Incredibly slow International traffic after 6pm

[smok3yjk]

I have True DOCSIS 17 mbps cable internet here in Bangkok. I have been trying to watch Netflix and I find in the morning and afternoon's it works fine without any problems. However once 6pm hits it seems all web traffic going internationally slows down to a < 150 kbps crawl. Obviously trying to watch any sort of video streaming on a connection like this is painfully slow. However, during the day I have no problems maintaining a 2-3 mbps international speed.

I've ran tons of speedtests to try and diagnose the problem and what I've found is web traffic that stays within Thailand maintains its 17 mbps speeds. So that means its definitely not a signal problem with my modem. It's only when the web traffic leaves Thailand it slows to an absolute crawl.

Is anyone else having slow issues with True DOCSIS in Bangkok?

[muratremix]

Its normal for sukhumvit area. I have no problem here in my mooban in bangkok. We dont have much farang here so nobody occupies international bandwith allocated in this area except me

[Trickbyte]

Internet speed will slow down at a peak time (6pm-11pm)

However, it depends on area you are at like muratremix have said.

[AyG]

Bandwidth between Thailand and the rest of the world is very limited thanks to a lack of investment by CAT, the monopoly supplier. Kids come home from school, adults from work, and start using the Internet and all the available international bandwidth is stretched to beyond breaking point.

[Pib]

All the Thai ISPs limit their international bandwidth...bandwidth cost money. Their international gateways just don't have the bandwidth...because they don't buy enough international bandwidth.

2-5Mb international speed sounds about right when using a java-based speedtester which is much less likely to be fooled download- and ping time-wise when compared to using a easily fooled (due to local cache servers) flashbased speedtesters like Speedtest.net.

2-5Mb intetnational download speed is what I get on my True 14Mb/1.4Mb DOCSIS plan...got the same speed when on their 20Mb/2Mb DOCSIS plan.

It's not an infrastructure issue; it's just they are not buying enough international bandwidth.

Sent from my Samsung S4 (GT-I9500)

[worgeordie]

I believe its when the kids get out of school and get on their pcs playing

games, as its same Saturdays and Sundays and also when schools are

on holiday, just think about it all the kids going online at that time must

double users, anyway thats what I think,or is it just a coincidence ?

The internet is just like a road going into town,rush hour in, rush hour

out then when people get to work/school, the congestion eases off.

Regards Worgeordie

[muratremix]

Problem is not due to the international bandwidth limitations but limited internet fiber carrier capacity allocated per location. Thats why internet in Pattaya/Phuket is much slower compared to the other cities (with less or very little farang population) except Bangkok and Chiang Mai.

For example if they have only 10Gbit domestic line that covers Sukhumvit area (which could be lower like 5gbit) and if 5gbit of this line is used by Thais to watch youtube (via peering) and thai websites, the rest of the 5gbit capacity would definitely cause a bottleneck for farangs trying to reach websites outside of Thailand.

[AyG]

Problem is not due to the international bandwidth limitations but limited internet fiber carrier capacity allocated per location.

Uh, no. The OP states "web traffic that stays within Thailand maintains its 17 mbps speeds". In other words, for him/her there's no local bottleneck. The problem is with international capacity.

[muratremix]

Problem is not due to the international bandwidth limitations but limited internet fiber carrier capacity allocated per location.

Uh, no. The OP states "web traffic that stays within Thailand maintains its 17 mbps speeds". In other words, for him/her there's no local bottleneck. The problem is with international capacity.

Well,

I never get 150kbps international speed neither in my TOT 10Mbit adsl in village back in Isaan or 20/2 True Ultra in my mooban in Bangkok.

They may have different domestic links in routers instead of routing all traffic in same pipe. Just because you get full in-Thailand speed, it doesn't mean there isn't a bottleneck to the international lines from your location to the next ISP router. Thats why everybody in farang crowded areas suffer from poor internet speeds.

They can put only 1gbit international bw to a 10Gbit domestic pool if they want. So speedtest will show full speed always (when you call a technician) but you'll suffer from low international speeds, which isn't guaranteed in the first place.

[lomatopo]

NetFlix'es popularity in the U.S. is leading to significant challenges, both between Cogent, and consumer's broadband suppliers (like Verizon and Comcast), owing to a peering imbalance, and with fair-use limits - Comcast has a 250 GB monthly FuP, which if exceeded more than once leads to service termination. And Netflix traffic is quickly becoming a significant portion of internet traffic.

“Netflix alone takes up a third of U.S. bandwidth between 9:00 PM and midnight.”

http://variety.com/2013/digital/news/netflix-puts-even-more-strain-on-the-internet-1200480561/

http://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2013/06/verizon-bandwidth-provider-blame-each-other-for-slow-netflix-streaming/

http://bgr.com/2013/04/23/netflix-bandwidth-consumption-estimate-459489/

[smok3yjk]

Thanks everyone for your replies. At least know I know that this is a common problem in Thailand. I know that flash based speedtests give's bogus results most of the time and I always use actual file large file downloads to measure my speeds.

I tried forcing my connection to route differently by using VPN's to Sinapore, Hong Kong, Hanoi, Kuala Lumpur hoping that maybe only Thailand's USA links are overwhelmed. But all my experiments with this yielded absolutely no results and just could not get above my 150 kbps during peak hours. I guess there's not much we can do about it other than hope that the thai carriers start investing more money on international links.

Also I don't live in a popular farang area. I live in a moo ban on the western outskirts of Bangkok.

Edited August 21, 2013 by smok3yjk

[balo]

Thats why I only pay for a 10Mb line , the cheapest from TOT . 599 baht .

In the evenings its sometimes impossible to watch a streamed video from Europe or US.

But after midnight when Thais go to sleep it gets better again so I watch movies late at night.

[muratremix]

Thanks everyone for your replies. At least know I know that this is a common problem in Thailand. I know that flash based speedtests give's bogus results most of the time and I always use actual file large file downloads to measure my speeds.

I tried forcing my connection to route differently by using VPN's to Sinapore, Hong Kong, Hanoi, Kuala Lumpur hoping that maybe only Thailand's USA links are overwhelmed. But all my experiments with this yielded absolutely no results and just could not get above my 150 kbps during peak hours. I guess there's not much we can do about it other than hope that the thai carriers start investing more money on international links.

Also I don't live in a popular farang area. I live in a moo ban on the western outskirts of Bangkok.

In that case, there is definitely a routing problem in your area (bang yai perhaps?). It would be very hard to convince True online about this unless they already know the existing problem. Or perhaps, there are more farang then they ever thought. The only thing you can do is to try TOT or 3BB (whatever have a DSLAM box near your home) for a month and then cancel it. 3BB asks a year contract but TOT is contract free.

[Pib]

Thats why I only pay for a 10Mb line , the cheapest from TOT . 599 baht .

In the evenings its sometimes impossible to watch a streamed video from Europe or US.

But after midnight when Thais go to sleep it gets better again so I watch movies late at night.

There can a lot of wisdom (and luck) in downshifting your speed. I use to have the True DOCSIS 20Mb/2Mb plan for Bt1299/month (Bt65 per 1Mb download speed); I switched to the True DOCSIS 14Mb/1.4Mb plan for Bt699/month (Bt50 per 1Mb download speed). Good move on my part I've never regretted...saved some significant baht in my monthly internet bill...saved more than enough to pay for my monthly DTAC Voice/3G plan...and I got just as good international speed to farang land (2 to 5Mb) on the 14Mb plan as did on the 20Mb plan...video streams just fine. I haven't noticed any speed difference for in-Thailand or international websites in my day-to-day surfing/emailing.

[tominbkk]

A million Thai kids on facebook and youtube.

[Pib]

A million Thai kids on facebook and youtube.

Plus my wife on YouTube....like right now...sucking up some of the bandwidth....she always looking for videos on Thai Soap celebrities.

Of course I can't complain as I'm sucking up a little bandwidth to the U.S. by being on ThaiVisa right now.

[samran]

I've noticed the same thing here in mid Sukhumvit. Up till the day before yesterday I was getting Netflix just fine on my 10mbs TOT plan. Speed has been really good.

Starting last night, I can barely watch it, and am getting at most 1.5mbs from the US and the stream stopping every minute or so.

[Pib]

I've noticed the same thing here in mid Sukhumvit. Up till the day before yesterday I was getting Netflix just fine on my 10mbs TOT plan. Speed has been really good.

Starting last night, I can barely watch it, and am getting at most 1.5mbs from the US and the stream stopping every minute or so.

Getting 1.5Mb download speed is more than enough to watch video, "if", repeat if the download speed is "steady, consistent" versus "surges, stop & go." And when I say surges/stop-go I'm talking about periods of time even in the milliseconds not just full seconds.

Speedtest programs usually throw-out the slowest and fastest speeds you get over the measurement period and then average the remaining sample speeds it took between. So, even though the "average" speed may have resulted in 1.5Mb it could have been a choppy/stop & go type speed---and streaming video hates choppy/stop & go speeds....it needs smooth, consistent data flow. While choppy data flow can still give a person good browsing/file downloads in most cases it won't work a durn with streaming video.

[samran]

I've noticed the same thing here in mid Sukhumvit. Up till the day before yesterday I was getting Netflix just fine on my 10mbs TOT plan. Speed has been really good.

Starting last night, I can barely watch it, and am getting at most 1.5mbs from the US and the stream stopping every minute or so.

Getting 1.5Mb download speed is more than enough to watch video, "if", repeat if the download speed is "steady, consistent" versus "surges, stop & go." And when I say surges/stop-go I'm talking about periods of time even in the milliseconds not just full seconds.

Speedtest programs usually throw-out the slowest and fastest speeds you get over the measurement period and then average the remaining sample speeds it took between. So, even though the "average" speed may have resulted in 1.5Mb it could have been a choppy/stop & go type speed---and streaming video hates choppy/stop & go speeds....it needs smooth, consistent data flow. While choppy data flow can still give a person good browsing/file downloads in most cases it won't work a durn with streaming video.

Thanks for the lesson. I am useless with this stuff.

Just tested my Thai speeds and getting similar download speeds inside inside of Thailand. What is the implication of that?

[Pib]

If you are only getting 1.5Mb "in-Thailand" on a 10Mb plan then you have a connection problem. Use Speedtest.net and test to the "nearest" server to you...that is, in your case test to a Bangkok Speedtest.net server. Personally I always test to the STS Group server since it always seems to give the fastest download speeds....guess that server has more bandwidth capability...don't get bogged down so easy.

Or even test to the TOT speedtester at this Link or to the True speedtester at this Link. Although they are both Flash/OOKLA-based speedtesters like Speedtester.net easily fooled by local cache servers they are still fine for checking your "local/basic connection"...you want to ensure you are getting the full speed you are paying for....10Mb in your case. But don't use a flash/ookla based tester for international speed testing as they are too easy fooled; use a java-based tester.

Remember, ISPs are only selling/advertising their "local/basic" connection speed; not their much lower international bandwidth. Just as FYI, below is the speeds I just got on my True DOCSIS/cable 14Mb/1.4Mb connection...from my Bangkok home to the Bangkok servers. And yes the download results are much faster than 14Mb since the DOCSIS system started using "bursting" around 6 months ago which gives you much higher speeds for the first 30 seconds or so...which is usually longer than the speedtester test period...therefore you log a much higher download speed...then the bursting stops and you get the normal speed (14Mb local speed). Bursting is great for browsing/opening up browser webpages, small file downloads, emails, etc.

Edited August 21, 2013 by Pib

[samran]

Cheers Pib. About to turn in for the night but will revisit tomorrow.

[NeverSure]

Those who say that the ISPs aren't buying enough bandwidth are right. Yes there may be individual issues within Thatland for some, but in general since most of the popular websites from google to Yahoo to MSN to Skype to netflix to twitter and facebook etc are US sites, the bandwidth can get used up in a hurry.

Once the bandwidth nears capacity, there are then more packet collisions, causing even more requests for replacement packets as the basic premise of TCP/IP makes the problem worse and worse.

I don't know the routing from the US to Thailand but I'm sure someone has calculated it and maximized it. (You could run from Los Angeles through Indonesia, or from Seattle through China, or any other combination depending an which brings the greatest speed) Some are dynamic and switch to load balance.

But the bottom line is still that the Thai ISPs aren't buying enough bandwidth.

[lomatopo]

I think the bare minimum for Netflix is 1.5 Megabits per second (Mbps), and 5 Mbps for HD. There may not be enough bandwidth ex-U.S.A., given the peering issues Netflix/Cogent have with the 'big boys' to support the growing int'l base of NF customers?

Google (YouTube) have server facilities in Singapore, Hong Kong and Taiwan (soon). I guess I assume local videos get uploaded to Singapore, and popular videos eventually migrate from other locations to Singapore?

[hellodolly]

Those who say that the ISPs aren't buying enough bandwidth are right. Yes there may be individual issues within Thatland for some, but in general since most of the popular websites from google to Yahoo to MSN to Skype to netflix to twitter and facebook etc are US sites, the bandwidth can get used up in a hurry.

Once the bandwidth nears capacity, there are then more packet collisions, causing even more requests for replacement packets as the basic premise of TCP/IP makes the problem worse and worse.

I don't know the routing from the US to Thailand but I'm sure someone has calculated it and maximized it. (You could run from Los Angeles through Indonesia, or from Seattle through China, or any other combination depending an which brings the greatest speed) Some are dynamic and switch to load balance.

But the bottom line is still that the Thai ISPs aren't buying enough bandwidth.

Defiantly not my field. I was told when I first moved here 7 years ago that Thailand had only one line connecting to the out side world, I remember about 5 years ago when it broke internet with the out side world was down for several days all over Thailand.

Time and Technology have moved on. Is the Government still limiting the amount of international space available?

[joncl]

Seven years ago and one international line for all of Thailand? Where do you get that from? To my knowledge there were at least 14 separate links seven years ago ..

[spermwhale]

I have a sort of related question.. >How are you able to get Netflix here. I have tried and I'm blocked from being in Thailand!

[Pib]

Plenty of fiber optic lines/bandwidth feeding Thailand; it's just the ISPs buy the amount of bandwidth they think will meet the needs of "most" of their typical customers (Thais) which probably have less of a need for fast international speed to the US/Europe/Farangland.

Sent from my Samsung S4 (GT-I9500)

[umbanda]

Internet speed will slow down at a peak time (6pm-11pm)

However, it depends on area you are at like muratremix have said.

Right...The same problem in Chiang Rai....

[balo]

I have a sort of related question.. >How are you able to get Netflix here. I have tried and I'm blocked from being in Thailand!

Use a VPN and you can watch anything you want outside Thailand.

https://www.overplay.net/

[bangkokstick]

This is why it is useless to pay for higher package...

590 is the way to go.