Refusal Of Entry Clearence Child 8 Years Old

[Jay Sata]

It's ironic that the UK government goes to such lengths to enforce child support yet intentionally keeps families apart even when paternity is evident. They really don't care about children at all; they simply wish to take whatever position is the most destructive or cruel.

Go to the press. Shame the evil bastards.

I think the OP made the mistake of not keeping a paper trail/records of support and it would have made a lot more sense for her to bring the child to the UK when she first got a spouse visa.

[wooloomooloo]

It's ironic that the UK government goes to such lengths to enforce child support yet intentionally keeps families apart even when paternity is evident. They really don't care about children at all; they simply wish to take whatever position is the most destructive or cruel.

Go to the press. Shame the evil bastards.

If it were so easy to explain, BudRight.

The child has submitted an application for settlement. The criterion was not met in the eyes of the ECO and a decision made.

There's no cabal involved in keeping anyone apart. Meet the requirements and life is good, otherwise it's life isn't fair, they're all ganging up on me, my own country hates me.

Making an application for a child is obviously, and proven to be, precarious at best.

There's a lesson here as with all visa applications - take professional advice if in doubt.

I'm always of the opinion, in the words of cookery programmes, you can add but you can't take away.

It's not a game and serious business for those involved.

[dighambara]

It looks to me that you have definitely failed the sole responsibility test, or at least failed to show that you satisfy it.

Unless you can rectify this any appeal or new application will also fail.

Hopefully someone more knowledgeable than I such as TonyM will see this and be able to advise soon. But as he is in Thailand and it's 1:30 am there, don't expect anything until tomorrow at the earliest.

I suggest sworn afidavits from the people in the village who took care of him - describing the source of funds and visits by PaPa.

[belg]

sad for the boy and hard news, but why was he not taken directly to the uk ?

[7by7]

It's ironic that the UK government goes to such lengths to enforce child support yet intentionally keeps families apart even when paternity is evident. They really don't care about children at all; they simply wish to take whatever position is the most destructive or cruel.

Go to the press.

Your post makes no sense.

The OP left her son with her mother 6 years ago and moved to the UK. Although she doubtless had valid reasons why her son did not come to the UK with her 6 years ago, lack of suitable accommodation perhaps, that is hardly the government's fault!

Nor is it the government's fault that she has waited for 6 years before applying to have her son join her in the UK; she no doubt has her reasons for waiting so long.

Parents who apply to have their children live with them in the UK need to meet certain requirements; including sole responsibility. This is not being deliberately cruel; those rules, even though some may disagree with them, are there for a purpose.

It is not for us to comment on why the OP and her son were separated for so long; except to say that the length of the separation is, I believe, a factor here; the longer parent and child are separated, the harder showing sole responsibility will be.

Certainly, in such a case the sponsoring parent must, in my opinion, explain in their sponsor's letter why the child did not apply at the same time as the parent and what has changed to make the child apply now.

[rin0000]

hi, everyone. thanks for all the comment...

The sole responsibility thats i've got " its about im the one thats look after by sending money home to provided everything thats my son need, which it my mum and my sister who's sign the paper at the town offece, says thats its true...thats the child's dad never involved in his life! it only me whow support him on financial and visit him when ever i can and phone weekly." (but it hard to proof that it spend on my son)

i've long time cos its will be better if he grow up in Thailand knew his own country first whice will be the best benefit for him

i dont have enough docs since 2006 by phone because i dont realised thats i will need it, so i didnt kept it plus in the last few year we're opp in to paperless bill so we used all online, which it will no bill send to me! ( so im the stupid one that didnt keep it all).

i dont blame anyone but some evident it hard to prove eg. things you talk on the phone which it hard to prove!! but anyway i'll do my best to find the record and the reson that they wanted whice it hard for the short time as 28 days!!

but thank you for all the advise you gave, help me a lots

thanks all again.

[theblether]

The fault is in the lack of record keeping, let that be a lesson to everyone involved in visa applications.

[wooloomooloo]

I suggest sworn afidavits from the people in the village who took care of him - describing the source of funds and visits by PaPa.

The definition of sole responsibility encompasses far more than financial support and whether the child's natural father chose to visit or not.

It's remotely being the final authority for key decisions in the child's upbringing, responsibility for their emotional and financial welfare, visits from abroad and evidencing the accountability for this period of separation.

Unfortunately for the OP, there's a six year hiatus of nothing.

I wish the OP and family well, but not entirely certain an appeal will be successful, with or without additional evidence of regular contact.

The damage appears to have been done with this particular application and a period of reflection, patience and specialist legal advice wouldn't go amiss prior to any further application. As always, don't throw good money after bad.

Edited June 2, 2013 by wooloomooloo

[Jay Sata]

The only other option is (assuming you have a UK passport/citizenship) return to Thailand for a couple of years and live with your son before making a new application.

Edited June 2, 2013 by Jay Sata

[7by7]

Rin, there is a lot more to sole responsibility than sending money to support him and calling him frequently.

You need to have been the person making all the major decisions about his life, e.g. choice of school, over the last 6 years of your separation.

The refusal notice says that when interviewed by phone, your mother said that it was she who did this, not you!

As TonyM says, you must get a copy of the written transcript of the conversation between your mother and the embassy.

But if your mother did say what the refusal notice says she did; you are going to have a very hard job getting this refusal overturned.

You must get professional advice.

[Jay Sata]

As I've noticed in other threads the telephone interviews are often a stumbling block when the questions are answered truthfully.

[rin0000]

Rin, there is a lot more to sole responsibility than sending money to support him and calling him frequently.

You need to have been the person making all the major decisions about his life, e.g. choice of school, over the last 6 years of your separation.

The refusal notice says that when interviewed by phone, your mother said that it was she who did this, not you!

As TonyM says, you must get a copy of the written transcript of the conversation between your mother and the embassy.

But if your mother did say what the refusal notice says she did; you are going to have a very hard job getting this refusal overturned.

You must get professional advice.

How can I get copy of transcript ??? Pls

[Tony M]

Rin, there is a lot more to sole responsibility than sending money to support him and calling him frequently.

You need to have been the person making all the major decisions about his life, e.g. choice of school, over the last 6 years of your separation.

The refusal notice says that when interviewed by phone, your mother said that it was she who did this, not you!

As TonyM says, you must get a copy of the written transcript of the conversation between your mother and the embassy.

But if your mother did say what the refusal notice says she did; you are going to have a very hard job getting this refusal overturned.

You must get professional advice.

How can I get copy of transcript ??? Pls

Send a request by email. Send it to VFS ( the visa application centre) and ask them to pass it on to the visa section at the Embassy.

[email protected]

Make sure you give the reference details from the GV51 ( refusal notice). Tell them that you require the transcripts quickly in order to submit an appeal.

[rin0000]

Rin, there is a lot more to sole responsibility than sending money to support him and calling him frequently.

You need to have been the person making all the major decisions about his life, e.g. choice of school, over the last 6 years of your separation.

The refusal notice says that when interviewed by phone, your mother said that it was she who did this, not you!

As TonyM says, you must get a copy of the written transcript of the conversation between your mother and the embassy.

But if your mother did say what the refusal notice says she did; you are going to have a very hard job getting this refusal overturned.

You must get professional advice.

How can I get copy of transcript ??? Pls

Send a request by email. Send it to VFS ( the visa application centre) and ask them to pass it on to the visa section at the Embassy.

[email protected]

Make sure you give the reference details from the GV51 ( refusal notice). Tell them that you require the transcripts quickly in order to submit an appeal.

Thank you.

[randall]

HI we went through the same thing i will post some of the letters we put together to see if this will help you in any way,one of the most important thing is to prove sole responsibility one way we did this was letters from her school you need to get these from the school to say you visit the school and are updated with how he is getting on.Good luck with you appeal and just try and get as much information together as possible for you appeal

Letter from Me

To Whom It May Concern

Dear Sir or Madam:

Re: …

I am writing this letter in
response to the refusal of the visa for**** .When me and **** first started
seeing each other she told me that she had a daughter that she is reasonable
for and that if we did carried on seeing each other that she would be part of
the family and this is something I knew right for the start and had no problems
with looking after *** and *** and as time went on and we had see each other
and be in contact all the time it was then that we started talking about being
together in one Country and we decided that it would be better if **** would
come to the UK as I am settled and have a good job and Home, and that ***** would come to the UK first and once we were
settled together we could then apply for a Visa for ***to come and live with us and in the mean
time we would carry on being Responsible for *** financially and that ****
would still have sole responsibility.

We had a conversation about what School
she would go to and this is when we decided we would pay for her to go to
private High School in Wang Nam Yen and before this she went to the Local
School in the village and it was ***** that decided that she would go to this school.

When we both went back to visit the
Family in Thailand the First occasion was 20^th Sep 2008 and we
stayed in Bangkok for a few Days together with Her Family Brother, Sister, Daughter and
Mother before travelling home to Wang Nam Yen and we stayed with her auntie as
at that time the Family home was just a small shack and there was no room for
both of us to stay there but was in the processor of building the family home
but it was not finished yet, so we stayed there for a few days and then we
spend some time travelling around Thailand and this included visiting ****
father and family in Mukdahan and then travelling back to Wang Nam Yen to see
the family , the reason Khanatcha did not come with us is that it was in School
term for Khanatcha.

I then travelled home on the 5^th
Oct 2008 as I had to get back to work and *****stayed on at the family home in Wang
Nam Yen so she could spend more time with her daughter and then travelled back
to the UK on the 18^th OCT 2008.

The second time we went back was the 25^th
April 2010 and this time my brother come with us as well we all meet in Bangkok
for a couple of days before then Travel to the family home which had now been
build where we stayed until 30^th April and then Me, ****My Brother
and *** Auntie all flew to Koh Samui were we were going to Stay for 5 days
before then travelling to Mukdahan but when we arrived in Koh Samui ****got a
phone call that her Gran was very ill in Hospital and that she should go and
see her straight away so I then changed the flight Tickets for *** and *** to
fly back to Bangkok where she could meet her Brother and Sister and then travel
up to Mukdahan to see her Gran and Me and my Brother would stay in Koh Samui
for the 5 Days we had booked and then travel up to Mukdahan after the 5 days to
meet back up with them and see the family which is what we did.

We then stayed in Mukdanhan to see ***
Dad, Gran and the rest of the family that live in Mukdahan and then Me, *****
and my Brother Paul went around to see some of the Temples in the area and the
Mekong river as show in the photos provided and stayed for about 4 days before
heading back home in Wang Nam Yen, where we stayed for just over a week and in
this time we arranged **** to go to a new private school in Wang Nam Yen as she
was about to start high school we then sorted out all the books she needed and
school uniform for Her and we would take her shopping to buy new clothes and a
new phone and anything else she needed as I would look after her as if she was
my own daughter and she sees me as a stepfather to her that will look after her
and when Me and ***** first talked about **** coming to the UK we would talked
about bring**** over to live in the UK as well so we could be a family together
and this was every more important once we had been all together this time in
Thailand as we now had **** with us which is *** little sister and after seeing
them play together all the time and how much *** loves being with her little sister.

After staying as long as we could
we then heading back to Bangkok to catch the flight back home, But just before
we were about to get on the plane the flight got cancelled and then ****got a
phone call to say that her Gran had just passed away with that we had to Stay a
extra day in Bangkok and we then arrange for ***** and **** to stay on in
Thailand so **** could then go to the Funeral of Her Gran so Me and my Brother
then left the next day and *** then went back home before arranging to go to Mukdahan
for the funeral of her Gran and then once this had been done She returned Home
before then Flying back to the UK on the 22rd May 2010.

Once home after about 3 months *** stop going
to school as she was missing being with her Mother and Sister and this is when
we then put everything together to apply for a visa for **** to come to live
with us in the UK once we had got all the information we needed **** and ****
then Travelled back to Thailand on the 27^th Sep 2010 to put together
the rest of the visa and she would stay in Thailand at the family home as if
She left *** in Thailand with Her Gran we didn’t know what She would get up to
as she was not going to school and would not listen to what her Gran was telling
her and missed being with her Mum and Sister so **** would stay till we had a
answer about the visa and hoping that everything would be alright and that She
could come back with **** and **** in November/December as Her Gran does not
have the time to look after **** full time as she has her own milking farm to
look after and is now in her fifties and has no transport.

Once we got the visa back and it
had be refused *** and *** would still come back to the UK as I had not seen my
Wife and Daughter for 3 months how had missed Her 1^st Birthday and
was missing them a lot, now that ***** is back she has been in contact with *****
most days and **** just keep asking when is she coming back to Thailand to get
her to bring her to the UK and then seens we got the refusal letter from you we
have be getting as much evidence to support **** has had sole responsibility of
her daughter and hope that these letters and addition information will help
prove that when **** when she did go back to Thailand she would be with *** as
much as possible and was staying at the family Home or was with Her Family in
Mukdahan.

The reason that there was phone
records for only November 2008 is that I had changed Telephone provider and
these bills where online only and you could only go back 6 months but since
getting the refusal letter I connected BT and Talk Talk to get copies of these
bill to show calls from when **** first come to the UK and was calling back
Home to Her Daughter on the bills you will see
some that say Special Svce and then the number 0844 8612121 and this
number was used to call Thailand as this was 1p a minute cheap rate number. We
have include copies of **** Birth certificate and House registrations that have
been translated to English and a Certification of guardian translated into
English and then there is **** School Results and letter from a teacher at the
school talking about her mum coming to the school to see how *** was getting on
with her schooling and there School report sign by Her Mum proving she look
after ****schooling and then there is a letter from **** Mother(gran) about her
looking after her and all this has been translated in to English and a letter
from my brother about his visit to Thailand and I have included some bank
statement that show us using our bank card in Sa Kaeo and Mukdahan but when we
went to Thailand I would take cash with me as I would be changed for using my
bank cards when overseas.

I trust the above is of some assistance,
should you need any further information please do not hesitate to contact me on

Your faithfully,

Letter from Mum

Dear Sir/Madame

My name is *** and I am the Mother of *** and am writing this
letter in response to your refusal of a visa for brings my daughter to come and
live with me and my family in the UK.

I have looked after ****emotionally and financial all my
life and It has always be my choice of what school she would go to Junior or
High school and what religion she would follow and if she needed anything or
was needing any support she would come
to me about these thing , It was me and My Husband that arranged and paid for
her to go to a private high school in Wang Nam Yen which she started when we
where last in Thailand in April 2010 which started of fine but after we had
left and gone back to the UK a few months later she stop going to school and
she wouldn’t listen to what my mum was
saying to her and she was going out and not coming back till late so this is
when I then flew back to Thailand so I could look after her and talk to her
about what was going on and this is when she said she wanted to come and live
with me, ****, her Sister and Mark my Husband in the UK as She had missing
being with us so I then started to arrange for her to come and live with us.

When I have been away from **** I was always still in contact
with my daughter and was still responsible for her and the only reason that she
did not come with me to the UK at the same time as me was that my husband ****
was sharing a house with his brother and did not have the room for my daughter
to come with me at that time but was always our intention to bring my daughter
to the UK as soon as we could and this has now changed as **** has now moved
out of the house and we are in the process of buy the house and any other time that I was away from her was
when I was working so I could earn money
which I could then send back home to
look after my daughter and family.

While I was in the UK I would phone my daughter a few times
a week so we could still be in connect with each other and make sure she was getting
on ok I would send money home each mouth to my mum to pay for her schooling and
food and anything else she needed, when we would go back to Thailand I would
spend as much time as I could with my daughter and look after her do her cooking
washing and take her out, as when she is left at the family home with my mum,
my mum does not have the time to look after my daughter as well as I would look
after her as she is in her fifties and runs a farm with her partner and spends a lot of her time looking after the
farm this include starting work early in
the morning to milk the cows and then again in the evening and then in the day time she has to look after
and feed the cows and this is a full time job for her and does not have the
time to be looking after **** as much as my daughter needs at this age and this
is getting harder for her as the farm grows and there are more and more cows to
look after.

The other thing is I went us to be all together as a family
as we planned all along and after see how much she loves her new sister ****
and seeing them play together and then having to leave her behind to come back
to the UK makes us all very upset and emotion and when I am back in the UK
every time I ring her she just ask when can she come to be with me and all I
ask is that you look at this again for us in favour of letting my daughter come
to the UK so she can be with her mother.

You’re Faithfully

[wooloomooloo]

As I've noticed in other threads the telephone interviews are often a stumbling block when the questions are answered truthfully.

There's two stories, the application story and the guardian's.

[GrantSmith]

randall - and how is your appeal getting on?

[7by7]

As I've noticed in other threads the telephone interviews are often a stumbling block when the questions are answered truthfully.

There's two stories, the application story and the guardian's.

If everyone is telling the truth, which they should be, then these two 'stories' will be the same.

[randall]

randall - and how is your appeal getting on?

We won the appeal and she has now been living with us for the last 2 years, at the time it was just a nightmare as when there spoke to her gran she told them she was quiet happy to look after her and have been looking after he sins see was 1 year old! we though it was going to be impossible to get this though but we just try to think what we could do to get this turn around, but i think the main things where getting letter from the school saying that her Mum had been involved in her schooling and proving that we had been visiting her when we went back to Thailand as there said we had show on evidence that we had go back to the family home when in holidaying in Thailand

[GrantSmith]

randall

Well that's just fabulous... What a great way to start a Friday... Just makes me feel like wanting to download Disney's Pinocchio and stay in bed... All warm and fuzzy...

Now... Where did I put my coat...