elected association committees, and suit themselves entirely. A farang who buys a condominium in Thailand is utterly at the mercy of this establishment.

A case in point... Our condo is installing a new water system, new pipes to every unit. Our manager lamented that there might not be enough money to pay for the project inasmuch as so many absentee owners refuse to pay their maintenance fees and assessment charges. When someone suggested the obvious ("Don't turn on their water; cut off their electricity."), he replied, "Oh, no, cannot! VIPs." .

Quite a few silly points there. Foreign condo owner has the same voting rights as a Thai owner, not at all at the "mercy of the establishment"...

If you refuse to pay your maintenance fees you accrue interest on the fees and you will not be able to sell your condo (land department will not allow the transfer) until the balance is paid (VIP or otherwise).

[Delight]

Don't kid yourself. The manager runs day-to-day affairs, but the power is in the hands of the few Thai majority owners/investors--who appoint the manager, pay no maintenance fees, evade all assessments, ignore elected association committees, and suit themselves entirely. A farang who buys a condominium in Thailand is utterly at the mercy of this establishment.

I am aware of one condo that is run as described by mgbcnx.

They get away with it by running the condo very well ,and create happy co -owners.

It is illegal but happy co -owners are apathetic co -owners.