Quick cash for condo

[mccw]

Hello

In the UK we have companies which offer quick cash for discounted property. Typically the seller accepts 30-40% under what an estate agent would list their property for- in exchange for quick cash sale, money in the bank with in a week or two.

I'm wondering if something like this could be popular in Chiang Mai?

I understand most 99.99% of people want the best price they can get of course. And good luck to them; but I think maybe there are a few that, for what ever reason just want to sell up ASAP and be done with it.

How can I find these people best do you think? Advertising in which forms? Costs?

I will further research myself of course but am interested for all thoughts and info here as a starting point and sounding board. So thanks for all contributions in advance.

Cheers

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[hellodolly]

Maybe just go around to the different condos and ask the management if there are any residents looking to sell. They of course will give you an inflated figure but you can maybe have a word with the owner. Send them a letter or some thing.

[Thighlander]

Do what Dolly said, and just make low offers, until you find a desperate seller. They're out there. Relatively low hoa fees, and zero property taxes make them fewer than many areas in the West. Banks will hold onto them for years. Go to the bank websites, like www.krungsriproperty.com and you will see what they are trying to unload. Occasionally, they will have big sales expos to unload their NPLs. They still have some left over from the 97-98 crash.

[Torrens54]

Think it is an excellent idea.

However, a few years ago my wife and I bought a re-po' house from one of the major banks. It, along with many others was advertised on a notice board in the bank here in CNX. They were too lazy to send an agent with us and we got the wrong address the first time and gave the owners a near heart-attack when we said the bank was trying to flog-off their home.

When we did find the right property, we discovered the original owner was living next door and that house was a "Repo" as well. The Bank hadn't at that stage bothered to toss him out, and in fact he had Tenants in the house that we wanted to look at.(The people at the Bank were SHOCKED when we told them.)

Long story/short, we bought the place at what was a good price, even though we tried to negotiate it down with the bank, and the the bank refused to budge. Later we put in offers to the bank on some other properties in the area but again, they refused to negotiate. Seems it is not only the banks but private -owners who would rather see the house rot than discount it. But, it could be worth your effort posting some adverts at places like Rimping etc., to "test the water."

Let me know your thoughts, my wife has something of a track record both here and abroad for doing some good property deals.

[NeverSure]

If a bank sells it for less than is owed on it, it has to write off the loss on its books. As long as it sits on the condo, even if it rots, it is allowed to carry it on its books for the amount it loaned on it. This is only one of several reasons I don't believe Thai banks' books.

I agree with others above. I'd make low ball offers on privately owned units. This is a bit off topic, but I got a heck of a deal on a scooter from a farang who was needing to leave the country really fast and needed money.

Good luck.

[Thighlander]

good example, or a family of three stuck in a studio. Ot Thais, who were transferred for work to another city. As far as carrying them on their books, the big banks in the US, UK,, Germany and elsewhere do the same thing. All have been pressured by recent rule changes to "mark to market." It would be much better for everyone, if they were forced to liquidate by auction within several years (or less). The neighborhood suffer a lot, too, as there are uncollected moo baan fees, uncared for lawns, etc.. An uncared for lawn can become a jungle quick in Thailand.

[true blue]

after going around a few condos last month looking for a place to rent for a friend i found ,they all have notice boards in the lobbies with many offers to sell on them.

[worgeordie]

I think you will find Thai owners will hang on for months, just to get

a few thousand Bht more for their property,even if they are in dire

straights,plus they all think their properties are always worth a lot

more than the market says.

Do not think you would find too many takers to make it a viable

business model,what works in the West does not always work

here.

regards Worgeordie

[Thighlander]

Here is the business model you are talking about: www.webuyuglyhouses.com. I've had lots of calls from them on the last three homes I've sold. They are so full of crap. I usually beat their "offer" by about 150%. They do manage to snag a few, but very rarely. They love widows, etc..They waist a lot of time driving around and bothering people. I like to run their names through public records databases, and often times it proves they are all talk.

[mccw]

Here is the business model you are talking about: www.webuyuglyhouses.com. I've had lots of calls from them on the last three homes I've sold. They are so full of crap. I usually beat their "offer" by about 150%. They do manage to snag a few, but very rarely. They love widows, etc..They waist a lot of time driving around and bothering people. I like to run their names through public records databases, and often times it proves they are all talk.

I would like to waste as little time as possible to be honest- that's why I'm sounding out ideas on how to reach people with out all the running around condos and putting low offers in to thousands of condos advertising at full price.

I think I know the Chiang Mai market well enough to give a ball park offer via email or phone based off sqm , building, location etc.

My family and I moved back to Chiang Mai to enjoy a better work-life balance, I certainly don't want to be driving around condos all day everyday, putting in offers just to get turned down and waste other people's time + be subjected to all that grumpy energies. I want to find a way for people to just contact me knowing what to expect, ie to recieve a lower sum in exchange for the fast cash service.

Everyone could achieve more than what I will offer for sure- if it wasn't like this then I couldn't make any money by resale and I wouldn't be interested to buy in the first place- but to get the top price takes time and some times money for refurbishment.

Scenarios where people would rather accept less I imagine would be like moving country for work or personal reasons and just wanting quick sale rather than leaving keys and trust in an agent or lawyers to sale the property with out one physical presence.

That you achieved "150% more" than the companies offers is surprising- in my experience that come in about 30-40% under market list price- where as for you they were offering only a third? For you to achieve full price of x3, right?

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[mccw]

I think you will find Thai owners will hang on for months, just to get

a few thousand Bht more for their property,even if they are in dire

straights,plus they all think their properties are always worth a lot

more than the market says.

Do not think you would find too many takers to make it a viable

business model,what works in the West does not always work

here.

regards Worgeordie

Hi

I lived in Thailand on and off for the decade+

I'm quite aware of the market, the culture and peoples. So i see / I know Thais hate to accept a loss. I would aim for foreigners; also so I can resale under the foreign quota. Also I expect only 1 or two people to come forward every year or so- maybe even less. So this why I'm asking advertising methods and costs - since with so few deals its not balance to be spending a fortune on advertising.

Does anybody happen to know the going rates for print advertising roughly at different publications?

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[dutchisaan]

I think you will find Thai owners will hang on for months, just to get

a few thousand Bht more for their property,even if they are in dire

straights,plus they all think their properties are always worth a lot

more than the market says.

Do not think you would find too many takers to make it a viable

business model,what works in the West does not always work

here.

regards Worgeordie

Hi

I lived in Thailand on and off for the decade+

I'm quite aware of the market, the culture and peoples. So i see / I know Thais hate to accept a loss. I would aim for foreigners; also so I can resale under the foreign quota. Also I expect only 1 or two people to come forward every year or so- maybe even less. So this why I'm asking advertising methods and costs - since with so few deals its not balance to be spending a fortune on advertising.

Does anybody happen to know the going rates for print advertising roughly at different publications?

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You Are aware of the market? And do not know what the cost is to advertise?

[mccw]

I think you will find Thai owners will hang on for months, just to get

a few thousand Bht more for their property,even if they are in dire

straights,plus they all think their properties are always worth a lot

more than the market says.

Do not think you would find too many takers to make it a viable

business model,what works in the West does not always work

here.

regards Worgeordie

Hi

I lived in Thailand on and off for the decade+

I'm quite aware of the market, the culture and peoples. So i see / I know Thais hate to accept a loss. I would aim for foreigners; also so I can resale under the foreign quota. Also I expect only 1 or two people to come forward every year or so- maybe even less. So this why I'm asking advertising methods and costs - since with so few deals its not balance to be spending a fortune on advertising.

Does anybody happen to know the going rates for print advertising roughly at different publications?

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

You Are aware of the market? And do not know what the cost is to advertise?

Aware of the property market. I've been a buyer and seller here + keep eyes open and research the listings of agents.

But I've never looked in to media advertising for any purposes.

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[mccw]

I'll just add on the morality side that I'm not out to swindle any old ladies or chasing widows or what ever.

There are times / scenarios where fast cash service is a very useful and valuable thing.

Such as I have debts in the falang land secured against a far higher valued property; the bank is about to foreclose unless I pay them by the end of the month. Fast cash in such a scenario is worth the discounted price.

Another could be that I have an investment opportunity else where that I know will make a lot of money but I need money right now to get in on it/ not in six months time.

Further- perhaps I am moving out of the country and want my place sold by a certain date since I do not trust lawyers or agents to hold keys or act on my behalf.

Adults making rational decisions aware of all the options.

Another idea, which could be seen as helping out (or taking advantage?) is to offer, with the older folks in mind, like an equity release scheme/ buy and rent back- where I buy the condo and agree a fixed rent for the resident to keep living there up to 5 or even 10years later, so they have released cash and can budget with surety what they will be paying going forward.

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[mccw]

Does anybody know the rough costs for print advertising?

Cheers

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[worgeordie]

Hi mccw, If you are only expecting one or two purchases a year,I would just

try putting free adverts on ThaiVisa classifieds,and BhatSold,that way it

would cost you nothing,you could do it quickly,(in case someone else takes

your idea ) that way you would at least find if there is any demand,before

spending any money,Plus I am sure there are other Thai sites you could

advertise on,sure someone on this forum will know.

regards Worgeordie

[haybilly]

I'll buy a couple of dirt cheap houses/condos, too, if you find any- how many of us don't want this?

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[scorecard]

Maybe just go around to the different condos and ask the management if there are any residents looking to sell. They of course will give you an inflated figure but you can maybe have a word with the owner. Send them a letter or some thing.

Remembering that the management staff will also want a commission. Normal in Thailand

[mccw]

I'll buy a couple of dirt cheap houses/condos, too, if you find any- how many of us don't want this?Sent from my GT-N7100 using Tapatalk

From what I can see there are no other companies offering this service in Thailand. I think the main problem is there are no public records for sold price comparisons.

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[mccw]

So local knowledge of markets is key really.

I'm talking to a friend of mine in Puket property to get involved and together we put in to build a website with a quote calculator based of sqm and location, floor and such; go in on some proper advertising. I've also lined up an international link to shift what we get as tenanted investments.

Logical markets to get in to are then Bangkok and Pattaya.

Land & houses would be great- I've come across motivated thai's selling before, basically when the bank is about to foreclose and they rather get something than nothing. Often the local rich family sucks up this land; but often the debtors just loose it to the bank. Its beyond our means but if a group of investors were to come on board and build this as a nation wide company it could be making a fortune i think. Trust issues with foriegners putting money in to a Thai company though as always.

Even just on the condos I could easily imagine a time when our funds don't stretch to buy everything. A group of interested purchasers/ investors in the wings to put things to would be most welcome. No need to lay out any cash- just recieve discounted properties to the inbox and free to buy or not to buy- bid or offer.

What do you think?

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[Thighlander]

Here is the business model you are talking about: www.webuyuglyhouses.com. I've had lots of calls from them on the last three homes I've sold. They are so full of crap. I usually beat their "offer" by about 150%. They do manage to snag a few, but very rarely. They love widows, etc..They waist a lot of time driving around and bothering people. I like to run their names through public records databases, and often times it proves they are all talk.

I would like to waste as little time as possible to be honest- that's why I'm sounding out ideas on how to reach people with out all the running around condos and putting low offers in to thousands of condos advertising at full price.

I think I know the Chiang Mai market well enough to give a ball park offer via email or phone based off sqm , building, location etc.

My family and I moved back to Chiang Mai to enjoy a better work-life balance, I certainly don't want to be driving around condos all day everyday, putting in offers just to get turned down and waste other people's time + be subjected to all that grumpy energies. I want to find a way for people to just contact me knowing what to expect, ie to recieve a lower sum in exchange for the fast cash service.

Everyone could achieve more than what I will offer for sure- if it wasn't like this then I couldn't make any money by resale and I wouldn't be interested to buy in the first place- but to get the top price takes time and some times money for refurbishment.

Scenarios where people would rather accept less I imagine would be like moving country for work or personal reasons and just wanting quick sale rather than leaving keys and trust in an agent or lawyers to sale the property with out one physical presence.

That you achieved "150% more" than the companies offers is surprising- in my experience that come in about 30-40% under market list price- where as for you they were offering only a third? For you to achieve full price of x3, right?

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Selling for 150% more than they offered meant sales price was 2.5X

(with x being their offer). Also, I've seen a cash for condos ad in the BKK Post this year.

Offering cash and quick close. Condos can range in BKK from 10K psm to 200K psm, so good luck with that.

[CraigSchuler]

Not to hijack your thread but I was curious as well about pawn shops or payday advance spots that cater to farangs? I've heard of an auction house that will move your items.

I think you have a good idea, Thai's do it all day long.

[wooloomooloo]

Thighlander, I think you're losing sight of the OP's objective. There is a market for his ambitions.

Those that want rid will sell sharpish for hard cash and two bargains a year fit the OP's business plan.

You might disagree with his perceived ethical model, but it's entirely possible. Market forces dictate and you haven't a say in the matter.

[mccw]

Not to hijack your thread but I was curious as well about pawn shops or payday advance spots that cater to farangs? I've heard of an auction house that will move your items.

I think you have a good idea, Thai's do it all day long.

There is a kinda pawn shop next to the fire station on the moat- they cash lend at interest with Thai gold as security.

Not seen any pawn shops / money lenders where they take anything / alsorts. The problem with this for me would be the time and security risks of running a shop with large amounts of valuables and cash on hand + the knowledge needed to asses jewlry gems, watches, more random stuff etc etcetera. But I do think such a shop would do good business with the right person running it.

Pay day advance- there is a maximum legal lending limits ie max chargeable interest I think. Must be Problems with defaults / runners. Still maybe it could work if on a large enough scale. Not something I would be willing or able to set up myself.

A service like webuyanycar.com aimed at farangs could be ok. Say I am leaving Thailand on x date and I want to sell my car (or bike) but want to use it right up to the day of leaving, a service to agree a price before hand and collect at specified time place for a discount would be advantageous for both parties , so the reseller gets a discounted price and the seller saves on hire costs and/ or inconvenience of being vehicle-less for x amount of time and etc. I might combine this with the quick cash for condo service.

For people leaving Thailand it could be a one stop service inc all the condo contents as well/ what ever they want to leave behind.

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[NeverSure]

good example, or a family of three stuck in a studio. Ot Thais, who were transferred for work to another city. As far as carrying them on their books, the big banks in the US, UK,, Germany and elsewhere do the same thing. All have been pressured by recent rule changes to "mark to market." It would be much better for everyone, if they were forced to liquidate by auction within several years (or less). The neighborhood suffer a lot, too, as there are uncollected moo baan fees, uncared for lawns, etc.. An uncared for lawn can become a jungle quick in Thailand.

"Mark to market" means to take each property and change the amount it is carried on the books to real market value. This is what at least US banks had to do, and why so many went broke. Most of the ones that went broke were absorbed by bigger banks which had the capital to take them over. The government also kicked in cash for many, and many have paid most or all of it back, but even that shows on the books as a liability if not paid.

The banks are regularly audited and the books are clean.

This is what Thai banks won't do, aren't required to do, and is the very reason that many units build in or about 1997 are still sitting empty and rotting. As long as the bank owns it, it can be carried on the books for what the value was originally stated as.

If Thai banks had to write off all of the actual losses they have from depreciated "assets," I believe many of them would be bankrupt.

[jackr]

Maybe just go around to the different condos and ask the management if there are any residents looking to sell. They of course will give you an inflated figure but you can maybe have a word with the owner. Send them a letter or some thing.

Remembering that the management staff will also want a commission. Normal in Thailand

Indeed, they'll want 3% just for sitting on their fat furry.

[binjalin]

there are many doing this already and you will be in a long, long queue

good luck but without knowledge and exp here you are ready to step on a mine

[thailiketoo]

good example, or a family of three stuck in a studio. Ot Thais, who were transferred for work to another city. As far as carrying them on their books, the big banks in the US, UK,, Germany and elsewhere do the same thing. All have been pressured by recent rule changes to "mark to market." It would be much better for everyone, if they were forced to liquidate by auction within several years (or less). The neighborhood suffer a lot, too, as there are uncollected moo baan fees, uncared for lawns, etc.. An uncared for lawn can become a jungle quick in Thailand.

"Mark to market" means to take each property and change the amount it is carried on the books to real market value. This is what at least US banks had to do, and why so many went broke. Most of the ones that went broke were absorbed by bigger banks which had the capital to take them over. The government also kicked in cash for many, and many have paid most or all of it back, but even that shows on the books as a liability if not paid.

The banks are regularly audited and the books are clean.

This is what Thai banks won't do, aren't required to do, and is the very reason that many units build in or about 1997 are still sitting empty and rotting. As long as the bank owns it, it can be carried on the books for what the value was originally stated as.

If Thai banks had to write off all of the actual losses they have from depreciated "assets," I believe many of them would be bankrupt.

Does the BOT use the "Current Exposure Method?" And isn't this accurate? Doesn't the Current Exposure Method take into consideration the Mark to Market value of property? Just saying......

[mccw]

good example, or a family of three stuck in a studio. Ot Thais, who were transferred for work to another city. As far as carrying them on their books, the big banks in the US, UK,, Germany and elsewhere do the same thing. All have been pressured by recent rule changes to "mark to market." It would be much better for everyone, if they were forced to liquidate by auction within several years (or less). The neighborhood suffer a lot, too, as there are uncollected moo baan fees, uncared for lawns, etc.. An uncared for lawn can become a jungle quick in Thailand.

"Mark to market" means to take each property and change the amount it is carried on the books to real market value. This is what at least US banks had to do, and why so many went broke. Most of the ones that went broke were absorbed by bigger banks which had the capital to take them over. The government also kicked in cash for many, and many have paid most or all of it back, but even that shows on the books as a liability if not paid.

The banks are regularly audited and the books are clean.

This is what Thai banks won't do, aren't required to do, and is the very reason that many units build in or about 1997 are still sitting empty and rotting. As long as the bank owns it, it can be carried on the books for what the value was originally stated as.

If Thai banks had to write off all of the actual losses they have from depreciated "assets," I believe many of them would be bankrupt.

But the bank all play the same game so it no problem?

Personally I think a solid floor in the market and a few untidy gardens is better than a total collapse scenario like Ireland or Spain etc.

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[binjalin]

good example, or a family of three stuck in a studio. Ot Thais, who were transferred for work to another city. As far as carrying them on their books, the big banks in the US, UK,, Germany and elsewhere do the same thing. All have been pressured by recent rule changes to "mark to market." It would be much better for everyone, if they were forced to liquidate by auction within several years (or less). The neighborhood suffer a lot, too, as there are uncollected moo baan fees, uncared for lawns, etc.. An uncared for lawn can become a jungle quick in Thailand.

"Mark to market" means to take each property and change the amount it is carried on the books to real market value. This is what at least US banks had to do, and why so many went broke. Most of the ones that went broke were absorbed by bigger banks which had the capital to take them over. The government also kicked in cash for many, and many have paid most or all of it back, but even that shows on the books as a liability if not paid.

The banks are regularly audited and the books are clean.

This is what Thai banks won't do, aren't required to do, and is the very reason that many units build in or about 1997 are still sitting empty and rotting. As long as the bank owns it, it can be carried on the books for what the value was originally stated as.

If Thai banks had to write off all of the actual losses they have from depreciated "assets," I believe many of them would be bankrupt.

Does the BOT use the "Current Exposure Method?" And isn't this accurate? Doesn't the Current Exposure Method take into consideration the Mark to Market value of property? Just saying......

The banks here are fanatical in their adherence to the principal that what is owed on a property is realized and there are 1000s of bank owned properties that will simply sit there forever, They simply don't auction them until a very long time has elapsed, occasionally a condo which is owed substantial common area fees can push the bank to sell but it is rare, and often the common area fees are more than the condo is worth. There are many here who sniff around the auctions regularly and speak Thai and they are finding it very tough to find 'bargains' - ten years ago it was easier (for some reason).