Getting married in UK/Schengen area on tourist visa

[Kudel]

@donutz.

I have not read what type of schengen visa the op's girlfriend has got i could have missed it.There are many travel restrictions for Thais also to the european union because many people where mis using this type of visas to get married and get settlement.

Many country's like my own have closed this loophole.

Most thai woman i have known that have applied for a visitors visa type C where all granted the single entry type + one transit to Belgium witch means they where not allowed to go outside said country's borders for the duration of their stay.If she has this type of visa she will not be allowed to just hop over to Denmark to get married.

[7by7]

I can't see how you gain any advantage over marrying in Thailand.

There are still all the hoops to jump through before your wife is allowed to live with you in the UK.

Not all of us are rich, international jetsetters and so can't afford to fly our families and friends to Thailand for a wedding.

So many have a Thai ceremonial wedding, which is not a legal wedding anywhere, for the Thai family and the legal wedding in the UK.

Those who know the UK immigration rules will be aware that if coming to the UK as a visitor anyway then marrying in the UK as a visitor, or even in another EU state, is cheaper than a fiancé visa and then FLR within 6 months.

Of course, I have no idea of the OP's actual reasons; and they are not really any concern of ours.

[Donutz]

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what are the Uk authorities going to beleive more. An EU state marriage certificate or a Thai one? Mmmmm


Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

They should accept both, granted that both are with the proper documentation: proper marriage certificate and properly stamped. BTW: For a Schengen family (spouse) visa a Thai marriage certificate, stamped (legalized) by the Thai ministry of Foreign Affairs plus an (English) translation (by an official translater, again stamped by the Thai MoFA) should be enough for a fast, easy and free spouse visa (excersising freedom of movement).

@donutz.
I have not read what type of schengen visa the op's girlfriend has got i could have missed it.There are many travel restrictions for Thais also to the european union because many people where mis using this type of visas to get married and get settlement.
Many country's like my own have closed this loophole.
Most thai woman i have known that have applied for a visitors visa type C where all granted the single entry type + one transit to Belgium witch means they where not allowed to go outside said country's borders for the duration of their stay.If she has this type of visa she will not be allowed to just hop over to Denmark to get married.

A Type C single entry visa (single or multi entry) entitles you entry to the entire Schengen area. Unless it explicitly states otherwise on the visa. I never heard of the Belgians or any other embassy only or mostly handing out visa with territorial restrictions.

The Belgians authorities do seem rather incompetent or unwilling though with various aspects of EU law (visa, settlement rights etc.). The Belgian embassy directing people to VFS, Belgian municipalities demanding the residence (F card) back from people who are doing the "EU route" when people move back (to the Netherlands for instance) even though officially people moving back to their orginal EU country can keep the residence card etc.

The closed and open " loopholes" are or were rather silly though: the EU route is still very much possible as this can only be stopped if the EU treaties are changed (seems unlikely, the EU nations and EU Home Affairs discussed this in 2012). The EU route isn't a loophole anyway, it used to be more strict then the national laws on settlement etc. but these became more and more strict, now they are (in various nations) more strict then the EU treaties (rights). I call it discrimination of your own national citizens. Other loopholes: well in my opinion it makes no sense at all to restrict settlement with marriage as one required parameter (any sincere relationship shuold do, if need be " durable" and ofcourse people should be able to provide for themselves) or that marriage would give you settlement rights. That is just as silly as decades ago with an international marriage the wife would automaticaly lose her citizenship and obtain her husbands nationality (and jin him in his country). Without special benefits or demands for marriage & settlement there wouldn't be a loophole in the first place...

Luckily not all EU nations require marriage for settlement or give extra settlement benefits to married couples. I'm glad the Dutch don't.

I can't see how you gain any advantage over marrying in Thailand.

There are still all the hoops to jump through before your wife is allowed to live with you in the UK.

Not all of us are rich, international jetsetters and so can't afford to fly our families and friends to Thailand for a wedding.

So many have a Thai ceremonial wedding, which is not a legal wedding anywhere, for the Thai family and the legal wedding in the UK.

Those who know the UK immigration rules will be aware that if coming to the UK as a visitor anyway then marrying in the UK as a visitor, or even in another EU state, is cheaper than a fiancé visa and then FLR within 6 months.

Of course, I have no idea of the OP's actual reasons; and they are not really any concern of ours.

Indeed.

Edited March 12, 2014 by Donutz

[Kudel]

<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

what are the Uk authorities going to beleive more. An EU state marriage certificate or a Thai one? Mmmmm

Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

They should accept both, granted that both are with the proper documentation: proper marriage certificate and properly stamped. BTW: For a Schengen family (spouse) visa a Thai marriage certificate, stamped (legalized) by the Thai ministry of Foreign Affairs plus an (English) translation (by an official translater, again stamped by the Thai MoFA) should be enough for a fast, easy and free spouse visa (excersising freedom of movement).

@donutz.

I have not read what type of schengen visa the op's girlfriend has got i could have missed it.There are many travel restrictions for Thais also to the european union because many people where mis using this type of visas to get married and get settlement.

Many country's like my own have closed this loophole.

Most thai woman i have known that have applied for a visitors visa type C where all granted the single entry type + one transit to Belgium witch means they where not allowed to go outside said country's borders for the duration of their stay.If she has this type of visa she will not be allowed to just hop over to Denmark to get married.

A Type C single entry visa (single or multi entry) entitles you entry to the entire Schengen area. Unless it explicitly states otherwise on the visa. I never heard of the Belgians or any other embassy only or mostly handing out visa with territorial restrictions.

The Belgians authorities do seem rather incompetent or unwilling though with various aspects of EU law (visa, settlement rights etc.). The Belgian embassy directing people to VFS, Belgian municipalities demanding the residence (F card) back from people who are doing the "EU route" when people move back (to the Netherlands for instance) even though officially people moving back to their orginal EU country can keep the residence card etc.

The closed and open " loopholes" are or were rather silly though: the EU route is still very much possible as this can only be stopped if the EU treaties are changed (seems unlikely, the EU nations and EU Home Affairs discussed this in 2012). The EU route isn't a loophole anyway, it used to be more strict then the national laws on settlement etc. but these became more and more strict, now they are (in various nations) more strict then the EU treaties (rights). I call it discrimination of your own national citizens. Other loopholes: well in my opinion it makes no sense at all to restrict settlement with marriage as one required parameter (any sincere relationship shuold do, if need be " durable" and ofcourse people should be able to provide for themselves) or that marriage would give you settlement rights. That is just as silly as decades ago with an international marriage the wife would automaticaly lose her citizenship and obtain her husbands nationality (and jin him in his country). Without special benefits or demands for marriage & settlement there wouldn't be a loophole in the first place...

Luckily not all EU nations require marriage for settlement or give extra settlement benefits to married couples. I'm glad the Dutch don't.

I can't see how you gain any advantage over marrying in Thailand.

There are still all the hoops to jump through before your wife is allowed to live with you in the UK.

Not all of us are rich, international jetsetters and so can't afford to fly our families and friends to Thailand for a wedding.

So many have a Thai ceremonial wedding, which is not a legal wedding anywhere, for the Thai family and the legal wedding in the UK.

Those who know the UK immigration rules will be aware that if coming to the UK as a visitor anyway then marrying in the UK as a visitor, or even in another EU state, is cheaper than a fiancé visa and then FLR within 6 months.

Of course, I have no idea of the OP's actual reasons; and they are not really any concern of ours.

Indeed.

look mate i am sick and tired of having this discussion,a single entry c visa with one transit does not allow you to travel around in the union that is what was told to me by my government and my local municipallety there is one person i know who did this and they got caught at the border and Thai girlfriend was locked up in an immigration detention center and put on a plane back to Thailand.

[Donutz]

look mate i am sick and tired of having this discussion,a single entry c visa with one transit does not allow you to travel around in the union that is what was told to me by my government and my local municipallety there is one person i know who did this and they got caught at the border and Thai girlfriend was locked up in an immigration detention center and put on a plane back to Thailand.

I hope you can keep a positive mood, no need to get worked up about this. Laugh, smile and enjoy yuor day.

However, you have been misinformed. Sadly it isn't the first time officials at emabassies or municipalities inform people incorrectly or incompleteltly (see my examples such as handing in the F card or embassies telling people they HAVE TO go to VFS... nope, WRONG!). The Schengen Code clearly dicates otherwise, as does the EU page. National pages on visa should do so to. The Belgian pages (Dutch version) also states this, for isntance that fo the Belgian embassy in Vietnam:

Het visum zal geldig zijn voor de volgende lidstaten (behalve als het visum beperkt is tot een of meerdere lidstaten): Oostenrijk, België, Tsjechië, Denemarken, Estland, Finland, Frankrijk, Duitsland, Griekenland, Hongarije, IJsland, Italië, Letland, Litouwen, Luxemburg, Malta, Nederland, Noorwegen, Polen, Portugal, Slovakije, Slovenië, Spanje, Zweden en Zwitserland.

Source: http://countries.diplomatie.belgium.be/nl/vietnam/naar_belgie_komen/visum_voor_belgie/visa_kort_verblijf/schengenvisum/

Translation: the Schengen C visa, by default single entry " is valid in the following member-countries: blablabla".

I would very much like to see an official Belgian page that says Schengen C (single entry) or D visa don't allow you to travel through the EU or marry elsewhere (Denmark). There shouldn't be any such page as this would be incorrect and in violation of the EU & Schengen rules and treaties. Do you have an official page to back up your claims? I showed you various sources including the main source (Schengen Visa Code, all members must abide this!!).

[MarkGM1957]

Donutz is correct. Also the German Embassy Thailand tells a similar story.

Wenn Sie zu einem kurzfristigen Aufenthalt nach Deutschland reisen möchten, dann beantragen Sie ein Schengenvisum (Aufenthalt bis zu 90 Tagen).

= if you want to travel to Germany for a short stay, then apply for a Schengen visa (stay up to 90 days).

So a tourist visa is defacto a Shengen visa. Go within Shengen where you like. Even go to DK and get married. hahaha.

[7by7]

what are the Uk authorities going to beleive more. An EU state marriage certificate or a Thai one? Mmmmm

Not really sure what you are saying here, and it has nothing to do with this topic, both are legal and internationally recognised, so I suspect it wouldn't be an issue.

They should accept both..............

Indeed; they will accept any legal marriage certificate from anywhere.

According to the provisions of the Foreign Marriages Act 1899 (as amended), any marriage which is legal in the country where it took place is also legal in the UK.

My wife and I married in Thailand and our Thai marriage certificate, with a certified English translation, has been accepted whenever we have needed to prove our marriage. Including all dealings with what was at the time the IND (since UKBA, now UKVI) from her initial settlement visa through to her naturalisation as British, HMRC, DWP etc.

Edited March 12, 2014 by 7by7

[Donutz]

To add to various previous post: you must apply to the embassy which country is your main destination (if there is no clear main destination apply at the first country you plan to enter), you can enter, travel and leave the Schengen area anywhere you like. So you could get a visa for Belgium but travel in and out of Schengen via France or Germany. Obviously at the border they may ask questions as to show you meet all requirements, including convincing them of your travel plans. If you land in northern France then it's very plausible that yuo travel to Belgium (for your main stay). If you'd arrive in the far north of Norway or south of Greece however... the border guard might not be convinced that you do plan to travel to Belgium (for your main stay). Keep a copy of all documentation you supplied for the visa with you can show this at the border incase they do ask questions.

Once inside the Schengen area you can travel anywhere you like on a C (or D) visa with single or multiple entry type, unless there is a explicit teritorial restriction (example: only valid in BE NL LUX" printed on the sticker ). So the OP can book aticket to anywhere in Schengen (chose a main destination), apply for the visa, after obtaining travel around a bit and get married in Denmark (or possible elsewhere but Denmark is the most fast and easiest).

Edited March 12, 2014 by Donutz