Unlimited Portability of Disability Pension

[seajae]

My Australian disability pension was stopped in March this year by centrlink and I have been going through the appeals process, ARO stated that my pension should never have been finalized but that as I live in Thailand I would no longer recieve it unless I moved back to Australia. I took this to the SSAT and I won, centrlink now owe me back pay till march and my pension now has unlimited portability, just waiting for centrelink to abide by the decision as they had 28 days to appeal it(that finished yesterday). Thought any other aussies that are having problems with centrelink would like to know that we do sometimes beat them and justice prevails, at least now I do not have to worry money coming in, Thailand is now my home and Australia is simply where I was born.

[chiangmaibruce]

Well done. Did you get any assistance from any organisation or did you research and submit everything yourself?

Please update this thread if there are any further developments of note.

[seajae]

Did it all myself, wasnt aware I could get help until yesterday. At least now I know what to do and where to turn to if I need help, pity I didnt find them sooner, if any aussies need to get any info on pensions at all including rights and what you can do just or just support, contact me and I will supply the url so you can get to the right website. I will post when centrelink contacts me/abides by the decision.

[MrWorldwide]

Thailand is now my home and Australia is simply where I was born

And the hand that feeds.

[cpofc]

Am I mistaken that the OP said in another post here that he was working and running his own business in Thailand. I think you will find that is against the rules. How 'disabled are you?

Audio: Chris Smith speaks with a remarkable Australian Veteran, Damien Thomlinson about narrowly escaping death after a landmine in Afghanistan.

http://s3.amazonaws.com/webstore.2gb.com/audio/the-chris-smith-afternoon-show/201310/18-without-warning.mp3

[seajae]

Thailand is now my home and Australia is simply where I was born

And the hand that feeds.

after 40 years of paying taxes there its good to get some back

[seajae]

Am I mistaken that the OP said in another post here that he was working and running his own business in Thailand. I think you will find that is against the rules. How 'disabled are you?

Audio: Chris Smith speaks with a remarkable Australian Veteran, Damien Thomlinson about narrowly escaping death after a landmine in Afghanistan.

http://s3.amazonaws.com/webstore.2gb.com/audio/the-chris-smith-afternoon-show/201310/18-without-warning.mp3

actually no, I said I grow frangipani, I would like to be able to sell them but thats yet to be seen. How disabled am I, if I sneeze hard I collapse, if I twist my upper body I collapse(broke my wrist and split my head open a few times from doing it), I suffer constant pain and what really makes it hard(or not hard) is the fact that sex is not on the menu due to it. Mate, you really need to get it right if you want to comment on it. I have stated several times what I do and that I paid locals to do all the physical stuff originally, I do the cross pollination and even then it is only a few a day at best but I keep trying to do things because I refuse to lie down and die. Just because I cant do a lot of physical stuff does not mean I have to be totally useless, even walking gets to the point where I can no longer move my feet, you may take it all for granted, I dont, it cause a lot of discomfort and pain but it keeps me going, coming in here gives me the chance to ge rid of my frustrations at it all especially when the wank_ers start their crap

Edited October 19, 2013 by seajae

[MrWorldwide]

seajae, I need to be clear on this:

- I dont question the severity of your disability

- I dont question your right to live in SE Asia

- I dont question your eligibility for for the disability pension

- i dont disagree that Centrelink is a tragic bureaucracy, and I'm happy that I've had very little to do with them

I don't even care about the Frangipani operation, but I do care about a statement which appears to be a repudiation of the very taxpayers who are paying your pension. You mention that you paid taxes for 40 years, so you know what it's like to drag your butt into work for years on end - I've only done so for a little over 30, but when I get on the plane in April next year it will be with the knowledge that when the money ends, so do I, and I would wager that this is the case for the vast majority on this board. That's fine - we pay our money and take our chances.

Let's look at the pluses - this country gave me a free education, (mostly) free health care, a stable political and economic landscape in which to make a living and it owes me nothing. I don't wave flags or hang around Anzac Day marches, but I recognise that other people made sacrifices so that I could enjoy 50+ years in a country that wasn't wracked by cycles of war and famine. I plan to live the remainder of my life (55-?) in Asia, and I expect I'll die there, but whenever someone asks me where I'm from I'll always say 'Australia'. We both have the right to distance ourselves from the country of our birth - we don't have the right to disown it. I don't know if your earlier statement was simply poorly thought out, but it seemed pretty black-and-white to me.

Over to you.

[Rooo]

A trollish post & response removed. If you have nothing constructive to post then don't.

[ABCer]

Thailand is now my home and Australia is simply where I was born

And the hand that feeds.

I will make a comment to this.

Mr. Man of the World, I like your very acidic comments here. I'm not foreign to caustic and sarcastic posts myself. But in this particular case your position is rather hard to justify.

Many Australians have been working all their lives only to find out that in retirement their life is reduced to a denigrating level of struggle for survival.

Under these circumstances the smarter ones have no choice but find a better life elsewhere. The dumb ones stick to their backyard BBQ, their unhelpful relatives, their weird ideas of loyalty to land and false patriotism.

Speaking for myself, - I do not need a 'feeding hand'. But I can hardly see why should I 'nobly' refuse a lousy pittance the Gov't offers people after sucking them dry during their working years.

I think if you are really MrWorldwide you owe an apology to seajae. Especially considering the reserve and politeness with which he took your comment.

BTW, his pension is not paid from other people taxes. It is paid from his taxes accumulated over years LESS the chunk the Gov't took out for ...

Edited October 20, 2013 by ABCer

[tlcwaterfall]

Well done mate. Good to see that you had the courage to fight for your rights and had a win.

Please inform us whether they appeal or not. No doubt they will as any appeal is paid for by the taxpayers of Australia.

And heaven forbid they do not wish the floodgates of portability to open.

The government is penny pinching in the wrong areas. If you have a genuine disability they should pay you regardless of where you are living.

Let the worldwide flames begin.

Edited October 20, 2013 by tlcwaterfall

[MrWorldwide]

BTW, his pension is not paid from other people taxes. It is paid from his taxes accumulated over years LESS the chunk the Gov't took out for ...

Please explain how said funds have been maintained by the Australian Government specifically for seajae and other folks with a disability. My understanding is that the welfare system is completely funded by the (current) ranks of Australian taxpayers - it would appear that you have some other understanding of how the system works.

[robblok]

BTW, his pension is not paid from other people taxes. It is paid from his taxes accumulated over years LESS the chunk the Gov't took out for ...

Please explain how said funds have been maintained by the Australian Government specifically for seajae and other folks with a disability. My understanding is that the welfare system is completely funded by the (current) ranks of Australian taxpayers - it would appear that you have some other understanding of how the system works.

Unfortunately MrWorldwide is right that is how it works in our systems (Dutch too) its a big ponzi scheme that will break sooner or later because of the shifting age groups. I wish people had the option to make a pension for themselves in the government system but there is not.

Oh not commenting on the case of Seajai here just explaining the system.

[Tolley]

seajae, I need to be clear on this:

- I dont question the severity of your disability

- I dont question your right to live in SE Asia

- I dont question your eligibility for for the disability pension

- i dont disagree that Centrelink is a tragic bureaucracy, and I'm happy that I've had very little to do with them

I don't even care about the Frangipani operation, but I do care about a statement which appears to be a repudiation of the very taxpayers who are paying your pension. You mention that you paid taxes for 40 years, so you know what it's like to drag your butt into work for years on end - I've only done so for a little over 30, but when I get on the plane in April next year it will be with the knowledge that when the money ends, so do I, and I would wager that this is the case for the vast majority on this board. That's fine - we pay our money and take our chances.

Let's look at the pluses - this country gave me a free education, (mostly) free health care, a stable political and economic landscape in which to make a living and it owes me nothing. I don't wave flags or hang around Anzac Day marches, but I recognise that other people made sacrifices so that I could enjoy 50+ years in a country that wasn't wracked by cycles of war and famine. I plan to live the remainder of my life (55-?) in Asia, and I expect I'll die there, but whenever someone asks me where I'm from I'll always say 'Australia'. We both have the right to distance ourselves from the country of our birth - we don't have the right to disown it. I don't know if your earlier statement was simply poorly thought out, but it seemed pretty black-and-white to me.

Over to you.

+1

Just because someone pays taxes through out their life doesnt not automatically entitle them to govt handouts although that seems to be the prevailing wisdom amongst many Australians.

There will be a time in the not too distant future where the bloated handout system that exists in Australia will come to an end. It is completely unsustainable what with family allowances, unemployment benefits, disability, old age pensions, student allowances, single parents benefits etc

http://au.ibtimes.com/articles/497848/20130809/welfare-poverty-australia-unemployment-social-security-coalition.htm#.UmM4tBDsmqE

'According to the bi-annual report of the Australian Institute of Health and Welfare, one in every four households lives on social security payments. The annual cost of welfare has increased to $119 billion, equivalent to $1,300 for every person including children.

Related Articles'

[MrWorldwide]

http://www.humanservices.gov.au/customer/services/centrelink/disability-support-pension

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Disability_pension

Like all Australian social security payments, eligibility for the DSP and the Sickness Allowance is not dependent on individual contributions; rather, benefits are paid out of general Commonwealth government revenue.

[MrWorldwide]

http://www.humanservices.gov.au/customer/services/centrelink/disability-support-pension

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Disability_pension

Like all Australian social security payments, eligibility for the DSP and the Sickness Allowance is not dependent on individual contributions; rather, benefits are paid out of general Commonwealth government revenue.

[mogo51]

Hi Seajae,

Interesting to read your article. I have just lost an appeal against my application for portability of pension. The system they use makes it almost unwinable. I have had 4 back operations and have 24/7 back pain and have had for more than 20 years. I worked from aged 15 to 60 often in pain - no give or take.

I travel to and from Thailand, but Australia will always be my home and Thailand where I choose to live full time when I turn 65.

What was the basis for your appeal if you do not mind me asking? Did you have a re assessment by Centrelink as to your level of disability?

[mogo51]

Am I mistaken that the OP said in another post here that he was working and running his own business in Thailand. I think you will find that is against the rules. How 'disabled are you?

Audio: Chris Smith speaks with a remarkable Australian Veteran, Damien Thomlinson about narrowly escaping death after a landmine in Afghanistan.

http://s3.amazonaws.com/webstore.2gb.com/audio/the-chris-smith-afternoon-show/201310/18-without-warning.mp3

actually no, I said I grow frangipani, I would like to be able to sell them but thats yet to be seen. How disabled am I, if I sneeze hard I collapse, if I twist my upper body I collapse(broke my wrist and split my head open a few times from doing it), I suffer constant pain and what really makes it hard(or not hard) is the fact that sex is not on the menu due to it. Mate, you really need to get it right if you want to comment on it. I have stated several times what I do and that I paid locals to do all the physical stuff originally, I do the cross pollination and even then it is only a few a day at best but I keep trying to do things because I refuse to lie down and die. Just because I cant do a lot of physical stuff does not mean I have to be totally useless, even walking gets to the point where I can no longer move my feet, you may take it all for granted, I dont, it cause a lot of discomfort and pain but it keeps me going, coming in here gives me the chance to ge rid of my frustrations at it all especially when the wank_ers start their crap

Well said, as someone who has had more than 20 years of back problems, I know exactly where you are coming from and I encounter many of the same problems as you. Only when you suffer do you understand what it is like.

[mogo51]

Just a couple more questions what is SSAT and you mentioned websites that can help me, as I would like to pursue another appeal if possible.

[seajae]

seajae, I need to be clear on this:

- I dont question the severity of your disability

- I dont question your right to live in SE Asia

- I dont question your eligibility for for the disability pension

- i dont disagree that Centrelink is a tragic bureaucracy, and I'm happy that I've had very little to do with them

I don't even care about the Frangipani operation, but I do care about a statement which appears to be a repudiation of the very taxpayers who are paying your pension. You mention that you paid taxes for 40 years, so you know what it's like to drag your butt into work for years on end - I've only done so for a little over 30, but when I get on the plane in April next year it will be with the knowledge that when the money ends, so do I, and I would wager that this is the case for the vast majority on this board. That's fine - we pay our money and take our chances.

Let's look at the pluses - this country gave me a free education, (mostly) free health care, a stable political and economic landscape in which to make a living and it owes me nothing. I don't wave flags or hang around Anzac Day marches, but I recognise that other people made sacrifices so that I could enjoy 50+ years in a country that wasn't wracked by cycles of war and famine. I plan to live the remainder of my life (55-?) in Asia, and I expect I'll die there, but whenever someone asks me where I'm from I'll always say 'Australia'. We both have the right to distance ourselves from the country of our birth - we don't have the right to disown it. I don't know if your earlier statement was simply poorly thought out, but it seemed pretty black-and-white to me.

Over to you.

Hi mate. I agree with you, I have always been a staunch aussie and spent time defending it, I rated it as probably the best country in the world. I still promote it to all my friends but after what they have put me through the last couple of years I started to realize that I was looking with rose coloured glasses. After my injury I was laid up for 6 months, had to have others wipe my bum, help me on and off the loo, couldnt sit in a car, etc etc. Before my injury I played and coached sport, worked oftenn 7 days a week, it was the way I was raised so I was made to change a lot. Centrelink went out of their way to make it hard, I was even told I couldnt live in a nice house because I was disable. This sort of thing just continued then when I found out I could live here much better than there it got worse. Doctors reports were ignored and re worded to stop me claiming, interviews were full of innuendo and lies(I found this out when I appealed and they had to supply me with all the past paperwork). To stop me claiming potability they said I was able to work more than 2 hours a week, it was when the tribunual went into the detail they realized I was being shafted. Centrelink said I could work for 10 minutes then have a few hours break then repeat it, doing it this way gave me over the 2 hour limit, they didnt allow for the fact that pain levels are so high after doing anything that doing anything after stopping is impossible. Mate, it is hard enough knowing that I am physically unable to do a lot of things but when you have a department that is supposed to help you shafting you instead you get a bit agro. I was raised in a country that helped each other, I still live by the old rules, a mate is a mate no matter what and you will do anything for him, what Australia is becoming for aussies is the opposite. I will always want to go back there because it will always be my home but not in the way it used to be, that was broken but deep down I know it is still the place I love but Thailand has overtaken it as where I want to live, the pain and frustration Australia has caused me has changed my views and if I come across pretty angry at times thats why.

[seajae]

Just a couple more questions what is SSAT and you mentioned websites that can help me, as I would like to pursue another appeal if possible.

Hi mate, SSAT is the second right of appeal ARO is the first. If you first appeal is knocked back then they should include info on how to approach SSAT(social security appeals tribunual), this is a free service and they will interview you and make a decision, If they knock you back you still have another chance. PM me and I will give you the URL of a group that assists aussies on pensions, they are brilliant and extremely helpful, there you can get all the help you will need.

[seajae]

Hi Seajae,

Interesting to read your article. I have just lost an appeal against my application for portability of pension. The system they use makes it almost unwinable. I have had 4 back operations and have 24/7 back pain and have had for more than 20 years. I worked from aged 15 to 60 often in pain - no give or take.

I travel to and from Thailand, but Australia will always be my home and Thailand where I choose to live full time when I turn 65.

What was the basis for your appeal if you do not mind me asking? Did you have a re assessment by Centrelink as to your level of disability?

Mate, I understand what you are going through totally, if there is anything I can do to help let me know.

[David48]

seajae.

BTW, his pension is not paid from other people taxes. It is paid from his taxes accumulated over years LESS the chunk the Gov't took out for ...

Just as an opening statement, this is just the facts, not a comment on the moral rights or wrongs of the question.

ABCer ... technically, you are incorrect about this.

All pension are funded by the recurring Budget income ... there is no money set aside.

seajae's children and grandchildren are funding the government who, in turn, fund him. Just as seajae funded those before him.

Don't confuse the Government Pension, in it's various forms with personal Superannuation which is, exactly as you have described ... a collection of funds, held on a members behalf, invested and hopefully delivering support in a persons later years.

Not wishing to confuse the issue, there is "The Future Fund was established by the Future Fund Act 2006 to assist future Australian governments meet the cost of public sector superannuation liabilities" ... currently that stands at a touch under 90 Billion Dollars.

Social Security is paid by working Australians like me.

What lies ahead for me when I reach retirement age is unclear.

By the time I reach that age, I will have to be 2 years older to be eligible, and that is designed to cater for the longer life we currently enjoy.

Personal Comment now ...

Even those changes (65 - 67) might directly affect me, I think it's a prudent policy change as the Social Security Bill rises every year there are many other pressing issues for the Australian Government Budget.

.

[aveabeeror2]

Am I mistaken that the OP said in another post here that he was working and running his own business in Thailand. I think you will find that is against the rules. How 'disabled are you?

Audio: Chris Smith speaks with a remarkable Australian Veteran, Damien Thomlinson about narrowly escaping death after a landmine in Afghanistan.

http://s3.amazonaws.com/webstore.2gb.com/audio/the-chris-smith-afternoon-show/201310/18-without-warning.mp3

actually no, I said I grow frangipani, I would like to be able to sell them but thats yet to be seen. How disabled am I, if I sneeze hard I collapse, if I twist my upper body I collapse(broke my wrist and split my head open a few times from doing it), I suffer constant pain and what really makes it hard(or not hard) is the fact that sex is not on the menu due to it. Mate, you really need to get it right if you want to comment on it. I have stated several times what I do and that I paid locals to do all the physical stuff originally, I do the cross pollination and even then it is only a few a day at best but I keep trying to do things because I refuse to lie down and die. Just because I cant do a lot of physical stuff does not mean I have to be totally useless, even walking gets to the point where I can no longer move my feet, you may take it all for granted, I dont, it cause a lot of discomfort and pain but it keeps me going, coming in here gives me the chance to ge rid of my frustrations at it all especially when the wank_ers start their crap

He also painted his own house. Disabled, hah hah hah.

[kevvy]

disabitily is there for people who need it .

Edited November 4, 2013 by kevvy

[kevvy]

Am I mistaken that the OP said in another post here that he was working and running his own business in Thailand. I think you will find that is against the rules. How 'disabled are you?

Audio: Chris Smith speaks with a remarkable Australian Veteran, Damien Thomlinson about narrowly escaping death after a landmine in Afghanistan.

http://s3.amazonaws.com/webstore.2gb.com/audio/the-chris-smith-afternoon-show/201310/18-without-warning.mp3

actually no, I said I grow frangipani, I would like to be able to sell them but thats yet to be seen. How disabled am I, if I sneeze hard I collapse, if I twist my upper body I collapse(broke my wrist and split my head open a few times from doing it), I suffer constant pain and what really makes it hard(or not hard) is the fact that sex is not on the menu due to it. Mate, you really need to get it right if you want to comment on it. I have stated several times what I do and that I paid locals to do all the physical stuff originally, I do the cross pollination and even then it is only a few a day at best but I keep trying to do things because I refuse to lie down and die. Just because I cant do a lot of physical stuff does not mean I have to be totally useless, even walking gets to the point where I can no longer move my feet, you may take it all for granted, I dont, it cause a lot of discomfort and pain but it keeps me going, coming in here gives me the chance to ge rid of my frustrations at it all especially when the wank_ers start their crap

He also painted his own house. Disabled, hah hah hah.

well said.

[seajae]

Am I mistaken that the OP said in another post here that he was working and running his own business in Thailand. I think you will find that is against the rules. How 'disabled are you?

Audio: Chris Smith speaks with a remarkable Australian Veteran, Damien Thomlinson about narrowly escaping death after a landmine in Afghanistan.

http://s3.amazonaws.com/webstore.2gb.com/audio/the-chris-smith-afternoon-show/201310/18-without-warning.mp3

actually no, I said I grow frangipani, I would like to be able to sell them but thats yet to be seen. How disabled am I, if I sneeze hard I collapse, if I twist my upper body I collapse(broke my wrist and split my head open a few times from doing it), I suffer constant pain and what really makes it hard(or not hard) is the fact that sex is not on the menu due to it. Mate, you really need to get it right if you want to comment on it. I have stated several times what I do and that I paid locals to do all the physical stuff originally, I do the cross pollination and even then it is only a few a day at best but I keep trying to do things because I refuse to lie down and die. Just because I cant do a lot of physical stuff does not mean I have to be totally useless, even walking gets to the point where I can no longer move my feet, you may take it all for granted, I dont, it cause a lot of discomfort and pain but it keeps me going, coming in here gives me the chance to ge rid of my frustrations at it all especially when the wank_ers start their crap

He also painted his own house. Disabled, hah hah hah.

???????, where do you get this crap from, this house hasnr been painted since new and I wasnt here when it was bought, if your going to say something try telling the truth.

[johnmarhall]

Am I mistaken that the OP said in another post here that he was working and running his own business in Thailand. I think you will find that is against the rules. How 'disabled are you?

Audio: Chris Smith speaks with a remarkable Australian Veteran, Damien Thomlinson about narrowly escaping death after a landmine in Afghanistan.

http://s3.amazonaws.com/webstore.2gb.com/audio/the-chris-smith-afternoon-show/201310/18-without-warning.mp3

actually no, I said I grow frangipani, I would like to be able to sell them but thats yet to be seen. How disabled am I, if I sneeze hard I collapse, if I twist my upper body I collapse(broke my wrist and split my head open a few times from doing it), I suffer constant pain and what really makes it hard(or not hard) is the fact that sex is not on the menu due to it. Mate, you really need to get it right if you want to comment on it. I have stated several times what I do and that I paid locals to do all the physical stuff originally, I do the cross pollination and even then it is only a few a day at best but I keep trying to do things because I refuse to lie down and die. Just because I cant do a lot of physical stuff does not mean I have to be totally useless, even walking gets to the point where I can no longer move my feet, you may take it all for granted, I dont, it cause a lot of discomfort and pain but it keeps me going, coming in here gives me the chance to ge rid of my frustrations at it all especially when the wank_ers start their crap

He also painted his own house. Disabled, hah hah hah.

???????, where do you get this crap from, this house has n been painted since new and I wasnt here when it was bought, if your going to say something try telling the truth.

if you twist you collapse???????????????????????????????

what do you do when you go fishing as you said in another post .dont you have to walk or twist or do something when fishing We can all bring up all your lies if we just go to your posts.you are a liar and a lot of members are seeing this

[johnmarhall]

Am I mistaken that the OP said in another post here that he was working and running his own business in Thailand. I think you will find that is against the rules. How 'disabled are you?

Audio: Chris Smith speaks with a remarkable Australian Veteran, Damien Thomlinson about narrowly escaping death after a landmine in Afghanistan.

http://s3.amazonaws.com/webstore.2gb.com/audio/the-chris-smith-afternoon-show/201310/18-without-warning.mp3

actually no, I said I grow frangipani, I would like to be able to sell them but thats yet to be seen. How disabled am I, if I sneeze hard I collapse, if I twist my upper body I collapse(broke my wrist and split my head open a few times from doing it), I suffer constant pain and what really makes it hard(or not hard) is the fact that sex is not on the menu due to it. Mate, you really need to get it right if you want to comment on it. I have stated several times what I do and that I paid locals to do all the physical stuff originally, I do the cross pollination and even then it is only a few a day at best but I keep trying to do things because I refuse to lie down and die. Just because I cant do a lot of physical stuff does not mean I have to be totally useless, even walking gets to the point where I can no longer move my feet, you may take it all for granted, I dont, it cause a lot of discomfort and pain but it keeps me going, coming in here gives me the chance to ge rid of my frustrations at it all especially when the wank_ers start their crap

He also painted his own house. Disabled, hah hah hah.

???????, where do you get this crap from, this house hasnr been painted since new and I wasnt here when it was bought, if your going to say something try telling the truth.

you said you were going to paint the house as you were a tradesman after it has been fixed or am i a liar to everyone can check all your lies if they read your posts from the past you should read them before you post

[harrry]

I suggest that a few people here should reflect on the saying "People in glass houses should not throw stones." Many of them have in in the past posted information that the Labor Department for example may be very interested in.

DSP is given under certain conditions. It dose not mean that the person is bedridden or cannot perform some activities. He may be able to and in fact encouraged to to maintain body fitness but he may not be able to do them consistently or regularly enough to hold down a job.