Situation in the capital is still tense after tear gas fired at protesters

[brit1984]

where is abhisit?... he seems to be the only one (on either side) with a smidgen of sense

[charmonman]

Meanwhile Deputy Prime Minister Phongthep Thepkanjana said, "We understand that the protest leaders are trying hard to force the government to use violence in order to increase their support fortheir own benefit.

Absolutely! It's a tactic straight out of the UDD copy book.

And fortunately the current governemment is showing more restraint. So far.

If the present government was to use the Dems' "tactics" there would be a pool of blood already. Lucky we are that Thailand has such a responsible government.

While a pool of blood is what many protesters, and many on here, are apparently hoping for, I also praise Yingluck, the reds and the government for their restraint. Very wise to try to avoid confrontation with mad dogs as much as possible.

The protesters are really trying hard to finally get to the bloodshed that the Dems need so much.

After all their criminal actions and violence, including cowards attacking a 10yrs old boy, we now see the most serious intimidation of the media.

Not sure what Suthep and his thugs want to explain on TV? If it is about being sorry because their little whistle silly trick did not work as planned, I am not sure it is necessary. But he may also just want to say that he will "upgrade" again his criminal actions... in something even more criminal.

The journalists of the seized TV station must have been terrified by these thugs, after having witnessed what they did to the red protesters last night.

Sent from my HTC One using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

You are completely, utterly, and obviously WRONG. The Red Shirts had occupied Rajprasong for something like 2 months before Abhisit called the military in. So, there would not "already be blood in the streets". The present government is currently using EXACTLY Abhisit's tactics - i.e. doing very little except trying to protect government buildings. We'll see what Yingluck does if this goes on for a couple more months and THEN you can waffle on about her "restraint". OK?

If she indeed takes the same actions as the then-government did in 2010, after the same length of time and same provocations, then I will believe she is justified in doing so, just as the Democrats were in 2010.

[wave]

where is abhisit?... he seems to be the only one (on either side) with a smidgen of sense

Yes I`ve been wondering the very same thing.... where has Abshit gone.

He disappeared down the rabbit hole giving Suthep his tacit support and hasn't been seen since....

[tingtongteesood]

Yingluck and her CAPO (di tutti CAPI) keep on repeating that they will abide by international standards of riot control. They have plenty of latitude to choose Chinese standards that permit the use of explosive tear gas grenades fired from shotguns and wooden staves used on farmers, Kyrgyzstani or Burmese standards that permit the massacre of minorities, Ukrainian or Russian standards that permit just about anything. Looking towards the Western world she could apply US standards as exemplified by the Ohio National Guard that successfully suppressed a peaceful protest at Kent State University in 1970 leaving 4 dead, or closer to home,take a leaf from the Korean book which permitted the massacre of 165 students at Gwangju University in order to restore order in 1980.

Which is to be Yingluck? Please don’t say you don't know anything about this but you have assigned officials to study the issue.

By quoting all these so-called 'standards', which are really just straw-man quotes, you only reveal your complete bias. The Kent State shooting in the US occurred during a student demonstration and everyone now agrees that it should not have happened. Moreover, at the time immediately after that shootings, hundreds of college campuses in the US were shut-down by students protesting the shoots and there was also a big march on Washington DC. The entire affair brought a complete change in how police handle protesting crowds. PM Yingluck seems to have learned (as Abhisit did not) that non-violent, ie., non-shooting, methods of crowd control are infinity better.

So if crazed idiots were firing guns at you, you would go and wave a stick at them instead of shooting back !? Give me a break....!! Once again silly people are comparing apples and oranges. Red rioters had all kinds of arms and were freely using them, the army had NO choice...

[brit1984]

where is abhisit?... he seems to be the only one (on either side) with a smidgen of sense

Yes I`ve been wondering the very same thing.... where has Abshit gone.

He disappeared down the rabbit hole giving Suthep his tacit support and hasn't been seen since....

would be a real shame if he's given up (or been pushed into the background by some of his neanderthal counterparts)

i hope he re-emerges (with/without the "democrats") with a fresh (and centrist) solution, tailored to appeal to the masses

none of the thais i know are interested in protesting / rioting (for either side) - they just want a decent person + party to vote for

most thais (obviously not the nutters dressed in red/yellow waving flags) are fed up with this never ending story

[FangFerang]

Just saw some nasty shots on Channel 7 of protestors choking on tear gas and wounded with rubber bullets that piece the skin. The reporter was quoting medics saying the authorities have mixed a chemical in the water fired by the water cannons that causes extremely itching and bleeding from the nose.

Not to be droll, but it is probably Thai chili peppers...

[FangFerang]

Meanwhile Deputy Prime Minister Phongthep Thepkanjana said, "We understand that the protest leaders are trying hard to force the government to use violence in order to increase their support fortheir own benefit.

Absolutely! It's a tactic straight out of the UDD copy book.

And fortunately the current governemment is showing more restraint. So far.

If the present government was to use the Dems' "tactics" there would be a pool of blood already. Lucky we are that Thailand has such a responsible government.

While a pool of blood is what many protesters, and many on here, are apparently hoping for, I also praise Yingluck, the reds and the government for their restraint. Very wise to try to avoid confrontation with mad dogs as much as possible.

The protesters are really trying hard to finally get to the bloodshed that the Dems need so much.

After all their criminal actions and violence, including cowards attacking a 10yrs old boy, we now see the most serious intimidation of the media.

Not sure what Suthep and his thugs want to explain on TV? If it is about being sorry because their little whistle silly trick did not work as planned, I am not sure it is necessary. But he may also just want to say that he will "upgrade" again his criminal actions... in something even more criminal.

The journalists of the seized TV station must have been terrified by these thugs, after having witnessed what they did to the red protesters last night.

Sent from my HTC One using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

You are completely, utterly, and obviously WRONG. The Red Shirts had occupied Rajprasong for something like 2 months before Abhisit called the military in. So, there would not "already be blood in the streets". The present government is currently using EXACTLY Abhisit's tactics - i.e. doing very little except trying to protect government buildings. We'll see what Yingluck does if this goes on for a couple more months and THEN you can waffle on about her "restraint". OK?

If she indeed takes the same actions as the then-government did in 2010, after the same length of time and same provocations, then I will believe she is justified in doing so, just as the Democrats were in 2010.

You are a punter. And pretending to be neutral.

[Thai at Heart]

Yingluck and her CAPO (di tutti CAPI) keep on repeating that they will abide by international standards of riot control. They have plenty of latitude to choose Chinese standards that permit the use of explosive tear gas grenades fired from shotguns and wooden staves used on farmers, Kyrgyzstani or Burmese standards that permit the massacre of minorities, Ukrainian or Russian standards that permit just about anything. Looking towards the Western world she could apply US standards as exemplified by the Ohio National Guard that successfully suppressed a peaceful protest at Kent State University in 1970 leaving 4 dead, or closer to home,take a leaf from the Korean book which permitted the massacre of 165 students at Gwangju University in order to restore order in 1980.

Which is to be Yingluck? Please dont say you don't know anything about this but you have assigned officials to study the issue.

By quoting all these so-called 'standards', which are really just straw-man quotes, you only reveal your complete bias. The Kent State shooting in the US occurred during a student demonstration and everyone now agrees that it should not have happened. Moreover, at the time immediately after that shootings, hundreds of college campuses in the US were shut-down by students protesting the shoots and there was also a big march on Washington DC. The entire affair brought a complete change in how police handle protesting crowds. PM Yingluck seems to have learned (as Abhisit did not) that non-violent, ie., non-shooting, methods of crowd control are infinity better.

How do you know Abhisit didn't learn? You would agree that he's a pretty sharp individual. The question I have is what exactly did he learn and what would he have done differently. Having your capitol's downtown occupied for several weeks is a big problem. Law enforcement often requires the use of force.

What would you do if your soldiers were being fired-upon? Distribute thicker body armor to the troops?

I have seen nothing at all to suggest that he is a "sharp" fellow whatsoever.

[beautifulthailand99]

Wont be long before the US decide whats best for Thailand and invade and take over the situation.

US is generally very happy with Thailand whatever the hue or legitimacy of the government. As long as no-one does something stupid and kills hundreds/thousands as in the Egypt,Syria et al all will be fine.

[cacruden]

A coup led by Suthep would cause considerable problems for the US since the laws of the US would require suspending any financial support for the new government that is not democratically elected..... and that would not be taken lightly since Thailand is the centre of CIA operations in the region. The only other country in the region with as important ties is Singapore.

[Jingthing]

A coup led by Suthep would cause considerable problems for the US since the laws of the US would require suspending any financial support for the new government that is not democratically elected..... and that would not be taken lightly since Thailand is the centre of CIA operations in the region. The only other country in the region with as important ties is Singapore.

What are you on about? Thailand has had many many coups in modern history and U.S. relations have been good, excepting WW2.

http://asiapacific.anu.edu.au/newmandala/2011/03/08/counting-thailands-coups/

[cacruden]

A coup led by Suthep would cause considerable problems for the US since the laws of the US would require suspending any financial support for the new government that is not democratically elected..... and that would not be taken lightly since Thailand is the centre of CIA operations in the region. The only other country in the region with as important ties is Singapore.

What are you on about? Thailand has had many many coups in modern history and U.S. relations have been good, excepting WW2.

http://asiapacific.anu.edu.au/newmandala/2011/03/08/counting-thailands-coups/

US laws change over time. Under current law if a democratic government is overthrown the US is legally not allowed to provide military or economic help to that country.

[Jingthing]

A coup led by Suthep would cause considerable problems for the US since the laws of the US would require suspending any financial support for the new government that is not democratically elected..... and that would not be taken lightly since Thailand is the centre of CIA operations in the region. The only other country in the region with as important ties is Singapore.

What are you on about? Thailand has had many many coups in modern history and U.S. relations have been good, excepting WW2.

http://asiapacific.anu.edu.au/newmandala/2011/03/08/counting-thailands-coups/

US laws change over time. Under current law if a democratic government is overthrown the US is legally not allowed to provide military or economic help to that country.

I know what you're talking about and I know you are referring to Egypt, but these things are a lot more flexible than you think. If there is a new coup government, the U.S. will deal with it here as they have before and you can relax and take that to a bank.

[cacruden]

A coup led by Suthep would cause considerable problems for the US since the laws of the US would require suspending any financial support for the new government that is not democratically elected..... and that would not be taken lightly since Thailand is the centre of CIA operations in the region. The only other country in the region with as important ties is Singapore.

What are you on about? Thailand has had many many coups in modern history and U.S. relations have been good, excepting WW2.

http://asiapacific.anu.edu.au/newmandala/2011/03/08/counting-thailands-coups/

US laws change over time. Under current law if a democratic government is overthrown the US is legally not allowed to provide military or economic help to that country.

I know what you're talking about and I know you are referring to Egypt, but these things are a lot more flexible than you think. If there is a new coup government, the U.S. will deal with it here as they have before and you can relax and take that to a bank.

Egypt is deemed more sensitive than Thailand. If it were 20 or 30 years ago, the administration would figure a way around it.... but now with relations with Vietnam normalized -- and in some cases absolutely friendly (Vietnam considering allowing US navy docking privileges because of problems with China).... there is not as much necessity to fudge things in the short term

[Thai at Heart]

A coup led by Suthep would cause considerable problems for the US since the laws of the US would require suspending any financial support for the new government that is not democratically elected..... and that would not be taken lightly since Thailand is the centre of CIA operations in the region. The only other country in the region with as important ties is Singapore.

They went through that last time. The amount of direct financial assistance is not significant these days.

[cacruden]

A coup led by Suthep would cause considerable problems for the US since the laws of the US would require suspending any financial support for the new government that is not democratically elected..... and that would not be taken lightly since Thailand is the centre of CIA operations in the region. The only other country in the region with as important ties is Singapore.

They went through that last time. The amount of direct financial assistance is not significant these days.

There are so many levels to this I would not be that quick to dismiss them. If there were not SIGNIFICANT financial interests.... Thailand would not have been so quick to extradite Viktor Bout to the US.... they would have allowed him to leave Thailand (especially with all the pressure Russia was applying).

[Jingthing]

This is just side, tangential "issue" anyway.

[cacruden]

This is just side, tangential "issue" anyway.

Maybe, but being that the their fat ass occupies the lazy boy next to my country.... I am a little more hesitant to dismiss it that easily

[Thesis]

If Yingluck really wants to stop the protestors. She needs to learn from Bashar al-Asad of Syria. Wipe out entire towns is the best and logical way. The hell with Western hypocritical human rights nonsense, it's all talk. Do it the way you want to do it. Like President Bashar did.

[harada]

Given the events over the last 24hrs there is obviously a higher daily rate paid for a violent crowd as opposed to a non violent crowd.

[michaeljordan]

This has been going on ever since I was in Thailand in the mid 1990s.

It is like a bad marriage. It seems like the one side is against democratic rule and the other is for it but we do not know this do we. I mean after all, if the Reds were losing the elections and the minority, it is likely they would be for a coup as well.

But in any case, if things turn real bad you will see the baht go over 40 to the dollar again and the economy in collapse.

For tourists and many who have non-baht money, this is good but for those who work here, not so much.

No chance this latest rightwing leader who is attempting a coup would be walking free if not backed by big power on the right--yellows.

Both sides have taken too far this time and massive violence could break out pushing Thailand into a real collapse.

Good luck to all but you really should give yourself an exit.

[slipperylobster]

Time to move the mechanics of government to Chiang Mai?

No thanks. It's high season, don't you know.... There's no room at the inn.

Got to improve those crazy roads going every whichaway first.... Crazy congestion.

[rikkie]

Yingluck and her CAPO (di tutti CAPI) keep on repeating that they will abide by international standards of riot control. They have plenty of latitude to choose Chinese standards that permit the use of explosive tear gas grenades fired from shotguns and wooden staves used on farmers, Kyrgyzstani or Burmese standards that permit the massacre of minorities, Ukrainian or Russian standards that permit just about anything. Looking towards the Western world she could apply US standards as exemplified by the Ohio National Guard that successfully suppressed a peaceful protest at Kent State University in 1970 leaving 4 dead, or closer to home,take a leaf from the Korean book which permitted the massacre of 165 students at Gwangju University in order to restore order in 1980.

Which is to be Yingluck? Please don’t say you don't know anything about this but you have assigned officials to study the issue.

get a live looser

[englishoak]

Lets hope the day brings a little more sense and toleration than some of the last few posters

Edited December 1, 2013 by englishoak

[thaimat]

"If that was how it worked"? That is exactly how it works, ask anyone from Issan especially. Everyone knows this.

Let's do it. End the farce.

And all go home and tick the/your box at the next election. Thats how it is done.

And don't forget to pick up your B500 for the "correct" vote.

if that was how it worked the opposition could buy the swing of votes required by paying 5000 baht (either through an official income assistance policy to the poor, or unofficially through hard cash in brown envelopes) for the equivalent of the cost of ~2 weeks of the rice pledge scheme...

rather the opposition doesn't want democracy because they think the electorate are stupid... this may well be true but ignoring them by forcing out the government they elected is not a solution as it will just lead to a new (and worse) cycle in this silly (and ultimately destructive) political merry go round

the only sensible way forward (i.e. that could lead to a stable outcome) is for yingluck (or better still a new leader of pheu thai not connected to thaksin) to announce new elections and for the "democrats" to focus on understanding the poor and winning their hearts (and therefore votes) rather than looking for ways to ignore them

unfortunately i don't foresee anything sensible emerging from either side any time soon

[Jim walker]

I could understand people dying for democracy and to be given the right for freedom to vote but dying to try and put some unelected people in government house to rule a country seems a bit pathetic to me going backwards, then again this is Thailand. At the end of the day Thailand has the ballot box to get rid of a government if the people don’t like them no need to die better out talking to people and trying to convince them who to vote for at the ballot box in the next election.

[witchhunter]

Well, our Sun is in an active phase and changing its magnetic poles. Such a regular polar reversal, i.e. once in about 11-12 years, always disturbs our Earth ionosphere and ignites instability in human societies as well as results in climate extremes. An unrest in Egypt, Ukraine, Thailand are in part are consequences of the Sun status.

I agree that a present government was not performing well in comparison with the Abhisit Vejjajiva government. In my vision, poor farmers were the main losers as their earnings groped tremendously last year. I believe the level of support of the RU from the farmers dropped and this recent unrest in Bangkok may lead very probably to withdrawal of the Yingluck Shinawatra as well as the parliament. The Sun is active and so the people are agitated, youngsters are especially sensitive to it.

[xylophone]

"The protesters also besieged at least three television stations demanding they broadcast the protesters views. The stations executives organised a meeting with representatives of the protesters and they agree to meet their demands."

Red, not red, govt, anti-govt, there appears to be no tolerance for any views of the other side. The stupidity and bigotry of all sides never fails to amaze me.

Doesn't amaze me.

It's all about money and who can get their hands on it.

Quote: "It's all about money and who can get their hands on it".

That's it, in a nutshell, nothing more, nothing less.

One set of corrupt government ministers replaces another set of corrupt government ministers. Meanwhile the portfolios they control remain as corrupt as they were before because the process to be so has been in place for centuries.

So the police remain corrupt, right from the top down to the local BIB, and it's the same with the departments of Immigration and Customs and every other government department.

The corruption extends from the very bottom to the very top and because Thais worship those people with money, those people who get rich from corruption are revered and nothing is ever done about it, except that the lower class try to copy this in whatever they do, thereby affecting just about everybody in the country, whether they may be Thai or Foreigners.

It would be great to think that a government which cares for the good of all of its people and for Thailand's well-being and future and decides to operate that way could be found, but that is impossible because of the way Thailand always has been, and probably always will be.

To think that a change of government will change the way the country operates is a pipe dream because corruption and greed are endemic in this country and culture, and because the processes are in place for this to continue, it will never change, and I mean NEVER.

As a foreigner, I will have to live here and accept that this happens and try to ensure that I do not become a part of it, or give in to it when I see it clearly demonstrated.

[NCFC]

where is abhisit?... he seems to be the only one (on either side) with a smidgen of sense

Abhisit is demonstrating why he is a very weak and vain man.

A true statesman would be calling for restraint on the streets. He would be offering solutions, perhaps mediation. Instead, he is keeping his head down, probably to see which way the situation goes, before he will make an appearance. If only this country had a real opposition party we wouldn't see half the problems we have now.

[rebelplatoon]

4 Dead, 57 wounded.... Wonder who'll stand trial for this later on down the road?

As it is a habit now that if the Government prevents people from entering restricted places by force, that someone has to pay and be responsible.... Who oh who...?