Buying a second hand car - What do you check ?

[kaizoku]

The short story :

- What do you check on a second hand car ?

=> If you don't want to read about my life you can stop here and answer

The less short story :

I'm prety lame with car as I have very little interest in it.

I read a lot on this forum about the fact that second hand car are overpriced and it's better to buy a new one ... but I don't have the million bath it cost so no choices.

So now I'm prospecting to buy a second hand car.

While prospecting I noticed that almost all the cars looks great, they are very good to make the outside (and all visible) looks perfect, but what about the engine ?

When I see a car, first I check the price range, if it's ok then I look at the kilometers.

Here is my problem as I really don't know if they cheated the meter or not.

My common sens tell me to avoid 12yo car with only 50/100K km, but no more clue.

Someone tell me to check for oil leaks, but usualy you won't see any at the shop.

Then they turn on the engine ... and it's just mean nothing to me.

I'm asking all this because my budget allow me only a 10 yo car minimun.

My price range is 250/300k I'm looking for a Isuzu (grand) adventure or toyota sport rider, or any 4 door SUV with a caryboy.

I'm also interested in a cheeroke or an old pajero (90's) but it's imposible to find one under 200k km

Thanks for your advices.

Edited August 13, 2013 by kaizoku

[Phronesis]

That is has a blue book. And pay for car at the transport office ONLY after the staff have accepted all of the vendors paperwork.

Mechanical issues are almost a non issue given the low cost of parts and repairs here for the older models.

Electrical issues can be more problematic as it is hard to find anyone that has the skill to diagnose a problem, or the willingness to try.

If you are in Phuket PM me and I can come along with you to help you to inspect an older car if you want.

[jombom]

Sorry, but if you don't know what to look for, then there is really no point in answering. I normally check many things and build a picture based on the kms and year of the car ---- i.e. what is realistic wear and tear ---- if something does not fit ---- walk away.

Check all the alignments between wings and openings such as doors, boot, bonnet etc. They are all correct when leaving the factory. If they are not equispaced and parallel, chances are the car has been crashed ---- walk away.

[WarpSpeed]

One tell tale sign of higher mileage then posted is the rubbers on the peddles, if they're worn through, definitely more than 100,000 miles, then go from there on how much rubber is worn off to get a better idea of additional mileage, (small amount, large, amount etc.) this trick takes a lot of observation & empirical experience to determine and approximate, it's not as much about mileage but it's just much about determining the honesty of the people you're dealing with instead of actual mileage..

Edited August 13, 2013 by WarpSpeed

[Skint]

There are plenty chariots to choose from at that money, there are too many things to check, flood damage, panel alignment, knocks and rattles, if you don't have a clue best get someone to go with you otherwise you potentially could be out of pocket. perhaps look at 4 door pickups aswell cheaper than SUV's.

[bkkjames]

One could imagine that a car with 50k on it from Bangkok would be more worn than an equiv one say upcountry somewhere?

Sitting / starting and stopping / crawling in traffic 2x a day in Bangkok won't show on the odometer.

How many previous owners of the car? The more the less-merrier.

Many people privately 'rent' out newer models for a few years then sell them off - but might only say 'one owner'. Not saying that makes them bad cars but...

Is it common practice to take your prospective ride in for a DR's check-up at a dealer before going all in?

No wonder everyone wants new I suppose - only have to worry about recalls and lemonade

[tingtong]

i also think that odometer doesnt give much indication necesserily...100k highway miles not equal to 100k city miles.

2 things:

choose an older model that was popular ( here, not your country home!)...so you will have enough spare parts and repairman who might know better what to do. ie. no Mitsu Pajero, rather the Toyota Sport Rider.

take the car to a testdrive, and not just around the house (if in the city) but for 10 min or so at least...to get a feel how it drives, if the engine has enough power...

my 24yrs old 500.000km Toyota pickup drove better testing it then some others, even with 200.000km less on the clock...

or see, once was to buy a minibus, just to find that the good looking second hand bugger couldnt hit 60km/h on highway, good that was the testdrive, right? of course, till 50 ( in city) seem to drive normal enough, engine starts of course, looked in good shape...

as another little sign for a no-no: check the tires...not meaning they are too worn ( they usually are), but found often they arent even matching...ie 3 different kind on a car = no proper care, for me.

oh, and a final one: dont rush yourself. it takes some frogs to kiss to find a prince(ss)

[mogandave]

A lot of good advice: pedal wear, steering wheel wear, seat wear, how the panels line-up, buy a popular model, beware of new paint etc.

Try to make sure it is complete. On a 10 year old vehicle any number of things might be missing, and it may have a bastard engine of some kind. Beware of crappy wiring, torn up dash, torn up radiator, missing gages etc. If it looks hokey, it if probably not original. Buying used, the more original it is, the better off you will be.

Check to make sure everything is working, windows, AC, lights, radio, gages, e-lights, mirrors, defrost reverse, all the gears, etc.

Overspray in the wheel wells or engine compartment, different colors in the door jambs or under scratches, flaking or peeling paint, rust, all are things to beware of.

That said, just because a car has been wrecked or painted does not mean you should not buy it. Many cars that old will have some body work, which is fine, but what is important is the quality of the work, and how long ago it was done. Feel the body with your fingertips, don’t just look at it. You can feel a lot more than you can see, particularly if the paint is dull.

Nothing like driving it. Take it through all the gears, check to see if the clutch slips (I would not buy a 10 year old automatic here) brakes good, steering tight, etc. If they will not let you drive it, don’t buy it.

All that said, this may sound silly, but don’t buy something just because it’s cheap. Buy something you like the look and feel of, and are happy to drive. You are going to have to dump money into it at some point, and it is much nicer spending money on something you like then something you don’t like. Would you buy a shirt you did not like because it was cheap?

[kaizoku]

Thank you guys for your advices.

Here is my personal synthesis.

• Ask to see the blue book
• Ask for how many previous owners of the car. The less the better.
• Pay for car at the transport office ONLY after the staff have accepted all paperwork. (is this possible ?)
• Check all the alignments between wings and openings such as doors, boot, bonnet etc. They are all correct when leaving the factory. If they are not equispaced and parallel, chances are the car has been crashed.
• Check the rubbers on the peddles - it give you an idea about the honesty of the people you're dealing with
• Choose an older model that was popular so you will have enough spare parts and repairman who might know better what to do.
• take the car to a test-drive, for 10 min or so at least to get a feel how it drives, if the engine has enough power.
• If they will not let you drive it, don’t buy it.
• Check if the tires matching (ie 3 different kind on a car = no proper care).
• Check everything is working, windows, AC, lights, radio, gages, e-lights, mirrors, defrost reverse, all the gears.
• Check for overspray in the wheel wells or engine compartment, different colors in the door jambs or under scratches, flaking or peeling paint, rust, all are things to beware of.
• Check to see if the clutch slips, brakes good, steering tight.

Mogandave says to beware of 10yo automatics but I want a manual transmition so this question is solved.

Also I agree with tingtong and I rather look for a toyota rider than an old pajero or a jeep.

I'm also considering a 10yo 4doors pick up with a carryboy.

Thank you for your advices its help a lot.

[transam]

AND, a test drive to include a fast-ish run. Listen for any clonks, knocks and drive train whines.

[bino]

Thai people do like to dress up their cars and drive something different from everyone else, and paint their cars with a custom paint job. I saw a really cool looking Honda Jazz with a dark purple metallic paint job a few days ago.

However, repainting can be a sign that a car has been in an accident... especially so if the new paint is in one area only. IE one fender or door is a darker shade than the rest of the car. If the accident was minor and repairs were done properly, you might be able to negotiate a good deal on a car like this if you point out to the salesman that the car has been damaged before and push him hard.

If the car has been completely repainted, it may have been in a very bad accident such as a roll-over, causing structural damage to the entire unit-frame of the car. When a car is damaged this badly, it is almost impossible to make it perfect again. Imagine trying to straighten out a crushed beer can. If the repairs are shoddy, you may have problems with wheel alignment, steering, tracking, tires wearing quickly, etc.

So- unless the paint job is done to customize the car, I would be very suspicious and inspect the car thoroughly for structural damage before buying a repainted car.

A few good indicators that you can check for structural damage;

Pull the rubber door molding off the door frame close to the roof of the car and door pillars on all the doors, and look for suspicious looking folds, ridges or creases indicating that the metal has been bent and straightened.

Get a flashlight and have a good look in the trunk (boot if you're from the UK) of the car, paying close attention to the top corners and front- close to where the metal meets the rear window and rear doors. Look for similar damage as described above. Also- the color of the paint in these areas is likely to tell you the original color of the car, as most repainters don't bother with these areas.

Get someone else to drive the car on a test drive, while you follow behind in another car. Look to see that the car is driving "straight", and that the front wheels appear to line up with the rear wheels. Cars that have had a bent frame will often appear to drive "crooked" or "sideways", or the wheels will not appear to line up when you follow them. The explanation might not be the best, but it is dead easy to spot- the car seems to be "crabbing" its way down the road.

[Lancashirelad]

Some great advice given here, although I'm still trying to work out what "reverse defrost" is??

Bino's post is excellent, especially regarding the alignment check. Following the car is the only way you will see this.

How to find out if the clutch is worn: (preferably with hot engine/drive train)

Apply the hand brake as hard as you can. (much harder than in normal use)

Select 5th gear, rev the engine & let up the clutch as if you were going to drive away.

If the engine stalls the clutch is fine.

If the engine doesn't stall until the clutch pedal is close to the top of its travel, the clutch is well worn and will require replacement probably within a year. (less if on city driving)

If the pedal comes to the top of its normal travel and the engine is still running, the clutch is worn out.

Edited August 18, 2013 by Lancashirelad

[Ace of Pop]

Reversing Lights and heated rear Window i guess

[mogandave]

Some great advice given here, although I'm still trying to work out what "reverse defrost" is??

Bino's post is excellent, especially regarding the alignment check. Following the car is the only way you will see this.

How to find out if the clutch is worn: (preferably with hot engine/drive train)

Apply the hand brake as hard as you can. (much harder than in normal use)

Select 5th gear, rev the engine & let up the clutch as if you were going to drive away.

If the engine stalls the clutch is fine.

If the engine doesn't stall until the clutch pedal is close to the top of its travel, the clutch is well worn and will require replacement probably within a year. (less if on city driving)

If the pedal comes to the top of its normal travel and the engine is still running, the clutch is worn out.

Great advice, but I would use low gear.

Oh, and if you have a girlfriend or wife, when buying a used car, make sure they like it, or if it does have problems you’ll never hear the end of it.

[David48]

Some great advice there ...

[transam]

Some great advice given here, although I'm still trying to work out what "reverse defrost" is??

Bino's post is excellent, especially regarding the alignment check. Following the car is the only way you will see this.

How to find out if the clutch is worn: (preferably with hot engine/drive train)

Apply the hand brake as hard as you can. (much harder than in normal use)

Select 5th gear, rev the engine & let up the clutch as if you were going to drive away.

If the engine stalls the clutch is fine.

If the engine doesn't stall until the clutch pedal is close to the top of its travel, the clutch is well worn and will require replacement probably within a year. (less if on city driving)

If the pedal comes to the top of its normal travel and the engine is still running, the clutch is worn out.

Great advice, but I would use low gear.

Oh, and if you have a girlfriend or wife, when buying a used car, make sure they like it, or if it does have problems you’ll never hear the end of it.

Yes, first gear if me.

[WarpSpeed]

Depends on how you count it, some count backwards and consider 5th gear as low gear (higher resistance), I agree with the consensus so far however.

[Lancashirelad]

A high gear is required for this test.

If you have driven a car with a slipping clutch when does it tend to slip, in 1st as you move off, (No) or in the high gears? (Yes)

Very difficult to stall it from 1st gear. If its a front wheel drive and you pile the revs on enough you will simply drag the handbrake locked rear wheels. A high gear will not provide enough torque to do that and is far more likely to force the clutch to slip if its going to.

Lancashirelad. Testing clutches since 1972

[mogandave]

And it is easy to stall in high gear yes?

Once you notice it slipping, it’s likely too late.

Have not had to change a clutch in my sh*t since ’79.

Hey, what kind of truck is that? I drove truck some back in the 70’s and 80’s and always wanted to puss out an old b-model but the insurance was too dang high, and I don’t want anything I can’t drive without fear…

[thaicbr]

Op. Why are you looking at a pickup truck. Any particular reason?

You can pick up nearly new (2010-) eco cars. Nissan March etc from about 300k.

I had a pickup now I have a Mitsubishi Mirage. Much happier.

Sent from my phone with the app thingy.

[thaicbr]

^^^^ make that from 250k baht.

Check out Taladrod.com

Sent from my phone with the app thingy.