Thai Energy minister to outline plan for rooftop solar panels

[webfact]

SOLAR PANELS
Energy minister to outline plan for rooftop solar panels
Watcharapong Thongrung
The Nation

BANGKOK: -- Energy Minister Pongsak Rattapongpaisal Ruktapongpisal plans to submit to the Energy Policy and Planning Office on Tuesday a proposal to promote electricity generation via solar panels installed on rooftops of houses, buildings, offices and factories.

For 2013-14, the ministry will propose a promotional electricity rate in the form of a feed tariff for 25 years for three groups of solar electricity producers. General residences will be entitled to support of Bt6.69 per unit; small and medium-sized enterprises (producing 10-250 megawatts of electricity) will get Bt6.55 per unit; and medium-to-large factories (producing more than 250MW) will get Bt6.16 per unit.

Pongsak expects this project to result in at least 200MW of electricity generated by rooftop solar panels. The impact of this support on the fuel tariff (Ft) rate will be about Bt0.50 per unit. In addition, there will be tax breaks, after the Energy Ministry consults with the Finance Ministry.

The Energy Ministry will brief Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra on Tuesday afternoon on the rise in world oil prices after the political turmoil in Egypt. The ministry can still cap the retail diesel price at Bt30 a litre as the Oil Fund still shows a surplus of Bt4 billion. However, the crude-oil price is expected to rise to US$106-108 a barrel late this year on softening demand after the United States produces more oil and gas from shale. Moreover, the winter season in Europe typically reduces the demand for oil for transporting goods.

As for the electricity cost in the second half of this year, it is likely that the Ft will rise by about Bt2.80 per unit to reflect the higher costs caused by the weak baht and the higher price of natural gas. With support from the Electricity Generating Authority of Thailand, the Ft rate could be maintained for a bit longer, Pongsak said.

Beginning on September 1, the price of liquefied petroleum gas for the household sector will begin rising by Bt0.50 per kilogram per month until the increases total Bt6 per kilo, which will result in the price of cooking gas rising from Bt18.13 per kilo to Bt24.82. Pongsak said this would not adversely affect low-income households that consume no more than 90 units of electricity, or about 7.5 million households without access to electricity, as they can still buy cooking gas (a maximum of 6kg per month) at the current price.


-- The Nation 2013-07-13

[theblether]

Great plan if they can get it off the ground, I have my doubts though.

[chiang mai]

Rooftop panels, get it off the ground!

[retell]

love to hear more of that and how to apply if it ever gets started i would have installed some allready if i could feed back in the grid

are the gonna make a big discount on the panels and batteries and so on ?

[kurnell]

30 years behind the rest of the word, but better late than never. I have my doubts it will ever happen though.

[OzMick]

The retail price of electricity is currently less than B4/kWh. This plan is to BUY electricity from solar panel producers at between B6.19 and B6.69, or around DOUBLE that paid to other generators, and the price of electricity looks to INCREASE B0.5/kWh via the fuel levy. Meanwhile tax breaks are envisaged for those installing solar panels.

Our increased power bills will slightly reduce the amount of fuel consumed in generation, but do nothing to reduce the fossil fuel generation capacity required because it is not available at the normal peak load periods. More gas/oil/coal power stations will still need to be built to meet rising demand.

Solar photovoltaic panels will return around 7 times the energy needed to make them over their life, and that energy SHOULD demand a low price because it is uncontrollable, it will reduce/stop under clouds, and is unavailable for peak demand. A hydro-power unit built onto one of the many proposed new dams will return 100+ times the energy input, and the energy produced is much more valuable as it is readily available and capable of fast variation for "load following".

[hanuman2543]

Hope that they keep in mind that the net is able to cope with the challenges (in daytime there will be a lot of additional electricity available) and that they have enough power plants on standby to cope with the additional need to produce electricity in nighttime. But a step in the right direction and time to slowly start to lookout for some cheap Chinese made panels.

[Rimbuman]

Just like Kurnell says, way to late like almost anything else in Thailand, but better now than never. Gonna have to see it first before I believe it though .

[oxo1947]

"Our increased power bills will slightly reduce the amount of fuel consumed in generation, but do nothing to reduce the fossil fuel generation capacity required because it is not available at the normal peak load periods. More gas/oil/coal power stations will still need to be built to meet rising demand.

Solar photovoltaic panels will return around 7 times the energy needed to make them over their life, and that energy SHOULD demand a low price because it is uncontrollable, it will reduce/stop under clouds, and is unavailable for peak demand. A hydro-power unit built onto one of the many proposed new dams will return 100+ times the energy input, and the energy produced is much more valuable as it is readily available and capable of fast variation for "load following"."--Laveroa

You really do fail to understand how the solar panel industry works Laveroa-- energy from the solar panels on Houses in Australia is sold back to the generating companies, at a cheaper price then it takes them to produce & is then used at peak periods---The panels do not stop working on a cloudy day, wow I have not heard someone say that in the last 20 years-----try to think back to the solar powered calculator you may have used at school or work. That didn't stop working on a cloudy day, and it's based on exactly the same solar technology.

My daughters last electric account in Australia for the whole year was $1,150 in credit !! even Britian is now moving towards installing solar paneling----- yet you will still get the cry that the only way to solve those problems is to build even bigger Power stations / Hydro dams etc

"Despite Britain having a reputation for grey and cloudy weather, there is in fact more than enough sunlight on our fair isle to power solar panels.

But it's not just theory that shows solar panels can work in the UK - it's been proven over the last couple of decades. Solar panels for domestic use may be relatively new, but certain industries have been using them with success for a number of years now." == solarpanels.co.uk/-----faq/solar-panels-uk.html

[OzMick]

"Our increased power bills will slightly reduce the amount of fuel consumed in generation, but do nothing to reduce the fossil fuel generation capacity required because it is not available at the normal peak load periods. More gas/oil/coal power stations will still need to be built to meet rising demand.

Solar photovoltaic panels will return around 7 times the energy needed to make them over their life, and that energy SHOULD demand a low price because it is uncontrollable, it will reduce/stop under clouds, and is unavailable for peak demand. A hydro-power unit built onto one of the many proposed new dams will return 100+ times the energy input, and the energy produced is much more valuable as it is readily available and capable of fast variation for "load following"."--Laveroa

You really do fail to understand how the solar panel industry works Laveroa-- energy from the solar panels on Houses in Australia is sold back to the generating companies, at a cheaper price then it takes them to produce & is then used at peak periods---The panels do not stop working on a cloudy day, wow I have not heard someone say that in the last 20 years-----try to think back to the solar powered calculator you may have used at school or work. That didn't stop working on a cloudy day, and it's based on exactly the same solar technology.

My daughters last electric account in Australia for the whole year was $1,150 in credit !! even Britian is now moving towards installing solar paneling----- yet you will still get the cry that the only way to solve those problems is to build even bigger Power stations / Hydro dams etc

"Despite Britain having a reputation for grey and cloudy weather, there is in fact more than enough sunlight on our fair isle to power solar panels.

But it's not just theory that shows solar panels can work in the UK - it's been proven over the last couple of decades. Solar panels for domestic use may be relatively new, but certain industries have been using them with success for a number of years now." == solarpanels.co.uk/-----faq/solar-panels-uk.html

"........in Australia is sold back to the generating companies, at a cheaper price then it takes them to produce & is then used at peak periods...."

This shows a complete ignorance of the facts. Electricity retailers have been forced to buy solar power at prices above their retail selling price, forcing them to raise their prices, and far above the price paid for wholesale energy. And the idea that the energy bought is stored to be used at peak load periods is almost infantile. That solar energy isn't absorbed by clouds approaches moronic.

Yes those installing solar panels have benefitted due to government policy and subsidies - to the detriment of the rest of the population. If the huge growth in solar power is so bloody wonderful, why have electricity prices spiralled to incredible heights since its introduction as policy?

[CIHUAHUA]

Solar panels? Many problems come into play with the batteries and the other parts of the system. Next the powers that be will be talking about those ugly, large windmills strewn all over the place. I think to conserve on energy and lower the fossil fuel consumption “developing countries” need to take a look at the rising amount of cars and develop an efficient public transportation system. Reduce the amount of energy it takes to operate all of the gadgets everyone thinks they need. Sustainable energy is energy unused.

[Neilly]

-The panels do not stop working on a cloudy day, wow I have not heard someone say that in the last 20 years

Try telling that to my neighbour...cloudy day means he has to switch back to mains power. The panels used in the UK couldn't take the heat here in Thailand...something to do with heat loss.

Hopefully someone with a better working knowledge of solar energy will be along to explain why

[monty1412]

Great plan.... now given I have been here long enough to know how things work let me tell you how this will pan out

This will be hailed as a huge step forward in fact wont be surprised if we dont see ministers and gov officials proclaiming Thailand as the Hub of Solar Power Implementation.. much fanfare, pictures and hullabaloo will follow.

Contract will be awarded to the lowest bidder and then only the one that allows certain key components to be downgraded or left off and the resultant extra monies will find their way into a raft of pockets and wallets of those who are connected with this.

Installation will be done by lowest bidder contractor again after brown paper bag rewards to the boyz..... the installations will be substandard, the panels and infrastructure will be substandard and the cleaning and maintenance contract again smeared by the ubiquitous brown paper bag routine will not happen...

Two years after installation and the much publicised and self rewarding press you shall see a press report that will claim along the lines that 64% of the panels as installed arent working, 23% of these have failed, 25% were installed facing the wrong way, 12% were installed upside down, 15% weren't installed at all etc etc. Of the 36% that are claimed to be working the savings will be minimal and and whole program will be deemed a complete failure. Corruption will be suspected as the root cause of the failure and the Anti Corruption Commission will spring into action to identify the guilty only to wound down the case after achieving their goal of creating much press and fanfare and getting a few handouts to make sure no conclusive findings are resultant.

So here is alternative.... why not just hand out some monies to those who would have got it anyway and use the left over monies to improve traffic infrastaructure and other more needy projects... saves a whole lot of derelict solar panels littering the roofs of Bangkok.

I know this sounds ultra cynical but I can just see it all happening.

[Thai at Heart]

-The panels do not stop working on a cloudy day, wow I have not heard someone say that in the last 20 years

Try telling that to my neighbour...cloudy day means he has to switch back to mains power. The panels used in the UK couldn't take the heat here in Thailand...something to do with heat loss.

Hopefully someone with a better working knowledge of solar energy will be along to explain why

Certain older cheaper types don't handle heat well.

All are specced globally at a given constant temperature, the spec needs to be compatible with local conditions. They won't use batteries. Maximum output will be at 2pm just when industry and offices need it.

A house will sell in daytime and draw back from the grid at night.

[OzMick]

Certain older cheaper types don't handle heat well.

All are specced globally at a given constant temperature, the spec needs to be compatible with local conditions. They won't use batteries. Maximum output will be at 2pm just when industry and offices need it.

A house will sell in daytime and draw back from the grid at night.

Max output will be when the sun is closest to vertical to the plane of the panel, which in most time zones will be around noon. Peak load periods in western industrialised nations is nowhere near that time, usually close to morning and evening meal times.

They won't use batteries because it is simply impossible to store this quantity of energy in batteries.

Say 'A house will sell in daytime and draw back from the grid at night.' is disingenuous. The capacity factor (the amount of electricity produced compared to rated value times 24 hours) is typically less than 25% in a desert, and that is for solar tracking panels. The energy produced is a factor of the sine of the angle of incidence - near zero below 15^o, further reduced by cloud cover and surface dust.

[oz93666]

something wrong with these numbers......"...small and medium-sized enterprises ,producing 10-250 megawatts of electricity... ": thats 70,000 to 1,750 000 square meters!!! ( 7sq m.=1kw) quite a big roof .... " Pongsak expects this project to result in at least 200MW of electricity generated by rooftop solar panels" ....so it's expected one small producer will result.

[Neilly]

Certain older cheaper types don't handle heat well.

All are specced globally at a given constant temperature, the spec needs to be compatible with local conditions. They won't use batteries. Maximum output will be at 2pm just when industry and offices need it.

A house will sell in daytime and draw back from the grid at night.

My parents in UK were some of the last to get the subsidy before it was withdrawn and the system you mention is as you say (no batteries) and does save them money.

The system at my neighbour has is only about a year old and uses batteries, but can’t store enough power to run one A/C through the night...hardly ideal. And before some bright spark (no pun intended LOL) says get more batteries...he could...but I doubt he would be able to get his car in his garage if he did.

[oz93666]

-The panels do not stop working on a cloudy day, wow I have not heard someone say that in the last 20 years

Try telling that to my neighbour...cloudy day means he has to switch back to mains power. The panels used in the UK couldn't take the heat here in Thailand...something to do with heat loss.

Hopefully someone with a better working knowledge of solar energy will be along to explain why

-The panels do not stop working on a cloudy day, wow I have not heard someone say that in the last 20 years

Try telling that to my neighbour...cloudy day means he has to switch back to mains power. The panels used in the UK couldn't take the heat here in Thailand...something to do with heat loss.

Hopefully someone with a better working knowledge of solar energy will be along to explain why

I've just purchased 50 x 100w panels from China (115,000Bht inc taxes delivered to Bangkok), on an overcast day they produce 10% (500w), if very dark and rainy 5% .... panells in UK are same as panels here and will work fine anywhere, used here the higher temperatures will give slight loss in efficency but more than made up for by increase in power due to 'stronger' sunlight

[lungmi]

In south-west Germany (green and social-democrat gouvernment) we have solar farms, solar cell roofs on chicken, pig and cow barnstables. It works very good.

Now a new technology of solar cells (Fraunhofer Institute, number 16 to 25 world ranking for research) is in application for the next years.

30% more efficiency (no problem with small clouds, dip angle extended), longevity doubled.

[Tep]

Two years after installation and the much publicised and self rewarding press you shall see a press report that will claim along the lines that 64% of the panels as installed arent working, 23% of these have failed, 25% were installed facing the wrong way, 12% were installed upside down, 15% weren't installed at all etc etc. Of the 36% that are claimed to be working the savings will be minimal and and whole program will be deemed a complete failure. Corruption will be suspected as the root cause of the failure and the Anti Corruption Commission will spring into action to identify the guilty only to wound down the case after achieving their goal of creating much press and fanfare and getting a few handouts to make sure no conclusive findings are resultant.

I think your cynicism is off the mark here. Nowhere in the article did it mention any roll out of roof top solar installations by any state agency. The Ministry of Energy is merely implementing a feed-in-tariff (FIT) for roof top solar in 3 categories of consumer/supplier. I imagine the installation of the required equipment will be done by the private sector or perhaps by MEA or PEA in what will probably be a competitive environment.

You may want to look at the experience of the private sector implementing energy efficiency through the Energy Service Companies. These ESCO's work with companies to help plan and implement investments in energy efficiency (in both technology and usage). They have set up a new association www.thaiesco.org.

[OzMick]

-The panels do not stop working on a cloudy day, wow I have not heard someone say that in the last 20 years

Try telling that to my neighbour...cloudy day means he has to switch back to mains power. The panels used in the UK couldn't take the heat here in Thailand...something to do with heat loss.

Hopefully someone with a better working knowledge of solar energy will be along to explain why

I've just purchased 50 x 100w panels from China (115,000Bht inc taxes delivered to Bangkok), on an overcast day they produce 10% (500w), if very dark and rainy 5% .... panells in UK are same as panels here and will work fine anywhere, used here the higher temperatures will give slight loss in efficency but more than made up for by increase in power due to 'stronger' sunlight

I'm assuming you have an output meter - do you ever achieve the rated output of 5kW?

[Tep]

You really do fail to understand how the solar panel industry works Laveroa-- energy from the solar panels on Houses in Australia is sold back to the generating companies, at a cheaper price then it takes them to produce & is then used at peak periods---The panels do not stop working on a cloudy day, wow I have not heard someone say that in the last 20 years-----try to think back to the solar powered calculator you may have used at school or work. That didn't stop working on a cloudy day, and it's based on exactly the same solar technology.

My daughters last electric account in Australia for the whole year was $1,150 in credit !! even Britian is now moving towards installing solar paneling----- yet you will still get the cry that the only way to solve those problems is to build even bigger Power stations / Hydro dams etc

A lot of factual errors in this plus some misconception about the way the electricity supply industry actually operates that have already been addressed by another poster but the attack on the other poster for mentioning large power plants should be countered. The article cites the Minister as saying that 200 MW of capacity is expected to be added by the roof top solar program. Thailand's capacity is nearing 30,000 MW. Roof top solar can only comprise a small portion of Thailand's energy supply needs. You will also find that with such a generous FIT, if roof top solar installations increase beyond the 200 MW allocated by the Ministry, then you will see the effects on the the tariff as this subsidy is passed through to consumers. Also, peak generation has been mentioned. We do not yet have any models of energy systems being made up exclusively of renewable energy. Germany will be the first perhaps, with 80% by 2030 and 100% by 2050 if I remember the figures from their new policy correctly. So how will they be managing peak demand without any peaking plant? Maybe through energy efficiency (negawatts) and imports (from nuclear generated in France perhaps). Certainly not by their roof top solar providers.

The current power development plan (PDP 2010 Revision 3) indicates that renewable energy will comprise 5% of capacity by 2030. At the moment is stands at around 2%. This is despite around 250 VSPP projects. It will be many years before renewable energy can be a significant component of Thailand's energy mix. Until then, fuel diversity and the over-reliance on gas remains the main energy security issue.

Renewable energy development is a complex issue. It should be debated without rancour or one-upmanship.

[Tep]

In south-west Germany (green and social-democrat gouvernment) we have solar farms, solar cell roofs on chicken, pig and cow barnstables. It works very good.

Now a new technology of solar cells (Fraunhofer Institute, number 16 to 25 world ranking for research) is in application for the next years.

30% more efficiency (no problem with small clouds, dip angle extended), longevity doubled.

I visited Fraunhofer Institute in Kassel in 2010 with the Thai Energy Regulatory Commission. The Institute had just completed a pilot project to operate the German grid for one hour on 100% renewable energy. It was very cutting edge stuff. However, there were a number of issues. The assumptions that they used for the amount of arable land that had to be turned to crops for fuel and households installing roof top solar etc were quite unrealistic. More importantly, the researchers were unable to give an economic or financial analysis of their model. Even though renewable technologies are diminishing in cost, particularly solar, they still need the feed-in-tariff to make this attractive for consumers to install. Nearly half the german electricity tariff is made up of taxes, levies and costs of feed-in-tariffs and there are studies that demonstrate this does have a real impact on German competitiveness.

Germany is going to have to face significant challenges in the implementation of its new energy policy and I suspect that future weaknesses in the German energy system will be covered by cross border trade.

[Thai at Heart]

Certain older cheaper types don't handle heat well.

All are specced globally at a given constant temperature, the spec needs to be compatible with local conditions. They won't use batteries. Maximum output will be at 2pm just when industry and offices need it.

A house will sell in daytime and draw back from the grid at night.

Max output will be when the sun is closest to vertical to the plane of the panel, which in most time zones will be around noon. Peak load periods in western industrialised nations is nowhere near that time, usually close to morning and evening meal times.

They won't use batteries because it is simply impossible to store this quantity of energy in batteries.

Say 'A house will sell in daytime and draw back from the grid at night.' is disingenuous. The capacity factor (the amount of electricity produced compared to rated value times 24 hours) is typically less than 25% in a desert, and that is for solar tracking panels. The energy produced is a factor of the sine of the angle of incidence - near zero below 15^o, further reduced by cloud cover and surface dust.

I don't disagree. We do some solar business. Max due to inclination of the panels is about 2pm, maximum draw in Thailand is reportedly 2pm.

You are right it isn't a cheap way to produce, but there is abundant sunshine here so it can be part of a strategy. People were mentioning batteries which is pointless.

[Rorri]

30 years behind the rest of the word, but better late than never. I have my doubts it will ever happen though.

You say 30 years behind, I won't argue, but what I will say, they haven't done it yet, only floated another idea, to appear to be doing something.

[Rorri]

"Our increased power bills will slightly reduce the amount of fuel consumed in generation, but do nothing to reduce the fossil fuel generation capacity required because it is not available at the normal peak load periods. More gas/oil/coal power stations will still need to be built to meet rising demand.

Solar photovoltaic panels will return around 7 times the energy needed to make them over their life, and that energy SHOULD demand a low price because it is uncontrollable, it will reduce/stop under clouds, and is unavailable for peak demand. A hydro-power unit built onto one of the many proposed new dams will return 100+ times the energy input, and the energy produced is much more valuable as it is readily available and capable of fast variation for "load following"."--Laveroa

You really do fail to understand how the solar panel industry works Laveroa-- energy from the solar panels on Houses in Australia is sold back to the generating companies, at a cheaper price then it takes them to produce & is then used at peak periods---The panels do not stop working on a cloudy day, wow I have not heard someone say that in the last 20 years-----try to think back to the solar powered calculator you may have used at school or work. That didn't stop working on a cloudy day, and it's based on exactly the same solar technology.

My daughters last electric account in Australia for the whole year was $1,150 in credit !! even Britian is now moving towards installing solar paneling----- yet you will still get the cry that the only way to solve those problems is to build even bigger Power stations / Hydro dams etc

"Despite Britain having a reputation for grey and cloudy weather, there is in fact more than enough sunlight on our fair isle to power solar panels.

But it's not just theory that shows solar panels can work in the UK - it's been proven over the last couple of decades. Solar panels for domestic use may be relatively new, but certain industries have been using them with success for a number of years now." == solarpanels.co.uk/-----faq/solar-panels-uk.html

They don't stop producing when the weather is overcast, BUT their output is diminished.

[retell]

small and medium-sized enterprises (producing 10-250 megawatts of electricity) will get Bt6.55 per unit;

could it be they meant KW ?

my house uses now about 400 KW and do not have an ac

[retell]

Certain older cheaper types don't handle heat well.

All are specced globally at a given constant temperature, the spec needs to be compatible with local conditions. They won't use batteries. Maximum output will be at 2pm just when industry and offices need it.

A house will sell in daytime and draw back from the grid at night.

Max output will be when the sun is closest to vertical to the plane of the panel, which in most time zones will be around noon. Peak load periods in western industrialised nations is nowhere near that time, usually close to morning and evening meal times.

They won't use batteries because it is simply impossible to store this quantity of energy in batteries.

Say 'A house will sell in daytime and draw back from the grid at night.' is disingenuous. The capacity factor (the amount of electricity produced compared to rated value times 24 hours) is typically less than 25% in a desert, and that is for solar tracking panels. The energy produced is a factor of the sine of the angle of incidence - near zero below 15^o, further reduced by cloud cover and surface dust.

I don't disagree. We do some solar business. Max due to inclination of the panels is about 2pm, maximum draw in Thailand is reportedly 2pm.

You are right it isn't a cheap way to produce, but there is abundant sunshine here so it can be part of a strategy. People were mentioning batteries which is pointless.

yep expensive those batteries and they do not last too long in lifespan

[Thai at Heart]

Certain older cheaper types don't handle heat well.

All are specced globally at a given constant temperature, the spec needs to be compatible with local conditions. They won't use batteries. Maximum output will be at 2pm just when industry and offices need it.

A house will sell in daytime and draw back from the grid at night.

Max output will be when the sun is closest to vertical to the plane of the panel, which in most time zones will be around noon. Peak load periods in western industrialised nations is nowhere near that time, usually close to morning and evening meal times.

They won't use batteries because it is simply impossible to store this quantity of energy in batteries.

Say 'A house will sell in daytime and draw back from the grid at night.' is disingenuous. The capacity factor (the amount of electricity produced compared to rated value times 24 hours) is typically less than 25% in a desert, and that is for solar tracking panels. The energy produced is a factor of the sine of the angle of incidence - near zero below 15^o, further reduced by cloud cover and surface dust.

I don't disagree. We do some solar business. Max due to inclination of the panels is about 2pm, maximum draw in Thailand is reportedly 2pm.

You are right it isn't a cheap way to produce, but there is abundant sunshine here so it can be part of a strategy. People were mentioning batteries which is pointless.

yep expensive those batteries and they do not last too long in lifespan

I would prefer they started subsidising insulation on new houses. Every house gets 4 or 5 aircons, and they have been built in the million with a bit of foil in the roof.

Brilliant.

[oz93666]

I've just purchased 50 x 100w panels from China (115,000Bht inc taxes delivered to Bangkok), on an overcast day they produce 10% (500w), if very dark and rainy 5% .... panells in UK are same as panels here and will work fine anywhere, used here the higher temperatures will give slight loss in efficency but more than made up for by increase in power due to 'stronger' sunlight

I'm assuming you have an output meter - do you ever achieve the rated output of 5kW?

After inverter losses 4.4kw at best : adverage daily output (in rain and sun) about 10 kwHrs (units) x 6.5Bht= 65Bht/day =23,725Bht/year . including cost of inverter and wires, total cost of system about 150,000Bht ( panels through Alibaba) , but I'll also save on the roof I'm building as I'll use the panels as the roofing panels, seal the gaps with silicon, this will also keep them cooler than fixing them ontop of a standard roof...