Gloomy prospect for Thai shrimp exports to EU

[thaigolfer]

Last year a German reporter toured Thailand. Conclusion was broadcast on TV and warning was: do no eat Thai shrimps. The land used by the farmers is contaminated for at least 100 years. There was a topic on Thaivisa about this last year. Maybe one should search for it.

[Markaew]

Pedro is right. Here's a few good article to read:

http://worldwildlife.org/industries/farmed-shrimp

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/3728019.stm

Hard for Thailand to argue with tariffs considering what they impose on imports here. Wine, cars, electronics, etc.

EXACTLY!!!

[Payboy]

early mortality syndrome (EMS)

Suicide, obviously.

[Markaew]

Most shrimps in Asian (Thai included) restaurants in France and Germany come from Vietnam.

I seem to remember someone saying that many of the Thai restaurants in the US can't use Thai produce because it's banned for various reasons. Maybe someone else knows if this is true.

I know their "morning glory" or "water spinach" is banned.

[Espen]

anybody ever noticed the environmental damage shrimp farming does to Thailand, you can see abandoned shrimp farms along the coast, not a blade of grass grows near these farms.

Yes I noticed this on a trip down the SE coast, the sheer scale of the wasteland was incredible. I was wondering if the land is toxic because it was flooded with saltwater, or is it due to chemicals used? Surely there is some way to rehabilitate the land and ultimately replant the mangrove forests?

As I understand it - the shrimps produce the waste that kills off the land.

Shrimp waste kills off the land? Are you serious? It's much more likely to be the antibiotics chemicals and hormones added to the water that degrade the land. You don't 'kill land'.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QDAPi0r4d9s

http://www.citizen.org/cmep/article_redirect.cfm?ID=12706

[Padova44]

"Shrimp waste kills off the land? Are you serious? It's much more likely to be the antibiotics chemicals and hormones added to the water that degrade the land. You don't 'kill land'. Really sloppy thinking."

I have a "fingerspitzengefuhl" you are showing seriously sloppy thinking. Have you seen the wasteland of shrimp farms for yourself? Yes or No. "Much more likely" is a vague phrase no scientist would ever use. Really sloppy thinking. You do 'kill land'. Land is killed around the world, hundreds of acres a day.

Let's dispense with insults and try to assemble facts.

[ttwitt]

Let's dispense with insults and try to assemble facts.

all i can see is some bucking NGO's

Edited July 3, 2013 by ttwitt

[Frank James]

I am bummed out that the US will be applying a high tariff to Thai imported shrimp and prawns, which we in the States can now purchase and enjoy for reasonable prices. There is no local US shrimp industry to protect anymore. (Thanks, Big Oil!) It makes no sense. For about $10 USD you can now buy frozen tiger prawns a kilo from Thailand that cook up very nicely, and everybody loves them.

Who in the corridors of The Power really cares about the dangers of fish farming, "dead land", etc? I'm not saying that this is not something to be concerned about, but still, we LOVE those Thai prawns! It sounds like nothing but a tariff war, perhaps retaliation for the outlandish tariffs Thailand places on all manner of imported goods.

One small ridiculous example: A fully decked out Harley-Davidson motorcycle, which costs less than $30,000 US, sells for well over 2 million baht here! Around $70,000! Insane!

[Padova44]

"all i can see is some bucking NGO's" I tried Google Translate and Bing Translator for a translation of this into English but they could not.

[pedro01]

Yes I am serious. I recall watching a documentary on it recently and the biggest culprit was what came out of the shrimp itself.

Shrimp excretion is high in ammonia, nitrite, urea, and uric acid.

You do kill land. Once you pollute it to the point where nothing grows, it is commonly called "dead land". Of course, an internet pedant might point out that soil does not breathe, grow, reproduce etc and can't be called living - but I think most people understand what is meant by killing off the land.

Interesting that the chemicals you ascribe to shrimp excreta are elsewhere called fertilizer. In centuries past the method of rendering an enemies fields infertile was to sow them with salt, and I personal experience how long it takes planted grass to grow in soil dredged from a river delta.

They are indeed - but it's the concentrations that are toxic. Try sprinkling pure ammonia on your flower bed and see how the plants do.

In a balanced eco-system, one animals waste is another animals food. With the shrimp farms, it's not a self-cleaning eco-system. These farms only last 7 years or so and to do that, they have to pump in all sorts of antibiotics and chemicals so that the shrimps can survive in these conditions.

[joeaverage]

is anybody else amused by the term "early mortality syndrome"

[sandrabbit]

I was under the impression that most of the farmed shrimp was freshwater, I live right on the coast and the farms seem to be using freshwater not seawater?.

[CobraSnakeNecktie]

Grow some more grass fed cows you dummy Thai farmers.

Tons of grass and why use machetes and weed whackers? More freaking cows and better tasting beef for consumers.

It's not impossible and good for the eco system. let them eat grass and revitalize the soil with their poops.

[Thai at Heart]

Irrespective of this instant issue, it seems that agriculture in Thailand has pursued a very unsustainable path.

4 crops of rice utilising huge amounts of fertilisers, shrimp that are farmed onshore ruining land etc.

And yet still many farmers living on the bread line.

[alant]

 

If Thailand's shrimp production has been cut in half, by about 250,000 tons then how does the loss of market of 10-30,000 tons matter?

Maybe that additional 13% duty is justified?

Thailand can still dump what I consider to be a dangerous product into the North American market, especially the Canadian market where there is little oversight over Thai shrimp imports.

 

GK, you have stepped on my feet before. You stop talking about things you are totally unqualified to talk about. The EU imported 50,000MT of shrimp from Thailand, or about 10% of the production. US and Japan are other major markets. Dangerous product? Give me a break. Most people don't know that Thailand is the safest major producer in the world for consistent quality product. Thailand hasn't had a shipment stopped due to contamination or banned chemicals in over 7 years while VN, Malaysia, Indonesia, India and all other major producer nations have. Hard for you to believe but there is no corruption in this area because it serves nobody.

Phew, "stepped on feet... You stop talking about things you are totally unqualified to talk about". Why would you think a reader of this would regard what you say as credible when it seems you are not prepared to accept some one else may have a view that differs and feel you must respond as such?

[geriatrickid]

 

If Thailand's shrimp production has been cut in half, by about 250,000 tons then how does the loss of market of 10-30,000 tons matter?

Maybe that additional 13% duty is justified?

Thailand can still dump what I consider to be a dangerous product into the North American market, especially the Canadian market where there is little oversight over Thai shrimp imports.

 

GK, you have stepped on my feet before. You stop talking about things you are totally unqualified to talk about. The EU imported 50,000MT of shrimp from Thailand, or about 10% of the production. US and Japan are other major markets. Dangerous product? Give me a break. Most people don't know that Thailand is the safest major producer in the world for consistent quality product. Thailand hasn't had a shipment stopped due to contamination or banned chemicals in over 7 years while VN, Malaysia, Indonesia, India and all other major producer nations have. Hard for you to believe but there is no corruption in this area because it serves nobody.

Do you have a vested interest in shrimp farming? This is a material question as you make a claim about safety and do not substantiate the claim. In fact, you make a false statement when you write that Thailand has not had a shipment stopped due to contamination or banned chemicals in 7 years.

I believe that Thai farmed shrimp on the whole presents a health hazard to the consumer. There are multiple reports/studies released documenting the over the questionable use and misuse of chemicals and antibiotics. Here's an example;

In 2012 Australian government inspectors rejected and quarantined prawn shipments from Thailand at least 7 times. The reason was attributable to the prawns being contaminated with vibrio cholerae or the presence of organochlorine chlorpyrifos. Do you know what cholera is? It is a deadly illness that is caused by the bacterium vibrio cholera. Are you aware that the chemical discovered is a banned chemical because it is implicated in birth defects and is a well known carcinogen.

There is absolutely no excused for Vibrio Cholera to be present in any food source. Responsible shrimp growers should not be using chemicals that are banned in the countries to which they export. Do you want to discuss the use and misuse of antibiotics in the shrimp farming industry? If Thailand knows that such antibiotics are banned or restricted in key export markets, why then would wholesalers export shrimp contaminated with the antibiotics to North America, Australia and the EU? Do you think the exporters were gambling on the fact that the USA tests less than 1% of its seafood imports, Australia less than 5% etc.?

Back to you now.

Please direct me to the documentation showing that Thai shrimp is safe from bacterial contamination and antibiotic and organic compound contamination. In a country where the government isn't known for a robust enforcement of food safety laws and the country itself is ranked at the lower end of sustainable agricultural practices, I expect you will have a difficult time trying to make your case. Please do not invent "facts" either.

Edited July 4, 2013 by geriatrickid

[Thai at Heart]

 

If Thailand's shrimp production has been cut in half, by about 250,000 tons then how does the loss of market of 10-30,000 tons matter?

Maybe that additional 13% duty is justified?

Thailand can still dump what I consider to be a dangerous product into the North American market, especially the Canadian market where there is little oversight over Thai shrimp imports.

 

GK, you have stepped on my feet before. You stop talking about things you are totally unqualified to talk about. The EU imported 50,000MT of shrimp from Thailand, or about 10% of the production. US and Japan are other major markets. Dangerous product? Give me a break. Most people don't know that Thailand is the safest major producer in the world for consistent quality product. Thailand hasn't had a shipment stopped due to contamination or banned chemicals in over 7 years while VN, Malaysia, Indonesia, India and all other major producer nations have. Hard for you to believe but there is no corruption in this area because it serves nobody.

Do you have a vested interest in shrimp farming? This is a material question as you make a claim about safety and do not substantiate the claim.

I believe that Thai farmed shrimp on the whole presents a health hazard to the consumer. There are multiple studies released documenting the over use and misuse of chemicals and antibiotics. Here's an example;

In 2012 Australian government inspectors rejected and quarantined prawn shipments from Thailand at least 7 times. The reason was attributable to the prawns being contaminated with vibrio cholerae or the presence of organochlorine chlorpyrifos. Do you know what cholera is? It is a deadly illness that is caused by the bacterium vibrio cholera. Are you aware that the chemical discovered is a banned chemical because it is implicated in birth defects and is a well known carcinogen.

There is absolutely no excused for Vibrio Cholera to be present in any food source. Responsible shrimp growers should not be using chemicals that are banned in the countries to which they export. Do you want to discuss the use and misuse of antibiotics in the shrimp farming industry? If Thailand knows that such antibiotics are banned or restricted in key export markets, why then would wholesalers using the antibiotics export shrimp contaminated with the antibiotics to North America, Australia and the EU? Do you think the exporters were gambling on the fact that the USA tests less than 1% of its seafood imports, Australia less than 5% etc.?

Back to you to direct me to the documentation showing that Thai shrimp is safe from bacterial contamination and antibiotic and organic compound contamination. BTW I was a big shrimp eater up until last year after I had observed a steady decline of quality in the past few years. I started reading up on the costs of shrimp farming and the health hazards and made an informed decision to avoid the product.

The problem has always been, thousands of tiny suppliers having access to all sorts of cheap products, trying to scrimp a baht to save money.

Chloropirphos is not good stuff to have on farms

[ttwitt]

 

If Thailand's shrimp production has been cut in half, by about 250,000 tons then how does the loss of market of 10-30,000 tons matter?

Maybe that additional 13% duty is justified?

Thailand can still dump what I consider to be a dangerous product into the North American market, especially the Canadian market where there is little oversight over Thai shrimp imports.

 

GK, you have stepped on my feet before. You stop talking about things you are totally unqualified to talk about. The EU imported 50,000MT of shrimp from Thailand, or about 10% of the production. US and Japan are other major markets. Dangerous product? Give me a break. Most people don't know that Thailand is the safest major producer in the world for consistent quality product. Thailand hasn't had a shipment stopped due to contamination or banned chemicals in over 7 years while VN, Malaysia, Indonesia, India and all other major producer nations have. Hard for you to believe but there is no corruption in this area because it serves nobody.

Do you have a vested interest in shrimp farming? This is a material question as you make a claim about safety and do not substantiate the claim. In fact, you make a false statement when you write that Thailand has not had a shipment stopped due to contamination or banned chemicals in 7 years.

I believe that Thai farmed shrimp on the whole presents a health hazard to the consumer. There are multiple reports/studies released documenting the over the questionable use and misuse of chemicals and antibiotics. Here's an example;

In 2012 Australian government inspectors rejected and quarantined prawn shipments from Thailand at least 7 times. The reason was attributable to the prawns being contaminated with vibrio cholerae or the presence of organochlorine chlorpyrifos. Do you know what cholera is? It is a deadly illness that is caused by the bacterium vibrio cholera. Are you aware that the chemical discovered is a banned chemical because it is implicated in birth defects and is a well known carcinogen.

There is absolutely no excused for Vibrio Cholera to be present in any food source. Responsible shrimp growers should not be using chemicals that are banned in the countries to which they export. Do you want to discuss the use and misuse of antibiotics in the shrimp farming industry? If Thailand knows that such antibiotics are banned or restricted in key export markets, why then would wholesalers export shrimp contaminated with the antibiotics to North America, Australia and the EU? Do you think the exporters were gambling on the fact that the USA tests less than 1% of its seafood imports, Australia less than 5% etc.?

Back to you now.

Please direct me to the documentation showing that Thai shrimp is safe from bacterial contamination and antibiotic and organic compound contamination. In a country where the government isn't known for a robust enforcement of food safety laws and the country itself is ranked at the lower end of sustainable agricultural practices, I expect you will have a difficult time trying to make your case. Please do not invent "facts" either.

given that a good percentage of thai shrimp product is sourced from the deep south, i'd say that the root cause of the toxic problem lies elsewhere, as most farmers would agree, you reap what you sow.

separately, i too stopped playing russian roulette many years ago.

Edited July 4, 2013 by ttwitt