No political goals can justify violence: Thai comment

[Baerboxer]

The irony is people all over the world have died for democracy, this lot are dying because they refuse to accept it.

If anyone thinks these deaths are as meaningful then please go tell that to their families.

Strange - I thought they were standing up a against a corrupt, wannabee dictatorship, that acted illegally and repeatedly lied to the people>

Democracy - means following all the principles associated with being a democracy. Being elected isn't carte blanche to do what you like, ignore the law and enrich yourself.

Or do you think an "elected" government can do as it pleases? Just like the old Eastern Bloc democratic peoples' republics eh?

[Baerboxer]

Violence?...Attacks?...None of that is apparent...Is internally generated mayhem, Violence? Is it an attack?..It has not been proven that any of these things have occurred. Video's showed an explosive device hurled from a truck within the protesters convoy...and was not an attack...There are also video's floating around the Internet about the explosion at Victory Monument, again featuring a military type well within the security cordon of the protesters throwing it, thereby suggesting 'internally generated explosions'....They are often referrred to as "Bombs", but is that what they are?...Is a hand grenade a bomb? Is a souped-up firecracker a bomb?...Even in the Iraq/Afghanistan conflict, the things buried in the sand are referred to as "IED's - Improvised explosive devices"...Bombs are what I imagine are dropped from airplanes and kill many people. They kill more than injure. The protesters must be very frustrated needing to generate mayhem via 'explosions' instead of being attacked by forces external to themselves...They must be very angry for the ubiquitous camera's catching the sources of these explosions.....Using the descriptors such as 'bombs' and 'violence' is magnifying protester shenanigans, quite effectively for the naive...IE, I saw that CNN bottom-screen newsreel last night talking about violence and people being injured in Thailand, implying all sorts of battles between opposing forces, which is not proven to be happening....The UDD/Rs know better than to play into the hands of the protesters by doing that, and apparently the police do as well...Expect these 'explosions' to continue and be ratchetted up, as the Election draws nearer...The protesters have a very limited window of opportunity to prevent or delay them...But any tampering with this date, from whatever source, will be deemed effectively a coup....Then there may be violence and attacks.

"There are also video's floating around the Internet about the explosion at Victory Monument, again featuring a military type well within the security cordon of the protesters throwing it, thereby suggesting 'internally generated explosions'"...

Here is what I am speaking of...My first attempt at attaching a file...See if it works-gulp!

Nonsense. The only suggestion is the one you'd like it to be! You think the guards at the protests are capable of checking every single person in the vicinity - yeah, right.

There is good evidence to identify this criminal. Let's how long it takes BiB to arrest him. Then we might know something factual rather than wishful stories.

[Baerboxer]

The Thai press should call it the way it is. Sedition and anarchy. When a protest leader pre announces that he will lead the protesters to "shutdown" the city, occupy government offices, and refuse to compromise or negotiate, it can be called only sedition and anarchy.

I believe in a former British colony, now know as the USA, about 250 years ago they called it "revolution"...

Red coats / Red shirts - good analogy Mike !

As always one man's freedom fighter is another man's terrorist.

[bigbamboo]

Democracy can never be achieved through violence?

I think the writer should put his thesaurus away and get his history books out.

[Muhendis]

As sand in the hourglass relentlessly falls, it's a reminder of our vulnerability in the face of dwindling time resources. One man's frantic drive to achieve an emporial status is way beyond a mere political goal and for his clan's eternal greatness, what price a few fallen pawns?

Thats a bit intelectual for this forum don't you think?

[Alwyn]

The irony is people all over the world have died for democracy, this lot are dying because they refuse to accept it.

If anyone thinks these deaths are as meaningful then please go tell that to their families.

this lot are dying because they refuse to accept it..............as it is.

Unless you think Thai democracy is currently as good as it gets, isn't an improvement worth fighting for?

BTW they are dying because those that don't want change are prepared to kill to prevent it.

Or how about they are dying because they believe the corrupt Suthep's stories over the corrupt Thaksin's stories? How about people vote on how they feel about corruption with their feet in 2 weeks like normal people. There is a democratic system here in Thailand. Don't like corruption? Don't accept money for the vote and elect Suthep's cronies into government., murder charges and all! It's the way democracy work. Don't like it? It doesn't mean it's not democratic, it means you don't like it.

[Scamper]

The thrust of this article is correct. These atrocious acts of violence have no place in civil discourse. And now that the source of the violence is becoming ever more clear and transparent by the day, we now can objectify that outrage. But the writer of this article ends by stating that the protest leaders have too a responsibility to ensure the protection of their supporters. What have they done ? They have set up checkpoints, they have tried to engage the assistance of the police - though obviously that was bound to fail, and have taken precautions both during the night and when the walks are mapped out. Bodyguards are simply everywhere. And yet the writer is right on this point - it is not enough. But what more can they do ? They clearly do not have the advantages of the power of the administration. The administration - through the police - ultimately, has the responsibility to ensure the protection of their citizens. And to that end, they have failed miserably.

[Halion]

Violence within politics has been a stable ingredient in Thai politics since the conception of the constitution.

The congruence of this violence is testimony to the past in that there has been little development in either judicial process or law enforcement or for that mater, structured government on a national basis.

The voting public have to significantly raise there expectancy from their elected leaders on an all country basis on not on partisan enclaves alone.

Until these quasi politicians are held personally responsible to both the people and a judicial system which dispenses fair and equal justice, there be little improvement in the current status quo.

Leaders and politicians get away with tardy performance and malfeasance simply because the can and only the determined will of the people can force this change but refusing to accept what is the norm for today..

Massive reforms are needed and frankly ,it could take decades to accomplish ,if at all, as corruption and inefficient governance, nepotism and a failed judicial system have been integrated into the culture of the people in part by manipulation and in part by the tolerance of ignorance.

[Melyn]

Pictures of armed yellow guards and protesters caught with all sorts of weapons appear on social media constantly.

Who is looking for violence?

The answer is easy and Suthep should be held responsible for all deaths.

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No complaints there providing that Thaksin and the red shirt leaders get the same.

If not then there is no justice

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[Snig27]

The irony is people all over the world have died for democracy, this lot are dying because they refuse to accept it.

If anyone thinks these deaths are as meaningful then please go tell that to their families.

this lot are dying because they refuse to accept it..............as it is.

Unless you think Thai democracy is currently as good as it gets, isn't an improvement worth fighting for?

Thats what the voting platform is there for so people don't have to fight for control of the country for real and kill each other. Everyone has a voice to use every term, thats the whole point. the fact is that no opposition can be bothered to do the hard groundwork to change opinion, and every couple of years it has a tantrum because they are too lazy and stupid to take in they have to appeal with real polities and respect all walks of society.

Respect the vote and no one has to get hurt.

I completely agree.

Suthep has opened the door to all this and has to bear the bulk of the responsibility. He has a history of making people disappear so he's no angel but I don't think he is directly responsible even if evidence seems to increasingly point to rogue elements in his organisation as the culprit. However his attempt to dismantle the electoral process to his own ends makes him culpable.

Also culpable is the newspaper that has printed this opinion. They have long encouraged this lawlessness and this reeks of ugly hypocrisy. They have as much blood on their hands as anyone for championing this self-serving assault on the body politic of Thailand.

Edited January 20, 2014 by Snig27

[Snig27]

The Thai press should call it the way it is. Sedition and anarchy. When a protest leader pre announces that he will lead the protesters to "shutdown" the city, occupy government offices, and refuse to compromise or negotiate, it can be called only sedition and anarchy.

I believe in a former British colony, now know as the USA, about 250 years ago they called it "revolution"...

You misunderstand the American Revolution. It was driven by the desire for democracy and freedom from the lack of representation. Their cry was "No taxation without representation" (although it was only while males who were to get it for a very long time). They were fighting for a democracy - for 'one person one vote'. Suthep's mob are on the streets blowing whistles to achieve the exact opposite.

[NoshowJones]

Those who resort to violence to further their struggle are incompetent and cowardly.

Now who do we know that is incompetent and cowardly???

The government perhaps?

Them both. The red shirts in 2010, and the protesters today.

[NoshowJones]

Yes the whole thing is sad but its hard to have sympathy for terrorists getting attacked by other terrorists.

And as usual, it's the innocent that suffer most.

[Cricketnut]

The irony is people all over the world have died for democracy, this lot are dying because they refuse to accept it.

If anyone thinks these deaths are as meaningful then please go tell that to their families.

Strange coming from a supposedly unbiased newspaper, who now report the truth after following B/post lead that anti government protestors covered up all the CCTV cameras at VMonument. Unbiased indeed or just plain embarrassing?

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[noitom]

Actually, it's not a good analogy. The UK was occupying the colony, the US, but overtaxing them, and not giving them equal rights. They tried to negotiate, but the UK was unwilling to compromise. So they started to form collectives that went up against the UK army in order to push them back. The revolutionists almost lost if not for Washington's victory at the Delaware River. Had Washington lost at the Delaware River, my English would be better.

I believe in a former British colony, now know as the USA, about 250 years ago they called it "revolution"...

The Thai press should call it the way it is. Sedition and anarchy. When a protest leader pre announces that he will lead the protesters to "shutdown" the city, occupy government offices, and refuse to compromise or negotiate, it can be called only sedition and anarchy.

Red coats / Red shirts - good analogy Mike !

As always one man's freedom fighter is another man's terrorist.