Giving the extended family a piece of my mind

[digibum]

While OP picked a way to handle the situation that achieved a result he wanted, another option would have been to explain that what was said wasn't polite and that if it happens again, they can't visit.

I understand the frustration but whether it's Thai or farang, saying nothing for 10 years and then having a blow up usually is not the best way to have handled the situation. You have to deal with it when it starts otherwise it becomes a difficult pattern to break.

Chances are, the relative has lost face, will say the same stuff but behind the back of OP's immediate family, and the result will be a long simmering feud.

I certainly wouldn't expect them to apologize and accept responsibility. That's never going to happen after 10 years of getting away with it. They'll stew on it, leave OP's family out of things, try to hurt OP's wife, etc.

I used to be one of those people who let things build up and then come out in explosions. But I noticed how that impacted business and personal relationships long before coming to Thailand and worked on addressing issues as they arise and not waiting for them to come to a boiling point before saying something.

Because usually you end up blowing up over something trivial which is what ends up making you look like a jerk to everyone else. They don't see, understand, or remember what built up to it. It's very easy to paint you as the villan because the response is usually disproportionate to the offense.

[unanimosity]

Buy a buffalo and hand them the rope so they assume that it is a gift to them. Then go to the village elder puyai and tell him you have bought him a buffalo and give him the family address so he can pick it up at his leisure.

[Just1Voice]

Five years ago when we bought our house, we bought a large, 2 story, in a nice moo ban. We went large because it was not just me and wife, but her 23 yr son - who is a great kid! - along with my wife's younger sister and her 11 yr old daughter, that I loved as my own. Okay, no problem. But after a while I started to get irritated as wife's sister would do wash and laundry for her and daughter, but never helped clean the rest of the house, would cook and leave everything dirty for my wife to clean up. One evening I had a quiet conversation with my wife and told her that her sister either had to start helping around here, or she couldn't live here any more. Much to my surprise, my wife said she had been thinking the same thing, but didn't know what my reaction would be if she confronted her sister, due to the father/daughter relationship I had with her sister's daughter. She told me that she would "handle it".

The next morning when sister came down, after her daughter had gone to school, there was a not so polite, one way conversation from my wife to her sister, which ended with sister storming back upstairs. I asked my wife what she had said, as back then I didn't understand a word of Thai, and she informed me that she had told her sister she was tired of her sister's lazy, disrespectful attitude, and that either she start helping to keep this house clean, or get out. Sister and daughter were gone the next day. It caused some tensions for a while, but when the rest of the family sided with me and my wife, the attitude of the younger sister gradually changed. A few months late she came and apologized to me, in English, for her previous attitude, and asked me to forgive her. No problem. My wife explained to me that if I had said anything it would have caused problems in the family, but since she is pretty much the "matriarch" of the family, it was her "right" to do so, and that no one would question it. No one ever did.

[LivinginKata]

An offensive post has been removed.

Forum rule 8) Not to post extremely negative views of Thailand or derogatory comments directed towards all Thais.

[irwinfc]

any sane and loving family man would do exactly what you did. good for you for standing up for your daughter. now your in-laws should think twice about messing with you and your family. them not speaking to you doesn't seem like a great loss.

[lucjoker]

Right on, there are limits to everything. But still, even (at this point) the wife is on the Farangs side, family "pressure" is ever-present. Not everybody is a Henry Kissinger, but I would try to "even-out" things with the rest of the family.

Once the family-attitude towards the Farang swings from "neutral" to "negative", it's hard to reverse and this can be reason for future grief for the Farang.

Cheers.

give everyone in the neighbourhood 20bht or more ,but not to the stupid family members,tell them you do this because budda ordered you to give to good people.

And than break contact with that family.

You dont know how to do this ?

Simple say that there face looks like the ass of a kwai.

Done.

[winstonc]

you did right we had similar i blew up ,,took 2 years but the constant take take,,was enough for me we moved to ubon their still in phuket,,,they get nothing now,not even a text reply,my wifes loves her parents,but as humans there discusting behaviour,doesnt merit them ,with even an acknowledgment of respect,,they lost FACE big time all there aunts and uncles fired into them bigstyle,,its not nice to see a grown man cry,,or woman ,,but i loved every moment of it,,,weve never been happier,,granted we are all different,and handle situations as we see fit,,jealousy is an awful thing isnt it,,,,its what it boils down to with us farangs alot of the time,,,,were not all rich wide boys,,,and the liberty taking stops when i say it stops,,,i bet you got a back like a colander after them slagging you off,,trying to save there grim little faces,,enjoy the rest of your lives,,be a very happy family,,i hope it feels like a big rock taken off your shoulders,,,,, ,,,,,,,,

[amse]

I'm an American, here for 12 years now, found my 1st job in Phuket as a P1 teacher, was allowed to live in the teachers dormatory and after school mixed with the Thai teachers and school workers also living on the school grounds. There was one 2 year old girl living there also with her grandma who was the school cook. The little girl was a special needs child with water on the brain, a club hand, vision problems, and left side body cordination difficulties. She was a throw-away child by her mother who would have nothing to do with her. I took the child under my wing after her grandma concented, and started teaching her English, and being she was so poor, I bought her clothes, toys, books and etc. She is insulted by her mother whenever she sees her, and she is verbally/physically abused by her grandma. I have stuck by her all these years, and she is 12 years old now, she has no friends at school and is constantly picked on and bullied by them. I am her best friend, and she's allowed to visit me on weekends and holidays. We meditate and study about the Buddha every time we're together, and she is such a great student that eventhough there's 175 students among the seven P5 classes in her school, because of her outstanding grades and respect for others, she was just awarded the Student Of The Week. Eventually she will be old enough to choose not to live among her family and will be free at last to live with me!

[Bagwan]

The message to my wife's family went out long long ago. She told them 'Don't make my husband angry - or else'. Her father and brother are already beyond the pale. I have great and loving relationships with all the rest, especially the kids who's favourite uncle I am, and they enjoy the benefits of me supporting them when they are needful.

[Morden]

I'm an American, here for 12 years now, found my 1st job in Phuket as a P1 teacher, was allowed to live in the teachers dormatory and after school mixed with the Thai teachers and school workers also living on the school grounds. There was one 2 year old girl living there also with her grandma who was the school cook. The little girl was a special needs child with water on the brain, a club hand, vision problems, and left side body cordination difficulties. She was a throw-away child by her mother who would have nothing to do with her. I took the child under my wing after her grandma concented, and started teaching her English, and being she was so poor, I bought her clothes, toys, books and etc. She is insulted by her mother whenever she sees her, and she is verbally/physically abused by her grandma. I have stuck by her all these years, and she is 12 years old now, she has no friends at school and is constantly picked on and bullied by them. I am her best friend, and she's allowed to visit me on weekends and holidays. We meditate and study about the Buddha every time we're together, and she is such a great student that eventhough there's 175 students among the seven P5 classes in her school, because of her outstanding grades and respect for others, she was just awarded the Student Of The Week. Eventually she will be old enough to choose not to live among her family and will be free at last to live with me!

What a sad but yet wonderful story. I'm moved by it. Credit is due to you for your humanity and perseverance. You know, just one kind act from a stranger can save an abused child. What you are doing will achieve much more than even that and she will remember what you are doing for her for the rest of her life.

Good for you and I'm sure you will see your reward in the way she develops into adulthood.

[robertson468]

anyone telling a 5 year old that they are fat & ugly needs a slap, so you did well to just give them a bollocking.

I don't care who they are or what country they come from, saying stuff like that to a child is out of order. I am tiger mother where my son is concerned & my husbands family know that the rules start & end with me when it comes to my boy. They all respect that, if they like it or not I don't know nor do I really care.

I show appropriate respect to them but also expect it back. It is not a one way street. Had the same happened in my family I would have done the same as op .

Parenting achieved.

Boo, brilliant answer and spot on. I think all the advice of "when" you should have put a stop to this is irrational. Wisdom in hindsight is a marvelous thing, but sadly we have not developed the skills to turn the clocks back - yet! As a human being, the OP was pushed to his limit and by God under the circumstances, I would have felt exactly the same way. Life should be full of fun and happiness, not eroded by frequent snide remarks, gradually cutting away people's confidence, to be replaced by frustration and depression. Ozzy111, I and many others are completely on side with you and if the wider Family can't or won't understand the damage they have the potential to cause, then they are not worth worrying about. In time it might be worth testing the ground by offering the "olive branch" in some way. If it is rejected, move on and live your happy Family life without them. Good luck.

[Card]

If it was me, I would consider moving away. I wouldn't want to live among all that crap. But then I live the other side of Thailand from my 'in laws'.

[Card]

Don't invite people who badmouth you or your family into your home.

Amazing how that policy solves so many little problems.

Or into your garden, or into your car for errands, or into a restaurant for a paid meal, or................... Just block them off.

[ozzy111]

If it was me, I would consider moving away. I wouldn't want to live among all that crap. But then I live the other side of Thailand from my 'in laws'.

Mate I'm not going anywhere, we live in a beautiful part of this country (Khao Yai) we have a nice home, my kids are go to a great international school with lots of friends, my in laws are great (her parents to be clear not some others as mentioned) why would I up root them. Generally I /we love it here!!!

[Card]

If it was me, I would consider moving away. I wouldn't want to live among all that crap. But then I live the other side of Thailand from my 'in laws'.

Mate I'm not going anywhere, we live in a beautiful part of this country (Khao Yai) we have a nice home, my kids are go to a great international school with lots of friends, my in laws are great (her parents to be clear not some others as mentioned) why would I up root them. Generally I /we love it here!!!

Yes I know, I am currently buying a holiday home in Khao Yai. I didn't necessarily mean move away from your region, but maybe to another part. Up to you, but I wouldn't want to live among people who I had strained relations with.

[SinglePot]

this is totally outside of my experience in Thailand with wife and kids.

Very unusual scenario. Not sure what's going on here. Seems like separation of the nuclear from the extended. rare in Thailand in my view.

[captspectre]

I would say that you had a chance to nip this in the bud 10 years ago and the opportunity is now lost. You didn't establish your place in the pecking order and have been relegated to your present position. Face was lost a long time ago but your recent outburst has just crystalised it for everybody concerned.

How to remedy it? I haven't got a clue, but I doubt the situation will improve much with time.

Thai's really do not mean anything when talking about appearances, it is a cluture thing. saew one the other day at the temple who told the monk that he has gotten fat! must be eating to much! everyone including the monk laughed and no malace was intended.

[pattayadingo]

Well done to the OP.

And sod their petty reactions. At least you are better off without their constant bickering, snide remarks and bitching.

[SinglePot]

Wifey is central to all this. what does she say OP.?

[remobb]

A real and possible solution.

Have a meeting with the families involved (all together, offer food and drinks) and explain what they are or have been doing is not good behavior and it upsets your family and it is not the Thai way.

Tell them you wish to be part of the family and do not want to be upset with them. Let them know you have respect for them but if it continues your respect will falter.

Also ask them why do they behave like this.

Trust me, this will cause them to lose face unless they respond correctly.

Worth a try, it worked for me.

[SinglePot]

reverse psychology with the concept of face sounds like Australian rules to me

[Card]

A real and possible solution.

Have a meeting with the families involved (all together, offer food and drinks) and explain what they are or have been doing is not good behavior and it upsets your family and it is not the Thai way.

Tell them you wish to be part of the family and do not want to be upset with them. Let them know you have respect for them but if it continues your respect will falter.

Also ask them why do they behave like this.

Trust me, this will cause them to lose face unless they respond correctly.

Worth a try, it worked for me.

Right - and make sure they empty their pockets of free food and drink before they leave.

[SinglePot]

Never mind the face check the pocket eh Card.

[dao16]

For family, I pretty much express my displeasure in a straightforward way.

For the village, if someone is going around saying negative things about me or the family, I use a technique I guess I learned here subconsciously--just stop talking to them. Almost INEVITABLY, they will come to you at some point or address you in a friendly manner and ask you a question. Your answer.....to ANYTHING they say or ask is "uh" (the Thai yes-grunt...don't know how to spell it). This drives them NUTS, but it is so slight that they would lose face if they confronted you about it (and you can always just say you are tired or hot....don't worry, they never ask or comment on your grunting).

This has worked for me several times for more moderate offenders. Eventually, they stop talking shizen or they at least hide it better. Once that is accomplished, I speak to them kindly again. Punishment and reward.

OP's case sounds extreme, though.

[SinglePot]

punishment and rewards sounds like children and dogs

[dao16]

punishment and rewards sounds like children and dogs

Um, yeah, but I didn't mean that about Thais, specifically. Believe me, there have been many foreign acquaintances and foreign (falang or whatever) coworkers I had to use the tactic on, and it works, too (different punishments and rewards in a work environment, though).

Of course, most people are nice and it never comes to this. But, for that small percentage that just doesn't get it, yes, you have to teach them how to behave with you. Oftentimes, they continue abusing others, but as long as you teach them not to mess with you, they will stop in your case. So, yeah, it is like children and dogs. Call me a cynic.

Edited July 1, 2013 by dao16

[SinglePot]

OP is about family. Not factory. But maybe it will help.

[dao16]

OP is about family. Not factory. But maybe it will help.

yeah.....different ways of going about it, but same result. Strangely enough, after I did it, I saw a Thai person doing it to another one. Like someone said to me a long time ago here "if Thais care about you, they will ask questions about what you are doing, etc. If they don't like you, they won't ask anything at all." Anyway, just an idea.

[SinglePot]

'Strangely enough, after I did it, I saw a Thai person doing it to another one'.

If they want the control freak's money they will do anything that is necessary.

[kimroe]

I am a big lad my self. And I have a 4year old son who is big to but our bone are differnt then the thai poeple are so if they want to put a fihgt with my son they loooooosing