If You Had A Choice, How Would You Plan Your Family?

[1DaySoon]

If you had a choice, how would you plan your family?

Ladies only question, if you don’t mind. If you are a male member and want to contribute please look at this question http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/632711-if-you-had-your-time-again-kids-choice/

My wife and I have been trying for some time now to conceive, without success.

We have gone through the escalation process of trying to conceive from the natural method (a couple of years), through timing the egg ovulation, artificial insemination (both turkey basting and though a Clinic) … without success to date.

Now the possibility of either IVF or IVF with ICSI is upon us.

This also raises the question of determining the sex of the child and how many are born in one pregnancy.

Our collective thoughts are to eventually have 2 or 3 kids, with 3 being the preferred option for us.

It’s a crazy thought to be able to play God … but that is the realms of medical technology nowadays.

Would you try for a

Boy first, then later twins?

Girl first, then later twins?

Twins first, then later a boy or girl?

We live in Thailand and have close family support.

We are both family orientated and I’m looking at the Family dynamics.

Also we have both discussed this question extensively and have both open minds on the subject.

My wife is under 35, so there is no imperative to inject 2 embryos hoping that at least one of them stick. Neither of us have or have had children.

From a wife's, mother's perspective, if you had your time again, or planning a family, what would you choose to do?

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[doji]

I don’t have any kids yet, but hopefully in 3-5 more years.
If I’m at the age of your wife, I would be leaning toward a set of twins, that’s it. (if I can really choose)

By the time the twins 2-3 yrs old, your wife will be approaching 40 and the probability of having a down syndrome baby will be higher. And I have no preference of boy or girl, they are my kids and born with unique personality and talent of their own,…I will love them no matter what.

I want to do and accomplish many things in life, and having baby right after baby is not one of my many goals. While I want to have children and think they are fun, adorable, and to see them grow up to be a unique and productive people will bring many tears to my eyes. However at the same time I also want to have enough time to do many things just for my own personal growth and achievement too. I really want to be one of the role models for my children and be able to teach them that they too can dream up and achieve things if they set their mind on it.
Yes I want to have time in doing things and be able to set an example for them, therefore a set of twins is just right for me.

I think having a child is not just to make a family only, but you have to be ready, not only financially, but physically and mentally as well. I also have seen many miserable parents who can’t take care of their children, whether be economically, physically or/and mentally....quite sad actually for the kids, without the proper planning.

Just a little thought…..from me (a thai woman)
And best wishes to you

Edited April 13, 2013 by doji

[Ave]

I believe Life is a gift. If I found it difficult to get pregnant I would take it as an encouragement to adopt a child of any age, race, gender, etc, which is most probably what I'm going to do before I leave this life. If I did have the intention, ability and means to give birth I would only want to know that my baby is going to be born naturally, preferably as the most amazing and surprising gift in my life. I would not be interested in knowing its gender, at all, and if it was born with a defect I would want it to enjoy its life and be unconditionally loved and nurtured for however long his/her/their life might be. Sorry if this might not be of help to you but your post compelled me to send you my opinion.

[billd766]

As a 68 year old father I was happy to settle for this way.

The same as as has happened so far.

A healthy baby boy with my first wife in the UK. He is now 35.

A healthy baby boy with my second wife in Thailand. He is 8 and will be 9 in August.

And yes I did read the other post first.

Be happy with what you can get as long as the baby is healthy and remember to love them always.

[swlondonmum]

I'm sure you have considered everything if you are starting to look into IVF etc but please bear in mind that it is not as easy as it sounds. I don't mean to be patronising as I'm sure you're aware it's not as simple as 'playing god' but I've seen a few friends go through it and it has been such a tough experience for them. The first couple tried 3 times - they went through an emotional and (for her) physical roller coaster and spent a fortune. They were lucky enough to conceiv twin boys but unfortunately one died during labour (they were born at 31 weeks, premature babies are very common with twins). They are very grateful for the boy but also regret putting two embryos in - they were aware of the risks but I guess it's hard to appreciate what exactly the risks mean in reality until it really happens. Another couple delayed trying for kids for work reasons and when it didn't happen quickly they said 'it's ok, we'll do IVF, then we can have twins so we can get two kids in one go'. A few attempts down the line they too have been through a tough time emotionally and physically, and spent a lot of money but are still nowhere. A third friend had twins and one was physically and mentally disabled as a result of a traumatic premature birth.

I'm not knocking you for saying things like this - I thought the same too about IVF before I saw what they went through - in fact after conceiving my son (age 34) we were unable to have any more kids and I did consider it for a while, but decided against it, though I would have loved more kids. Of course, a lot of people have a better IVF experience and I sincerely hope you do,, but I just wanted to pass on their experiences in case it helps you and your wife in any way. Please don't underestimate the effect it will have on her, but also on you and you both as a couple - it can really affect your relationship too.

On to my personal choice, if I was starting again I'd choose one child of either sex and then one more child of either sex, and ideally maybe even a third child depending on age and finances at that point (though I might be tempted to choose a child of the opposite sex for the second or third child...I always wanted one of each) and I wouldn't personally choose to have twins.

[1DaySoon]

Thanks for all the replies above.

Couple of things.

My wife is well under 35 so, while I am conscious of the Downs Syndrome issues, the percentages of that are reduced.

I really do appreciate the honesty, so please don't hold back, all posts by the ladies help.

We've both made a commitment to a family and it's great that we have a common goal (but no experience) to have a family together as sometimes it's a one sided argument.

[sunspun]

For myself, I would never have twins given the choice. I had always wanted them, but after having my son I realised how much work just one baby is and I have no idea how I would have dealt with 2! Definitely think long and hard about it. As for gender, I did hope for a girl, but now that I met this little boy I can't imagine wanting anyone else I don't think it really matters which you have first, you'll definitely never wonder if you made the wrong choice

[phuturatica]

I personally wouldn't want twins as I think one baby at a time is enough!

However if I was able to choose... I'd like a boy first and then a girl so he could grow up and look after his little baby sister.

[billd766]

Thanks for all the replies above.

Couple of things.

My wife is well under 35 so, while I am conscious of the Downs Syndrome issues, the percentages of that are reduced.

I really do appreciate the honesty, so please don't hold back, all posts by the ladies help.

We've both made a commitment to a family and it's great that we have a common goal (but no experience) to have a family together as sometimes it's a one sided argument.

My wife was 38 when our son was born and he has grown up to be perfectly normal and I love them both to bits.

[Raesum]

The title of your topic is..."If you had a choice"...I haven't had any children and at the ripe of age of 54 sure as eggs(no pun intended) ain't going to be having any either.

When I married my Thai husband at 32 years of age his son was 10 years old and we even discussed having children with him!!

However after 5 years nothing happened-we considered IVF but because we lived in country Australia it was just going to be too hard so decided on the option of "many overseas trips instead"( I was ready to have kids at 26 or so but because i hadn't met the right man had to be content with travelling the world-and content I was!)

So here I am with a wonderful step-son married to his wonderful wife and I am "Nanna Rae" to his 4 gorgeous girls! Couldn't have asked for better really!

Sometimes Plan A doesn't always happen so be prepared to look at Plan B..etc.

Oh and by the way..before anyone says "adoption"..you need to be under 30 to even start that process in Aus.So nnow , here in Bangkok I am involved in an Orphanage nearby giving babies aged between 0-5 years cuddles and kisses.(I dare not say the "V' word)

[Konini]

I don't want to burst your balloon, and maybe I shouldn't have a say in this as my husband and I made the decision that we didn't want children - neither of us are maternal or broody or anything. We have lots of nephews and nieces, and they are great - the best thing about them is that we can give them back when we get bored.

A very close friend of mine went through the IVF process 6 times without success. The actual success rate is very, very low. A lot of the figures include those conceived with artificial insemination where there were only minor problems. It was over 10 years ago and there must have been advances, but the hormone injections have a big side effect - mental health suffers. To this day she still has bouts of depression and anxiety attacks which a couple of doctors and a psychologist have put down 100% to the hormone treatment, and there is a 'very strong likelihood' that it will be permanent. She says it wasn't worth it - I can understand why she says it, it cost a lot of money, was unsuccessful and left her quite damaged mentally. Also, a lot of couples who go through IVF separate - there are statistics somewhere for this, much higher rate than those who haven't been through the IVF process.

Not wanting to put a downer on things, just advising you not to get your hopes up too high and that you fully understand the risks to you're wife's mental health. Please do a lot of research, and as Raesum said, have a plan B in case plan A doesn't go your way.

[transam]

I personally wouldn't want twins as I think one baby at a time is enough!

However if I was able to choose... I'd like a boy first and then a girl so he could grow up and look after his little baby sister.

Oddly enough............as an older guy, l now think about my sister who is two years younger, and she thinks of me, which for decades didn't happen. When l talk on the phone, from time to time, l feel she has a tear in her eye. Yeh, mum and dad have now gone and so perhaps the vibes work between us siblings. Who knows.

[1DaySoon]

Again, thanks for the replies.

We were only talking yesterday about what our dream is.

Enjoying a bottle of wine, watching the sunset, couple of romantics we are.

@ Konini

Yes, something to think about and I admit, I had not read similar information on the 'baby' websites.

I will research this a little.

Currently we are just using the AI method at home with no medical or pharmaceutical assistance.

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[fletchsmile]

I wouldn't want twins. I'd prefer 2 to 3, as an even number is often convenient for lots of things.

First one I'd want gender picked at random for the lottery experience just like it would be if conceiving naturally.

Second/next one I might consider choosing the gender, after seeing what the first one turned out like. May want same again or different. Don't know for sure, so I would see how I felt. Choosing gender never came into it for us, and so it wasn't a choice

Of course what I think wouldn't really matter too much. More likely the Mrs would choose.

...

BTW On the first one we were initially diagnosed as having a risk of Downs Syndrome. That was a horrible few weeks while we did some extra tests. All sorts of things to think about with that. Most people sort of expect their child will be healthy but wonder if what if they aren't. We were sort of expecting the reverse: baby having an impairment but hoping what if it wasn't.

I think my opinion on a Downs Syndrome child might be different living in Thailand in a cross cultural marriage where some people believe it's your kharma. UK people would be less judgemental and better facilities. We considered abortion.

In the event things turned out all right, after horrible weeks of worry they decided it wasn't Downs syndrome based on tests. So we never had to make that decision. Still not sure what we'd have done.

We were still worried up till the birth though, in case they were wrong. In the end we had a lovely healthy daughter. At that point we were just very happy and relieved everything was OK. I really couldn't have given a **** about the gender at that point, just very relieved, and very happy.

I sometimes look at her and wonder that we nearly made a very bad mistake, and what if we had chosen to have an abortion. That's a strange thought to describe, sad that we might have done that, relieved we didn't, plus a bit of guilt for even thinking about it.

Bottom line: sometimes things just turn out as they were meant to be. Twins/male/female may be things to think about, but in the great scheme of things aren't really important at all. I think deep down you know it really doesn't matter that much either, and it's just icing on the cake for you, at hopefully a time of hope for you both, and something nice to think about together.

Best wishes for success. Hope the procedure works and you have a child (children). My bet is you'll also appreciate the gift(s) regardless of what you end up with

Cheers Fletch

Edited April 18, 2013 by fletchsmile

[Sheryl]

As some posters have said, you may be greatly overestimating your options and the success of IVF.

Success rate per attempt are low, many people fail despite multiple attempts.

As for culling embryos, the reason doctors usually implant several at a time is not because the couple wants a multiple birth but rather to increase the chances that they will carry any of them to term. If you want to eliminate any possibility of multiple birth, you'll have to refuse to allow the implant of more than 1 embryo, which is turn makes success even more unlikely. You are likely to end up going through this repeatedly at no small financial, emotional and physical cost.

[1DaySoon]

Thanks for the above comments.

Sheryl, yes, there is the question if when using IVF do you implant 1 or more embryos, hoping that at least one of them 'sticks'.

My wife's womb lining is classed as 'thin' and took drugs to thicken the lining before the last 2 AI attempts.

We hope and pray.

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[Halsted6]

Thanks for the above comments.

Sheryl, yes, there is the question if when using IVF do you implant 1 or more embryos, hoping that at least one of them 'sticks'.

My wife's womb lining is classed as 'thin' and took drugs to thicken the lining before the last 2 AI attempts.

We hope and pray.

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My sister (and brother-in-law) tried AI multiple times unsuccessfully. Then, our other sister had a baby and she was spending lots and lots of time with our niece and then the AI was successful. She attributes it to all the time spent around the baby, that her body went "I get it, that's what you wanted me to do." Have talked to a few other people who've said similar things about themselves or others they've known: that spending time around a baby helped them conceive. Not sure it's based on actual scientific evidence -- and it may be excruciating for someone who's been heretofore unsuccessful conceiving to be around a baby -- but just putting it out there as something to maybe consider.

[rene123]

When I first got married I wanted children, but my husband failed to mention that he had been sterilized before we were married because he didn't want children. Now at 38, and single, I've given up on the idea of having children. I'm learning to enjoy being single and free to do whatever I want. Good luck at getting your own child. I can only relate one strange story that somewhat confirms what Halsted6 wrote. There was a man in the office where I worked who thought he or his wife were sterile, so they adopted a child. When the baby was only a year old the man's wife got pregnant with twins. Two years later she got pregnant with twins again. So in the period of only 3 years the couple went from no children to 5 babies all under the age of 3.

[onvacation]

I have my most gorgeous, beautiful and precious twins via IVF. I can't imagine life without them.

I had several failed insemination, 1 fresh cycle of IVF and one frozen. It was a long and painful journey. I finally decided to go to the clinic that had the highest success rate in the world and Bingo...one try a girl and boy twins. All of this cost about $50k + but it makes my life complete!

PM me if you had like more info.

[Goinghomesoon]

1DaySoon would love to hear what you ultimately decided. If I could be invasive and ask whether you and your wife had extensive testing before doctors led you down the AI path? When we were first investigating, we went to a couple of the 'top' hospitals in Bangkok - both suggested testing hub's swimmers plus a bunch of tests to determine open tubes, hormonal levels and possible immunology issues that can prevent implantation. Whereas the specialist fertility clinic that has been recommended numerous places on here didn't suggest anything except lots of medication and straight to AI. Which would have been useless if there was ultimately a physical problem with either of us.

We were also on the Thai adoption waiting list (and presumably still are, since we haven't formally withdrawn) but the wait is currently a number of years. There is a Facebook group for families living in Thailand & wanting to adopt if you are interested.