The Recycle Bin

[Mumbo Jumbo]

Some times I send things to the recycle Bin, by mistake and my auto clean programme emptys the recycle bin along with other things on shutdown, and then its too late to get back the things ive dumped !!,

instead of sending things I '' think " i want to dump to the recycle bin, is there a way I can send the items to say a folder, which will not be autmatically emptyed on shut down by the clean up programme , and at a later date when I am sure I don't want the item I can then delete it from the special folder..? ( or put it back )

Thanks ..... Mumbo

[Artisan]

Some times I send things to the recycle Bin, by mistake and my auto clean programme emptys the recycle bin along with other things on shutdown, and then its too late to get back the things ive dumped !!,

instead of sending things I '' think " i want to dump to the recycle bin, is there a way I can send the items to say a folder, which will not be autmatically emptyed on shut down by the clean up programme , and at a later date when I am sure I don't want the item I can then delete it from the special folder..? ( or put it back )

Thanks ..... Mumbo

Easy, configure your 'auto clean programme' not to clean the recycle bin on shutdown. In the configuration, uncheck the recycle bin. I use CCleaner; what's your auto clean programme?

[thohts]

sure...

create a folder on your desktop. call it "fake recycle bin" if you want.

then put things in there instead of your regular recycle bin.

[Artisan]

create a folder on your desktop. call it "fake recycle bin" if you want.

then put things in there instead of your regular recycle bin.

That's rather crude as you'll lose the "right click" recycle bin options....and more! As you have an auto clean program that kicks in when you shut down, the sensible, and very slick, option is to re-configure that program so as to NOT empty the recycle bin...as I have said already.

[elkangorito]

Some times I send things to the recycle Bin, by mistake and my auto clean programme emptys the recycle bin along with other things on shutdown, and then its too late to get back the things ive dumped !!,

instead of sending things I '' think " i want to dump to the recycle bin, is there a way I can send the items to say a folder, which will not be autmatically emptyed on shut down by the clean up programme , and at a later date when I am sure I don't want the item I can then delete it from the special folder..? ( or put it back )

Thanks ..... Mumbo

Well Mumbo, you, like most of my clients, end up paying dearly for not understanding 'File Management'. I'm talking about files/folders & how/why they are named plus the understanding of their extensions. I have prescribed a couple of simple rules for my clients when using Windows based systems;

1) Read 'top left to bottom right' of each open window.

2) If in doubt, right click.

It is not usually successful to have all computer maintenance activities as an automatic function. Unfortunately, you will have to take 'control' over some parts of your computer to ensure that data is as you wish it to be. This requires some basic skills in 'File Management'.

Don't worry, it's not rocket science. As a matter of fact, it is very simple & can save you a lot of problems once you get the incredibly simple hang of it.

If you're interested in learning about the essential 'File Management', give me a yell & I'll help you.

Edited April 9, 2006 by elkangorito

[sting01]

First there is possible to retrieve your files, by using some tools that allow it (I think Norton do that well, but it's not the only one).

Second, do not trust the wonderfull and automatic program, it will always be a mess and I di suppose you know Peter's Law (the worst come at the worst time).

Third, if you do not have clue, do not want to be a technie, so do not bother yourself more that needed. A feature is worth the time you can gain when using it, if you do not gain time, the feature (even if with nice looking) is worthless.

I am a programmer since several years, I am fluent in MacOS up to 7.5, Win XP, and Linux (to give a level of fluency, I did commit some small part of the 2.2 kernel some years ago). So I still have a folder named 'poubelle pas sure' where I push things that I will eventually delete , as for exemple work made for a client that I consider finish (already paid) but that maybe the client will ask a quick mod , so worth to have it for some few days, but just in that folder. Then , I will not drag and drop to the garbage, nor use the right click, I will simply select and hit the key named Delete (immedate deletion of the file).

So, in short, a folder where you stock the eventual loozy files of the day, and that you manualy empty the next morning.

But the best, if you are not working for an intelligence office, and do not have porn child video, is simply to wipe out that program who do things obviously unwanted, do you need to erase automatically your trash bin? Look, that give you problem. More manual, more flexible, more control. And better, a prog that automatically empty the trash bin have a value (mut pay for it even 20 bht), do it manualy will always be free, and yo uwill never have to pay for that or to learn how to do it

[sting01]

Some times I send things to the recycle Bin, by mistake and my auto clean programme emptys the recycle bin along with other things on shutdown, and then its too late to get back the things ive dumped !!,

instead of sending things I '' think " i want to dump to the recycle bin, is there a way I can send the items to say a folder, which will not be autmatically emptyed on shut down by the clean up programme , and at a later date when I am sure I don't want the item I can then delete it from the special folder..? ( or put it back )

Thanks ..... Mumbo

Well Mumbo, you, like most of my clients, end up paying dearly for not understanding 'File Management'. I'm talking about files/folders & how/why they are named plus the understanding of their extensions. I have prescribed a couple of simple rules for my clients when using Windows based systems;

1If you're interested in learning about the essential 'File Management', give me a yell & I'll help you.

Man, it's not WINDOW BASED, that is WINDOW.If you want to speak technical, please be accurate (for exemple I will never speak about spelling due the way I type).

File management, get headhache suddently, do yo uhave some acide acethysalocylic? .... Aspirin , please?

Look like you promote some stages, or school, do you? File management is not related to that, what isrelated to that is ability to use a mouse (sometimes, late at night after 20 hours of work in front of the puter I do also send thewrong file to the wrongfolder ...).

Anyway if you have advice, why not say them here, in public? The rare time I advice I also do it in public. I can say a mistake, I can presume wrong, and others can correct me, or give complementary advice.

WHY SPEAK IN PM? Selling something? Some courses, seminars? Books?

For the spelling, I apologise, but I am french and I just spend some mnute here, so I try to type as fast as I can. But I really wonder why ask the OP to private you? Make business? lol

[Artisan]

First there is possible to retrieve your files, by using some tools that allow it (I think Norton do that well, but it's not the only one).

The recovery of deleted files from the "Norton Protected Recycle Bin", and similar 'tools', will not work on files that have been deleted prior to the installation of the Norton software.

[sting01]

First there is possible to retrieve your files, by using some tools that allow it (I think Norton do that well, but it's not the only one).

The recovery of deleted files from the "Norton Protected Recycle Bin", and similar 'tools', will not work on files that have been deleted prior to the installation of the Norton software.

That is right, I simply assumed the OP used Norton or something equivalent.

Whatever there is recovery tools who can do that, the limitating factor is WHEN. If you did it 10 days ago and then used to add some data, the files will be revored partially. If you use them just after the deletion, then the recovery will be mostly complete (well, you will retrieve the bytes, so for some applications like excell files you will have to work on a bit).

To make things clear : the basic is a file is never deleted, that is the entry in the registry that is deleted, and then it make the space free. That is magnetic head who read and write, so both operation are performed on the same time (like when we used a tape to record Angie over Smoke on Water in the 70'). So untill you write something in the clusters used by your files, they are just fine. So any tools able to scan in low level your HD will perform just fine also. It's also why the ######ing perverts who used porn child are always caught by the Police, a simple low level examination of their HD scream speaker they are guilty.

[Artisan]

That is right, I simply assumed the OP used Norton or something equivalent.

I can't understand anybody with any computer nouse (NOT mouse ) ever considering to use any of Norton's products.

Also, please can you explain, in layman's language, why the OP shouldn't just reconfigure his auto-cleaner as I suggested? That is such a simple solution to his problem.

[sting01]

That is right, I simply assumed the OP used Norton or something equivalent.

I can't understand anybody with any computer nouse (NOT mouse ) ever considering to use any of Norton's products.

Also, please can you explain, in layman's language, why the OP shouldn't just reconfigure his auto-cleaner as I suggested? That is such a simple solution to his problem.

Layman? What is that? Oooooooooooooooooops are you refering about my barking english? Well, I am sorry, but I am french, so I am not NATIVE speaker (I do love to call native people that are from anglo saxon countries). Anyway sorry to have offended you with my broken blahblah.

To answer your accurate question :

1) I was assuming, but I can be wrong it's a mere supposition of mine. the original poster was in need of that feature (automatic deletion). The main reason that made me supposing that is he DID NOT ask to turn it off, but is calling to have something btw the trashbin and his workingspace (desktop, folder, even Staroffice workingspace).

2) I was also assuming he was needing some explanations (technical) because I felt some posters where trying to take advantage of him and sell hims some useless garbages. It's why I tried (with my barking language I do apologise to WIlliam Shaekspear and William Faulkner) to give him a summary of what happend when a file is deleted, and also give him hope, about a possible resurection (Alleluyah, Miracle, God have bless us) of the files if the problem was not too long ago.

If I shocked you, I am sorry of it, but btw us and with respect I do not care much of it, you will have to live with. If I was technically not correct, then please point EXACTLY where I was not correct, assuming if you were able to read my barking language each and every areable to do the same.

Last point, where did I wrote your solution was not good? I am pissed off by another poster who tried (my feelings) to sell something to the OP. I did not spoken about turning it off, even if I adviced something else because reasons given in point 1.

But the best, if you are not working for an intelligence office, and do not have porn child video, is simply to wipe out that program who do things obviously unwanted, do you need to erase automatically your trash bin?

What part don't you understand? Or is it the reference to porn child abuser? If you are one, sorry but I can not help ... or maybe give you a rope to handg yourself, if you are not, you have to admit I followed your point, and adviced the OP the best is to turn off the automatic. But did you read what I posted? Are you sure?

So, rather than complain because someone think different of you, simply read accuratly what the OP ask (as I use to speak a barking english, I do read 3 times the original post before to answers, that is why in 4 years I merely posted 300 times).

[elkangorito]

Some times I send things to the recycle Bin, by mistake and my auto clean programme emptys the recycle bin along with other things on shutdown, and then its too late to get back the things ive dumped !!,

instead of sending things I '' think " i want to dump to the recycle bin, is there a way I can send the items to say a folder, which will not be autmatically emptyed on shut down by the clean up programme , and at a later date when I am sure I don't want the item I can then delete it from the special folder..? ( or put it back )

Thanks ..... Mumbo

Well Mumbo, you, like most of my clients, end up paying dearly for not understanding 'File Management'. I'm talking about files/folders & how/why they are named plus the understanding of their extensions. I have prescribed a couple of simple rules for my clients when using Windows based systems;

1If you're interested in learning about the essential 'File Management', give me a yell & I'll help you.

Man, it's not WINDOW BASED, that is WINDOW.If you want to speak technical, please be accurate (for exemple I will never speak about spelling due the way I type).

File management, get headhache suddently, do yo uhave some acide acethysalocylic? .... Aspirin , please?

Look like you promote some stages, or school, do you? File management is not related to that, what isrelated to that is ability to use a mouse (sometimes, late at night after 20 hours of work in front of the puter I do also send thewrong file to the wrongfolder ...).

Anyway if you have advice, why not say them here, in public? The rare time I advice I also do it in public. I can say a mistake, I can presume wrong, and others can correct me, or give complementary advice.

WHY SPEAK IN PM? Selling something? Some courses, seminars? Books?

For the spelling, I apologise, but I am french and I just spend some mnute here, so I try to type as fast as I can. But I really wonder why ask the OP to private you? Make business? lol

What, on heavens earth, are you talking about? I didn't PM you!! What is 'speak in PM'? What do you mean? What drug are you on? If you're not on drugs, please get on some.

'Windows based' means any Operating Systems that are Microsoft. Where else is there a 'recycle bin' as such?

You sound like an 'IT expert'. I love 'IT experts'. They give me lots of work & therefore money. I am in constant demand to fix the cock-ups that the 'IT experts' create. As stated before, most of the time these problems occur because people don't know anything about simple File Management. The common 'IT' recommendation is to employ more software to solve a problem that can otherwise be solved with a bit of education...& this usually costs the client considerable $. What you propose is a bit like the yanks sending out 10 000 troups to kill one person...overkill, costly & unnecessary.

Edited April 9, 2006 by elkangorito

[sting01]

Some times I send things to the recycle Bin, by mistake and my auto clean programme emptys the recycle bin along with other things on shutdown, and then its too late to get back the things ive dumped !!,

instead of sending things I '' think " i want to dump to the recycle bin, is there a way I can send the items to say a folder, which will not be autmatically emptyed on shut down by the clean up programme , and at a later date when I am sure I don't want the item I can then delete it from the special folder..? ( or put it back )

Thanks ..... Mumbo

Well Mumbo, you, like most of my clients, end up paying dearly for not understanding 'File Management'. I'm talking about files/folders & how/why they are named plus the understanding of their extensions. I have prescribed a couple of simple rules for my clients when using Windows based systems;

1If you're interested in learning about the essential 'File Management', give me a yell & I'll help you.

Man, it's not WINDOW BASED, that is WINDOW.If you want to speak technical, please be accurate (for exemple I will never speak about spelling due the way I type).

File management, get headhache suddently, do yo uhave some acide acethysalocylic? .... Aspirin , please?

Look like you promote some stages, or school, do you? File management is not related to that, what isrelated to that is ability to use a mouse (sometimes, late at night after 20 hours of work in front of the puter I do also send thewrong file to the wrongfolder ...).

Anyway if you have advice, why not say them here, in public? The rare time I advice I also do it in public. I can say a mistake, I can presume wrong, and others can correct me, or give complementary advice.

WHY SPEAK IN PM? Selling something? Some courses, seminars? Books?

For the spelling, I apologise, but I am french and I just spend some mnute here, so I try to type as fast as I can. But I really wonder why ask the OP to private you? Make business? lol

What, on heavens earth, are you talking about? I didn't PM you!! What is 'speak in PM'? What do you mean? What drug are you on? If you're not on drugs, please get on some.

'Windows based' means any Operating Systems that are Microsoft. Where else is there a 'recycle bin' as such?

You sound like an 'IT expert'. I love 'IT experts'. They give me lots of work & therefore money. I am in constant demand to fix the cock-ups that the 'IT experts' create. As stated before, most of the time these problems occur because people don't know anything about simple File Management. The common 'IT' recommendation is to employ more software to solve a problem that can otherwise be solved with a bit of education...& this usually costs the client considerable $. What you propose is a bit like the yanks sending out 10 000 troups to kill one person...overkill, costly & unnecessary.

About drug, wich one you use? Crack? cocaine?

You wrote that :

If you're interested in learning about the essential 'File Management', give me a yell & I'll help you.

So it mean, if my understanding of english is correct (can be wrong, in case I apologise and will call myself the moron of the week) you ask the OP to send you a private message.

I do NOT think I refered to any private send by you to me, but I refered to YOU asking the OP to private you and start a private conversation. So I supposed it was in purpose to sell him something (like a course or a seminar to learn about file management).

Where did I advice the OP to use more soft? I strongly adviced him to TURN OFF any automatic programs, not to ue more. I also told him (but without given any link or URL because they are commercials and I do not have to advertise for any of them) there is out there program that can retrieve the files ... Did you refute that? Did you refute the technical advice a program able to read an HD at low level will be able to retrieve a file that was just deleted (JUST is a key point, because it's obvious and I explained why, you will not retrieve what you deleted 1 month ago).

So, if you did not understand, it's because I use a barking language. Do you mind if I re explain my point ????????????

1) The OP problem is NOT a 'file management' that name is usually used by the community to refer to something else than an automatic deletion by McAffee.

2) I was supposing, with a very trong feeling, you did not tried to help out the OP, but simply tried to sell some course or seminar of yours that will be certainly great for the OP general culture but useless on that point.

3) I strongly advice to not affirm a second time I am a drug addict, or if you do so , please remenber that arab saying : there is only the mountains that never meet. Trying to get new clients is fair, I used to do so 4 years when I started, now thanks God I have enought. Insulting people because they say something different of you is not the same game.

And yes , firmly I still advice you to give your advice on that case here, in public. If it''s your business, show us how competent your are. I tried to help out, but I can be wrong. But I tried to help out in front of all, with the risk to be called moron, so do the same, if not, watch your mouth and keep insult for you, insult only show you are not able to have a technical discussion on that topic, and then lead people to have doubt on your main capacity to handle a very simple and basic problem.

P.S. My spelling is horrible because I am not NATIVE english, not because I am stupid, or drunk. So no arguement on it, anyway even with bad spelling, what I wrote was clear enought to make you complain

Regards lol

[sting01]

Not finish with you,

'Windows based' means any Operating Systems that are Microsoft. Where else is there a 'recycle bin' as such?

WRONG and INACCURATE.

Windows based means .... windows based, or if you prefer, an Operanting System that will use the core (or main)features of windows + something else. Lindows is the exemple that come to my mind.

So, rather that use wording that are non accurate, you should make things simple.

You simply have some clues on the subject, maybe because you used to type several letters with MsWord or something, but please do not use technical wording that irrelevant.

And if you disagree, you will have to show us where Microsoft qualify win 95 or 98 or Me or XP as ' Windows based Operanting System'? Or maybe you are more qualified than them on that subject also?

[Artisan]

Layman? What is that? Oooooooooooooooooops are you refering about my barking english? Well, I am sorry, but I am french, so I am not NATIVE speaker (I do love to call native people that are from anglo saxon countries). Anyway sorry to have offended you with my broken blahblah.

To answer your accurate question :

1) I was assuming, but I can be wrong it's a mere supposition of mine. the original poster was in need of that feature (automatic deletion).

2) I was also assuming he was needing some explanations (technical) because I felt some posters where trying to take advantage of him and sell hims some useless garbages.

If I shocked you, I am sorry of it, but btw us and with respect I do not care much of it, you will have to live with.

Last point, where did I wrote your solution was not good? I am pissed off by another poster who tried (my feelings) to sell something to the OP.

Oh Mr. Sting, I hope that we haven’t touched a raw nerve. I’m not referring to your English and I wish that I could write, and speak I’m sure, French as well as you can with the English language. I’m impressed with your linguistic skills and I have taken no offence nor am I shocked at all. More than that, I am an amateur when it comes to understanding computers and how they work. I know what I know and I don’t pretend to know anything else.

Having said that, maybe you have taken offence where there was none intended and over-reacted to the comments so far. Yes, you never critisised my solution or wrote that it wasn’t any good, but nor did you write to say that it would be worthwhile trying. For the purposes of the OP, it is the simplest solution…in layman’s terms.

To help you understand my previous post, “Layman’s language” means putting it in simplified or non-technical terms. Unlike you, apparently, many of us are ‘laymen’ (or non-professionals) and can learn only from simple explanations.

The OP isn’t in need of an automatic deletion feature…he has one already but I assume that he is unaware how to configure it so as not to delete the contents of the recycle bin on shutdown. Why do you say that some are trying to take advantage of him and sell his some useless garbage? I haven’t detected that in this topic so far….and who has tried to sell what to whom?

[sting01]

I apologise to have been quite rude or aggresive. Mostly I get problems because my languages skills, and my typing (fingers dislexia, or kinda sort of).

Let say also I was upset about another poster acting, and I obviously over reacted.

Yes your solution is the most evident, I do agree. I suggested another one and given some details (technical) in more. Both solutions can be used on the same time. Or only one of them, or another solution ...

About selling, as I wander here since a bit of time, I noticed some patterns from people who do business. One is to say they know, not precise in public, but ask people to contact them. The wording used is always hightly technical, but mostly irrelevant. For exemple a person with basic skills with Front page will always call him 'Web designer' ... Another exemple is to speak about Windows based ... sound great, but the OP (as I ) use Windows (XP I presume, or 98 ..) not Lindow who is the only window based operanting system that I know. More, I never hear any technician, engineers or MS specialists speak about windows based operanting system when refering to windows. Mac , Linux, BeOS and other (Minix, Atari ....) have different way to handle the file system (that is one feature of Linux that allow to format a partition for the file system you need).

If I ask someone to speak with me in private, it's because I do not need other hear what I will say, if not I will simply (as you did) post in the forum. So I guess the guy tried to abuse (strong word I agree) of the OP, and just would like to warn the OP. And it was not related to you at all, but it given me nerve because I have that way of acting. That is a forum for help, not to made money. I got help here 4 years ago, I feel like a moral obligation to return that help, when I have time.

Edited April 9, 2006 by sting01

[JSixpack]

is there a way I can send the items to say a folder, which will not be autmatically emptyed on shut down by the clean up programme , and at a later date when I am sure I don't want the item I can then delete it from the special folder..? ( or put it back )

Thanks ..... Mumbo

Yes, very easily through your right-click context menu.

First, create the container folder, say, C:\Junk. Then, create a shortcut to it, and place that shortcut in your C:\Documents and Settings\<User Name>\SendTo folder, where <User Name> is your user name. Immediately thereafter, when you right-click on a file, you will see the name of your container folder in the Send To submenu of the context menu. After you send it, you can then delete it knowing that you have a copy saved.

If you need greater flexibility, download http://www.veign.com/downloads/reg_hacks/tofolder.zip, which has a simple registry file. Unzip it and click on the .reg file to add a Copy To and Move To file dialogue option to your right-click context menu. If you want to avoid clicking and scrolling to find your container folder in the file dialogues, you could map the container folder to a drive letter as described here:

http://techrepublic.com.com/5100-10877_11-...ag=feed&subj=tr

Another very different solution would involve your shutdown routine: just before you automatically empty the recycle bin, automatically copy all the files therein to another folder.

Finally, if you don't use your computer much after a deletion, you may be able to recover a deleted file with such free tools as Restoration:

http://www.snapfiles.com/get/restoration.html

or PC Inspector:

http://www.pcinspector.de/file_recovery/uk/download.htm

[elkangorito]

Dear oh dear! It appears that 'give me a yell' was suddenly converted to' PM me'. Anyone can 'give me a yell' simply by asking ME a question...whether it be PM or not. I don't care either way.

As for the other complicated methods, all I can say is that it is obviously more than '2 keystrokes' to action such an idea. If this is the case, which it obviously is, then why not spend the extra 2 joules of energy reqiured to learn about the 'rocket science' (NOT!) of File Management? This is very simple & will save 'one' a whole lot of time. The 'law of conservation of energy' says quite implicitly that you never get something for nothing.

If one is foolish enough to TOTALLY rely upon automatic programs to 'tidy up' their computer, then one will be, sooner or later, in big trouble. With computers, there are simply some 'things' that you cannot escape doing. File Management skills will resolve most of the problems encountered in this respect. Yes, one does have to do some work if computers are to operate according to one's needs.

[sting01]

Dear oh dear! It appears that 'give me a yell' was suddenly converted to' PM me'. Anyone can 'give me a yell' simply by asking ME a question...whether it be PM or not. I don't care either way.

As for the other complicated methods, all I can say is that it is obviously more than '2 keystrokes' to action such an idea. If this is the case, which it obviously is, then why not spend the extra 2 joules of energy reqiured to learn about the 'rocket science' (NOT!) of File Management? This is very simple & will save 'one' a whole lot of time. The 'law of conservation of energy' says quite implicitly that you never get something for nothing.

If one is foolish enough to TOTALLY rely upon automatic programs to 'tidy up' their computer, then one will be, sooner or later, in big trouble. With computers, there are simply some 'things' that you cannot escape doing. File Management skills will resolve most of the problems encountered in this respect. Yes, one does have to do some work if computers are to operate according to one's needs.

So I was wrong, I got you wrong and I apologise. It seems yesterday I was more trying to spead/throw my mood than trying to understand other. My bad, apologise again.

On the other hand, and to show I was not drunk or something, I have to precise since some weeks, I do not stop to get propositions for various IT seminars, all related to the basis of programming. So it mean several people are trying to scam, the pricing of those seminars are around 35 k , and that is scam when you read what will be teaching.

Then I did a wrong merging, btw your ;give me a yell, that is a legitimate way to speak (first time I see that word, so I supposed it was a slang for PM), and those scams.

P.S. Just got another one, from Natthakan@zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz, so if you think my explanation is buggy, just let me know and will send it to you by PM.

Anyway it was 3 month I did not come here, maybe better if I do not come the next 3 month lol (rather than to be aggresive with others). Sorry againfor the rudeness, even if I still claim there is nothing to deal with file management (notice you did not address the technical points I gived, but due the impolitness I had I will not bother about that)

Best regards

Apologise to the OP and other posters.

[JSixpack]

Anyone can 'give me a yell' simply by asking ME a question...whether it be PM or not.

Which you said many posts ago. We're all well aware now of your very valuable expertise waiting in the wings. You've already tossed out two astonishing examples:

1) Read 'top left to bottom right' of each open window

2) If in doubt, right click.

So now, isn't it about time for you to sit back and wait for the queries to roll in?

Why not spend the extra 2 joules of energy reqiured to learn about the 'rocket science' (NOT!) of File Management?

Having to skip over your tiresome huffing and puffing has already exhausted any extra 2 joules that you think might be needed to listen to your opinion. Hence why not spend 2 of your own by just posting your precious little nut in public here, as sting02 has already called for in vain, and so get it out of the way, hopefully once and for all? And thereafter no one need "yell" and you won't be overwhelmed with huge numbers of desperate queries by those who are currently paying dearly for not consulting you.

And we may then just paste in the URL of this thread whenever anyone has one of "most problems" and note that you have already given the solution.

Yes, one does have to do some work if computers are to operate according to one's needs.

Yes ma'am. But, oddly, the question here is, what work is it? Now, rather than schoolmarm, could you please, please just finally give out some useful information here in this particular technical discussion? Otherwise, I think most of us would appreciate it if you'd buzz off and make money meeting your constant demand for fixing cock-ups caused by IT experts, Accountants, Computer Scientists, Financial Officers, Management Consultants, Welfare Workers, Politicians, and whomever else may on the blacklist. Rest assured that we'll give a yell as needed!

[sting01]

Anyone can 'give me a yell' simply by asking ME a question...whether it be PM or not.

Which you said many posts ago. We're all well aware now of your very valuable expertise waiting in the wings. You've already tossed out two astonishing examples:

1) Read 'top left to bottom right' of each open window

2) If in doubt, right click.

So now, isn't it about time for you to sit back and wait for the queries to roll in?

Why not spend the extra 2 joules of energy reqiured to learn about the 'rocket science' (NOT!) of File Management?

Having to skip over your tiresome huffing and puffing has already exhausted any extra 2 joules that you think might be needed to listen to your opinion. Hence why not spend 2 of your own by just posting your precious little nut in public here, as sting02 has already called for in vain, and so get it out of the way, hopefully once and for all? And thereafter no one need "yell" and you won't be overwhelmed with huge numbers of desperate queries by those who are currently paying dearly for not consulting you.

And we may then just paste in the URL of this thread whenever anyone has one of "most problems" and note that you have already given the solution.

Yes, one does have to do some work if computers are to operate according to one's needs.

Yes ma'am. But, oddly, the question here is, what work is it? Now, rather than schoolmarm, could you please, please just finally give out some useful information here in this particular technical discussion? Otherwise, I think most of us would appreciate it if you'd buzz off and make money meeting your constant demand for fixing cock-ups caused by IT experts, Accountants, Computer Scientists, Financial Officers, Management Consultants, Welfare Workers, Politicians, and whomever else may on the blacklist. Rest assured that we'll give a yell as needed!

Sound like I was not the only to misunderstood and to raise intterrogation.. I dream one day I will be able to have this mastering in english language.

[Artisan]

Having to skip over your tiresome huffing and puffing has already exhausted any extra 2 joules that you think might be needed to listen to your opinion. Hence why not spend 2 of your own by just posting your precious little nut in public here.

And we may then just paste in the URL of this thread whenever anyone has one of "most problems" and note that you have already given the solution.

Yes ma'am. But, oddly, the question here is, what work is it? Now, rather than schoolmarm, could you please, please just finally give out some useful information here in this particular technical discussion? Otherwise, I think most of us would appreciate it if you'd buzz off and make money meeting your constant demand for fixing cock-ups caused by IT experts, Accountants, Computer Scientists, Financial Officers, Management Consultants, Welfare Workers, Politicians, and whomever else may on the blacklist. Rest assured that we'll give a yell as needed!

Great!!! Well said JSixpack.....he's full of himself, isn't he?

Edited April 11, 2006 by Artisan

[elkangorito]

Anyone can 'give me a yell' simply by asking ME a question...whether it be PM or not.

Which you said many posts ago. We're all well aware now of your very valuable expertise waiting in the wings. You've already tossed out two astonishing examples:

1) Read 'top left to bottom right' of each open window

2) If in doubt, right click.

So now, isn't it about time for you to sit back and wait for the queries to roll in?

Why not spend the extra 2 joules of energy reqiured to learn about the 'rocket science' (NOT!) of File Management?

Having to skip over your tiresome huffing and puffing has already exhausted any extra 2 joules that you think might be needed to listen to your opinion. Hence why not spend 2 of your own by just posting your precious little nut in public here, as sting02 has already called for in vain, and so get it out of the way, hopefully once and for all? And thereafter no one need "yell" and you won't be overwhelmed with huge numbers of desperate queries by those who are currently paying dearly for not consulting you.

And we may then just paste in the URL of this thread whenever anyone has one of "most problems" and note that you have already given the solution.

Yes, one does have to do some work if computers are to operate according to one's needs.

Yes ma'am. But, oddly, the question here is, what work is it? Now, rather than schoolmarm, could you please, please just finally give out some useful information here in this particular technical discussion? Otherwise, I think most of us would appreciate it if you'd buzz off and make money meeting your constant demand for fixing cock-ups caused by IT experts, Accountants, Computer Scientists, Financial Officers, Management Consultants, Welfare Workers, Politicians, and whomever else may on the blacklist. Rest assured that we'll give a yell as needed!

Dear JSixpack, where are your technical explanations upon how to solve these problems? All you seem to do is to refer people to other websites! I use the example of the "Computer Has Slowed Down" post, in which you do nothing but argue against my ideas without much technical explanation whatsoever. In this instance, you resort to using other websites ,which I proved to be flawed.

And again, in this post, you fail to provide any technical retort to my idea.

I'll happily let my idea stand but if you value your own advice, please provide some 'real advice' of 'your own.'

By the way, I am perfectly willing & able to provide all the necessary details to back up my ideas. If 'File Management' needs to be explained, I'll be happy to do so (lengthy as it may be). Maybe you would be better off providing REAL support instead of wasting your time trying to belittle me.

Also, I do not have an ulterior motive about 'selling' something. I 'do not/will not' gain monetarily from my postings.

As for 'sting01', your apologies are completely accepted.

[sting01]

Quietly and without any argument, could you please point on your solutions?

You spoked about file management, obviously that word is mis used, or maybe better used with a different meaning that the one used by any professional.

Does 'yell' can be counted as technical advice?

Where have you give a concrete, real, technically understandable solution? I do agree 'read from top left to bottom right' is a good advice, but is it accurate on that case? Are you sure McAfee display always from top left to bootom right, or simply a list to read from top to bottom (McAffee is an exemple).

Other posters have give advice, you simply said their advice were crap (I make short a long story) and invited the OP to contact you because you know best ... I am still waiting your technical expertise on that main subject, or maybe some thought about the deletion, or the clusters management by any OS?

Btw us , and to explain those who did not know, file management is used mostly to describe how an OS handle the file system. I also precise, because people can be confuse, file system is NOT system file. System file is a file (amongst thousands of other file) that is inherent to the OS. File system is how a given OS put the file on a storage device (floppy, HD) , how that device is organised, how he will recover the fiels when needed .....

So speak technic, there is no problem, as I am an IT guy, and like you seems to not really estimate IT guy know much, please enlight me, enlight us , and post in public what are your solutions, comments , ideas .

Today I am okie, I do not try to flame you, I just ask. I am still young enought to learn, if you have something to teach.

[elkangorito]

Quietly and without any argument, could you please point on your solutions?

You spoked about file management, obviously that word is mis used, or maybe better used with a different meaning that the one used by any professional.

Does 'yell' can be counted as technical advice?

Where have you give a concrete, real, technically understandable solution? I do agree 'read from top left to bottom right' is a good advice, but is it accurate on that case? Are you sure McAfee display always from top left to bootom right, or simply a list to read from top to bottom (McAffee is an exemple).

Other posters have give advice, you simply said their advice were crap (I make short a long story) and invited the OP to contact you because you know best ... I am still waiting your technical expertise on that main subject, or maybe some thought about the deletion, or the clusters management by any OS?

Btw us , and to explain those who did not know, file management is used mostly to describe how an OS handle the file system. I also precise, because people can be confuse, file system is NOT system file. System file is a file (amongst thousands of other file) that is inherent to the OS. File system is how a given OS put the file on a storage device (floppy, HD) , how that device is organised, how he will recover the fiels when needed .....

So speak technic, there is no problem, as I am an IT guy, and like you seems to not really estimate IT guy know much, please enlight me, enlight us , and post in public what are your solutions, comments , ideas .

Today I am okie, I do not try to flame you, I just ask. I am still young enought to learn, if you have something to teach.

Hi Sting,

Firstly, "give me a yell" means the same as "notify me", "let me know", "speak to me if you want".

Now about this mysterious thing called 'File Management'. It is simply the management of files upon a computer. Those who know how to create directories (Folders) & understand the 8 x 3 file naming rule will not need to learn this (later Microsoft OS's allow for 64 x 3 & even 256 x 3 file rules).

My suggestion is simple...if one is able to organise their files into logical arrangements, then many problems will be minimised. Those who do not understand 'File Management' are the ones who don't understand where to install programs etc. For example, if someone who doesn't understand about 'File Management' & is adding a new program to their computer & is presented with a 'Destination Folder' question, the "C:\programs\Partition Magic" will mean nothing. Consequently, these people click "ok" or "yes", which allows the program to be installed to 'C' drive. If one has had their hard drive wisely partitioned, then it is very wise to know what to do when presented with the question, "Destination Folder". Surprisingly, MANY people do not know how to change the 'destination folder'. The chances are, if they don't know how to do this simple thing, they will also not understand anything about files & their extensions. As an example, one of my clients called me because she could not access a document. I told her that I would charge her $100 to help her & she said ok. When I arrived at her place, I found that a file extension had changed from "doc" to "dot" (due to a lack of awareness about 'file management'). The problem was that she could not see the file thaty she thought she had saved. I found the file & renamed it, & then was able to 'normally' access it. I did not charge the person but I did advise them to learn about files & their management. The person asked me to teach them, which I did (for free), & they have told me that they now not only feel that they have control over their files but the "computer works better with less problems". They also now know WHERE to put their files & how to create directory (folder) structures, which was unknown to them before. Since their HDD was sensibly partitioned (I did it), they now know where to place their new programs, which requires 2 keystrokes (1 delete keystroke & adding an 'E'). 6 months later I was called back to this persons house to do some upgrades. This was a lie because when I arrived, I was presented with a large sum of money (which I refused) for not only teaching them about 'File Management' but preventing many problems happening with their computer. You see, once they knew all about files, they were able to recognise possible virus attacks (recognition of file extensions) & able to place files in the correct location, which reduced the need to de-fragment the drive(s) (especially 'C' drive). This also enabled them to back-up their critical data quickly & easily.

If one insists upon using 1 logical drive & therefore the cluster sizes will be larger, the amount of wasted space increases (slack) dramatically increases & fragmentation will be very apparent...especially if one uses the same drive for the 'page file' (understanding 'File Management' will make this realisation apparent & real).

As for the "read top left to bottom right" rule, if one abides by this rule, then one will not miss what a program is trying to tell them. Most people are lazy & simply refuse to read the detail. This invariably leads to things like, "I installed my anti virus program but I still got infected. This program is no good". Generally, in this case, the program 'default' settings did not allow for the checking of compressed files &/or only allowed for a 'smart' scan, which did not scan every file. The user failed to 'setup' the program properly because they simply did not bother to click on every tab &/or check every option. The "read top left to bottom right" rule helps here.

Most problems that people have with computers are easily solved but not without the user "learning" something or having to do something. THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A FULLY AUTOMATIC COMPUTER. I'm sure you'll agree. The user DOES have responsibilities, which are unavoidable. Adding a multitude of "fix it" programs usually spells disaster for the unknowledgable computer user. Much the same with cars etc.

I hope that you can understand what I'm trying to say.

[Beachcomber]

QUOTE

Also, please can you explain, in layman's language, why the OP shouldn't just reconfigure his auto-cleaner as I suggested? That is such a simple solution to his problem.

Right On

I have used various “cleaners” and they all had a configuration option – just un-check the Bin option.

Easy Peasy no need for any technical knowledge.

[sting01]

QUOTE

Also, please can you explain, in layman's language, why the OP shouldn't just reconfigure his auto-cleaner as I suggested? That is such a simple solution to his problem.

Right On

I have used various “cleaners” and they all had a configuration option – just un-check the Bin option.

Easy Peasy no need for any technical knowledge.

I do agree it's the easiestway to do ... but read what the OP was looking for. If someone need to buy a ford mustang cabriolet, why try to sell him a japanese car on the ground it's cheaper and use less oil? Just that, but yes, un check the automatic cleaning is the easiest way to go, and the most secure too, I fully agree

[Artisan]

I do agree it's the easiestway to do ... but read what the OP was looking for. If someone need to buy a ford mustang cabriolet, why try to sell him a japanese car on the ground it's cheaper and use less oil? Just that, but yes, un check the automatic cleaning is the easiest way to go, and the most secure too, I fully agree

Wow, agreement at last eh?..... after all that huffing and puffing between the pair of you. Mumbo, the OP, didn't really appreciate that he could configure his auto-cleaner to NOT empty the Recycle Bin. Instead, he thought that he would look for an alternative whereas his existing software was adequate.

A Ford Mustang Cabriolet give me a Japanese Lexus SC 430 any day.....and many other Japanese cars.

Lexus SC 430

[sting01]

I do agree it's the easiestway to do ... but read what the OP was looking for. If someone need to buy a ford mustang cabriolet, why try to sell him a japanese car on the ground it's cheaper and use less oil? Just that, but yes, un check the automatic cleaning is the easiest way to go, and the most secure too, I fully agree

Wow, agreement at last eh?..... after all that huffing and puffing between the pair of you. Mumbo, the OP, didn't really appreciate that he could configure his auto-cleaner to NOT empty the Recycle Bin. Instead, he thought that he would look for an alternative whereas his existing software was adequate.

A Ford Mustang Cabriolet give me a Japanese Lexus SC 430 any day.....and many other Japanese cars.

Lexus SC 430

Well Artisan I do agree as I agree also with you , the huffing puffing meli melo was with another poster (got the same about electricity with the same poster).

It's obvious if a prog do not do what I expected I will or modify the settings, or remove it. As I am lazy and affraid by things that I can not control I do prefer to remove.

I used Ford mustang, because I am not skilled in recent cars, so I used the first old model name who came in my mind (could have use citroen ligier, or alpha romeo Montreal for exemple, but I wonder how many will know it, or have ever see it)

[sting01]

Quietly and without any argument, could you please point on your solutions?

You spoked about file management, obviously that word is mis used, or maybe better used with a different meaning that the one used by any professional.

Does 'yell' can be counted as technical advice?

Where have you give a concrete, real, technically understandable solution? I do agree 'read from top left to bottom right' is a good advice, but is it accurate on that case? Are you sure McAfee display always from top left to bootom right, or simply a list to read from top to bottom (McAffee is an exemple).

Other posters have give advice, you simply said their advice were crap (I make short a long story) and invited the OP to contact you because you know best ... I am still waiting your technical expertise on that main subject, or maybe some thought about the deletion, or the clusters management by any OS?

Btw us , and to explain those who did not know, file management is used mostly to describe how an OS handle the file system. I also precise, because people can be confuse, file system is NOT system file. System file is a file (amongst thousands of other file) that is inherent to the OS. File system is how a given OS put the file on a storage device (floppy, HD) , how that device is organised, how he will recover the fiels when needed .....

So speak technic, there is no problem, as I am an IT guy, and like you seems to not really estimate IT guy know much, please enlight me, enlight us , and post in public what are your solutions, comments , ideas .

Today I am okie, I do not try to flame you, I just ask. I am still young enought to learn, if you have something to teach.

Hi Sting,

Firstly, "give me a yell" means the same as "notify me", "let me know", "speak to me if you want".

Now about this mysterious thing called 'File Management'. It is simply the management of files upon a computer. Those who know how to create directories (Folders) & understand the 8 x 3 file naming rule will not need to learn this (later Microsoft OS's allow for 64 x 3 & even 256 x 3 file rules).

My suggestion is simple...if one is able to organise their files into logical arrangements, then many problems will be minimised. Those who do not understand 'File Management' are the ones who don't understand where to install programs etc. For example, if someone who doesn't understand about 'File Management' & is adding a new program to their computer & is presented with a 'Destination Folder' question, the "C:\programs\Partition Magic" will mean nothing. Consequently, these people click "ok" or "yes", which allows the program to be installed to 'C' drive. If one has had their hard drive wisely partitioned, then it is very wise to know what to do when presented with the question, "Destination Folder". Surprisingly, MANY people do not know how to change the 'destination folder'. The chances are, if they don't know how to do this simple thing, they will also not understand anything about files & their extensions. As an example, one of my clients called me because she could not access a document. I told her that I would charge her $100 to help her & she said ok. When I arrived at her place, I found that a file extension had changed from "doc" to "dot" (due to a lack of awareness about 'file management'). The problem was that she could not see the file thaty she thought she had saved. I found the file & renamed it, & then was able to 'normally' access it. I did not charge the person but I did advise them to learn about files & their management. The person asked me to teach them, which I did (for free), & they have told me that they now not only feel that they have control over their files but the "computer works better with less problems". They also now know WHERE to put their files & how to create directory (folder) structures, which was unknown to them before. Since their HDD was sensibly partitioned (I did it), they now know where to place their new programs, which requires 2 keystrokes (1 delete keystroke & adding an 'E'). 6 months later I was called back to this persons house to do some upgrades. This was a lie because when I arrived, I was presented with a large sum of money (which I refused) for not only teaching them about 'File Management' but preventing many problems happening with their computer. You see, once they knew all about files, they were able to recognise possible virus attacks (recognition of file extensions) & able to place files in the correct location, which reduced the need to de-fragment the drive(s) (especially 'C' drive). This also enabled them to back-up their critical data quickly & easily.

If one insists upon using 1 logical drive & therefore the cluster sizes will be larger, the amount of wasted space increases (slack) dramatically increases & fragmentation will be very apparent...especially if one uses the same drive for the 'page file' (understanding 'File Management' will make this realisation apparent & real).

As for the "read top left to bottom right" rule, if one abides by this rule, then one will not miss what a program is trying to tell them. Most people are lazy & simply refuse to read the detail. This invariably leads to things like, "I installed my anti virus program but I still got infected. This program is no good". Generally, in this case, the program 'default' settings did not allow for the checking of compressed files &/or only allowed for a 'smart' scan, which did not scan every file. The user failed to 'setup' the program properly because they simply did not bother to click on every tab &/or check every option. The "read top left to bottom right" rule helps here.

Most problems that people have with computers are easily solved but not without the user "learning" something or having to do something. THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A FULLY AUTOMATIC COMPUTER. I'm sure you'll agree. The user DOES have responsibilities, which are unavoidable. Adding a multitude of "fix it" programs usually spells disaster for the unknowledgable computer user. Much the same with cars etc.

I hope that you can understand what I'm trying to say.

First, and without trying to flame or insult everyone, that not every people who is anglo saxon. To explain what I mean I will say the following :

In the midle of the 90, a 'young couple' (40 y old) of american university professors bought a Villa in Cogolin (france, Var). Those people were well educated and not moron. One day they called my boss to ask for technician, they had problem with the eletectric line (some appliances were working, some others not).

As I was the only one to speak english I was sent, even if my rates (hourly fees) were obviously at this time higher than a technician. When arrive I found in 1 mn the problem ... the maid unplunged the TV to use the vacuum, and forgot to replug. As I was laughting out like crazed, the husband explained me that was normal reaction in USA. They touch nothing but pay someone to do it.

I know there is people out there who know nothing, who do not need to now nothing, and are ready to pay to have the feeling they got 'by miracle' a bit a knowledge. What you describe, and now I get your concept, is trully common is anglo saxon culture. In mine it's still uncommon, and I always react against that. Knowledge must be allowed to each and every, but they have to learn to get the knowledge. For exemple, a true hacker will never give you a tool that will hack the CIA website, nor even give you a step by step to do it, but he/she will more point you on several documentation that point out on the potential flaws and how to exploits those flaws. Then up to you to understand, think and act. I am alas not clevert enought to be like Michnick, but I like that way to act.

For exemple, you speak about clusters and partioning, I agree on the general idea, but what is the roof and the top? Mean what size a give Microsoft OS is hable to optimatly use, and what size is always relvant? And then what is the actual average size for a HD?

For all MS OS, 5 GB is the good size, for XP it's indeed 10 Gb, after that the clusters size will simply increase and you will lost in fact storage capacity. Why? because there is only a given and limitate amount of clusters that can be handle by a given OS. But Right now, the size of an HD is often superior at 80 Gb, so it mean you should have 8 partitions, or 25 in case of of 250 Gb, quite uneasy to handle by normal user. So here also, rules are sometimes only the medium way. In the case to advice someone to do partition, you have to clearly know what the person will do (if storage of movies get by bitlord, a huge partition of 200 Gb can be the best), the rest could be a small for XP itself, and 2 medium for various programs. Aother case will mean another approach and maybe a different solution. But there is no technical in those approach, but simply pratical mean make it easy for someone who understand nib to computer. The difference is you use a pseudo technical language to make yourclient confortable and let them thought they are suddenlty became clevert like Bill, me I will simply tell them I do not speak english enought to explain and give them the relevant links to the RFC, or the Microsoft online documentation. Up to them to read and understand.

Why that? Knowledge is power, and without knowledge , you are powerless. If you think you know, you will never try to understand, but claim "Oh yes I know , it's .....". So I really hope when I do that, people will at least read, and will try to understand, so get some knowlege. At least the kind of knowledge as describe by Sire Roger Bacon, by opposition of the Aristote definition of knowledge (mean they will at least know clusters are describe and discussed somewhere in Microsoft online documentation).

Should I have wrote ' Real knowledge mean real power' ? But I will never use pseudo technical blahblah just to make people happy. So for me there is no 'file management' involved, nor the .doc to .dot involved, in the late case the problem was the person got a third party sofware (mostly unwanted) that did that for unfriendly reasons (even staroffice do not modify the extension, and they are hidden by default in every Microsoft OS, and the modification of them when using a X OS (Sun or Linux) will have little impact. but I will tease the person and assuming the computer was used to surf some weird websites (porn or illegal games). I will also warn the person about the danger of unprotected relations (condom for safe sex, norton for safe net ... lol).And not call it file management. A white cat is a white cat, and a shit floating in a dark canal is only a shit floating in a dark canal. IRL as they use to say in IRC channels.