thailand missing opportunities by No foreign ownership

[12DrinkMore]

Politics, dear boy, politics.

Thailand is still a rural society in many ways. Land is extremely important to Thais, it represents a store of wealth and security. They don't trust paper and with good reason.

No Thai politician is going to risk his place at the trough by advocating changes to the law in favour

of falangs. Falangs have no votes. Period. Full stop.

Most Thais are parochial, they know little and care even less about international investment or happy falangs or the long term.

As long as their rice bowl is full, little else matters.

Yep, they certainly do have an issue with full rice warehouses, let alone bowls.

[jacksam]

I give up. At the moment Thailand is a basket case. Its kept alive by tourism. Yes we all love Thailand but let's get real. This is a time bomb . The infrastructure here I.e rail and light transport is a joke. Google this . kilometers of light rail in bkk and same for say Melbourne. Its like 10 tomes in favour of Melbourne with population one quarter Thai. Point is you selfish expats need to think about long term Thai and not your own life expectancy

[Beetlejuice]

If farangs were given more leeways to gain footholds here in Thailand, then right from the beginning the system would be open to abuse and corruption, it would be a land grab on a major scale.

In order to gain land and real estate, there would be marriages of convenience, land and property speculators and dealing with corrupt Thai officials to give farangs priority land purchasing options as they would have more money. Many middle class and poor Thais would not be able to compete, as land and property values would escalate, they would literally be out priced and pushed out of the land and housing markets.

It is happening now only on a smaller scale. Farangs owning land and real estate they are not legally entitled to own, property speculators using farang money and running businesses on agricultural land.

Letting farangs freely into the land and property markets would be a disaster for Thailand and these are the reasons it will never happen.

[khunPer]

In Denmark within European Union foreign nationals cannot own land or property, even nationals from other EU countries. A Danish national moving abroad have to give up both property and any rented flat. However, a summerhouse, allowed for maximum stay less than 180 days a year, is legal to own for a Danish national living abroad. Politic to prevent for example Germans to buy up Danish land and summerhouses – they can rent, but not even own a condo – so not that different, thus even more restrictive than Thailand. Doesn’t seem like Denmark is missing any opportunities, being in the absolute European financial top – Thailand may not miss any opportunities either…

[spidermike007]

Not medieval -- 1954 as in Land Code Act B.E. 2497 (1954) as further amended.

I was being a little sarcastic. I was referring to Thai methods of construction. From foundations to the pillar/infill walls. I'm suggesting is when you allow people from overseas to work and own such things as real estate, you untap so many skills and techniques.

Australia did this post WW2 and has ripped the rewards from Europe and other areas. A closed country falls behind quickly in the long run.

Though I have been criticized in the past for making such a suggestion on a lot of levels Thailand is paying a heavy price, for never having been colonized. I know that sounds harsh. But, think of how much Malaysia, Singapore, the Philippines, and many others benefitted from the exposure to the world this brings. I understand it also brings many other terrible aspects, such as was the case with India in particular. But, foreign languages are learned, other forms of construction, engineering, etc. In addition to widening the culture. Many Thais are not open to different ways of doing things, and few ever pick up a book or a learning manual, unless it is required reading at school, or on the job. Many would benefit from exposure to the outside world, and the amazing world of books, and adult learning. What a concept. LOL.

[khunPer]

Not medieval -- 1954 as in Land Code Act B.E. 2497 (1954) as further amended.

I was being a little sarcastic. I was referring to Thai methods of construction. From foundations to the pillar/infill walls. I'm suggesting is when you allow people from overseas to work and own such things as real estate, you untap so many skills and techniques.

Australia did this post WW2 and has ripped the rewards from Europe and other areas. A closed country falls behind quickly in the long run.

Foreigners can be partner / shareholder in building construction companies and run a company as active directors – many actually are – so great possibilities to improve building construction techniques.

By the way many medieval houses lasts for hundred of years, whilst many modern building don’t last – some of the old-fashioned medieval building techniques like timber-framed houses are not that different from the Thai cement post constructions, other than the posts are not made by wood.

[khunPer]

It would double, triple the prices for the locals

Thai nationals seem to be very good to pump up prices without any “help” from the foreigners already on the market through various available instruments (company, girlfriend, wife etc.).

[commie Joe]

I give up. At the moment Thailand is a basket case. Its kept alive by tourism. Yes we all love Thailand but let's get real. This is a time bomb . The infrastructure here I.e rail and light transport is a joke. Google this . kilometers of light rail in bkk and same for say Melbourne. Its like 10 tomes in favour of Melbourne with population one quarter Thai. Point is you selfish expats need to think about long term Thai and not your own life expectancy

Thailand has a long way to go before it moves out of 3rd world status & maybe it never will . Untill such times just like the USA it will be inward looking. That is a fact about 3rd world countries & a way of protecting themselfs from the multinational sharks . It also keeps the price of housing within the reach of Thai people working in the Cities. Open up Thailand to foriegn ownership of land & things will get much more expensive.

It is all about prices. Which when I look around at all the empty housing points to the prices being beyond the pockets of most Thais so a bubble. The fact that they don't earth electricity (no law that they must) just to save 5000bt on the average townhouse is an indicator of cutting to the bone to keep prices down.

I dont think it is kept alive by tourism , the food industry is the backbone & the tax's on imports keeps it that way . However if the western countries that allow Thai products into their countries due to Thailands Third world status decide to tax them Thai products then Thailand will be nackered.

So given the way things are here I would say its not so easy to change the ownership laws

[khunPer]

I give up. At the moment Thailand is a basket case. Its kept alive by tourism. Yes we all love Thailand but let's get real. This is a time bomb . The infrastructure here I.e rail and light transport is a joke. Google this . kilometers of light rail in bkk and same for say Melbourne. Its like 10 tomes in favour of Melbourne with population one quarter Thai. Point is you selfish expats need to think about long term Thai and not your own life expectancy

I think tourism counts for some 9 to 15 percent – was 9 percent a few years ago but may have gone up since. So some 85 to 90 percent foreign currency inflow comes from other sources – not “kept alive by tourism”.

[thaiguzzi]

It would double, triple the prices for the locals

Sorry. Disagree completely. Money comes from overseas. As land currently owned by Thai, it turns nothing plots into rentable properties. Actually buts more supply also an injection in realoney terms to Thailand. Win win

And i disagree again. Check central London prices out, and who owns it. Not the English, but all new Arab and Russian money. And it's ridiculous money.There is a fair good thing to restricting foreign land ownership in most countries.

[thaiguzzi]

I give up. At the moment Thailand is a basket case. Its kept alive by tourism. Yes we all love Thailand but let's get real. This is a time bomb . The infrastructure here I.e rail and light transport is a joke. Google this . kilometers of light rail in bkk and same for say Melbourne. Its like 10 tomes in favour of Melbourne with population one quarter Thai. Point is you selfish expats need to think about long term Thai and not your own life expectancy

All the above is crap. Tourism alone does not keep Thailand alive. Want Western infrastructure - go back home. I've lived here over 10 years, and one of the main reasons i prefer it to the West, is because it IS a basket case, and not a pristine immaculate nanny state. By the way, construction methods are generally fine over here too.

[wym]

Foreigners that want to own/control land in Thailand ......already do by the various means available.

And the very clever Thais (and sometimes farang scamming farang) have convinced them their "investment" is "safe".

Far from it, anytime they feel like it the government can "crack down" and just take the property back for having been obtained illegally, e.g. nominee directors.

I give up. At the moment Thailand is a basket case. Its kept alive by tourism. Yes we all love Thailand but let's get real. This is a time bomb . The infrastructure here I.e rail and light transport is a joke. Google this . kilometers of light rail in bkk and same for say Melbourne. Its like 10 tomes in favour of Melbourne with population one quarter Thai. Point is you selfish expats need to think about long term Thai and not your own life expectancy

Tourism's share of the Thai economy has been steadily declining. Yes 10% or so is significant, but hardly critical.

Sure it's less developed, but development for it's own sake is not a good thing in itself.

Empty land is wonderful, rampant construction a blight wherever it shows up.

Thailand is DEFINITELY wise to prevent foreign ownership of its land.

Now business startups and actually encouraging skilled immigration, those are other topics and I agree should be opened up a lot more.

But not land ownership or RE development business.

[thailiketoo]

What percent of land bought in Thailand is owned by Americans and Chinese? American Treaty of Amity and the Chinese through family connections. What do you think all those new hotels are financed by Thai money?

[BudRight]

In Denmark within European Union foreign nationals cannot own land or property, even nationals from other EU countries. A Danish national moving abroad have to give up both property and any rented flat. However, a summerhouse, allowed for maximum stay less than 180 days a year, is legal to own for a Danish national living abroad. Politic to prevent for example Germans to buy up Danish land and summerhouses – they can rent, but not even own a condo – so not that different, thus even more restrictive than Thailand. Doesn’t seem like Denmark is missing any opportunities, being in the absolute European financial top – Thailand may not miss any opportunities either…

Most of this is untrue, not that it matters anyway as this thread is about Thailand. I'm extremely bored with the 'oohh a found a country where it's more messed up than Thailand so that makes it totally okay' game.

[rgs2001uk]

I give up. At the moment Thailand is a basket case. Its kept alive by tourism. Yes we all love Thailand but let's get real. This is a time bomb . The infrastructure here I.e rail and light transport is a joke. Google this . kilometers of light rail in bkk and same for say Melbourne. Its like 10 tomes in favour of Melbourne with population one quarter Thai. Point is you selfish expats need to think about long term Thai and not your own life expectancy

All the above is crap. Tourism alone does not keep Thailand alive. Want Western infrastructure - go back home. I've lived here over 10 years, and one of the main reasons i prefer it to the West, is because it IS a basket case, and not a pristine immaculate nanny state. By the way, construction methods are generally fine over here too.

Excellent post.

Just another Johnny come to late farang property developer who wants to rape and pillage the place, turn it into another shithole a la Hua Hin, Pattaya, etc etc.

Thankfully there are still places left undevolped by these get rich quick fly by nights.

Melbounre, <deleted> do me a favour.

[thehelmsman]

Your all missing the point.

Foreign ownership for INDIVIDUALS would not push up prices. I give up. . Clearly no one here understands wealth creation for Thai people, not farang. I never suggested company players or foreign condo development. This joint is stuffed for Thai people because there is very low tax on land and the rich sit on it. And the not rich cannot sell it or use it. The land is owned by Thai people, broaden the purchaser based market and they make money. Very subjective that a farang will make much. Would be better investing in AU. . They would do it as they want to live here.

No matter how you slice or dice it. Thailand not allowing foreigners to own land is better for the Thai people. It's not working so well for the US where anybody with money can buy as they please.

[thailiketoo]

Singapore-based property firm Frasers Centrepoint (FCL) will raise its profile and increase its investments in Thailand as part of its future strategy for growth as a stand-alone entity.

http://www.asianewsnet.net/Spore-property-firm-to-boost-presence-in-Thailand-55663.html

Is it a problem for foreign people to invest in property in Thailand? No. You want to buy a hotel of small town on the ocean? No problem.

Edited March 7, 2014 by thailiketoo

[wym]

No matter how you slice or dice it. Thailand not allowing foreigners to own land is better for the Thai people. It's not working so well for the US where anybody with money can buy as they please.

Actually it's working out just fine for the people that matter. American's don't feel so insecure realize it doesn't matter who owns the land, letting in foreigners is the basis for our growth historically and for the future.

The bottom half of the population's never going to own any property anymore, and the middle class is quickly disappearing, creating third-world conditions internally will ensure a hungry pool of cheap labor, won't even have to send jobs overseas anymore cheaper to staff the factory locally.

Edited March 7, 2014 by wym

[jacksam]

Someone is comparing Denmark foreign ownership policy to Thailand . again I give up. Denmark along with UK dutch Spain etc were worlds apart from Thailand. Let's stick to point. Thailand needs change even at cost if expats living high on the hog.

[jacksam]

I give up. At the moment Thailand is a basket case. Its kept alive by tourism. Yes we all love Thailand but let's get real. This is a time bomb . The infrastructure here I.e rail and light transport is a joke. Google this . kilometers of light rail in bkk and same for say Melbourne. Its like 10 tomes in favour of Melbourne with population one quarter Thai. Point is you selfish expats need to think about long term Thai and not your own life expectancy

All the above is crap. Tourism alone does not keep Thailand alive. Want Western infrastructure - go back home. I've lived here over 10 years, and one of the main reasons i prefer it to the West, is because it IS a basket case, and not a pristine immaculate nanny state. By the way, construction methods are generally fine over here too.

Excellent post.

Just another Johnny come to late farang property developer who wants to rape and pillage the place, turn it into another shithole a la Hua Hin, Pattaya, etc etc.

Thankfully there are still places left undevolped by these get rich quick fly by nights.

Melbounre, <deleted> do me a favour.

You think pattaya developments etc are done with overseas ownership?

Reference to Melbourne ??? What you on about. Voted most livable city 3 out of last 4 years. Where you from ? Thailand ! NO

[thailiketoo]

Someone is comparing Denmark foreign ownership policy to Thailand . again I give up. Denmark along with UK dutch Spain etc were worlds apart from Thailand. Let's stick to point. Thailand needs change even at cost if expats living high on the hog.

Do you really think that the government in Thailand has any way to keep land prices under control? Do you see all of the new construction going on?

[thehelmsman]

No matter how you slice or dice it. Thailand not allowing foreigners to own land is better for the Thai people. It's not working so well for the US where anybody with money can buy as they please.

Actually it's working out just fine for the people that matter. American's don't feel so insecure realize it doesn't matter who owns the land, letting in foreigners is the basis for our growth historically and for the future.

The bottom half of the population's never going to own any property anymore, and the middle class is quickly disappearing, creating third-world conditions internally will ensure a hungry pool of cheap labor, won't even have to send jobs overseas anymore cheaper to staff the factory locally.

Thank you for the cheerful report.

[jacksam]

Someone is comparing Denmark foreign ownership policy to Thailand . again I give up. Denmark along with UK dutch Spain etc were worlds apart from Thailand. Let's stick to point. Thailand needs change even at cost if expats living high on the hog.

Do you really think that the government in Thailand has any way to keep land prices under control? Do you see all of the new construction going on?

Good point. I am trying to work out what is driving all the condo developments???

I'm in kanchanaburi at present. Nice place but many joints empty. Why I see 3 five story developments. Correct me please but this must be from very rich Thai groups same as drives pattaya jomtien etc. Someone please tell me this is foreign driven.

[thailiketoo]

Someone is comparing Denmark foreign ownership policy to Thailand . again I give up. Denmark along with UK dutch Spain etc were worlds apart from Thailand. Let's stick to point. Thailand needs change even at cost if expats living high on the hog.

Do you really think that the government in Thailand has any way to keep land prices under control? Do you see all of the new construction going on?

Good point. I am trying to work out what is driving all the condo developments???

I'm in kanchanaburi at present. Nice place but many joints empty. Why I see 3 five story developments. Correct me please but this must be from very rich Thai groups same as drives pattaya jomtien etc. Someone please tell me this is foreign driven.

The money is from China, Singapore and America. You can ask any of the Thai Visa legal sponsors how this is possible. But it's not really rocket science.

[sam sen]

Thai politicians love to bang the nationalism drum and the populace lap it up. any party that is perceived to be pursuing anti-thai policies, regardless of potential benefits from such a policies, will be doomed at the polls.

example; decision of the international court in the temple dispute with cambodia

- thai politicians and press; resounding victory for thailand - yeah!

- international press; court upheld cambodia's position

[nontabury]

If farangs were given more leeways to gain footholds here in Thailand, then right from the beginning the system would be open to abuse and corruption, it would be a land grab on a major scale.

In order to gain land and real estate, there would be marriages of convenience, land and property speculators and dealing with corrupt Thai officials to give farangs priority land purchasing options as they would have more money. Many middle class and poor Thais would not be able to compete, as land and property values would escalate, they would literally be out priced and pushed out of the land and housing markets.

It is happening now only on a smaller scale. Farangs owning land and real estate they are not legally entitled to own, property speculators using farang money and running businesses on agricultural land.

Letting farangs freely into the land and property markets would be a disaster for Thailand and these are the reasons it will never happen.

What about Farangs being allowed to own just 1 rai for their own use,, would that not be a good thing?.

[Beetlejuice]

If farangs were given more leeways to gain footholds here in Thailand, then right from the beginning the system would be open to abuse and corruption, it would be a land grab on a major scale.

In order to gain land and real estate, there would be marriages of convenience, land and property speculators and dealing with corrupt Thai officials to give farangs priority land purchasing options as they would have more money. Many middle class and poor Thais would not be able to compete, as land and property values would escalate, they would literally be out priced and pushed out of the land and housing markets.

It is happening now only on a smaller scale. Farangs owning land and real estate they are not legally entitled to own, property speculators using farang money and running businesses on agricultural land.

Letting farangs freely into the land and property markets would be a disaster for Thailand and these are the reasons it will never happen.

What about Farangs being allowed to own just 1 rai for their own use,, would that not be a good thing?.

• Become a Thai citizen
• Be the principal investor in a export orientated Board of Investment (BOI) approved company. The current maximum size limit of freehold ownership rights is one rai of land (1'600 sq m).
• Make an approved investment of over 40 million Baht left for a (to be fixed) minimum number of years. The current maximum size limit of freehold ownership rights is one RAI of land

[nontabury]

If farangs were given more leeways to gain footholds here in Thailand, then right from the beginning the system would be open to abuse and corruption, it would be a land grab on a major scale.

In order to gain land and real estate, there would be marriages of convenience, land and property speculators and dealing with corrupt Thai officials to give farangs priority land purchasing options as they would have more money. Many middle class and poor Thais would not be able to compete, as land and property values would escalate, they would literally be out priced and pushed out of the land and housing markets.

It is happening now only on a smaller scale. Farangs owning land and real estate they are not legally entitled to own, property speculators using farang money and running businesses on agricultural land.

Letting farangs freely into the land and property markets would be a disaster for Thailand and these are the reasons it will never happen.

What about Farangs being allowed to own just 1 rai for their own use,, would that not be a good thing?.

• Become a Thai citizen
• Be the principal investor in a export orientated Board of Investment (BOI) approved company. The current maximum size limit of freehold ownership rights is one rai of land (1'600 sq m).
• Make an approved investment of over 40 million Baht left for a (to be fixed) minimum number of years. The current maximum size limit of freehold ownership rights is one RAI of land

Ah!, the same restrictions and rules that apply to foreigners owning land in the UK or USA.

Just joking of course. It seems to me that the rules here in Thailand are mainly for the benefit

Of rich Thais. Of course they do get around it, to help the rich Arabs to literally own vast areas of the north, while Farangs with Thai wives and children are exempt.

P.S do you qualify under one of the three examples you gave, and if so,which one.

Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

[chotthee]

Farang are rich.

Thai people poor.

If Farang allowed to buy land, there won't be land left for Thai people.

[IsaanUSA]

Too lazy to Google, but in other kingdoms, can foreigners own land in the kingdom? I thought the king "owns" all the land in a kingdom.