Alternative to Pangasius Fish?

[tropo]

I'm sure that the real reason that this fish is "taking the world by storm" is because it's the cheapest thing on the market , same as the Nile Perch which flooded the market 10/15 years ago - at least the Perch had a bit of taste though.

Incorrect. Do you really think that cheap fish that tastes like crap would become a big hit world wide?

I've already mentioned that it was impacting the local catfish industry in the US because it TASTED BETTER.

Here's the reasons why it's so popular:

1. It's white and flaky.

2. It has a mild flavour.

3. It's cheap.

4. It makes good, boneless fillets.

Edited September 30, 2013 by tropo

[moonseeker]

Interested if others have experienced the same? Pangasius getting like slimy jelly in the center, even if pan-fried well done. Have found several studies describing exactly this problem which seems to have developed over the last couple of years. 2 companies (importers) i contacted her in Thailand admit to quality issues with some batches. Certainly Pangasius is not a quality fish to begin with, not even nutritional wise. It is a very cheap fish, that is certainly part of the success. No comparison to a wild caught sea fish. So, anybody with same experience. Tried various sizes, importers and still the same. Does not matter if "fresh" or frozen. Thanks. MS>

[tropo]

Interested if others have experienced the same? Pangasius getting like slimy jelly in the center, even if pan-fried well done. Have found several studies describing exactly this problem which seems to have developed over the last couple of years. 2 companies (importers) i contacted her in Thailand admit to quality issues with some batches. Certainly Pangasius is not a quality fish to begin with, not even nutritional wise. It is a very cheap fish, that is certainly part of the success. No comparison to a wild caught sea fish. So, anybody with same experience. Tried various sizes, importers and still the same. Does not matter if "fresh" or frozen. Thanks. MS>

Interesting. I stopped eating it nearly 3 year ago and never experienced any "slimy jelly" in the center. Perhaps they're selling junk to the Thailand market, or perhaps this is a Thailand variety competing with the imported (Vietnamese) stuff. They wouldn't get away with such quality in the bigger export makets (Europe, US).

You mention "nurtitional wise". What information do you have regarding the nutritional content of these fish?

[ALFREDO]

Interested if others have experienced the same? Pangasius getting like slimy jelly in the center, even if pan-fried well done. Have found several studies describing exactly this problem which seems to have developed over the last couple of years. 2 companies (importers) i contacted her in Thailand admit to quality issues with some batches. Certainly Pangasius is not a quality fish to begin with, not even nutritional wise. It is a very cheap fish, that is certainly part of the success. No comparison to a wild caught sea fish. So, anybody with same experience. Tried various sizes, importers and still the same. Does not matter if "fresh" or frozen. Thanks. MS>

Interesting. I stopped eating it nearly 3 year ago and never experienced any "slimy jelly" in the center. Perhaps they're selling junk to the Thailand market, or perhaps this is a Thailand variety competing with the imported (Vietnamese) stuff. They wouldn't get away with such quality in the bigger export makets (Europe, US).

That was what I meant -Tropo- as far as I experienced it, the bit more pricy Pangasius has more consistency and also some more color slightly pink.

The cheapest one can be a bit on the slimy side.

[tropo]

Interested if others have experienced the same? Pangasius getting like slimy jelly in the center, even if pan-fried well done. Have found several studies describing exactly this problem which seems to have developed over the last couple of years. 2 companies (importers) i contacted her in Thailand admit to quality issues with some batches. Certainly Pangasius is not a quality fish to begin with, not even nutritional wise. It is a very cheap fish, that is certainly part of the success. No comparison to a wild caught sea fish. So, anybody with same experience. Tried various sizes, importers and still the same. Does not matter if "fresh" or frozen. Thanks. MS>

Interesting. I stopped eating it nearly 3 year ago and never experienced any "slimy jelly" in the center. Perhaps they're selling junk to the Thailand market, or perhaps this is a Thailand variety competing with the imported (Vietnamese) stuff. They wouldn't get away with such quality in the bigger export makets (Europe, US).

That was what I meant -Tropo- as far as I experienced it, the bit more pricy Pangasius has more consistency and also some more color slightly pink.

The cheapest one can be a bit on the slimy side.

I was thinking about your comment when I was at Big C Extra today. I noticed unfrozen (was it defrosted??) Pangasius fillets and they weren't cheap at 180 baht per kg. They were pinkish and didn't look at all appealing. All the pangasius I've eaten in the past was pure white from a frozen pack. I even had a look in the freezer and noticed the frozen ones had a pinkish hue.

All the more reason not to eat it.

[Phil Conners]

I'm completely gone off pangasius after getting a batch that was really as described, slimy. Ewww. I'd like to stick with salt water fish, in general I like the taste better, and though I realize our oceans are polluted too, I'm sure it can't be as bad as rivers and lakes, particularly not farmed fish.

So what's the alternative? I've tried some sole (don't remember specifics but they were relatively small) that wasn't too bad, and I like parrot fish too. Any other suggestions of a well tasting salt water fish that isn't too complicated to cook?

[jonnyscot]

The flatfish with the sharp teeth ain't so bad, and reasonably priced I filleted them and pan fried them in breadcrumbs (I don't mean the Indian halibut), also these Dover sole oval shaped (tongue) smaller ones were ok although very small thus difficult to fillet unless you're good at it, but can easily descale them and cook them either pan fried baked in oven or steamed

[chaiyapoon]

Pangasius has been causing a huge response on several sites for many years now.

All I know is we started selling it as fish and chips over 3 years ago at around 75 to 125 portions a week. We use the Bookers value range and have had many comments along the line of thats the best fish and chips I've ever had. We did try another brand from a Chinese supermarket which my chefs were not happy to sell as it was breaking up in the fryer,so there may be some issues.

Due to the ongoing controversy I'm sure environmental heath departments all around the world would have tested these fish numerous times and they are still on sale so there cant be any health issues and in UK at least they are red hot and respond to all complaints from the public. Sales are growing and more major brands like Youngs are selling Bassa fillets.A French friend of mine told me it is a top seller in France.

I'm of the opinion as are many others that a good deal of the issues with these fish is spoiling action from those loose out from its success.

[moonseeker]

I'm completely gone off pangasius after getting a batch that was really as described, slimy. Ewww. I'd like to stick with salt water fish, in general I like the taste better, and though I realize our oceans are polluted too, I'm sure it can't be as bad as rivers and lakes, particularly not farmed fish.

So what's the alternative? I've tried some sole (don't remember specifics but they were relatively small) that wasn't too bad, and I like parrot fish too. Any other suggestions of a well tasting salt water fish that isn't too complicated to cook?

Thanks Phil.

Fully agreed. We have tried 5 big suppliers (Thailand) and they all have the same issues. We called 2 and they admitted that they have these problems. "Wait for next batch, maybe better!" We then did hours of googeling in 3 languages and found a large study in German (scientific) and there was a large chapter describing quality problems that have developed mainly the last 2 years and large batches of fish that, even after extended frying, stay jelly-like and muddy.

They also described in great detail the added stabilizers that retain and add water to the fish (up to 80% of weight!) and a ton of medications that are usewd indiscriminately in the producer country Vietnam.

We have tried every shop in town and done samples from all of them. 2 out of 3 fillets are bad quality. Same problems. As mentioned prior, this is a low-end fish, cheap so, but low on Omega etc. etc.

Hard to find a reasonable good alternative that can be used in a restaurant with consistent quality, size/weight and affordable for the very much cost-consience market here in Pattaya. Just did a nice size Tubtim Filet and it tasted 10 times better that any Pangasius, firm, flaky, did not loose 80% of its weight neither...., but double the wholesale. Checking out suppliers next.

Interesting discussion that has not yet declined to the often seen Pattaya-level. Great forum and some great people! Have a great evening. MS>

[Guderian]

A day or two back I picked up a pack of frozen grouper fish fillets in Makro but I haven't got around to trying them yet. Does anybody know if this is a good alternative?

[lujanit]

Perhaps slightly off topic, but I just wanted to issue a warning about yet another scam: tilapia being sold as "red snapper" and barramundi being sold as "sea bass." Both are crap fish, IMHO, farm raised disgusting fish (fed every possible thing that you can think of that is revolting). You see these two fishes everywhere in Thailand now. The scam is big business. Buyer beware. Yes, before you say it, I am aware that barramundi is sometimes called "sea bass" in Asia, but it is not the saltwater sea bass that most of us like. If you want authentic red snapper and authentic sea bass, you have to pick it out yourself and take it to the kitchen and watch them cook it, otherwise, they will likely make a switch to one of the crap species.

What you say about barramundi/sea bass is sorta right. Barramundi is known as Asian Sea Bass, often shortened to Sea Bass outside of Oz. The fish you see in Thailand are actually the same fish (Lates calcarifer). There is a very simple reason why there is such a variance in quality. A lot of sea bass/Barra grown here are grown in fresh water and that often gives them a bland even muddy flavour. The best flavour comes from fish gown entirely in the sea. Some freshwater farmers will finish off the growing cycle in the sea in an attempt to rid the fish of the bland/muddy flavour.

Obviously the best barra of all are wild caught.

[jonnyscot]

Just an update maybe some of you guys have tried these frozen fish I've attached below,, although I normally prefer to buy fresh unless making a fish soup, sometimes we are limited here in what's available, but I certainly won't be buying any of those again if I can help it, To me they were all very dry and not much taste to them,,, sure if at all possible to source, I'd say fresh sea fish is far and away ahead of frozen fish, although there are considerations to this as there are some debatable chemical treatments on the market which help prolong the freshness of fish for 5 or 10 days longer, I have also tasted some of those treated chemically treated fish and can vouch that the quality in taste is consistent to the untreated fish on the ones that I tried.

[Awohalitsiktoli]

Perhaps slightly off topic, but I just wanted to issue a warning about yet another scam: tilapia being sold as "red snapper" and barramundi being sold as "sea bass." Both are crap fish, IMHO, farm raised disgusting fish (fed every possible thing that you can think of that is revolting). You see these two fishes everywhere in Thailand now. The scam is big business. Buyer beware. Yes, before you say it, I am aware that barramundi is sometimes called "sea bass" in Asia, but it is not the saltwater sea bass that most of us like. If you want authentic red snapper and authentic sea bass, you have to pick it out yourself and take it to the kitchen and watch them cook it, otherwise, they will likely make a switch to one of the crap species.

What you say about barramundi/sea bass is sorta right. Barramundi is known as Asian Sea Bass, often shortened to Sea Bass outside of Oz. The fish you see in Thailand are actually the same fish (Lates calcarifer). There is a very simple reason why there is such a variance in quality. A lot of sea bass/Barra grown here are grown in fresh water and that often gives them a bland even muddy flavour. The best flavour comes from fish gown entirely in the sea. Some freshwater farmers will finish off the growing cycle in the sea in an attempt to rid the fish of the bland/muddy flavour.

Obviously the best barra of all are wild caught.

Yes, the "Thai sea bass" is grown in ponds that are mostly freshwater. They really taste awful to me, compared to other species of sea bass that are not farm raised. I really do not like that species, so, for me, it is more than just an issue of being farm raised. It is sad that it is so difficult to find actual saltwater fish in restaurants that are located right by the Gulf of Thailand. Most restaurants are serving farm raised fish that have been grown in freshwater ponds and passing them off as saltwater fish. The two worst "cons" are the barramundi and tilapia..........but it does not stop there......they serve freshwater, farm-raised shrimp and pass them off as saltwater shrimp. Buyer beware! TIT.

[bartender100]

Just an update maybe some of you guys have tried these frozen fish I've attached below,, although I normally prefer to buy fresh unless making a fish soup, sometimes we are limited here in what's available, but I certainly won't be buying any of those again if I can help it, To me they were all very dry and not much taste to them,,, sure if at all possible to source, I'd say fresh sea fish is far and away ahead of frozen fish, although there are considerations to this as there are some debatable chemical treatments on the market which help prolong the freshness of fish for 5 or 10 days longer, I have also tasted some of those treated chemically treated fish and can vouch that the quality in taste is consistent to the untreated fish on the ones that I tried.

ImageUploadedByThaivisa Connect Thailand1380888663.514092.jpgImageUploadedByThaivisa Connect Thailand1380888699.104648.jpgImageUploadedByThaivisa Connect Thailand1380888720.914299.jpg

You can buy those in Friendship, not expensive.

But as posted earlier try the Pollock from Makro B185 for 12 nice loins, they poach up very nice, or pan fry