Three Hurt In U S Helicopter Hard Landing In Thailand

[webfact]

Three hurt in US helicopter hard landing in Thailand

BANGKOK, Feb 20, 2013 (AFP) - A US Marine helicopter on Wednesday made a "hard landing" during military exercises in northern Thailand, seriously injuring some of the passengers, the US Embassy in Bangkok said.

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Embassy spokesman Walter Braunohler said there were no fatalities in the incident, which involved a CH-46 Sea Knight helicopter carrying US personnel taking part in the Cobra Gold joint military drills.

A source close to the exercises said two of the helicopter passengers were believed to need emergency surgery, while one sustained more minor injuries and a further three were unhurt.

Cobra Gold is the largest US multilateral exercise in the Asia-Pacific, bringing together thousands of troops from the US, Thailand and other countries for field training.

The annual drills are a key part of the US military relationship with Thailand, whose air bases and ports remain vital to the American military's logistical network in Asia.

-- (c) Copyright AFP 2013-02-20

[Locationthailand]

I am sure the Thai military needs to remain ever ready at the beckon call of the US or is this a 'comply' order or else? What ever happened to Utapao revamp in favour of the US 'weather balloons'?

[KHR1010]

I am sure the Thai military needs to remain ever ready at the beckon call of the US or is this a 'comply' order or else? What ever happened to Utapao revamp in favour of the US 'weather balloons'?

What are you possibly bleating on about....Cobra Gold has been a joint military exercise for decades and at the invitation of Thailand. It includes Singapore, Indonesia, Malaysia, Thailand, USA, Japan and Korea. Thailand and The US have been treaty allies since 1833 and routinely train together across different military platforms.

[Briggsy]

Nice one, KHR 1010.

Trouble is you brought facts to the table.

People round here prefer a rant.

[TomTao]

I hope the injured personnel make a full recovery, the fact that no one was killed is a testament to the pilot's skill and training, well done!

[Mosha]

Was it flying at night?

[Carib]

I hope the injured personnel make a full recovery, the fact that no one was killed is a testament to the pilot's skill and training, well done!

The pilot made a hard landing, they are trained not to, so the skill must have failed for a minute there.

[55Jay]

I hope the injured personnel make a full recovery, the fact that no one was killed is a testament to the pilot's skill and training, well done!

The pilot made a hard landing, they are trained not to, so the skill must have failed for a minute there.

Me thinks you haven't sufficient information to make such a declarative statement.

[TomTao]

I hope the injured personnel make a full recovery, the fact that no one was killed is a testament to the pilot's skill and training, well done!

The pilot made a hard landing, they are trained not to, so the skill must have failed for a minute there.

The hard landing may have been caused by a mechanical failure, military pilots are trained to a very high standard.

[jamhar]

I am sure the Thai military needs to remain ever ready at the beckon call of the US or is this a 'comply' order or else? What ever happened to Utapao revamp in favour of the US 'weather balloons'?

My country, which i love very much, does more than enough legitimately stupid things in foreign policy,

that you can complain about........you really dont need to fabricate any.

but thanks anyways.

[rubl]

"A US Marine helicopter on Wednesday made a "hard landing""

No landing where all can basicly walk or be carried away from alive is a bad landing. Mind you, it's either the weather, those military pilots or just the bloody flying contraption itself, but helicopters seem somewhat less safe than other means of transportation (even though in these heli's you don't need to open a door to get rid of your cigar stomp)

[IMA_FARANG]

I hope the injured personnel make a full recovery, the fact that no one was killed is a testament to the pilot's skill and training, well done!

The pilot made a hard landing, they are trained not to, so the skill must have failed for a minute there.

------------------------

What the military refer to as a "hard landing" is little more than a controlled crash.

In general it is an unpowerd auto rotate landing.

And a Helicopter, even at the best of times, is a box you are in riding in with all of the weight and equipment (including the engne and rotor) ABOVE you

NOT a good place to be in a "hard landing".

Edited February 20, 2013 by IMA_FARANG

[BoonToong]

Lots and lots of speculation, 'maybes', comments and judgements made about the Pilot's ability (or, rather, lack of it).

Do some people really still get a kick out of pretending to know something about helicopters?

Edited February 20, 2013 by BoonToong

[BoonToong]

I hope the injured personnel make a full recovery, the fact that no one was killed is a testament to the pilot's skill and training, well done!

The pilot made a hard landing, they are trained not to, so the skill must have failed for a minute there.

Based on your own experience?

[BoonToong]

"A US Marine helicopter on Wednesday made a "hard landing""

No landing where all can basicly walk or be carried away from alive is a bad landing. Mind you, it's either the weather, those military pilots or just the bloody flying contraption itself, but helicopters seem somewhat less safe than other means of transportation (even though in these heli's you don't need to open a door to get rid of your cigar stomp)

Statistics show that this is not actually true; but I agree, the common perception amongst the general public is that helicopters 'are dangerous'

[BoonToong]

I hope the injured personnel make a full recovery, the fact that no one was killed is a testament to the pilot's skill and training, well done!

The pilot made a hard landing, they are trained not to, so the skill must have failed for a minute there.

------------------------

What the military refer to as a "hard landing" is little more than a controlled crash.

In general it is an unpowerd auto rotate landing.

And a Helicopter, even at the best of times, is a box you are in riding in with all of the weight and equipment (including the engne and rotor) ABOVE you

NOT a good place to be in a "hard landing".

Not true; there are many other things that might cause a heavy landing. Even an autorotative landing (that you refer to), if carried out correctly, can be conducted very smoothly

[alfalfa19]

I know nothing about helicopters, but I would like to pontificate anyway. Please give me a few minutes while I think up some good stuff.

[canman]

"A US Marine helicopter on Wednesday made a "hard landing""

No landing where all can basicly walk or be carried away from alive is a bad landing. Mind you, it's either the weather, those military pilots or just the bloody flying contraption itself, but helicopters seem somewhat less safe than other means of transportation (even though in these heli's you don't need to open a door to get rid of your cigar stomp)

Statistics show that this is not actually true; but I agree, the common perception amongst the general public is that helicopters 'are dangerous'

I'd be interested in seeing those statistics. I have been a passenger in hundreds of helo flights and my impression has always been that the helo flight was much more dangerous then the plane flight to get there. Although I don't have any hard stats to back it up I am fairly sure that more oil workers die in helo crashes then are killed in airplane crashes.

[geriatrickid]

I am sure the Thai military needs to remain ever ready at the beckon call of the US or is this a 'comply' order or else? What ever happened to Utapao revamp in favour of the US 'weather balloons'?

What are you possibly bleating on about....Cobra Gold has been a joint military exercise for decades and at the invitation of Thailand. It includes Singapore, Indonesia, Malaysia, Thailand, USA, Japan and Korea. Thailand and The US have been treaty allies since 1833 and routinely train together across different military platforms.

Don't bother going there. Facts take a back seat to an opportunity to allege something negative about the USA. The sad part is that such people are the first to expect a helicopter to come to the rescue in the event of a catastrophe or air disaster offshore. It's this training and US assets that make such assistance possible. This reminds me of the Pakistanis that regularly criticized the Americans but turned up as uncontrolled mob to grab when the US military was bringing in much needed relief and aid after the earthquake and floods. It's fun to bash the USA until you need a rescue flight or protection.

[Falcon01]

I am sure the Thai military needs to remain ever ready at the beckon call of the US or is this a 'comply' order or else? What ever happened to Utapao revamp in favour of the US 'weather balloons'?

What are you possibly bleating on about....Cobra Gold has been a joint military exercise for decades and at the invitation of Thailand. It includes Singapore, Indonesia, Malaysia, Thailand, USA, Japan and Korea. Thailand and The US have been treaty allies since 1833 and routinely train together across different military platforms.

You nailed it. Good to see some posters actually know what they are talking about!

[jpinx]

Too many facts spoiling the party

Of course helicopters are dangerous, but so are motorbikes!

Of course USA foreign policy is to blame - nothing to do with the terrorists!

et seq................

[Payboy]

Any landing is better than a crash. So much better when there are no fatalities.

Edited February 21, 2013 by Payboy

[55Jay]

"A US Marine helicopter on Wednesday made a "hard landing""

No landing where all can basicly walk or be carried away from alive is a bad landing. Mind you, it's either the weather, those military pilots or just the bloody flying contraption itself, but helicopters seem somewhat less safe than other means of transportation (even though in these heli's you don't need to open a door to get rid of your cigar stomp)

I heard a continuation of the "any landing you can...." clique. Goes like, "any landing you can walk away from is a good landing..... any landing you can walk away from AND use the aircraft again, is a great landing!"

[rotorbreeze]

Lots and lots of speculation, 'maybes', comments and judgements made about the Pilot's ability (or, rather, lack of it).

Do some people really still get a kick out of pretending to know something about helicopters?

As an Engineer servicing helicopters for 30 yrs, a hard landing may occur if the helicopter is below the safety Auto-rotation height of 300 feet this is death mans curve, also zero airspeed when this occurs...usually take off condition. Over weight condition while in the take off mode. Wind direction..down wind assures a slow climbing speed through the dead mans curve. Maintenance check to see if auto-revs are set while in flight to see if the rotor speed while descending stays in green range est 300 rpm of rotor speed indicator. Over gross will make the helicopter descend very quickly and a maintenance check will show this...adjust the pitch links on main rotor blades. Flying over water with floats on skids the pilot does not have a reference..like in a snow storm all white out..on ocean no vertical reference...the water comes up and decent must be slow and with caution... well enough..oh yes a tail rotor failure will cause the helicopter to Yaw and power must be cut..allowing helicopter to keep a forward decent and again the helicopter must be high enough to safely land. Any more questions I can address..lets see the accident report...Rotor Ron...

[sunshine51]

Since this article comes to us via AFP I can't heckle the local press

however my guess leads to two probabilities...either Chalerm was

aboard and or...LOS is trying for another Hub...A hub of hard landings.

[willyumiii]

I hope the injured personnel make a full recovery, the fact that no one was killed is a testament to the pilot's skill and training, well done!

The pilot made a hard landing, they are trained not to, so the skill must have failed for a minute there.

I was a wildland fire fighter in the U.S. and flew on many, many helecopters...I noticed that they never say a helecopter "crashed"..it is always refered to as a "hard landing". even if the ship is totaly destroyed and all are killed.....still a "hard landing".

[phuketjock]

"A US Marine helicopter on Wednesday made a "hard landing""

No landing where all can basicly walk or be carried away from alive is a bad landing. Mind you, it's either the weather, those military pilots or just the bloody flying contraption itself, but helicopters seem somewhat less safe than other means of transportation (even though in these heli's you don't need to open a door to get rid of your cigar stomp)

Statistics show that this is not actually true; but I agree, the common perception amongst the general public is that helicopters 'are dangerous'

I'd be interested in seeing those statistics. I have been a passenger in hundreds of helo flights and my impression has always been that the helo flight was much more dangerous then the plane flight to get there. Although I don't have any hard stats to back it up I am fairly sure that more oil workers die in helo crashes then are killed in airplane crashes.

In order to answer this question, you would need to look at actual statistics, and a good place to find them is the NTSB website, which chronicles aircraft incidents nationwide. Here it is.

http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/query.asp

[phuketjock]

I hope the injured personnel make a full recovery, the fact that no one was killed is a testament to the pilot's skill and training, well done!

Or far more likely a testament to the sturdy design and construction of the helicopter, a very high percentage of

aviation accidents are caused by pilot error, rather than mechanical failure.

[BoonToong]

"A US Marine helicopter on Wednesday made a "hard landing""

No landing where all can basicly walk or be carried away from alive is a bad landing. Mind you, it's either the weather, those military pilots or just the bloody flying contraption itself, but helicopters seem somewhat less safe than other means of transportation (even though in these heli's you don't need to open a door to get rid of your cigar stomp)

Statistics show that this is not actually true; but I agree, the common perception amongst the general public is that helicopters 'are dangerous'

I'd be interested in seeing those statistics. I have been a passenger in hundreds of helo flights and my impression has always been that the helo flight was much more dangerous then the plane flight to get there. Although I don't have any hard stats to back it up I am fairly sure that more oil workers die in helo crashes then are killed in airplane crashes.

I was thinking more of the statistics about transport in general, not just in aviation.

[BoonToong]

Lots and lots of speculation, 'maybes', comments and judgements made about the Pilot's ability (or, rather, lack of it).

Do some people really still get a kick out of pretending to know something about helicopters?

As an Engineer servicing helicopters for 30 yrs, a hard landing may occur if the helicopter is below the safety Auto-rotation height of 300 feet this is death mans curve, also zero airspeed when this occurs...usually take off condition. Over weight condition while in the take off mode. Wind direction..down wind assures a slow climbing speed through the dead mans curve. Maintenance check to see if auto-revs are set while in flight to see if the rotor speed while descending stays in green range est 300 rpm of rotor speed indicator. Over gross will make the helicopter descend very quickly and a maintenance check will show this...adjust the pitch links on main rotor blades. Flying over water with floats on skids the pilot does not have a reference..like in a snow storm all white out..on ocean no vertical reference...the water comes up and decent must be slow and with caution... well enough..oh yes a tail rotor failure will cause the helicopter to Yaw and power must be cut..allowing helicopter to keep a forward decent and again the helicopter must be high enough to safely land. Any more questions I can address..lets see the accident report...Rotor Ron...

Hi Ron, you have covered a lot of the possible causes of a heavy landing but, with the greatest of respect (I was an engineer before becoming a pilot), some of the stuff you have described is not quite accurate. Always good to hear another expert opinion though.

The reason some of the earlier posts illuminated my 'amber cautions' is because, all too often, people speculate about how the Pilot might have messed up and there really is no need for it. I'm all for debate and discussion based on qualified judgements and opinions, but speculation based on knowledge gained in a bar or from a Google search really can be done without.

Happy to conduct some basic instruction in aerodynamics for anyone willing to pay me