Thai opposition protesters prepare for 'final showdown'

[ggold]

bi-partisanship

jaltsc Please tell me you are not American

Not sure when those words have ever been used lately in any North American Country.

Politics around the world seems to be getting more polarized than ever.

Remember what they used to be like in Canada and the US.

I'm American and yes, I remember what politics used to be like. Every time the Senate and House decided to compromise and be bi-partisan, the country suffered from more Socialism. Little by little our freedoms have been eroded, our currency devalued and the productive people taxed to support the unproductive. Enough is enough. Compromise and be bi-partisanship are a losing game. Standing for what is right and true is the only way forward. The corrupt liars must be CRUSHED, not coddled.

Democracy is also a losing game. It always devolves into Mobacracy (on display in Thailand). The life of a Democracy is as short as it's end is violent. Democracy is just a stepping stone to Socialism/Communism. My idea would be to return to the ideas of our Founding Fathers. Only the educated, mature, moral and responsible members of society would play a part in societal decisionmaking.

Only the educated, mature, moral and responsible members of society would play a part in societal decisionmaking.

Pretty much how some in this country think it should be run! Problem is There are no educated, mature, moral, or responsible members in Thai society! Certainly not in government that is for sure.

[ggold]

Just seen one of the sub-rallies pass through lower Sukhumvit. The protesters were peaceful and good humoured, but I'd say the numbers were quite small, There was a mini convey of pickups accompanied by people on foot and then three or four small groups of motor bikes and pickups a few minutes later. At the moment all is sweetness and light, and I hope nobody does anything silly to get hurt. My own view is that there are good people on both sides, but that the yellow side has to be patient and accept that the party that wins the election governs. With the USA and the ASEAN partners looking on any move to suspend democracy in Thailand will have negative consequences. I suspect that the US has whispered in the army's ear already.

I suspect that the US has whispered in the army's ear already.

Oh of course, The US says Jump, and everyone asks how high! <deleted>

[mjj]

bi-partisanship

jaltsc Please tell me you are not American

Not sure when those words have ever been used lately in any North American Country.

Politics around the world seems to be getting more polarized than ever.

Remember what they used to be like in Canada and the US.

I'm American and yes, I remember what politics used to be like. Every time the Senate and House decided to compromise and be bi-partisan, the country suffered from more Socialism. Little by little our freedoms have been eroded, our currency devalued and the productive people taxed to support the unproductive. Enough is enough. Compromise and be bi-partisanship are a losing game. Standing for what is right and true is the only way forward. The corrupt liars must be CRUSHED, not coddled.

Democracy is also a losing game. It always devolves into Mobacracy (on display in Thailand). The life of a Democracy is as short as it's end is violent. Democracy is just a stepping stone to Socialism/Communism. My idea would be to return to the ideas of our Founding Fathers. Only the educated, mature, moral and responsible members of society would play a part in societal decisionmaking.

Couldn't disagree with you more. :-)

How would you gauge educated in Thailand? Lots of degrees are bought and even those with degrees can be somewhat lacking in thinking ability.

Mature? So, what? Only over 35 years old??? Or is it someone that can have a debate without sulking........Suthep, I'm looking at you!!

Moral? So anyone that has been corrupt cannot vote? Well that maybe difficult to have in tandem with mature, as I would think that could only include under 5 years old.

Responsible? Someone that can admit when they are wrong and say sorry? Well that's the 5 year olds gone as well.

Edited December 9, 2013 by mjj

[soundman]

Please refer to political organisations by their correct and/or recognised names or your posts and any subsequent replies will be removed from view.

[citizen33]

Just seen one of the sub-rallies pass through lower Sukhumvit. The protesters were peaceful and good humoured, but I'd say the numbers were quite small, There was a mini convey of pickups accompanied by people on foot and then three or four small groups of motor bikes and pickups a few minutes later. At the moment all is sweetness and light, and I hope nobody does anything silly to get hurt. My own view is that there are good people on both sides, but that the yellow side has to be patient and accept that the party that wins the election governs. With the USA and the ASEAN partners looking on any move to suspend democracy in Thailand will have negative consequences. I suspect that the US has whispered in the army's ear already.

I suspect that the US has whispered in the army's ear already.

Oh of course, The US says Jump, and everyone asks how high! <deleted>

It is not a matter of what ought to be, but what is. There will have been communication, and the Foreign Assistance Act will have been mentioned. The generals may still have some decision space, but they will be weighing possible consequences.

[risky11]

bi-partisanship

jaltsc Please tell me you are not American

Not sure when those words have ever been used lately in any North American Country.

Politics around the world seems to be getting more polarized than ever.

Remember what they used to be like in Canada and the US.

I'm American and yes, I remember what politics used to be like. Every time the Senate and House decided to compromise and be bi-partisan, the country suffered from more Socialism. Little by little our freedoms have been eroded, our currency devalued and the productive people taxed to support the unproductive. Enough is enough. Compromise and be bi-partisanship are a losing game. Standing for what is right and true is the only way forward. The corrupt liars must be CRUSHED, not coddled.

Democracy is also a losing game. It always devolves into Mobacracy (on display in Thailand). The life of a Democracy is as short as it's end is violent. Democracy is just a stepping stone to Socialism/Communism. My idea would be to return to the ideas of our Founding Fathers. Only the educated, mature, moral and responsible members of society would play a part in societal decisionmaking.

Couldn't disagree with you more. :-)

How would you gauge educated in Thailand? Lots of degrees are bought and even those with degrees can be somewhat lacking in thinking ability.

Mature? So, what? Only over 35 years old??? Or is it someone that can have a debate without sulking........Suthep, I'm looking at you!!

Moral? So anyone that has been corrupt cannot vote? Well that maybe difficult to have in tandem with mature, as I would think that could only include under 5 years old.

Responsible? Someone that can admit when they are wrong and say sorry? Well that's the 5 year olds gone as well.

Words need definitions, so as not to be twisted. I am a post-Christian, but still believe in the eternal battle between Good and Evil. Man's problem is sin (corruption/greed/selfishness). We were ALL born with it and it is always "crouching at the door, ready to pounce." So your conclusion that there is no one righteous and worthy of governing is correct. Nonetheless, there are those who are higher on the scale than others.

Education and Maturity comes in many forms and from a variety of life experiences. The Elders are not always wise, but generally, the wise reside amongst them. Responsible behavior can be shown by one's track record. I am in favor of proven, respected, wise, prudent, competent men leading the people. If any can be found. That's all.

Edited December 9, 2013 by risky11

[DGIE]

So when this Suthep character says we don't want democracy, we want an unelected peoples council, he's talking about himself right? Who would the "people's council" be held to account by. Is the plan to put a mix of people together for this council so there's some kind of fair representation? Or is it basically a cartel of high society clowns? Will this people's council have people with some experience to talk trade etc with other countries or will it be a manufacturer who has a friends etc.... Most countries want democracy - which is why so many are dead in Egypt and Syria and fighting still goes on in Syria. How many revolutions and civil wars have there been in the last century fighting to get democracy? This country has democracy and they're fighting to get rid of it! How bizarre

There is absolutely NO PLAN!! I have asked many many many protesters to see if they know what the plan is...NOTHING...."what are you going to do when/if Yingluck steps away?" Uhhhhhhhhhhh...........really. No one knows

anything!

the plan is in Mr. Suthep's mind

[Toscano]

Newermonkey ,

There are no experts to run the country . Thaksin was the most expert , for all his faults and all the troubles are against him running the country by

proxy or returning to do so in person . 111 members of the Tai Rak Tai party are now eligible to stand for election . Professors , businessmen or retired

military , whoever , do not have political experience . Selecting them might be ill judged creating a one sided government that arouses further strong

opposition . People talk about the educated and uneducated in Thailand , there are very few of the educated and they are nearly as ignorant as the

uneducated . A Thai university degree doesn't count for much , as compared those aquired in the western world .

[Alwyn]

So when this Suthep character says we don't want democracy, we want an unelected peoples council, he's talking about himself right? Who would the "people's council" be held to account by. Is the plan to put a mix of people together for this council so there's some kind of fair representation? Or is it basically a cartel of high society clowns? Will this people's council have people with some experience to talk trade etc with other countries or will it be a manufacturer who has a friends etc.... Most countries want democracy - which is why so many are dead in Egypt and Syria and fighting still goes on in Syria. How many revolutions and civil wars have there been in the last century fighting to get democracy? This country has democracy and they're fighting to get rid of it! How bizarre

There is absolutely NO PLAN!! I have asked many many many protesters to see if they know what the plan is...NOTHING...."what are you going to do when/if Yingluck steps away?" Uhhhhhhhhhhh...........really. No one knows

anything!

the plan is in Mr. Suthep's mind

Somebody make the voices in Mr Suthep's head stop then! (and how come he has a warrant for civil disobedience or whatever it is and he hasn't been arrested? Not like he's hard to find is it..)

[binjalin]

got to love this - and how TRUE

The Pheu Thai leader had words of advice for the Democrat Party. "Don't be afraid of an election. Don't play a street game. Although you have lost in the last eight elections, one day you might win."

[ggold]

Just seen one of the sub-rallies pass through lower Sukhumvit. The protesters were peaceful and good humoured, but I'd say the numbers were quite small, There was a mini convey of pickups accompanied by people on foot and then three or four small groups of motor bikes and pickups a few minutes later. At the moment all is sweetness and light, and I hope nobody does anything silly to get hurt. My own view is that there are good people on both sides, but that the yellow side has to be patient and accept that the party that wins the election governs. With the USA and the ASEAN partners looking on any move to suspend democracy in Thailand will have negative consequences. I suspect that the US has whispered in the army's ear already.

I suspect that the US has whispered in the army's ear already.

Oh of course, The US says Jump, and everyone asks how high! <deleted>

It is not a matter of what ought to be, but what is. There will have been communication, and the Foreign Assistance Act will have been mentioned. The generals may still have some decision space, but they will be weighing possible consequences.

<deleted> has that got to do with the US, and frankly that statement doesn't make any sense what so ever. Thai Generals taking orders from The US! really, I see it worked in Syria and Iran. You must be right

Edited December 9, 2013 by ggold

[DK2223]

Hi all, we as a foreigner in this country will not benefit if whoever win of lose. Let be neutral in this issue and see what is the impact and face the reality. Let not take side.

1st all people talk about corruption. Do we really understand corruption? As i know, we can control corruption but can never stop corruption now or in the future. We all know that when there is power involve, corruption will be there. We cannot change this fact and we just need to face reality and accept it. Just give you all an example, a policeman at the roadside have been doing corruption and what do we think a person as powerful as a politician don't have. For me all politic and politician is dirty and politic for them is like money flowing to their pockets. How full is their pockets does not matter, what really matter is what they will do for the country economy and people is the main issue. Just to ask a question, we all know that doing something as big as road protesting need a lot of money. Do we every ask our self where do the leader of the group get all the money? "Remember they all are also politician".

2nd people that about dictatorship. Do they really know what is dictatorship? I come from a country that the country runs by the same government since the first day of independent and have been for the past 50 over years until present.The only person can practice dictatorship is the King of the country and no one else can. The opposition always used the phase stop government dictatorship and a see what is they doing now? What they are doing now is not call dictatorship by over throw the currently government and creating civil unrest? then what is it call? by influence the people to go against the law of the country?

3rd let talk about what is right or wrong. General protest to voice out is right, but now is not a general protest anymore. No matter what we know that we cannot occupied the government building and parliament as this is the main administration of the country. This way is only use by terrorist to paralyses a country administration and to make the country economy down the drain. But what I can see now is the same people that is living in doing that without realizing the effect on the country and them. In some country, this kind of act is counted as internal terrorist act and the leader can be put to jail for a very long time.

Everywhere we go, corruption and dictatorship exist no matter in business or government. I very agree that the government need to change the way how they run it but I don't agree with the way that the opposition is doing now. By the end of the day, I can only see that the country economy and the people of Thailand will lose, not the politician. The opposition is very clever in the way how they influence the people to follow them to over throw the government by using the phase "People Council" and give back the power to the people. Then let me ask the Thai people? isn't the currently government is elected by you?

Then we talk about buying vote and the failure of the election system. Buying vote is just phase use by the opposition to influence the people. Lets say in reality, political party give money to the people to vote for them, but by the end of the day, the people will have the right to choose the government because there will be no prove that the people follow what the paying party say and they still receive the money.Correct?

Then the concept of "people council" come in. As what I can see, we cannot run a country like we run a village. There will be no way the international community will accept this kind of government country. All people know that a business or country will need to have a leader not a council with a lot of people that have different thinking. Talking about the "People Council" who will elect the committee member and on what ground and law they need to follow? Can you grantee that the people council will not have corruption? The opposition leader in their heart know that the people council will not work and they are selling it to the people because this is what they want to hear so the people will continue to follow them.

Then I can see that the opposition talking about "Thaksin regime" and the involvement of him in the politic of the country?Just to ask do the opposition have any solid prove to support the statement or all the statement is just a big guess and can the opposition grantee that when they run the government there will not be any Thaksin involvement in politic? no one can grantee that because how deep is he no one know. Right? Then why want to take all the past reason to over throw the country?

I just want to say tell all Thai people to wake up and face the reality and fact, not just to listen to what they wants to hear. The fact is the past is the past, do not bring the past to live in the present and future. If the people of Thailand can't move forward, then the country will never move forward. Remember, government by the end run the country by term basis, you don't like the current the just elect the opposite but you all will live, eat, survive in this country forever. Don't just because of a few mistake done in the past effect the future of this country.

The country not really run by the government, but by the economy done by the people in the country. Without a stable economy and a stable mentality of the people, the country will never move forward. without the country moving forward, the economy cannot grow and when economy don't grow, the people in the lower and middle class will always remain the same or even worst. Please all Thai people, look at what is happening to the country just because of some leader selling empty promise and empty statement. You all are better then this.

We always live in the cycle of life. One thing done will connect with the second and so on. Just start to think by yourself and make this a better country. Don't because of a small group of politician just want what they want, YOU people of Thailand cause the downturn of your own country. Start to think and face the reality.

[outsider]

When I read this phrase 'a billionaire telecoms tycoon turned populist politician who was ousted by royalist generals in a coup seven years ago' at the top of the article, I bet it was an AFP article, and I was proven right when I scrolled down. AFP... do you only have ONE writer working for you? On a more serious note, I hope cool heads prevail today. I'm a supporter of neither party nor colour but I do feel Thaksin should stay in the Middle East or wherever the hell he is, shut up and be cut off from the rest of the world. And I also feel Suthep should join him.

[Benmart]

'Final Showdown'

More unnecessary noise, traffic congestion, BS, violence and hatred then, great

Cartoon politics at its worst.

No one ever died in a cartoon. A sad time in the troubled history of the lovely country.

[jimbeam1]

So when this Suthep character says we don't want democracy, we want an unelected peoples council, he's talking about himself right? Who would the "people's council" be held to account by. Is the plan to put a mix of people together for this council so there's some kind of fair representation? Or is it basically a cartel of high society clowns? Will this people's council have people with some experience to talk trade etc with other countries or will it be a manufacturer who has a friends etc.... Most countries want democracy - which is why so many are dead in Egypt and Syria and fighting still goes on in Syria. How many revolutions and civil wars have there been in the last century fighting to get democracy? This country has democracy and they're fighting to get rid of it! How bizarre

There is absolutely NO PLAN!! I have asked many many many protesters to see if they know what the plan is...NOTHING...."what are you going to do when/if Yingluck steps away?" Uhhhhhhhhhhh...........really. No one knows anything!

Tonight on telly they showed a guy on stage at the rally shouting... We have our own democracy, we don't need western democracy. Look at America!

Can't wait.

jb1

[Alwyn]

So when this Suthep character says we don't want democracy, we want an unelected peoples council, he's talking about himself right? Who would the "people's council" be held to account by. Is the plan to put a mix of people together for this council so there's some kind of fair representation? Or is it basically a cartel of high society clowns? Will this people's council have people with some experience to talk trade etc with other countries or will it be a manufacturer who has a friends etc.... Most countries want democracy - which is why so many are dead in Egypt and Syria and fighting still goes on in Syria. How many revolutions and civil wars have there been in the last century fighting to get democracy? This country has democracy and they're fighting to get rid of it! How bizarre

There is absolutely NO PLAN!! I have asked many many many protesters to see if they know what the plan is...NOTHING...."what are you going to do when/if Yingluck steps away?" Uhhhhhhhhhhh...........really. No one knows anything!

Tonight on telly they showed a guy on stage at the rally shouting... We have our own democracy, we don't need western democracy. Look at America!

Can't wait.

jb1

This was the guy shouting in the style of Hitler? I saw him too when I was in my local issan restaurant an hour ago!

[jimbeam1]

Just seen one of the sub-rallies pass through lower Sukhumvit. The protesters were peaceful and good humoured, but I'd say the numbers were quite small, There was a mini convey of pickups accompanied by people on foot and then three or four small groups of motor bikes and pickups a few minutes later. At the moment all is sweetness and light, and I hope nobody does anything silly to get hurt. My own view is that there are good people on both sides, but that the yellow side has to be patient and accept that the party that wins the election governs. With the USA and the ASEAN partners looking on any move to suspend democracy in Thailand will have negative consequences. I suspect that the US has whispered in the army's ear already.

We were around Siam about 12.30 - 1.00 and it was heaving.

jb1

[balo]

A friend in BKK told me its not possible to get out of the city , main roads are blocked? Any truth in this ?

[Spartakos]

bi-partisanship

jaltsc Please tell me you are not American

Not sure when those words have ever been used lately in any North American Country.

Politics around the world seems to be getting more polarized than ever.

Remember what they used to be like in Canada and the US.

I'm American and yes, I remember what politics used to be like. Every time the Senate and House decided to compromise and be bi-partisan, the country suffered from more Socialism. Little by little our freedoms have been eroded, our currency devalued and the productive people taxed to support the unproductive. Enough is enough. Compromise and be bi-partisanship are a losing game. Standing for what is right and true is the only way forward. The corrupt liars must be CRUSHED, not coddled.

Democracy is also a losing game. It always devolves into Mobacracy (on display in Thailand). The life of a Democracy is as short as it's end is violent. Democracy is just a stepping stone to Socialism/Communism. My idea would be to return to the ideas of our Founding Fathers. Only the educated, mature, moral and responsible members of society would play a part in societal decisionmaking.

Please keep your ideas of Founding Fathers away from the innocent people, they did you no harm. There is nothing wrong with democracy, it is fairest political system invented. It's people that are not perfect and laws should be enforced to keep them in check.

[Sunderland]

A friend in BKK told me its not possible to get out of the city , main roads are blocked? Any truth in this ?

Tell your friend he or she is stuck in a cul-de-sac. Turn around and walk the other way and you will come to the junction with the main road.

Some of the main roads are busy, but they are not blocked by any kind of blockade, although I heard earlier that it was almost impossible to cross the bridge between Rajadamnoen and Thonburi due to the volume of protesters in that part of the city.

The city is definitely not blocked, but there are traffic jams in many places - quite normal for Bangkok.

[casindonet]

So did they get the numbers that they promise...1 million supporters? Will they pack their bags & go home? Will Suthep surrender & rot in jail?

[Spartakos]

So did they get the numbers that they promise...1 million supporters? Will they pack their bags & go home? Will Suthep surrender & rot in jail

The numbers were very impressive, not sure about 1 million but more than nov 24 for sure and that shows that the movement is gaining popularity.

I believe that the protestors are at home, it is Thailand after all.

I am sure Suthep is going to consider your proposal but I belive it's safe to say that he already made other arrangements.