Marriage......

[theblether]

First of all no, I'm not getting married, I want to enjoy life.

My pal went through a village wedding a couple of months ago and he's in no hurry to properly register the marriage, so I'll take it that under UK law he's not recognized as being married at all just now?

Don't start your griping, but he's from a seriously wealthy family, ( I know them ) and his thinking is that he may as well err on the side of caution to see if the marriage will work out or not. He's got no intention of going back to the UK any time soon so he reckons issues such as spousal visas etc are irrelevant.

I think that's good thinking, is there a flaw in it somewhere?

ps. I got a reminder as to why I don't want to get married again, Mercedes Girl is kicking off because I'm heading to South America for a few months and not taking her with me. Who can be bothered with brain damage?

Never again, nope, never ever again.

[sbk]

Moving to marriage forum

But short answer is that if he did not register his marriage at the Amphur then Thailand does not consider him married.

[JLCrab]

1. Under Thai law (simplified) only property acquired subsequent to the marriage or current income is considered common property.

2. Anyone from a country that recognizes trusts could, prior to the marriage, transfer their assets to a trust, establish a trustee arrangement, and then have themselves established as a beneficiary of the trust such that the assets no longer belong to the beneficiary -- what might happen then upon dissolution of the marriage becomes moot point.

Edited July 14, 2013 by JLCrab

[theblether]

1. Under Thai law (simplified) only property acquired subsequent to the marriage or current income is considered common property.

2. Anyone from a country that recognizes trusts could, prior to the marriage, transfer their assets to a trust, establish a trustee arrangement, and then have themselves established as a beneficiary of the trust such that the assets no longer belong to the beneficiary -- what might happen then upon dissolution of the marriage becomes moot point.

I mentioned the idea of a trust to him last night, I think that's a wise move on a lot of levels.

[soi41]

1. Under Thai law (simplified) only property acquired subsequent to the marriage or current income is considered common property.

2. Anyone from a country that recognizes trusts could, prior to the marriage, transfer their assets to a trust, establish a trustee arrangement, and then have themselves established as a beneficiary of the trust such that the assets no longer belong to the beneficiary -- what might happen then upon dissolution of the marriage becomes moot point.

I mentioned the idea of a trust to him last night, I think that's a wise move on a lot of levels.

Why would he need a trust, when he is not married? After the village wedding, he is not any more married to his partner, than he is to any other female in this country!

As commonlaw marriage is not recognized under Thai law, I don't see the problem? As long as he doesn't legalise the marriage at the amphur, it is smoth sailing. Well at least when comes to, who owns what, if

[Mario2008]

When he gets married he can have a pre-nuptial drawn up and entered in the wedding register at the time he goes and registers for marriage.

That will have limited value in the UK, as the concept of a prenuptial is not known in UK law and the high court is just considering things, with nothing having crystalized. But best to ask a lawyer about that.

[sirineou]

First of all no, I'm not getting married, I want to enjoy life.

what makes you think that you cant enjoy life when you are married?

My pal went through a village wedding a couple of months ago and he's in no hurry to properly register the marriage, so I'll take it that under UK law he's not recognized as being married at all just now?

Don't start your griping, but he's from a seriously wealthy family, ( I know them ) and his thinking is that he may as well err on the side of caution to see if the marriage will work out or not.

Not the most auspicious way to start a marriage, an institution that is supposed to be based on commitment and trust.

I think that's good thinking, is there a flaw in it somewhere?

Is there a flaw somewhere??

You Think?

[David48]

I think that's good thinking, is there a flaw in it somewhere?

theblether ... no flaw there ... if in doubt ... hesitate.

South America ... humm.

Always wanted to go ... never did.

I don't speak Spanish or Portuguese ... but more put off by how little they value (your) life.

Good Luck mate.

.

[ripstanley]

With you heading for Sth America for a few months this means that you will not be posting on this forum? One can only hope.

[Lite Beer]

A nonsense and off topic post has been removed.

[Kudel]

1. Under Thai law (simplified) only property acquired subsequent to the marriage or current income is considered common property.

2. Anyone from a country that recognizes trusts could, prior to the marriage, transfer their assets to a trust, establish a trustee arrangement, and then have themselves established as a beneficiary of the trust such that the assets no longer belong to the beneficiary -- what might happen then upon dissolution of the marriage becomes moot point.

Funny this topic come's up because a law company wich is a well known sponsor of Thaivisa answered almost the same question asked by a farang on the stickmanweekly today.

Said farang was splitting up from only village girl wedding ,and according to this company it is still possible that in some cases the thai judge would still split everything fifty fifty of acquired property in thailand during said only village wedding.

I had my prenup signed up in my home country and Thailand legal wedding of course ,so wich means divorce in my country said divorce laws apply ,divorce in Thailand thai divorce laws apply.

I mentioned the idea of a trust to him last night, I think that's a wise move on a lot of levels.

Why would he need a trust, when he is not married? After the village wedding, he is not any more married to his partner, than he is to any other female in this country!

As commonlaw marriage is not recognized under Thai law, I don't see the problem? As long as he doesn't legalise the marriage at the amphur, it is smoth sailing. Well at least when comes to, who owns what, if:hit-the-fan:

[I Like Thai]

When his marriage breaks up, he will blame you for sticking your nose in with advice.

[theblether]

@sireneou, I think he's wise to watch his back, there's too many horror stories of guys getting cleaned out. His parents also expressed concern about the situation. So in as much as you're a flag waver for the institution of marriage, I'm a flag waver for guys to be careful and watch themselves.

I'll mention to him about the pre-nup before he eventually if ever registers the marriage. Thanks for that Mario

[theblether]

When his marriage breaks up, he will blame you for sticking your nose in with advice.

He asked me, and then I asked the experts here. Mario came up with a good bit of advice re the Thai pre-nup as there's already some money of his floating around in Thailand, if he can protect that, then it's a start.

[MAJIC]

@sireneou, I think he's wise to watch his back, there's too many horror stories of guys getting cleaned out. His parents also expressed concern about the situation. So in as much as you're a flag waver for the institution of marriage, I'm a flag waver for guys to be careful and watch themselves.

I'll mention to him about the pre-nup before he eventually if ever registers the marriage. Thanks for that Mario

As others have mentioned the Thai Village wedding means nothing,I once knew a guy who had been through 3 Village weddings,without having to cancel out any of them (Divorce).It's only legal and Recognised in the UK after Registering at the local Amphur,together with a Official (Notary Public) Translation.The reason for that is: it's a nice Flowery Marriage Certicate,but the text is all in Thai.

Edited July 14, 2013 by MAJIC

[Chittychangchang]

Watch out for them south American beauties!

Never say never to Mrs Blether.

CCC

[theblether]

Watch out for them south American beauties!

Never say never to Mrs Blether.

CCC

I actually prefer Latino's, I dated a Colombian when I was in China of all places

[JLCrab]

@sireneou, I think he's wise to watch his back, there's too many horror stories of guys getting cleaned out. His parents also expressed concern about the situation. So in as much as you're a flag waver for the institution of marriage, I'm a flag waver for guys to be careful and watch themselves.

I'll mention to him about the pre-nup before he eventually if ever registers the marriage. Thanks for that Mario

Even if there is no legal amphur registered marriage, if the assets are big enough, the Thai female (or even male) citizen and the non-Thai party have been co-habiting long enough & that the Thai citizen says he 'promised me' he would take care of me for the rest of my life and (legal consideration) has given me 'property' that can be used as evidence to such promise of some future marraige, it may be only a matter of time before some enterprising Thai lawyer brings up the question of breach-of-promise and tries to find a sympathetic Thai court.

[David48]

When his marriage breaks up, he will blame you for sticking your nose in with advice.

He asked me, and then I asked the experts here. Mario came up with a good bit of advice re the Thai pre-nup as there's already some money of his floating around in Thailand, if he can protect that, then it's a start.

From my basic understanding of Thai Marriage and Divorce Laws ... what he had (in Thailand) remains his before marriage.

So, as long as he doesn't sell the assets or transfer the title to another's name ... it remains his ... a great system.

But the double edged sword is that any debts your spouse accumulates during marriage are a lien against both partners.

Mario2008 ... correct in principle?

.

[JLCrab]

When his marriage breaks up, he will blame you for sticking your nose in with advice.

He asked me, and then I asked the experts here. Mario came up with a good bit of advice re the Thai pre-nup as there's already some money of his floating around in Thailand, if he can protect that, then it's a start.

From my basic understanding of Thai Marriage and Divorce Laws ... what he had (in Thailand) remains his before marriage.

So, as long as he doesn't sell the assets or transfer the title to another's name ... it remains his ... a great system.

But the double edged sword is that any debts your spouse accumulates during marriage are a lien against both partners.

Mario2008 ... correct in principle?

.

I would say the above is generally OK. However, it is really up to the court to decide what in-his-own-name, especially if major asset amounts are involved, came before the marriage and what came after. With a trust arrangement, it isn't in his own name.

[pigeonjake]

First of all no, I'm not getting married, I want to enjoy life.

hi blether,

that was your first sentence,

ill just point out that you can still enjoy life as well as being married,!

i do anyway,,lol,

have a good trip mate,, youll find a big difference there, when i worked in brazil, wow, all them big boobs and asses,, just the opposit to my wife,,lol,

have a good one,

jake

[GreenSnapper]

Prenups are a good idea.

But in many Western (feminist dominated) countries, they are declared invalid because they are disadvantagous for the woman and women must be protected in any case.

So be very careful because you may think you are save from robbery, but actually you are not.

[Mario2008]

Under Thai law only the gains during the marriage will be consdered, not what one had before the marriage.

A prenup protects both spouses, as it can alos be a protection gainst one of the psouse being bankrupt. A prenup can than prevent the debtors callling to collect on the property of the other spouse.

A prenup is not invalid in western countries, but it must not be that the other spouse is left out in the cold.

[GreenSnapper]

Prenups in Western countries are often a waste of money. Many people assume "a contract is a contract" but this is not true when it comes to "women's rights". A woman can sign everything, and she can later claim she didn't understand the meaning.

But as long you don't take your woman to the West, you may have some safety with a prenup, especially if you are wealthy.

[JLCrab]

Under Thai law only the gains during the marriage will be consdered, not what one had before the marriage.

A prenup protects both spouses, as it can alos be a protection gainst one of the psouse being bankrupt. A prenup can than prevent the debtors callling to collect on the property of the other spouse.

A prenup is not invalid in western countries, but it must not be that the other spouse is left out in the cold.

A prenuptial agreement in Thailand is only as good as the Thai judge or judges who is/are willing to enforce it.

And if those gains came suspiciously close to the actual marriage date a judge might decide there was an attempt to defraud the soon-to-be Thai spouse out of what might otherwise have been common property -- just depends how good her lawyer would be that such was the ill intent of the non-Thai spouse.

Edited July 15, 2013 by JLCrab

[Mario2008]

Besides the fact that it is the question if a non-Thai will get a different treatment than a Thai naitonal, the date of the property gains would be irrelevant in the case of a prenup. The protection of property and it not becomming communal property is the purpose of the prenup.

[GreenSnapper]

A prenuptial agreement in Thailand is only as good as the Thai judge or judges who is/are willing to enforce it.

And if those gains came suspiciously close to the actual marriage date a judge might decide there was an attempt to defraud the soon-to-be Thai spouse out of what might otherwise have been common property -- just depends how good her lawyer would be that such was the ill intent of the non-Thai spouse.

But this applies only to your assets you have inside Thailand, I assume? Does a Thai court realistically have any access to your world wide assets and can they enforce that?

Generally I like your suggestion to put everything into a trust. I have to do some research how this may protect you even at Western courts.

[Jasun]

Forgive me if I'm wrong, but don't 'sin somros' rules apply only to 100% Thai marriages?

I was of the belief that under Thai law, the division of assets is determined by the divorce laws of the husband's nationality with the exception of 'immovable assets' such as property, which are governed by the divorce laws of the country in which they are held.

This seems to be designed to favour the home team, ie what's yours is hers and what's hers is hers.

If you're worried about being fleeced, a course of action could be liquidate assets in your home country and move them into legally-held Thai property before registering the marriage.

[Mario2008]

You marry in Thailand under Thai law and that means the consequences are also according to Thai law, including assets in other countries.

Enforcement is another question, but there are treaties about that.

[Mario2008]

Forgive me if I'm wrong, but don't 'sin somros' rules apply only to 100% Thai marriages?

I was of the belief that under Thai law, the division of assets is determined by the divorce laws of the husband's nationality with the exception of 'immovable assets' such as property, which are governed by the divorce laws of the country in which they are held.

This seems to be designed to favour the home team, ie what's yours is hers and what's hers is hers.

If you're worried about being fleeced, a course of action could be liquidate assets in your home country and move them into legally-held Thai property before registering the marriage.

There is no seperate law for a marriage involving a non-Thai national.