The Chinese......Another View.

[OldChinaHam]

While mentioning this book is interesting,

There are also several translations into English, some better than others.

The Hawkes translation some say is better.

But the Jolly translation you can find here for free on Gutenberg: http://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/9603

I would say, if you are going to devote so much time to read this book, then you really ought to pay to buy the best translation, which you can decide for yourselves.

But it will very much help you to understand what is being talked about on this thread, and understand more about Chinese culture, and so Chinese politics.

Hope this helps, because I wish someone had mentioned a few books to me when I was young and impressionable:

A page from one of the transcripts around 1750 or something.

[Publicus]

I hate to correct anyone here,

But it sticks in my craw if I do not,

That it is pretty obvious that someone meant FENGJING, not FENQING.

Or, maybe I did not catch the gist of this thread and someone did mean fenqing?

QiFen, I do know, and some are spoiling it as you say

The transliteration varies according to the varying pronunciations, as some say jing and some say ching.

Those who emphasize the 'jing' spell it fengjing.

Those who emphasize the 'ching' spell it fenqing.

The latter is by far the more common and regular use I've seen in print.

I assume everyone is speaking Mandarin unless I hear otherwise.

And in Mandarin, FengJing is Fengjing.

Native speakers of Cantonese, primarily in the South of the PRC, almost always pronounce it fenqing.

As you may know, the many native Cantonese speakers don't like Mandarin, Putonghua, as it is not a language of Chinese origin, coming instead from Mongolia.

Cantonese is truly the native Chinese language, not Beijinghua/Mandarin/Putonghua.

[theblether]

How can you say that Harrry when it clearly states that he is the King of Barbarian nation, and that it would be in his best interests to pay homage to China or risk war, among other direct insults?

[harrry]

@Publicus, your post #200, Superb Sir.

Every Chinese apologist should read that and weep

I am beginning to think that we would need a very very wide table but what a night. If a night like that could be organised somewhere in Chianmai please make sure it is wheelchair accessible so that if my health permits I could come. Hint Hint Lawrence.

[SinglePot]

Not quite sure of the relevance of a classic novel about 18th century Chinese aristocratic families to the current thread.

Will it help me understand the culture of China and modern day Beijing?

Where does this masterpiece fit? We've seen Mao Zedong, the cultural revolution ( destruction?) and the enforcement of amputated families since this was written.

Yes, it will absolutely help you understand the culture of China and today's Beijing.

It will help also the understanding of politics in the family.

Most consider this novel to be a book read by and for girls.

Someone here on another thread recommended to me reading several important novels in addition to histories for the purpose of understanding Thai culture.

This I will do, because to understand the culture then we must read the literature.

If you wish to understand politics or history, then you must be able to put yourself in the perspective of another viewer, the Chinese who are living in "modern day Beijing".

How are you going to do this if you do not read what they read, eat what they eat, and live under the same conditions they live under?

I could tell you more, I suppose.

If They haven't read the book then not a lot of point me reading it eh?

Chinese businessman in Beijing asked me how many children I had. I told him.

He almost fell of his chair.

Chinese family? Understanding of politics in the family?

Big round rotating dinner table. Mother, Father, and State Owned Single Child.

[LawrenceChee]

The topic was a good discussion till you joined in...your extreme views and opinions seem to mirror the fenqing except you probably don't eat congee for brekkie and can't speak a word of mandarin.

Again the fenqing group is a small minority and you can find this anywhere in the world including the USA if you go to the right places

Did you repeat you hate china this much to their face while they were using the "f" word ...must have got you a free badaling Great Wall tour....

The fenqing are the extreme and militant representatives of the view of the general population as daily propagandized and indoctrinated by the CCP.

Your soft soaping approach doesn't change the fact.

In your little world ...seems only the Chinese is bad or has a militant arm...silly really. Every country has them and the majority of the population ignores them or think they are silly to overdo the patriot card.

Soft Soaping ? my respect for elders as taught by my Chinese family (even for bigots) dictates I bite my tongue rather than say something foolish to hurt your fingers from typing.

For your own generations ahead of you, you would be better served if there were more moderates within the CCP who can easily fend off a western supremacy thinking process by some and again loo at the bigger picture of trade

On the meantime for yourself , have a look around your house and start a bonfire in your yard for anything made in china ...you hate the country, the culture and people so much ...

surely you won't be a cheap Charlie and bought something MIA ...that would be a disgrace to everything you posted on this topic and the others where you openly bash China and is race

The least you could do is to pay all the import taxes and make sure our house is filled with western goods and its superior innovation

Wonder what phone or computer u use for TV ...you may have to burn it too

[OldChinaHam]

The topic was a good discussion till you joined in...your extreme views and opinions seem to mirror the fenqing except you probably don't eat congee for brekkie and can't speak a word of mandarin.

Again the fenqing group is a small minority and you can find this anywhere in the world including the USA if you go to the right places

Did you repeat you hate china this much to their face while they were using the "f" word ...must have got you a free badaling Great Wall tour....

The fenqing are the extreme and militant representatives of the view of the general population as daily propagandized and indoctrinated by the CCP.

Your soft soaping approach doesn't change the fact.

You should live with people for a time, a long time.

Then you will see that they are not extremists, the majority of them.

They are just thinking about things like how much garlic will they add to their next meal and where can they buy enough of it at the right price.

Sometimes this is difficult if there is a run on garlic,

Which there sometimes is.

Edited September 8, 2013 by OldChinaHam

[CHRISTIANa9]

Yeah it's sort of like that, but the Chinese national isn't going to go to Afghanistan if it's not an approved destination...

I believe quite awhile ago a few Chinese pros were caught in Afghanistan. Google it.

[OldChinaHam]

Not quite sure of the relevance of a classic novel about 18th century Chinese aristocratic families to the current thread.

Will it help me understand the culture of China and modern day Beijing?

Where does this masterpiece fit? We've seen Mao Zedong, the cultural revolution ( destruction?) and the enforcement of amputated families since this was written.

Yes, it will absolutely help you understand the culture of China and today's Beijing.

It will help also the understanding of politics in the family.

Most consider this novel to be a book read by and for girls.

Someone here on another thread recommended to me reading several important novels in addition to histories for the purpose of understanding Thai culture.

This I will do, because to understand the culture then we must read the literature.

If you wish to understand politics or history, then you must be able to put yourself in the perspective of another viewer, the Chinese who are living in "modern day Beijing".

How are you going to do this if you do not read what they read, eat what they eat, and live under the same conditions they live under?

I could tell you more, I suppose.

If They haven't read the book then not a lot of point me reading it eh?

Chinese businessman in Beijing asked me how many children I had. I told him.

He almost fell of his chair.

Chinese family? Understanding of politics in the family?

Big round rotating dinner table. Mother, Father, and State Owned Single Child.

Of course, I cannot now take you seriously.

No one could hold the views that you here share.

Sort of a caricature of someone who has been planting corn in Iowa all his life and never read much.

But since you say you have been to Beijing,

Then you just could not honestly think as you purport.

[harrry]

How can you say that Harrry when it clearly states that he is the King of Barbarian nation, and that it would be in his best interests to pay homage to China or risk war, among other direct insults?

The so-called ‘Verona List’, of c.314, names the Scots, the Picts and the Caledonians amongst the “barbarian tribes who have increased under the emperors”. This is the final historical reference to the Caledonians, and also the first reference to the Scots ([/size]Scoti[/size]

or [/size]Scotti[/size]).[/size]

[/size]

http://www.dot-domesday.me.uk/picts.htm

And was he not your King?

In Great Britain, George III used the official style "George the Third, by the Grace of God, King of Great Britain, France, and Ireland, Defender of the Faith, and so forth". In 1801, when Great Britain united with Ireland, he dropped the title of king of France, which had been used for every English monarch since Edward III's claim to the French throne in the medieval period.^[89] His style became "George the Third, by the Grace of God, of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland King, Defender of the Faith."^[124]

In Germany, he was "Duke of Brunswick and Lüneburg, Archtreasurer and Prince-elector of the Holy Roman Empire" until the end of the empire in 1806. He then continued as duke until the Congress of Vienna declared him "King of Hanover" in 1814.^[124]

wikipaedia. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_III_of_the_United_Kingdom Edited September 8, 2013 by harrry

[theblether]

@Publicus, your post #200, Superb Sir.

Every Chinese apologist should read that and weep

I am beginning to think that we would need a very very wide table but what a night. If a night like that could be organised somewhere in Chianmai please make sure it is wheelchair accessible so that if my health permits I could come. Hint Hint Lawrence.

I would enjoy that too Harrry and I know the very place. If our CM colleagues would like to join us for an evening that would be a real pleasure.

[theblether]

How can you say that Harrry when it clearly states that he is the King of Barbarian nation, and that it would be in his best interests to pay homage to China or risk war, among other direct insults?

The so-called ‘Verona List’, of c.314, names the Scots, the Picts and the Caledonians amongst the “barbarian tribes who have increased under the emperors”. This is the final historical reference to the Caledonians, and also the first reference to the Scots ([/size]Scoti[/size]

or [/size]Scotti[/size]).[/size]

[/size]

http://www.dot-domesday.me.uk/picts.htm

And was he not your King?

The furthest my family tree has been traced to is around 1170AD, my most notable ancestor was The Black Douglas.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Douglas,_Lord_of_Douglas

Strange that you mention the Picts, I've been studying them recently in connection with a novel I will be writing next year. They were a fascinating race that won two victories of great note before being bred out of existence. One famous one over the Romans, one less so over the Germanic kings of Northumbria and Cumbria. Although the first victory has gone down in history, the second one was more remarkable and has had a longer lasting effect on World history.

[SinglePot]

@Publicus, your post #200, Superb Sir.

Every Chinese apologist should read that and weep

I am beginning to think that we would need a very very wide table but what a night. If a night like that could be organised somewhere in Chianmai please make sure it is wheelchair accessible so that if my health permits I could come. Hint Hint Lawrence.

A wide table, or a circular revolving table?

And if it's a Chinese restaurant, best leave the dachshund outside eh?

[Publicus]

The thread has been very interesting to read, and many of the contributions have been insightful and revealing. Unfortunately a couple of members have posted in regards to racism and to be brutal about it, they have humiliated themselves.

The entire cause of the downfall of China from it's preeminent and dominant World position was Nationalism and Racism.

King George III sent an emissary to the Imperial Court to request that China consider trading with the West. What happened next is one of the most appalling misjudgments in human history.

The Emissary requested an audience. For two whole years negotiations took place as to the court protocol. It began with a demand that the Emissary should prostrate himself in front of the Emperor and crawl towards him. There was no way a Royal Emissary of the British Court was going to do that.

Arguments went back and forth as the Chinese were intent on ramming their superiority down the throats of any visiting diplomats. They regarded these individuals with contempt, convinced that the Middle Kingdom was the centre of Planet Earth and that every other country in the World should bow obediently to their gracious power.

They enforced this policy throughout Asia, Japan, Korea and other nations would bow to the Chinese Emperor, and be regarded as inferior childling nations by the Chinese. Another example of Institutionalized Nationalist Racism.

Anyway, the issue was trade, vast quantities of Chinese goods were flowing to the West, the simple question was, how about buying some stuff from us?

After two years an agreement was reached, a painting of King George III was placed behind the Emperor, hidden behind a silk screen. The Emissary approached and bowed deeply. Those watching ( that didn't know about the painting ) were of the opinion that the King of Britain was kowtowing to the Emperor, as an Emissary represents the Regent. This farce suited the Face issue that the Chinese Emperor was trying to present. It was essential for him to portray himself as the leader of men, the Most Powerful, Most Blessed Regent in the World.

The Emissary wasn't bowing deeply to the Emperor at all, he was bowing deeply to the hidden portrait. After listening to the request made on friendly terms for China to consider trading with the West, and the UK in particular, the Emperor dismissed the Emissary with a contemptuous " We are the Middle Kingdom, you have nothing that we want or need ".

Yup, that's what he said to the UK Emissary right on the cusp of the Industrial Revolution. When word got back to the British Royal Court they were enraged. Instead of a situation where silk, tea and porcelain would cross the oceans one way, while wool and industrial technology would flow the other between friendly trading nations. Chinese Nationalism and Racism caused a split.

It was essential that the West force open trade with China, China was sucking in all of the capital in the form of silver. It was effectively bleeding the West dry.

You can date the downfall of China from the moment that Emperor opened his mouth. He sealed the fate of his nation that day. If China had traded, they would have built themselves up to being the preeminent manufacturing power in the World in the early 1800's. Could you picture the Chinese getting their hands on rail and steam technology back in the day? No one would have come close to overcoming their trading power.

What really happened was that the Brits rolled out their arms manufacturing, steam ships, incredible naval resources et al. They forced open the market and the rest of the Western countries rejoiced. I'm delighted to say it was two Scotsmen, Jardine and Mathieson who were at the forefront of this trading conquest.

Yes they rammed Opium down the throats of the Chinese, however people choose to ignore the fact that it was willing throats. They wanted it. The Emperors of the day were enraged when they realized that they had fallen off their lofty perch. Little Britain could roll in at any time it wanted and boot them all over the place. The Chinese went from Omnipotent to Impotent in one wayward sentence from the Imperial Mouth.

This is the true nature of the Rage In China. They were humiliated, but to make it even worse, it was a self inflicted wound, caused by their Racist Nationalist agenda.

After the Americans sailed into Isolationist Japan and shelled them, bullied them, into submission, the Japanese grabbed hold of the technological expertise provided partly by the US and exploded into being a militarized and industrial force. It was the ultimate humiliation for China when Japan, who they regarded as being inferior monkeys, came a calling. What you saw at Nanking, disgusting as it was, was pay back for centuries of Imperial domination by China.

Payback is a bitch huh?

The Chinese and Chinese apologists date all the faults and humiliations from the first Opium War. The Chinese Communist government cannot tell the truth, and the truth is that it was China's own fault that they didn't grasp the hand of friendship when offered. They can't tell the truth that all the humiliations came as a result of their superiority complex, their nationalist, racist agenda.

They still stoke the Nationalist, Racist fire. Members here have stated that they have seen the degree of vilification directed towards the Japanese. I stand by my additional contention that there is institutional hatred of the West in the system too.

My OP addressed the issue of racism in China right away. I explained that was behind a lot of the dynamic that you see with the Chinese here in Thailand. They are disdainful of the Thais, they don't hate them, they just regard them as inferior.

Talk of White Supremacy is dribbling garbage. It's intellectually vacuous to argue that point. The real danger is the return of a centuries old Racial Supremacy mindset in China. The Chinese Communist party has been fertilizing that crop for decades, you better hope that we don't one day reap what they have sowed.

Here's the full text of the letter Chinese Emperor Long sent to George III of Great Britain in response to the king's offer of trade relations with China.

The letter is replete with references to the superiority and supremacy of the Chines in all of the world and in the affairs of all the world.

It represents the 5000 year history of Chinese racism that the world is facing in the present.

In accordance with the "fair use" rule of TVF, I present three choice lines from the smugly and self-satisfied supremacist letter that makes clear the historical Chinese state of mind that they are the undoubted and unquestioned supreme overlords of the world.

Emperor Qian Long: Letter to George III, 1793

http://academic.brooklyn.cuny.edu/core9/phalsall/texts/qianlong.html

Swaying the wide world, I have but one aim in view, namely, to maintain a perfect governance and to fulfil the duties of the State: strange and costly objects do not interest me.

As your Ambassador can see for himself, we possess all things. I set no value on objects strange or ingenious, and have no use for your country's manufactures.

It behoves you, O King, to respect my sentiments and to display even greater devotion and loyalty in future, so that, by perpetual submission to our Throne, you may secure peace and prosperity for your country hereafter.

thank you for an interesting link. I see the letter totally diferently to you as in fact a very complete measured and polite response to a King of a foreign country whose letters contained always a list of his majesty and that of his county his subject and his widespread realm.

Regret to have to disagree with you. It's that I just don't see this as polite or respectful:

"It behoves you, O King, to respect my sentiments and to display even greater devotion and loyalty in future, so that, by perpetual submission to our Throne, you may secure peace and prosperity for your country hereafter."

I see arrogance and a condescending attitude and state of mind.

Emperor Long was fortunate the Brits were tied up at the time trying to figure out the French Revolution. Later vacuously arrogant emperors some 40 years later however felt the full force of British cannon and got severely burned for it.

[harrry]

How can you say that Harrry when it clearly states that he is the King of Barbarian nation, and that it would be in his best interests to pay homage to China or risk war, among other direct insults?

The so-called ‘Verona List’, of c.314, names the Scots, the Picts and the Caledonians amongst the “barbarian tribes who have increased under the emperors”. This is the final historical reference to the Caledonians, and also the first reference to the Scots ([/size]Scoti[/size]

or [/size]Scotti[/size]).[/size]

[/size]

http://www.dot-domesday.me.uk/picts.htm

And was he not your King?

The furthest my family tree has been traced to is around 1170AD, my most notable ancestor was The Black Douglas.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Douglas,_Lord_of_Douglas

Strange that you mention the Picts, I've been studying them recently in connection with a novel I will be writing next year. They were a fascinating race that won two victories of great note before being bred out of existence. One famous one over the Romans, one less so over the Germanic kings of Northumbria and Cumbria. Although the first victory has gone down in history, the second one was more remarkable and has had a longer lasting effect on World history.

Sorry I edited my post while you were posting as the point was to show that the titles and expressions were not one sided. I do not think it has affected your reply.

[SinglePot]

Not quite sure of the relevance of a classic novel about 18th century Chinese aristocratic families to the current thread.

Will it help me understand the culture of China and modern day Beijing?

Where does this masterpiece fit? We've seen Mao Zedong, the cultural revolution ( destruction?) and the enforcement of amputated families since this was written.

Yes, it will absolutely help you understand the culture of China and today's Beijing.

It will help also the understanding of politics in the family.

Most consider this novel to be a book read by and for girls.

Someone here on another thread recommended to me reading several important novels in addition to histories for the purpose of understanding Thai culture.

This I will do, because to understand the culture then we must read the literature.

If you wish to understand politics or history, then you must be able to put yourself in the perspective of another viewer, the Chinese who are living in "modern day Beijing".

How are you going to do this if you do not read what they read, eat what they eat, and live under the same conditions they live under?

I could tell you more, I suppose.

If They haven't read the book then not a lot of point me reading it eh?

Chinese businessman in Beijing asked me how many children I had. I told him.

He almost fell of his chair.

Chinese family? Understanding of politics in the family?

Big round rotating dinner table. Mother, Father, and State Owned Single Child.

Of course, I cannot now take you seriously.

No one could hold the views that you here share.

Sort of a caricature of someone who has been planting corn in Iowa all his life and never read much.

But since you say you have been to Beijing,

Then you just could not honestly think as you purport.

Blast. I've been sussed. How did the ol china ham know I'm from the mid west and never been near Beijing.

[Publicus]

The topic was a good discussion till you joined in...your extreme views and opinions seem to mirror the fenqing except you probably don't eat congee for brekkie and can't speak a word of mandarin.

Again the fenqing group is a small minority and you can find this anywhere in the world including the USA if you go to the right places

Did you repeat you hate china this much to their face while they were using the "f" word ...must have got you a free badaling Great Wall tour....

The fenqing are the extreme and militant representatives of the view of the general population as daily propagandized and indoctrinated by the CCP.

Your soft soaping approach doesn't change the fact.

You should live with people for a time, a long time.

Then you will see that they are not extremists, the majority of them.

They are just thinking about things like how much garlic will they add to their next meal and where can they buy enough of it at the right price.

Sometimes this is difficult if there is a run on garlic,

Which there sometimes is.

My views and thinking are predicated on living in the CCP-PRC in, with and among the PRChinese for an appreciable period of time.

As an American I was popular despite Beijing's propagandizing and indoctrination from birth that the United States is to blame for all of the ills of the CCP-PRC, from inflation, to earthquakes (weather warfare) to the housing bubble that soon will burst, among other bubbles, to reaping dissent among cheated farmers and underpaid and abused factory workers who have their own legitimate grievances.

And it turned out that, over time, some of my PRChinese learners decided to reveal themselves to me as fenqing. No right winger in the United States is as deranged or demented, as intense and closed minded, as are the fenqing of the PRChina, created from birth by the CCP and by 2500 years of Chinese history - 5000 years if you look at it more broadly.

So I would offer some unsolicited advice to you, which is that you might want to be cautious concerning that which you like to presume.

[SinglePot]

And I don't like being called a liar, and I don't like being told what to think.

So there's a couple of guys on this thread who can enjoy their Chinese dinner together without my unfortunate presence spoiling their enjoyment.

I lived and worked in Beijing for a year. My friends said love it, change it or leave it.

I could do none of those.

I got deported.

I have no regard for the CCP-PRC.

Europeans, Tibetans and Mongolians were my friends.

Edited September 8, 2013 by SinglePot

[theblether]

No problem Harrry, it didn't affect my reply.

If I can interject on behalf of SP for a moment. I can verify that SP is eminently qualified to participate in this debate, he is a China hand and his role over the last while has brought him into a contact with a rough element of the Chinese character.

We have both clocked a disturbing pattern in the Chinese psyche which bodes ill for us all.

However in saying that, I do agree with OCH that at heart we are just interested in our next meal and our next kiss. If only our common humanity could side step this unnecessary Nationalism and Patriotism on all sides that causes conflict where none should exist.

In saying that, I'm still a bit pissed off that the Emperor said that my Great Great Granny was a Barbarian. Bloody cheek that was.

[Publicus]

Yes, it will absolutely help you understand the culture of China and today's Beijing.

It will help also the understanding of politics in the family.

Most consider this novel to be a book read by and for girls.

Someone here on another thread recommended to me reading several important novels in addition to histories for the purpose of understanding Thai culture.

This I will do, because to understand the culture then we must read the literature.

If you wish to understand politics or history, then you must be able to put yourself in the perspective of another viewer, the Chinese who are living in "modern day Beijing".

How are you going to do this if you do not read what they read, eat what they eat, and live under the same conditions they live under?

I could tell you more, I suppose.

If They haven't read the book then not a lot of point me reading it eh?

Chinese businessman in Beijing asked me how many children I had. I told him.

He almost fell of his chair.

Chinese family? Understanding of politics in the family?

Big round rotating dinner table. Mother, Father, and State Owned Single Child.

Of course, I cannot now take you seriously.

No one could hold the views that you here share.

Sort of a caricature of someone who has been planting corn in Iowa all his life and never read much.

But since you say you have been to Beijing,

Then you just could not honestly think as you purport.

Blast. I've been sussed. How did the ol china ham know I'm from the mid west and never been near Beijing.

Iowa, UK.

Edited September 8, 2013 by Publicus

[harrry]

No problem Harrry, it didn't affect my reply.

If I can interject on behalf of SP for a moment. I can verify that SP is eminently qualified to participate in this debate, he is a China hand and his role over the last while has brought him into a contact with a rough element of the Chinese character.

We have both clocked a disturbing pattern in the Chinese psyche which bodes ill for us all.

However in saying that, I do agree with OCH that at heart we are just interested in our next meal and our next kiss. If only our common humanity could side step this unnecessary Nationalism and Patriotism on all sides that causes conflict where none should exist.

In saying that, I'm still a bit pissed off that the Emperor said that my Great Great Granny was a Barbarian. Bloody cheek that was.

Just following in the footsteps of the Roman Emperor who did so for her Great Great Great Great Granny

Edited September 8, 2013 by harrry

[SinglePot]

Theblether and Publicus are good men.

SP

[onionluke]

There is a movement in Hong Kong fighting vocally for the preservation of Cantonese against the cultural and economical imperialism from the Han , Beijing

.I say " In the beginning was the sound" Get them all to Fuk .

[Publicus]

The topic was a good discussion till you joined in...your extreme views and opinions seem to mirror the fenqing except you probably don't eat congee for brekkie and can't speak a word of mandarin.

Again the fenqing group is a small minority and you can find this anywhere in the world including the USA if you go to the right places

Did you repeat you hate china this much to their face while they were using the "f" word ...must have got you a free badaling Great Wall tour....

The fenqing are the extreme and militant representatives of the view of the general population as daily propagandized and indoctrinated by the CCP.

Your soft soaping approach doesn't change the fact.

In your little world ...seems only the Chinese is bad or has a militant arm...silly really. Every country has them and the majority of the population ignores them or think they are silly to overdo the patriot card.

Soft Soaping ? my respect for elders as taught by my Chinese family (even for bigots) dictates I bite my tongue rather than say something foolish to hurt your fingers from typing.

For your own generations ahead of you, you would be better served if there were more moderates within the CCP who can easily fend off a western supremacy thinking process by some and again loo at the bigger picture of trade

On the meantime for yourself , have a look around your house and start a bonfire in your yard for anything made in china ...you hate the country, the culture and people so much ...

surely you won't be a cheap Charlie and bought something MIA ...that would be a disgrace to everything you posted on this topic and the others where you openly bash China and is race

The least you could do is to pay all the import taxes and make sure our house is filled with western goods and its superior innovation

Wonder what phone or computer u use for TV ...you may have to burn it too

Don't presume to accuse me of hate.

I'm reacting to the highly objectionable views, attitudes and state of mind I encountered first hand while spending an appreciable time in the CCP-PRC with and among many PRChinese I got to know and spend a lot of time with.

The revelations over time of the Chinese character, traits, attitudes and mindset - not to mention their expectation of violent world conquest as their rightful purpose and end goal - has given me a firm and tough minded reaction to the insanity of a people who have been closed to the world culturally and intellectually for many millennia.

The Chinese always have lived life in their own minds, never in the actual and real world. This has made them detached and not in contact with reality. And I have seen the consequence, i.e., in the present world of nuclear, chemical, biological weapons of mass destruction, the CCP Chinese are dangerous in the extreme.

Edited September 8, 2013 by Publicus

[jimbobs1]

As long as they don't undermine the imperialistic American government ,,,what's to lose ?

They are ignorant people the same as I am (English ) the Thais ,welsh French ,Mexicans ,,the Russians are no shrinking violets ,,,WE ARE ALL obnoxious as a race

So where do we go with religion ?

NUFF said the Chinese are no worse then the Danes or Irish ,,,,,but not as bad as the yanks YET

[onionluke]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MVvOi-JLidE&feature=share&list=PL5idB691UAbXBqN71zXWZkGXDPiloOXZ9

doo lei sap bat doi

...

Edited September 8, 2013 by onionluke

[EyesWideOpen]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MVvOi-JLidE&feature=share&list=PL5idB691UAbXBqN71zXWZkGXDPiloOXZ9

doo lei sap bat doi

...

" You had better put a down payment on your coffin"..... Wow that video cracked me up, the girl was funnier than hell.

I can hardly wait to use that phrase on my next China trip !!

Regarding the fenqing, hopefully their inroads to seats of power is relatively minor.....

[onionluke]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MVvOi-JLidE&feature=share&list=PL5idB691UAbXBqN71zXWZkGXDPiloOXZ9

doo lei sap bat doi

...

" You had better put a down payment on your coffin"..... Wow that video cracked me up, the girl was funnier than hell.

I can hardly wait to use that phrase on my next China trip !!

Regarding the fenqing, hopefully their inroads to seats of power is relatively minor.....

Aye but remember that's a colloquialism . I have untold experience in said .

[LawrenceChee]

@Publicus, your post #200, Superb Sir.

Every Chinese apologist should read that and weep

I am beginning to think that we would need a very very wide table but what a night. If a night like that could be organised somewhere in Chianmai please make sure it is wheelchair accessible so that if my health permits I could come. Hint Hint Lawrence.

I would enjoy that too Harrry and I know the very place. If our CM colleagues would like to join us for an evening that would be a real pleasure.

Be a pleasure to organize it for the CM colleagues next week after I'm back and it will be wheel chair accessible (blast that knocks the Fujian off for dimsum)

The blether would help for a suggestion ...be a real pleasure to meet some of the members here to talk about our views on china without throwing pots or statues :-)

[Publicus]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MVvOi-JLidE&feature=share&list=PL5idB691UAbXBqN71zXWZkGXDPiloOXZ9

doo lei sap bat doi

...

" You had better put a down payment on your coffin"..... Wow that video cracked me up, the girl was funnier than hell.

I can hardly wait to use that phrase on my next China trip !!

Regarding the fenqing, hopefully their inroads to seats of power is relatively minor.....

I have to advise you that the fenqing don't grow on trees.

The fenqing are, always have been, created by those in power since before Deng Xiao Peng up to the present and will continue to be created into the indefinite future.

The project started out as an initiative. It's long since become a continuous program.

Those in power are churning out the fenqing every day, always. It's become self-perpetuating.

The United States Government doesn't speak publically of the fenqing, however, the fenqing are of great concern to the US, the Pentagon especially, going forward into the immediate future and beyond.

Edited September 8, 2013 by Publicus