Thai Wife Left Husband And 2 Y/o Daughter.

[Mario2008]

Let's hope that the new test will be positive and you can start your new live together in the US without worries.

Good luck.

[Annonymous]

Hi,

Any update?

I must say that I am really surprised by the U.S. requirements to be a dad! In my European country DNA testing is illegal (unless ordered by court) for the reason that the father is considered as the father even if not biologically, and that a DNA test could damage the father-child relation as well as the entire family...

In regard to my European country, all I have to do to be legally the father of a child, is to go to my embassy with the Birth Certificate or even the document delivered by the hospital/clinic or midwife and say that I recognize the child as mine, and I immediately get an European Birth Certificate with my name on it and the name of my child! It's a 10-minutes process, even if not married to the mother.

Anyway apparently it's not that simple for you so I wish you'll find a way to keep your child with you in the U.S.

Also if your third DNA test is positive, then that would mean that non-blood based DNA tests are totally unreliable!!!!

[Doinrite]

Hi,

Any update?

I must say that I am really surprised by the U.S. requirements to be a dad! In my European country DNA testing is illegal (unless ordered by court) for the reason that the father is considered as the father even if not biologically, and that a DNA test could damage the father-child relation as well as the entire family...

In regard to my European country, all I have to do to be legally the father of a child, is to go to my embassy with the Birth Certificate or even the document delivered by the hospital/clinic or midwife and say that I recognize the child as mine, and I immediately get an European Birth Certificate with my name on it and the name of my child! It's a 10-minutes process, even if not married to the mother.

Anyway apparently it's not that simple for you so I wish you'll find a way to keep your child with you in the U.S.
Also if your third DNA test is positive, then that would mean that non-blood based DNA tests are totally unreliable!!!!

I finalized my divorce with my wife (daughter's mother). We are in agreement our daughter will come stay with me in the U.S.. But if 3rd DNA test excludes me as father I will have to start adoption process. From what I understand it can take a very long time for adoption. My daughter and I have taken a DNA test using blood at Khon Kan University. Should get results in 2 months. Then will proceed from there with either reapplying for birth aboard with US Embassy or adoption.

I would like to thank everyone for their comments and advice in the matter. I will be posting updates as anything new develop. Thank you, Doinrite Edited February 24, 2013 by Doinrite

[Annonymous]

Hi,

Any update?

I must say that I am really surprised by the U.S. requirements to be a dad! In my European country DNA testing is illegal (unless ordered by court) for the reason that the father is considered as the father even if not biologically, and that a DNA test could damage the father-child relation as well as the entire family...

In regard to my European country, all I have to do to be legally the father of a child, is to go to my embassy with the Birth Certificate or even the document delivered by the hospital/clinic or midwife and say that I recognize the child as mine, and I immediately get an European Birth Certificate with my name on it and the name of my child! It's a 10-minutes process, even if not married to the mother.

Anyway apparently it's not that simple for you so I wish you'll find a way to keep your child with you in the U.S.

Also if your third DNA test is positive, then that would mean that non-blood based DNA tests are totally unreliable!!!!

I finalized my divorce with my wife (daughter's mother). We are in agreement our daughter will come stay with me in the U.S.. But if 3rd DNA test excludes me as father I will have to start adoption process. From what I understand it can take a very long time for adoption. My daughter and I have taken a DNA test using blood at Khon Kan University. Should get results in 2 months. Then will proceed from there with either reapplying for birth aboard with US Embassy or adoption.

I would like to thank everyone for their comments and advice in the matter. I will be posting updates as anything new develop. Thank you, Doinrite

Thanks for the update, were you able to bring your daughter with you to the U.S.? what type of visa did she get?

I really wish you luck for all the remaining process...

[Mario2008]

Do keep us updated.

Did you check out the legalisation process with a US-lawyer? Another possibility is to get your daughter a lawyer. Don't forget your daughter has rights of her own, not only you. In some cases your rights might be stronger in other cases her own rights might be stronger than yours and give a bette chance for success.

[Doinrite]

Hi,

Any update?

I must say that I am really surprised by the U.S. requirements to be a dad! In my European country DNA testing is illegal (unless ordered by court) for the reason that the father is considered as the father even if not biologically, and that a DNA test could damage the father-child relation as well as the entire family...

In regard to my European country, all I have to do to be legally the father of a child, is to go to my embassy with the Birth Certificate or even the document delivered by the hospital/clinic or midwife and say that I recognize the child as mine, and I immediately get an European Birth Certificate with my name on it and the name of my child! It's a 10-minutes process, even if not married to the mother.

Anyway apparently it's not that simple for you so I wish you'll find a way to keep your child with you in the U.S.

Also if your third DNA test is positive, then that would mean that non-blood based DNA tests are totally unreliable!!!!

I finalized my divorce with my wife (daughter's mother). We are in agreement our daughter will come stay with me in the U.S.. But if 3rd DNA test excludes me as father I will have to start adoption process. From what I understand it can take a very long time for adoption. My daughter and I have taken a DNA test using blood at Khon Kan University. Should get results in 2 months. Then will proceed from there with either reapplying for birth aboard with US Embassy or adoption.

I would like to thank everyone for their comments and advice in the matter. I will be posting updates as anything new develop. Thank you, Doinrite

Thanks for the update, were you able to bring your daughter with you to the U.S.? what type of visa did she get?

I really wish you luck for all the remaining process...

Do keep us updated.

Did you check out the legalisation process with a US-lawyer? Another possibility is to get your daughter a lawyer. Don't forget your daughter has rights of her own, not only you. In some cases your rights might be stronger in other cases her own rights might be stronger than yours and give a bette chance for success.

I'm going to wait for the results on the 3rd DNA test. Once I have the results I will fiqure out from there what would be best course of action. In the meantime my in-laws (wife's parents) will take care of my daughter while I'm back in the U.S.. The grandparents do a very good job and care alot about my daughter. I will be looking for a good lawyer while I'm back in the U.S..

[Doinrite]

Update: results of 3rd DNA test via blood. I'm excluded as father. So, adoption is only option. Any advice on adoption would be greatly appreciated.

[Mario2008]

Update: results of 3rd DNA test via blood. I'm excluded as father. So, adoption is only option. Any advice on adoption would be greatly appreciated.

Sorry to hear that, would have been much easier.

Adoption will be difficult as under Thai law you are the legal father already since you were married to the mother at the time of the birth of the child. It is the US-law that is the problem here and under which you need to adopt the child/legalize the child.

The only advise I can give you is to get a good US lawyer to help you sort things out. Maybe contact your congress man for help.

https://www.childwelfare.gov/adoption/laws/ gives some information.

[commande]

Sorry to hear about the DNA test. You are looking at a VERY long process, adoption in the USA can takes years when they are already US Citizens. It can take even longer since your "daughter" isn't a US Citizen. International adoption law is very complex AND very expensive. Your probably looking at spending 20k-50k USD to get this done with all the lawyer fees, etc.

She has to go through the same process as everyone else that is an alien to the US since she is Thai and not your biological child. She might even have to be placed into an adoption agency program in Thailand that has an agreement with the USA foreign adoption program. This is going to take a LONG time for you. I do hope that everything will work out though, you seem to be a very good guy taking responsibility for a child that is not biologically yours, I agree with everything your doing. Not many people like you around in this world, you will be a great parent!!!

[Mario2008]

It cannot be an international adoption, as under Thai law the child is already his. He might not be the biological father but he is the legal father. The differences between Thai family law and US-nationality law make it a difficult situation.

[bangkokburning]

No way she will ever see the US until she is 12 and youbwant tonsend her to a private high school and obtain a visa for that. Emigrate as your kid, no.way.

Cut your losses. Seems like her family quite willing to offload her on you. Dont let them.off the hook so easily.

Not the kids fault, but mom really did you raw bro. You dont need to be a hero.

You married a real princezz, good luck.

[commande]

It cannot be an international adoption, as under Thai law the child is already his. He might not be the biological father but he is the legal father. The differences between Thai family law and US-nationality law make it a difficult situation.

I agree but only if sole parental authority has been granted in Thailand to him which would in the end make him the legal parent. Unfortunately since the girl is Thai and he is a US Citizen it doesn't matter, the US Courts could deem that he isn't the legal father and have so far under DNA testing - because of a lack of Biological proof. In America you can't legally adopt a foreign citizen without permission under US International Adoption Law. He is US (not dual citizen Thai), she is Thai (not dual citizen). He has to play by the USA rules in the end to get her to America. Just because Thailand will give a child away to a foreigner doesn't make that child in USA Law their legal parent because the USA Adoption Law which could be applied here because of no Biological history could be enforced.

Bottom line you look at from the USA immigration legal side. You have an American citizen saying that Thailand gave him parental rights over a non biological related person, essentially that is adoption. This being said they could look at it this way and the international or rather USA Adoption laws might apply. No guarantee that this is what would happen but it is possible because in the end this is what it is no matter if Thailand gave him a receipt for purchase.

I personally think the best way to avoid all this confusion would be for him to get his Thai citizenship. Should be easy, DNA test from his parent and himself confirmed, they issue him a Thai Passport. He then goes to the court and get the daughter under sole custody as declared parent. He can then process all of this as a Thai with a Thai daughter and not as a USA Citizen with a Non-Biological Thai Daughter. and then use his dual citizenship to get the USA to recognize she is his legal daughter, they will let that pass because Thailand will update her birth certificate which is what's required to show parental status in this situation.

Under USA law you can not give, sell, take ownership/custody, etc. children, he can't legally under US law take parental ownership or responsibility - he can generally only be a foreign sponsor such as sending money, gift, etc but that doesn't get her a Visa to the USA... She is not his biological daughter, so he can't legally as a US Citizen take her, this falls under human trafficking law. It's very complicated, it's not so easy otherwise there would be thousands of foreign children being brought into the USA every day by people saying they are their children. It used to be you could do that about 20 years ago until they closed the loopholes in the system and made it difficult in order to protect children from being sold by 3rd world corrupt countries (not singling out Thailand here, there are many on the planet) while making it appear legal with all paperwork.

I am no attorney, he really needs to get an attorney and be ready to pay big money as this is going to be confusing, everything is when the government gets involved.

Edited May 14, 2013 by commande

[bangkokburning]

Wow, commande and mario -as well as others, that was excellent analysis of this situation!

[Mario2008]

US nationality law allows him to legitimize the child if he is not the biological father, but the problem is that he can't legitimize the child as he already is the legal father.

See my earlier post.

[commande]

US nationality law allows him to legitimize the child if he is not the biological father, but the problem is that he can't legitimize the child as he already is the legal father.

See my earlier post.

You can't legitimize the child unless you legally adopt the child. He can't legally take parental custody of the child because under US Law it is illegal, it doesn't matter that Thailand gave him parental custody of the child or not; she is not his biological daughter. The United States Government will not recognize it because again it's against the law. It's possible that you are only reading a piece of the legal requirement and not the entire legal process.

Honestly, I hope that everything I am saying here is flat out wrong because if it is it means that he will be reunited with his daughter faster and with less drama. I don't mind being incorrect or proven wrong especially in this circumstance. I say all of this because I have seen it before in Africa, Afghanistan, Iraq, Bosnia, Ukraine and Russia. There are many people that will go from the USA and want children for various reasons mostly good reasons example being they can't have children. They will say anything to get a child especially woman because they want a child, immigration will look at it this way and so will social services and the international adoption program. They will not let his situation set a precedence because if they did the courts would have to start bending to everyone who claimed the same thing, most of which would be lying because they just want a child so bad and will say anything to get one fast; they want a family with children.

Last thing I will add here is this. Another example, if a US Child parents dies (parents are US Citizens also) the family, Grandparents etc. can request guardianship over the child, they have to accept this responsibility but it's voluntary. If they want to legitimize the child as there own child and not and not just legal guardianship they have to adopt the child. This adoption is even between family in the USA, they are citizens and Biologically related. Now consider this issue, not biologically related, not a US Citizen - this is boiling it down to basics. The USA won't do anything, they have no rights to exercise any authority over the child (she is Thai, Thai law applies), he is American, he has no rights under USA Law to take her anywhere even if Thailand said he can because Thailand doesn't govern USA Law just like USA Law doesn't govern Thai Law. I honestly think he will have to adopt her to legitimize under USA Law and get her a passport. This is what all the other people I have met in the past had to do and it takes years sometimes to get it done and a ton of money.

Edited May 15, 2013 by commande

[amykat]

You should look into the immigration laws for stepparents. Although, unfortunately, you got divorced already ...if you were not divorced, you could have the child immigrate as a stepchild, for sure, without the mother immigrating with you. (Well I mean, for sure, when the kid is really a stepchild ...but I think if the child is not yours biologically, you MUST be at least, a step-parent.)

I am not sure what happens if you are divorced, but I think there is some importance put on even past step-parent relationships.

If you need help, I would suggest a lawyer in BKK, called William White, you can google him and find his info. He knows about immigration law and adoption and everything you need, and I believe, can be trusted! The ONLY lawyer in Thailand that I have found, who knows about these things.

I wish you luck!

[Sheryl]

Concult a good immigration lawyer.

And good luck.