Civil conflict is sliding towards an uncivil war: Thailand

[webfact]

Civil conflict is sliding towards an uncivil war
Walden Bello
Philippine Daily Inquirer
Asia News Network


An anti-government protester listens as protest leader Suthep Thaugsuban speaks from a stage in Bangkok last week.

But both sides' demand for justice and real democracy is the middle ground upon which a debate on the future of Thailand can be built

BANGKOK: -- The current showdown between the Pheu Thai government and the opposition is the latest round in an epic struggle between conservative and populist forces that began when Yingluck's brother Thaksin Shinawatra became prime minister in 2001.

Thaksin came to power in the aftermath of the Asian financial crisis of 1997-'98, which saw more than a million Thais drop to the ranks of the poor after one of Southeast Asia's most dynamic economies collapsed owing to capital flight followed by an austerity programme imposed by hapless governments under the thumb of the International Monetary Fund (IMF).

Thaksin had benefited from globalisation owing to his firms' monopolistic position in private telecommunications, one of the economy's most globalised sectors. Yet, with unerring populist instinct, he sensed that the financial crisis catalysed popular fears about free-market globalisation, smouldering resentment at the urban and rural elites that seemed to be cornering the country's wealth, and anger at the international financial institutions. On becoming prime minister, Thaksin made a number of dazzling, if opportunistic, moves. He paid off the country's IMF loan and kicked the Fund out of Thailand, initiated a universal healthcare system that allowed people to be treated for the equivalent of a dollar, imposed a moratorium on the payment of farmers' debts, and created a Bt1 million fund for each village that villagers could invest however they wanted.

This side of Thaksin won him a mass following among the country's deprived and marginalised sectors. But there was another side to Thaksin, the side that most of his urban and rural poor followers chose to ignore.

Thaksin literally bought his political allies, constructing in the process a potent but subservient parliamentary coalition. He used his office to enhance his wealth and that of his cronies. He failed to distinguish public interest from private gain. He gave short shrift to human rights concerns, backing a police campaign against drugs that saw the extra-judicial execution of over 2,000 people.

Like many others with overwhelming power in their hands, Thaksin overreached.

The courts ruled that while prime minister, he abused his power to help his wife buy public land at auction, and sentenced him to two years in jail. He was also stripped of Bt46 billion, half his wealth, for failing to declare his assets when he sold his 48 per cent stake in Shin Corp to Singapore's Temasek in January 2006.

Fast forward eight years and the widespread perception that Prime Minister Yingluck is a "puppet" for her brother turned into protest when her government tried to push through an amnesty bill that would have forgiven all those charged in connection with 2010's tragic street protests. The opposition contended, however, that the bill was mainly a ploy to allow Thaksin to return to the country without having to serve out his jail term. This was confirmed when in an early morning parliamentary manoeuvre, the ruling coalition rammed through a provision that would extend the amnesty to 10 years before 2010.

Yingluck's counterstroke against the Bangkok "shutdown" was to dissolve Parliament in mid-December and set new elections for February 2. Sensing it had momentum, the opposition called for a boycott, insisting that Yingluck step down and calling for the formation of an unelected council that would formulate reforms.

The opposition's stand against elections has deepened the divisions within Thailand's liberal and progressive community. For Kraisak Choonhavan, an ex-parliamentarian and one of the pillars of the human rights community, non-participation in the February 2 elections was justified by the fact that the priority is a "total reform" of the electoral system. "Every democracy needs such a period of reform," he contends.

To others, the principle of one person-one vote, the basic tenet of democracy, is what is at stake. Chris Baker, who together with his equally prominent wife, economist Pasuk Pongpaichit, has written some of the most comprehensive exposes of Thaksin's amassing of wealth and power, expressed concern that key forces in the PDRC "have clearly said they think Bangkok people should have more weight in the elections than non-Bangkok people".

The Bangkok Post, a supporter of the street protests against the amnesty bill, drew the line at protest leader Suthep Thaugsuban's call to boycott the elections, characterising it a "deeply flawed plan" that "contains hugely anti-democratic principles that are troubling at best. The entire call for a year or more of this country under an unelected, unaccountable 'council' is unacceptable."

To many liberals and progressives, recent remarks by scholar-activist Thirayut Boonmi, who has iconic status as key leader of the historic 1976 student uprising, are troubling. According to an account of his comments at a recent forum that appeared in The Nation, Thirayut acknowledged that while the anti-government movement "consists of a minority in Thai society, mostly from the middle classes and people from the South", he argued that "those who voted for the Yingluck Shinawatra administration have forfeited their rights by accepting a corrupt and dictatorial government, which would have to be removed by a 'people's revolution." To people like Thirayut and Kraisak, extraordinary means are needed to rescue Thailand from what they feel is the all-pervasive corruption of the country's institutions by the Shinawatra family, which Thirayut likens to a "flock of mating vultures".

What is clear is that both sides of the political divide defy simplistic explanations. The protesters are not simply tools manipulated by traditional political and economic elites whose interests are threatened by Thaksin, as some pro-government analysts have characterised them.

Most see themselves as participants in a grand crusade against corruption. On the other hand, many among the masses that have brought the red-shirt coalitions to power are not bought and corrupted by Thaksin's money, as they are portrayed in anti-government speeches; they really feel that they are fighting to salvage democratic rule and economic justice against reactionaries.

Perhaps this universal demand for justice and real democracy is a middle ground upon which a debate on the future of Thailand can be built.

While the protests have still remained largely non-violent, instances of violence, including grenade attacks last month, portend another bloody denouement like May 2010. Some pro-government sources people think the PDRC strategy is to provoke the military to intervene to oust Yingluck and impose Suthep's unelected Reform Council.

There is tremendous hesitation on the part of the military to embark on this, given the terrible experience it had in governing the country after the 2006 coup, though another putsch this time is not out of the question.

With no third force to break the deadlock, there is no prospect in sight except deeper and sharper polarisation. If Yingluck is ousted, it will be the turn of the red shirts to invade Bangkok. Following the opposition's failed court bid to have the February 2 poll declared null and void, elections may eventually put another Pheu Thai government in power, but this will not bring an end to the opposition's refusal to grant legitimacy to any Thaksin-led government and put its middle-class muscle to oust it. For many on both sides, it is no longer a question of if but when this deep-seated civil conflict descends into outright civil war.

Walden Bello is a member of the Philippine House of Representatives and is principal author of "Siamese Tragedy: Development and Degradation in Modern Thailand".

-- The Nation 2014-02-14

[TVGerry]

Unfortunately quite true. There is no middle ground here until one side is utterly gone. Civil war seems to be the only way out since both sides don't seem to want to budge. An alternative would be to let the North and Northeast just break away and form the Shin Republic. Would love to see how they manage without the 'urban middle class elite royalists' from Bangkok bothering them.

[cdmtdm]

i wonder if that happens who will do all the manual labor ? more burmese ?for sure it wont be the Isaan folk ... Civil war or a breakaway state is the only real solution imo .... or a messiah appears in the form of a new political party with no ties to any of the present imbeciles .....

[terryp]

almost 40 years here in Thailand and this is the time I can see civil war on the horizon ...so sad for a Country with massive potential

[Curt1591]

Unfortunately quite true. There is no middle ground here until one side is utterly gone.

I was listening to a couple neighbors discussing the situation, in Thai. Three times during the conversation the word "compromise" was clearly said, in English.

I guess there is no Thai word for "compromise"!

[chainarong]

As Thailand is incapable of running their affairs without conflict, the only reasonable solution to avoid a civil war is to return to military rule, I say this with a heavy heart , but, I do not want to see a civil war that brings total loss , you need to pull the country into line , off load all the dead wood, bring reforms in with lasting benefit , introduce democracy with the help from the Academic's, to divide the country would be counter productive , infrastructure, communications , defence industry ,etc all need support from the whole of Thailand, Thai senior Commanders would be keeping any eye on the situation , you can bet on that.

[virtualtraveller]

Tell us something new Walden, any one of 10 people on this forum could have written a background article like that on the crisis.

[GeorgeO]

i wonder if that happens who will do all the manual labor ? more burmese ?for sure it wont be the Isaan folk ... Civil war or a breakaway state is the only real solution imo .... or a messiah appears in the form of a new political party with no ties to any of the present imbeciles .....

I have been saying for some time that the only way out of this is for a new party to come to the fore based upon a solemn pledge from all participants that they will never use their position for personal gain. Anyone who later decided to 'drift' into corrupt practices should be dealt with in accordance with the full weight of the law for breaching their solemn pledge.

This would have no attraction whatsoever to any of those (who do not need to be named here) whose sole purpose of being in politics is to line their own pockets. Given time, such a dedicated party would become the major force in Thai politics, xenophobic attitudes could be quashed thereby leading to a greater willingness to seek suggestions and advice from outside, ultimately leading to a greater willingness for foreign nations to once again engage in FDI, and the country would be allowed to prosper.

Corruption could be rooted out, appropriate infrastructure policies could be pursued based upon appropriate use of taxes, the police force could (and should) be overhauled, law and order could be truly enforced, and the country could be turned around within a single generation.

However ...... the reality for the time being is that this is still a "Me First" society, and anything which is for the good of the nation continues to be of low priority in the minds of many, if not the vast majority, of its citizens.

[bangkokheat]

never judge a politician by how much he takes, but by how much he gives back, thaksins probably pissed off because half his wealth was seized, perhaps the rice scam was his way of regaining his seized assets

[pete66]

Unfortunately quite true. There is no middle ground here until one side is utterly gone.

I was listening to a couple neighbors discussing the situation, in Thai. Three times during the conversation the word "compromise" was clearly said, in English.

I guess there is no Thai word for "compromise"!

This is the thai word for compromise

ประนีประนอม

Source- English-Thai Dictionary for students

How's that pronounced? Is it "bpranee-bpranoarm"

Depends which transliteration protocol you follow. I have no idea how you think "noarm" sounds but its probably right. Its just an 'n' sound followed by long 'o' sound (hard 'o' as in word mOnster), then 'm'

I would encourage to learn anyone that wants to learn Thai to use the Thai script, instead of phonetics. Phonetics make it *really* difficult. Thai script is so much easier.

[stickylies]

just copy paste in google translate and click listen...

[kikoman]

The Idiotic Idea that the military should lead the country is tantamount to giving the Elite free hand in running the country, and clearly not acceptable to the people of the free democratic Thailand, who would be better off with the division of the country rather than give up it Democratic ideals to a dictatorship or of a civil war.

As Bangkok is dependent for its water supply from the red sections of the country, a compromise can be worked out between both countries for free Thailand to supply water and rice to the Dictatorship in exchange for a seaport facility for Free Thailand.

Cheers

[Thait Spot]

The Idiotic Idea that the military should lead the country is tantamount to giving the Elite free hand in running the country, and clearly not acceptable to the people of the free democratic Thailand, who would be better off with the division of the country rather than give up it Democratic ideals to a dictatorship or of a civil war.

As Bangkok is dependent for its water supply from the red sections of the country, a compromise can be worked out between both countries for free Thailand to supply water and rice to the Dictatorship in exchange for a seaport facility for Free Thailand.

Cheers

What on earth are you smoking?

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[Bluespunk]

The Idiotic Idea that the military should lead the country is tantamount to giving the Elite free hand in running the country, and clearly not acceptable to the people of the free democratic Thailand, who would be better off with the division of the country rather than give up it Democratic ideals to a dictatorship or of a civil war.

As Bangkok is dependent for its water supply from the red sections of the country, a compromise can be worked out between both countries for free Thailand to supply water and rice to the Dictatorship in exchange for a seaport facility for Free Thailand.

Cheers

Where does this article call for the military to lead the country? I'll read the article again but not seeing that. There was one sentence saying that pro govt factions are alleging that is what pdrc, but we all know allegations aren't facts, don't we? Edited February 14, 2014 by Bluespunk

[stickylies]

the solution is simple: substantial change. probably with (some) violence, as that's us-humans' "way" in solving shit... every "developed" country went through that too.

Edited February 14, 2014 by stickylies

[Prbkk]

It may look like the brink but a compromise solution will be found without violence. All parties have too much to lose by NOT coming to a negotiated settlement. Suthep has taken this way too far and the sane voices in the democrats will now emerge to engage in dialogue

[Bluespunk]

It may look like the brink but a compromise solution will be found without violence. All parties have too much to lose by NOT coming to a negotiated settlement. Suthep has taken this way too far and the sane voices in the democrats will now emerge to engage in dialogue

All for that.

Though as is my wont I will say that suthep and his pdrc are still not the Dems.

Edited February 14, 2014 by Bluespunk

[stickylies]

^^ there is violence already... when i say violence i don't mean machetes and stuff...

anyway, we in the west had the same thing decades ago when the working class didn't take it any longer...

[rreddin]

Unfortunately quite true. There is no middle ground here until one side is utterly gone. Civil war seems to be the only way out since both sides don't seem to want to budge. An alternative would be to let the North and Northeast just break away and form the Shin Republic. Would love to see how they manage without the 'urban middle class elite royalists' from Bangkok bothering them.

Actually, quite wrong. This whole saga is not about populist polices or politicians - even Suthep made populist policies when he was an MP. Or even about Bangkok middle calsses against rural Thais. It is about which of two possible contenders is the next monarch of this country. The Nation and the other English language newspaper in this country are part of a group that supports one of those respected people. Each of these respected persons has support from parts of the "elite Royalists", influential politicians, parts of the armed forces, parts of the police, and business leaders. As the Prime Minister of the day has some influence in the choice of monarch, the faction of which The Nation is part wants to see "their man" leading the government when the time comes for that choice to be made. The Bangkok middle classes and now the farmers are just pawns in this power struggle.

One thing we can draw from The Nation's article is that this power struggle looks likely to go to the wire, which is why they are trying to bolster the position of "their side" by alarmist talk of civil war. This article casts some light on who is in which camp: http://asiapacific.anu.edu.au/newmandala/2014/02/07/the-weakness-of-the-thai-royalists/

[noitom]

The author almost succeeded in mentioning Thaksin, his sister, Pheu Thai or Shin Co in every paragraph. Almost any pr is good. The Thai press has been aggrandizing Thaksin in five out of six lead stories every day and engendering acrimony and conflict. Why do you think he is so popular?

Edited February 14, 2014 by noitom

[Imale]

Unfortunately quite true. There is no middle ground here until one side is utterly gone.

I was listening to a couple neighbors discussing the situation, in Thai. Three times during the conversation the word "compromise" was clearly said, in English.

I guess there is no Thai word for "compromise"!

It is normally not very meaningful to argue that if Language A borrows a word from Language B, it means that Language A has no word for the concept so described or never had the concept .

English borrowed 'second' from French, when it already had 'other', which then took on a different meaning.

If you follow Curt1591's line of thinking, then note that the Thai word คอร์รับชั่น (kho-rap-chan) is regularly heard on the PRDC stage and elsewhere. Are we therefore to assume that Thai has no word for 'corruption' and that the concept is a novel one for Thais?

[JeffreyWitty]

Civil War?

Well, that's more than 1 persons OPINION.

[Maggusoil]

almost 40 years here in Thailand and this is the time I can see civil war on the horizon ...so sad for a Country with massive potential

i wonder if that happens who will do all the manual labor ? more burmese ?for sure it wont be the Isaan folk ... Civil war or a breakaway state is the only real solution imo .... or a messiah appears in the form of a new political party with no ties to any of the present imbeciles .....

Most 2 party democracies suffer from this same problem. The parties maintain their power through local representatives. The representatives are beholden to the power brokers in the parties they come from and instead of acting for their constituents, they toe the party line. They break promises and do as they're told.

Sometimes, like in Australia a mediating force can be a party that controls the Senate or upper house and even then, there are many compromises. More independent representatives, directly and only directly responsible for their own areas ensures that their constituents concerns are properly taken care of.

Some people put forward a coalition of independents is a way to go.

The problem in Thailand is not so much voting but freedom of speech. As long as draconian laws against this freedom exist, the truths can never be fully discussed in public.

Ignorance that can spill over into violence, as the frustration with a non-transparent system rises.

There definitely seems to be a dire need for a 3rd political force in Thailand and a charismatic, honest intellectual to lead it.

[thhMan]

Sometimes a kid does need a spanking to learn humility and respect... The kid is Thailand of course...

Edited February 14, 2014 by thhMan

[tingtongteesood]

Unfortunately quite true. There is no middle ground here until one side is utterly gone. Civil war seems to be the only way out since both sides don't seem to want to budge. An alternative would be to let the North and Northeast just break away and form the Shin Republic. Would love to see how they manage without the 'urban middle class elite royalists' from Bangkok bothering them.

Actually, quite wrong. This whole saga is not about populist polices or politicians - even Suthep made populist policies when he was an MP. Or even about Bangkok middle calsses against rural Thais. It is about which of two possible contenders is the next monarch of this country. The Nation and the other English language newspaper in this country are part of a group that supports one of those respected people. Each of these respected persons has support from parts of the "elite Royalists", influential politicians, parts of the armed forces, parts of the police, and business leaders. As the Prime Minister of the day has some influence in the choice of monarch, the faction of which The Nation is part wants to see "their man" leading the government when the time comes for that choice to be made. The Bangkok middle classes and now the farmers are just pawns in this power struggle.

One thing we can draw from The Nation's article is that this power struggle looks likely to go to the wire, which is why they are trying to bolster the position of "their side" by alarmist talk of civil war. This article casts some light on who is in which camp: http://asiapacific.anu.edu.au/newmandala/2014/02/07/the-weakness-of-the-thai-royalists/

That article is a load of clearly biased red nonsense written by an idiot on a red biased idiots crap website. Notice how they take every opportunity to trash the opposition in the article. Total waste of brain cells, nothing intelligent in there at all..

Yet another lame attempt to distract people's attention away from the crimes committed by the Shin regime and try and make people ignore the poor farmer's plight.

Edited February 14, 2014 by tingtongteesood

[Why ask]

Unfortunately quite true. There is no middle ground here until one side is utterly gone. Civil war seems to be the only way out since both sides don't seem to want to budge. An alternative would be to let the North and Northeast just break away and form the Shin Republic. Would love to see how they manage without the 'urban middle class elite royalists' from Bangkok bothering them.

This article casts some light on who is in which camp: http://asiapacific.anu.edu.au/newmandala/2014/02/07/the-weakness-of-the-thai-royalists/

Good Lord, what a load of complete codswallop that article is, from a spectator who neither even lives here nor obviously knows Thailand very well.

That was a lecture in one vision, from one single perspective, and from yours truly - a Thaksin freak. No mention of corruption, not a mention of the financial rape, no mention of the illegal deaths caused, and no mention of a corrupt fugitive who illegally interferes with the operations of a government leading a country whilst in exile.

Tremendous insight that lecturer has... NOT!

[Why ask]

Unfortunately quite true. There is no middle ground here until one side is utterly gone. Civil war seems to be the only way out since both sides don't seem to want to budge. An alternative would be to let the North and Northeast just break away and form the Shin Republic. Would love to see how they manage without the 'urban middle class elite royalists' from Bangkok bothering them.

Actually, quite wrong. This whole saga is not about populist polices or politicians - even Suthep made populist policies when he was an MP. Or even about Bangkok middle calsses against rural Thais. It is about which of two possible contenders is the next monarch of this country. The Nation and the other English language newspaper in this country are part of a group that supports one of those respected people. Each of these respected persons has support from parts of the "elite Royalists", influential politicians, parts of the armed forces, parts of the police, and business leaders. As the Prime Minister of the day has some influence in the choice of monarch, the faction of which The Nation is part wants to see "their man" leading the government when the time comes for that choice to be made. The Bangkok middle classes and now the farmers are just pawns in this power struggle.

One thing we can draw from The Nation's article is that this power struggle looks likely to go to the wire, which is why they are trying to bolster the position of "their side" by alarmist talk of civil war. This article casts some light on who is in which camp: http://asiapacific.anu.edu.au/newmandala/2014/02/07/the-weakness-of-the-thai-royalists/

That article is a load of clearly biased red nonsense written by an idiot on a red biased idiots crap website. Notice how they take every opportunity to trash the opposition in the article. Total waste of brain cells, nothing intelligent in there at all..

Yet another lame attempt to distract people's attention away from the crimes committed by the Shin regime and try and make people ignore the poor farmer's plight.

My apologies.... we wrote at the same time 555

[DeepInTheForest]

Unfortunately quite true. There is no middle ground here until one side is utterly gone.

I was listening to a couple neighbors discussing the situation, in Thai. Three times during the conversation the word "compromise" was clearly said, in English.

I guess there is no Thai word for "compromise"!

This is the thai word for compromise

ประนีประนอม

Source- English-Thai Dictionary for students

The English language word was obtained from Middle French around 500 years ago. http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=compromise

At the time, apparently, English did not yet have the word "compromise". Does that mean that English people did not know the meaning of the word? I don't think so. Languages overlap and borrow from one another all the time. The English language itself is a prime example of this. How many French words transported to English do you know? How many from Spanish?

Could we somehow refrain from looking for cultural superiority at every opportunity, and maybe try to celebrate the better aspects of different cultures once in awhile?

Ok, lecture over.

Edited February 14, 2014 by DeepInTheForest

[thhMan]

Unfortunately quite true. There is no middle ground here until one side is utterly gone. Civil war seems to be the only way out since both sides don't seem to want to budge. An alternative would be to let the North and Northeast just break away and form the Shin Republic. Would love to see how they manage without the 'urban middle class elite royalists' from Bangkok bothering them.

This article casts some light on who is in which camp: http://asiapacific.anu.edu.au/newmandala/2014/02/07/the-weakness-of-the-thai-royalists/

Good Lord, what a load of complete codswallop that article is, from a spectator who neither even lives here nor obviously knows Thailand very well.

That was a lecture in one vision, from one single perspective, and from yours truly - a Thaksin freak. No mention of corruption, not a mention of the financial rape, no mention of the illegal deaths caused, and no mention of a corrupt fugitive who illegally interferes with the operations of a government leading a country whilst in exile.

Tremendous insight that lecturer has... NOT!

I wouldn't be too judgmental... and thats from someone that has lived here 8 years, has a wife and 2 kids...

5 minutes watching police and traffic, will convince you there is no law and order. A bribe will pay for no helmet, speeding and even being grossly intoxicated behind the wheel.

Then there is the racial side of Thailand. Something the Western world is well aware of and is still shaking off. Thailand has yet to acknowledge it even exists.

Then there is the rights of an individual.... If your not Thai... its very difficult to get justice.

Some schools discourage half breeds to attend. There are quotes from TV parents who have been told some disgusting things about what the teachers at school are telling the kids, with no actions to squash that behavior from principals or Human Rights departments.

Put all of this in a melting pot called Thailand.. add lack of respect, lack of justice, corruption and a self importance attitude over the rest of the world and that is a normal day in Thailand...

Then at some point, a Thai figures out how people get elected (vote buying) and finds that WRONG... then creates an illegal and destructive action using people to right the wrong and its all gets more confusing for the outsider. Thats when you get situations like this... Its a c-ock fight.... nothing more.... and as usual, the country suffers time and time again... because lessons are never learned and measures are never taken to make sure that situations like this can be dealt with like intelligent, educated people.

Perhaps comment on what you know and not what you think you know, because perception changes when you live here....

[Why ask]

Unfortunately quite true. There is no middle ground here until one side is utterly gone. Civil war seems to be the only way out since both sides don't seem to want to budge. An alternative would be to let the North and Northeast just break away and form the Shin Republic. Would love to see how they manage without the 'urban middle class elite royalists' from Bangkok bothering them.

This article casts some light on who is in which camp: http://asiapacific.anu.edu.au/newmandala/2014/02/07/the-weakness-of-the-thai-royalists/

Good Lord, what a load of complete codswallop that article is, from a spectator who neither even lives here nor obviously knows Thailand very well.

That was a lecture in one vision, from one single perspective, and from yours truly - a Thaksin freak. No mention of corruption, not a mention of the financial rape, no mention of the illegal deaths caused, and no mention of a corrupt fugitive who illegally interferes with the operations of a government leading a country whilst in exile.

Tremendous insight that lecturer has... NOT!

I wouldn't be too judgmental... and thats from someone that has lived here 8 years, has a wife and 2 kids...

5 minutes watching police and traffic, will convince you there is no law and order. A bribe will pay for no helmet, speeding and even being grossly intoxicated behind the wheel.

Then there is the racial side of Thailand. Something the Western world is well aware of and is still shaking off. Thailand has yet to acknowledge it even exists.

Then there is the rights of an individual.... If your not Thai... its very difficult to get justice.

Some schools discourage half breeds to attend. There are quotes from TV parents who have been told some disgusting things about what the teachers at school are telling the kids, with no actions to squash that behavior from principals or Human Rights departments.

Put all of this in a melting pot called Thailand.. add lack of respect, lack of justice, corruption and a self importance attitude over the rest of the world and that is a normal day in Thailand...

Then at some point, a Thai figures out how people get elected (vote buying) and finds that WRONG... then creates an illegal and destructive action using people to right the wrong and its all gets more confusing for the outsider. Thats when you get situations like this... Its a c-ock fight.... nothing more.... and as usual, the country suffers time and time again... because lessons are never learned and measures are never taken to make sure that situations like this can be dealt with like intelligent, educated people.

Perhaps comment on what you know and not what you think you know, because perception changes when you live here....

Lived here a lot longer than you have

And the article included no reference to anything you alluded to... I wonder why not? Police are all Thaksin cronies too!

Edited February 14, 2014 by Why ask