Teachers Face Jail Term For Thai Toddler's Death

[Thai at Heart]

To "the hang them high brigade" here, at least get your facts right!

For crying out loud, it was a tragic accident, that could have happened anywhere in the world! Yes it was coursed by recklessness and stupidity, but with no intent. And as the teachers have been named and shamed, apart from having to live with the knowledge of coursing a childs death, what good does it do to throw them in jail?? Spoiling the lives of two more families.

@MaxLee. Your uneducated driver was one of the teachers!

Spare your indignation for the Red Bull heir or the young Ms na Ayutthaya.

Great response!

Despite the fact the a young girl's death is horrible, it's Thailand.

Higher fines, longer jail time (obviously like in the West) will do no good.

The fact that the juridical system is so much different from the Western system attracts "us" Westerners to come here.

You came to Thailand to run from the western courts???

[EyesWideOpen]

To "the hang them high brigade" here, at least get your facts right!

For crying out loud, it was a tragic accident, that could have happened anywhere in the world! Yes it was coursed by recklessness and stupidity, but with no intent. And as the teachers have been named and shamed, apart from having to live with the knowledge of coursing a childs death, what good does it do to throw them in jail?? Spoiling the lives of two more families.

@MaxLee. Your uneducated driver was one of the teachers!

Spare your indignation for the Red Bull heir or the young Ms na Ayutthaya.

Great response!

Despite the fact the a young girl's death is horrible, it's Thailand.

Higher fines, longer jail time (obviously like in the West) will do no good.

The fact that the juridical system is so much different from the Western system attracts "us" Westerners to come here.

"Despite the fact the a young girl's death is horrible, it's Thailand."

So let me get this straight..... Your kid gets picked up for school,

and later the school calls you to say your child is brain dead because she was left in the school pick up van. And your response is " It's Thailand"?

Wow that is one of the most negative things I have ever read here about Thailand.

[SteeleJoe]

Despite the fact the a young girl's death is horrible, it's Thailand.

Higher fines, longer jail time (obviously like in the West) will do no good.

The fact that the juridical system is so much different from the Western system attracts "us" Westerners to come here.

<deleted>?

"Despite the fact the a young girl's death is horrible, it's Thailand."

Huh? It's Thailand so...what? The gilr's death is to be expected? Accepted? Viewed as less tragic? All of that or...what?!

"The fact that the juridical system is so much different from the Western system attracts "us" Westerners to come here"

The fact that you think that the difference you speak of is an attraction is only slightly more odd than your assumption that the rest of "us" do.

Edited April 18, 2013 by SteeleJoe

[Thai at Heart]

To "the hang them high brigade" here, at least get your facts right!

For crying out loud, it was a tragic accident, that could have happened anywhere in the world! Yes it was coursed by recklessness and stupidity, but with no intent. And as the teachers have been named and shamed, apart from having to live with the knowledge of coursing a childs death, what good does it do to throw them in jail?? Spoiling the lives of two more families.

@MaxLee. Your uneducated driver was one of the teachers!

Spare your indignation for the Red Bull heir or the young Ms na Ayutthaya.

Great response!

Despite the fact the a young girl's death is horrible, it's Thailand.

Higher fines, longer jail time (obviously like in the West) will do no good.

The fact that the juridical system is so much different from the Western system attracts "us" Westerners to come here.

"Despite the fact the a young girl's death is horrible, it's Thailand."

So let me get this straight..... Your kid gets picked up for school,

and later the school calls you to say your child is brain dead because she was left in the school pick up van. And your response is " It's Thailand"?

Wow that is one of the most negative things I have ever read here about Thailand.

It's not negative about Thailand, it's negative about an idiotic response.

" the reason I came here is to get away from the courts" is idiotic.

"Hello Mr. Farang, unfortunately your child got gang raped". Mai born a rai, it's Thailand.

" hello Mr. Farang, unfortunately your child got run over by a teacher pissed driving in school"

"Mai bpen a rai, its Thailand. I love it here."

It's such a dumb and irresponsible attitude it doesn't even deserve answering.

In fact, maybe I send my 12 year old out tonight to run him over. Mai born a rai, it's Thailand. I love it here.".

Ha ha, let's have a beer. Dick.

Edited April 18, 2013 by Thai at Heart

[Noistar]

RIP Beautiful young girl

You never stood a chance in the land of me me me

Teachers School Admin / owners and driver should all be named and shamed then tossed in the slammer.

I just wish it could have been different - I hope her next life gives her the happiness she didn't have a chance to enjoy.

Notwithstanding the loss to her family, perhaps the country of me, me,me, money, money, money is the loser.

It's so difficult to find the right balance between punishment for the wrongdoer and benefit to the victim, in any legal system. The Thai 'legal' system is even worse. Pick and choose the answer then allocate the crime. But nothing will bring her back, can only hope a repeat will become less likely.

[cougar52]

Thailand's judiciary gives sentences of 18 years for defamation due to loss of 'face', but a death will result in less than half that attached to a pissy 20,000 Baht fine. The legal system of Thailand is simply a joke. What is more important dear judiciary?

Not to mention that this is truly a terrible ACCIDENT , but what about the Red Bull grandson that killed a policeman while reckless driving, while drunk, and high on cocaine will he face the same 10 year sentence?

[fotog]

There were thirteen children under the care of two teachers!

Why no head count and a sweep of the van before closing and locking the doors?

[Greer]

There were thirteen children under the care of two teachers!

Why no head count and a sweep of the van before closing and locking the doors?

Exactly - its not difficult to check the van just to be sure - even if the head count tallies its still best to look just in case.

So very sad for this little one and her parents. Words cannot express at all.

[HarryMilton]

a maximum fine of just over 400 pounds ..... enough said .

You're deliberately ignoring the 10 years in jail bit. Enough said.

[HarryMilton]

Dream on, the people on top of this school will never see anything of this sensitive case and buy their way out of accountability.... Face saved, lets keep those cheap uneducated drivers and move on..., but blame ONLY the teachers... Well doesn't mean that I sympathize with the teachers. In fact they are also accountable for the well being of the children..

To confirm my understanding, were the teachers with the children INSIDE the bus as well??? If yes, they're equally accountable for overlooking anyone... because when I went to International school, we were also brought home by school van, mixed with students of all levels, including kindergarten kids, and no teachers in the van...

That's why I'm saying if the teachers were NOT in the van, the drivers must be held accountable... the more it'd be ridiculous to blame the teachers ALONE, IF they were not even inside the van to double check... It doesn't make sense to save face of the transportation unit and crush the teachers ones...

But of course the school directors on the top obviously couldn't care less, because somebody has to take the blame on their behalf, in this case the teachers only,...

Read it again, the driver will be charged also.

[HarryMilton]

Thailand's judiciary gives sentences of 18 years for defamation due to loss of 'face', but a death will result in less than half that attached to a pissy 20,000 Baht fine. The legal system of Thailand is simply a joke. What is more important dear judiciary?

A possible 10 year sentence is more than half of 18 I think, not less.

[HarryMilton]

Once again it's a little 3 years old who is the victim of nonchalance and non professionalism that most of the Thai shows at work Shame on them, I really wish they will be prosecuted according to the gravity of they irresponsible act but....it is Thailand!

Perhaps they will be, that seems to be the police's intention.

[HarryMilton]

To "the hang them high brigade" here, at least get your facts right!

For crying out loud, it was a tragic accident, that could have happened anywhere in the world! Yes it was coursed by recklessness and stupidity, but with no intent. And as the teachers have been named and shamed, apart from having to live with the knowledge of coursing a childs death, what good does it do to throw them in jail?? Spoiling the lives of two more families.

@MaxLee. Your uneducated driver was one of the teachers!

Spare your indignation for the Red Bull heir or the young Ms na Ayutthaya.

"what good does it do to throw them in jail"? Well, they apparently committed an offence so they should be punished if found guilty, unless you're going to apply your logic equally in which case nobody who offends should be thrown in jail for any offence...what good would it do? Why spoil the lives of criminals?

[HarryMilton]

I can't even find the words for how sad this makes me feel. Literally made my eyes fill a bit... Awful beyond description in every aspect. No punishment will suffice (my daughter was a 3 year old riding to school in a van just last year) and yet I have some sympathy for the teachers. Awful.

Yes it is an unfortunate incident, but from what I have seen at our local kintergarten the teathers do a marvelous job. Obviously there was a serious lack of oversight but these teachers have very large classes, I have no idea how they do manage so well.

Don't put all the blame on the teachers, please!!

Who would you like to be blamed for the horrific death of the child?

[HarryMilton]

But killing a policeman with a car high on booze and drugs, does not cost anything !

Money money money !

Why do you say that? That case is still ongoing.

[HarryMilton]

To "the hang them high brigade" here, at least get your facts right!

For crying out loud, it was a tragic accident, that could have happened anywhere in the world! Yes it was coursed by recklessness and stupidity, but with no intent. And as the teachers have been named and shamed, apart from having to live with the knowledge of coursing a childs death, what good does it do to throw them in jail?? Spoiling the lives of two more families.

@MaxLee. Your uneducated driver was one of the teachers!

Spare your indignation for the Red Bull heir or the young Ms na Ayutthaya.

Great response!

Despite the fact the a young girl's death is horrible, it's Thailand.

Higher fines, longer jail time (obviously like in the West) will do no good.

The fact that the juridical system is so much different from the Western system attracts "us" Westerners to come here.

What's a "juridical system"? And whatever it is might attract you but don't include the rest of us in your banal statement.

[HarryMilton]

Thailand's judiciary gives sentences of 18 years for defamation due to loss of 'face', but a death will result in less than half that attached to a pissy 20,000 Baht fine. The legal system of Thailand is simply a joke. What is more important dear judiciary?

Not to mention that this is truly a terrible ACCIDENT , but what about the Red Bull grandson that killed a policeman while reckless driving, while drunk, and high on cocaine will he face the same 10 year sentence?

That was an ACCIDENT also.

[shaurene]

Dream on, the people on top of this school will never see anything of this sensitive case and buy their way out of accountability.... Face saved, lets keep those cheap uneducated drivers and move on..., but blame ONLY the teachers... Well doesn't mean that I sympathize with the teachers. In fact they are also accountable for the well being of the children..

To confirm my understanding, were the teachers with the children INSIDE the bus as well??? If yes, they're equally accountable for overlooking anyone... because when I went to International school, we were also brought home by school van, mixed with students of all levels, including kindergarten kids, and no teachers in the van...

That's why I'm saying if the teachers were NOT in the van, the drivers must be held accountable... the more it'd be ridiculous to blame the teachers ALONE, IF they were not even inside the van to double check... It doesn't make sense to save face of the transportation unit and crush the teachers ones...

But of course the school directors on the top obviously couldn't care less, because somebody has to take the blame on their behalf, in this case the teachers only,...

I live in village Khon Kaen my wifes grandson is 7 he gets the school bus each morning and evening to come back, there is only the driverwho is the owner of the mini bus and also a teacher, he does not get up off his ass when he picks kids up or drops them off. No pad to put the childs name on to check at the drop off. This litteraly brought tears to my eyes this poor little child in this hot box which can get up to 60 to 80c. Should imprison the lot and then it will teach other schools to do these safety checks.

[NeverSure]

It's a terrible tragedy and it saddens me.

I don't understand who it would benefit to throw those responsible in jail. A deterrent for caregivers in the future?

Is being fined, and then sued by the parents not enough of a deterrent?

Under Western common law, money is the appropriate thing to compensate for the life or injury of a person when it's not intentional. Only money will help compensate for the loss of a limb or a child. Nothing can bring it back.

Do we jail people who cause a death in a non-intentional, sober auto accident, even if that driver wasn't paying enough attention?

Would we jail every doctor who makes a mistake and causes a death in the operating room, even if it was totally his fault? More likely he would be sued for a whole bunch of money, and if bad enough he might lose his license. Only in rare and very egregious circumstances such as being under the influence would he be charged with a crime.

Why do we focus so hard on one death? How many children die each year, left in a hot car the world over? The only numbers I can find are for the US and it been more than 500 children since 1998. It was 32 last year. The smaller percentage of the responsible adults went to jail. Link Link

It is horrible, horrible, horrible. But nothing will bring that child back. Surely those responsible feel terrible about it. I feel as if people are talking about a rapist-killer or some other murderer. 10 years in a Thai prison for a horrible mistake?

[SteeleJoe]

Thailand's judiciary gives sentences of 18 years for defamation due to loss of 'face', but a death will result in less than half that attached to a pissy 20,000 Baht fine. The legal system of Thailand is simply a joke. What is more important dear judiciary?

Not to mention that this is truly a terrible ACCIDENT , but what about the Red Bull grandson that killed a policeman while reckless driving, while drunk, and high on cocaine will he face the same 10 year sentence?

What about it?!

How does that case in any way make this one less horrible?

No "buts"...

[Traveling Sailor]

"If convicted, both face up to 10 years in jail and a maximum fine of Bt20,000."

The key word here is FACE. Chances of these two, or anyone else associated with the school, actually serving time is remote.

[MaxLee]

Dream on, the people on top of this school will never see anything of this sensitive case and buy their way out of accountability.... Face saved, lets keep those cheap uneducated drivers and move on..., but blame ONLY the teachers... Well doesn't mean that I sympathize with the teachers. In fact they are also accountable for the well being of the children..

To confirm my understanding, were the teachers with the children INSIDE the bus as well??? If yes, they're equally accountable for overlooking anyone... because when I went to International school, we were also brought home by school van, mixed with students of all levels, including kindergarten kids, and no teachers in the van...

That's why I'm saying if the teachers were NOT in the van, the drivers must be held accountable... the more it'd be ridiculous to blame the teachers ALONE, IF they were not even inside the van to double check... It doesn't make sense to save face of the transportation unit and crush the teachers ones...

But of course the school directors on the top obviously couldn't care less, because somebody has to take the blame on their behalf, in this case the teachers only,...

Previous reports showed that both teachers where inside the van - the female assistant (don't even know if she was teacher) was meant to look after the children and make sure all are out of the bus. While this action was negligent I don't see how they can face more severe punishment than a high ferrari driver running down and killing someone or an unlicenced driver killing 9 van passengers. Sadly, most parents are happy with a payout here. Would love to see them go to jail in liew of a payout. I highly doubt the either will see jail time unless the parents were very well connected.

First of all thank you for confirming this information with me,... and it's indeed a very sad story...

.... so in short the jail term is technically speaking justified for those teachers responsible, because they WERE inside the bus with those kids, and overlooked the missing child... Yet what puzzles me is why the transportation department and it's drivers weren't made accountable as well, because the driver WAS the one driving that van, ... I don't see any sense of saving face of the driver and transportation department who practically get away with it unlike the teachers...

... while in the mean time the school authorities on top of course will just pay some tea money, and their face is spared from further accountability trouble, typical top to bottom approach, punishing the "inferior teaching aka slaves", but never reviewing the system overall...

[DocN]

It's a terrible tragedy and it saddens me.

I don't understand who it would benefit to throw those responsible in jail. A deterrent for caregivers in the future?

Is being fined, and then sued by the parents not enough of a deterrent?

Under Western common law, money is the appropriate thing to compensate for the life or injury of a person when it's not intentional. Only money will help compensate for the loss of a limb or a child. Nothing can bring it back.

Do we jail people who cause a death in a non-intentional, sober auto accident, even if that driver wasn't paying enough attention?

Would we jail every doctor who makes a mistake and causes a death in the operating room, even if it was totally his fault? More likely he would be sued for a whole bunch of money, and if bad enough he might lose his license. Only in rare and very egregious circumstances such as being under the influence would he be charged with a crime.

Why do we focus so hard on one death? How many children die each year, left in a hot car the world over? The only numbers I can find are for the US and it been more than 500 children since 1998. It was 32 last year. The smaller percentage of the responsible adults went to jail. Link Link

It is horrible, horrible, horrible. But nothing will bring that child back. Surely those responsible feel terrible about it. I feel as if people are talking about a rapist-killer or some other murderer. 10 years in a Thai prison for a horrible mistake?

Wait,wait,wait...are you not the guy, who asked for a mother, to be killed, to do her daughter justice??

Here is a good advice: get off the crack!

[DRONGOH]

a maximum fine of just over 400 pounds ..... enough said .

And I hope the school owner / director are also charged with a serious crime and seriously punished. They are just as guilty.

Also just wondering whether this 'school' was registered etc?

It might have been registered, but in Bang POO.

[frimu]

Even a cheap and uneducated driver can check whether the car ist empty! That has to do with a sense of responsibility and not education!

And I - for a change (answering to all posts) - really don't see how the superiors of this school should be totally guilty.

I mean: Do schools of Western countries have checklists to check whether a car is empty after arrival or so?

The teacher certainly should have raised an alarm, that one of his pupils isn't there anymore some time during the day. Then they should have started to search and everything would have ended with a shock but not a death.

So yes: It's right to focus on driver and teachers. The superiors could be held responsible for the lack of procedures or checklists.

Dream on, the people on top of this school will never see anything of this sensitive case and buy their way out of accountability.... Face saved, lets keep those cheap uneducated drivers and move on..., but blame ONLY the teachers... Well doesn't mean that I sympathize with the teachers. In fact they are also accountable for the well being of the children..

To confirm my understanding, were the teachers with the children INSIDE the bus as well??? If yes, they're equally accountable for overlooking anyone... because when I went to International school, we were also brought home by school van, mixed with students of all levels, including kindergarten kids, and no teachers in the van...

That's why I'm saying if the teachers were NOT in the van, the drivers must be held accountable... the more it'd be ridiculous to blame the teachers ALONE, IF they were not even inside the van to double check... It doesn't make sense to save face of the transportation unit and crush the teachers ones...

But of course the school directors on the top obviously couldn't care less, because somebody has to take the blame on their behalf, in this case the teachers only,...

[jackr]

To "the hang them high brigade" here, at least get your facts right!

For crying out loud, it was a tragic accident, that could have happened anywhere in the world! Yes it was coursed by recklessness and stupidity, but with no intent. And as the teachers have been named and shamed, apart from having to live with the knowledge of coursing a childs death, what good does it do to throw them in jail?? Spoiling the lives of two more families.

Um, it may provide a little incentive for those in a similar position to think with their brain in future. I wonder, would you say the same if it were your kid? Thought not!

[NeverSure]

It's a terrible tragedy and it saddens me.

I don't understand who it would benefit to throw those responsible in jail. A deterrent for caregivers in the future?

Is being fined, and then sued by the parents not enough of a deterrent?

Under Western common law, money is the appropriate thing to compensate for the life or injury of a person when it's not intentional. Only money will help compensate for the loss of a limb or a child. Nothing can bring it back.

Do we jail people who cause a death in a non-intentional, sober auto accident, even if that driver wasn't paying enough attention?

Would we jail every doctor who makes a mistake and causes a death in the operating room, even if it was totally his fault? More likely he would be sued for a whole bunch of money, and if bad enough he might lose his license. Only in rare and very egregious circumstances such as being under the influence would he be charged with a crime.

Why do we focus so hard on one death? How many children die each year, left in a hot car the world over? The only numbers I can find are for the US and it been more than 500 children since 1998. It was 32 last year. The smaller percentage of the responsible adults went to jail. Link Link

It is horrible, horrible, horrible. But nothing will bring that child back. Surely those responsible feel terrible about it. I feel as if people are talking about a rapist-killer or some other murderer. 10 years in a Thai prison for a horrible mistake?

Wait,wait,wait...are you not the guy, who asked for a mother, to be killed, to do her daughter justice??

Here is a good advice: get off the crack!

You see no difference between a whore mother who repeatedly and for years rents out her 9 year old daughter to pedophiles for profit, and someone who accidentally leaves a child in a hot car, even if by carelessness.

Man, I do want some of what you're smoking.

[Travel2003]

There were thirteen children under the care of two teachers!

Why no head count and a sweep of the van before closing and locking the doors?

Even I can answer that.

They forgot.

No conspiracy, or this is Thailand, they simply forgot.

[uptheos]

a maximum fine of just over 400 pounds ..... enough said .

Could be 10 years in jail.

[DocN]

It's a terrible tragedy and it saddens me.

I don't understand who it would benefit to throw those responsible in jail. A deterrent for caregivers in the future?

Is being fined, and then sued by the parents not enough of a deterrent?

Under Western common law, money is the appropriate thing to compensate for the life or injury of a person when it's not intentional. Only money will help compensate for the loss of a limb or a child. Nothing can bring it back.

Do we jail people who cause a death in a non-intentional, sober auto accident, even if that driver wasn't paying enough attention?

Would we jail every doctor who makes a mistake and causes a death in the operating room, even if it was totally his fault? More likely he would be sued for a whole bunch of money, and if bad enough he might lose his license. Only in rare and very egregious circumstances such as being under the influence would he be charged with a crime.

Why do we focus so hard on one death? How many children die each year, left in a hot car the world over? The only numbers I can find are for the US and it been more than 500 children since 1998. It was 32 last year. The smaller percentage of the responsible adults went to jail. Link Link

It is horrible, horrible, horrible. But nothing will bring that child back. Surely those responsible feel terrible about it. I feel as if people are talking about a rapist-killer or some other murderer. 10 years in a Thai prison for a horrible mistake?

Wait,wait,wait...are you not the guy, who asked for a mother, to be killed, to do her daughter justice??

Here is a good advice: get off the crack!

You see no difference between a whore mother who repeatedly and for years rents out her 9 year old daughter to pedophiles for profit, and someone who accidentally leaves a child in a hot car, even if by carelessness.

Man, I do want some of what you're smoking.

Yes I do see the difference.

Between a mother whoring out her daughter and a teacher, neglecting his duty, to take care of the children, who you want to have gone scott- free, because it was an accident and no punishment will bring the little one back!.

Here is my definition of an accident: the doors of the bus close, by computer, before all children are out, trapping the little one inside. And because the windows were made from bullet- proof glass, they had to cut through the bus- walls to get to the child.

Here is what is not an accident: 13 children go INTO the bus, 12 come out and no one notices.

Now back to your crack- pipe!

Edited April 20, 2013 by DocN