Help With Refused Settlement Visa

[r4b]

Is what you have posted the actual refusal letter ?

Headed "REFUSAL FOR RELATIONSHIP" ?

I think many will doubt the validity of this post which contains many errors relating to the use of English .

Sorry I do not believe this originated from an ECO based in the British Embassy.

NO lol.. sorry this is my wife writing it and sending it to me by email.

[theoldgit]

Is what you have posted the actual refusal letter ?

Headed "REFUSAL FOR RELATIONSHIP" ?

I think many will doubt the validity of this post which contains many errors relating to the use of English .

Sorry I do not believe this originated from an ECO based in the British Embassy.

He did say that his Thai wife was copying the refusal letter into an email, it was never claimed to be the original letter.

[r4b]

financial requirements

your sponser is exempt from meeting the requrements of paragraph e

ecp.3.1 as he is in receipt of disability living allowance.in order to

meet the requirements of these rules you and your sponser must be abel

to maintain and accommodate yoursevlves and any dependents adequately

in the uk with out recourse to public funds. your sponser receives 74

each week in dla .he also receives employment support allowance, child

tax credit,child benefit and housing benefit however esa ,child tax

credit, child benefit and hb are in come related benefits and as such

are not premissible for inclusion in any financial year.

caculations in these rules he does however receive 1o every 2 week

from his childens mother wich is permissible income under these rules,

whilst he says this income including all the a bove is 487.83 per week

i am unabel to include esa, child tax credit, child benefit and hb in

my calculations

as the rules hibit this appendix fm se section d 2a 21 this mean that

for the purposes of these rules his income level is as per his dla of

74 a week 52 week = 3848 ayear and his maintenance of 10 every 2 week

= 260 a year as the other benefits are income related and excluded for

any calculations in these rules , this means that with regard to these

rules your sponser in come is 4108 a yesr/342 a month .he say s that

his ernt and rates are 97.68 a week although it apprars these are piad

for by housing benefit and he has 2 chidren of 7 and 4 year old to

support .the dwp income suport rate for a couple as his children are

british have excluded them in this calculation is 482.95 pm after

housing and council tax costs have been paid. your sponser has 342pm

before any housing costs whilst i ama ware that you would be alloweed

to work in the uk there is no proof that you have any education or

qualifications and you speak only very basic english .as such i am not

satisfied that your will readily obtain obtain employment in the uk .

[r4b]

SORRY GUYS JUST TO PUT EVERYTHING ORDER HERE IS THE FULL LETTER

REFUSAL FOR RELATIONSHIP

you say that you met your soponsor in 2012 when he was in thailand on
holiday . you say that you began a relationship with him when he
returned in 2013 when he come to see his father who was in hospitata.you say that you spent 6 weeks togetter in that time and
your husband says he returned afew weeks later in the year and spent a
futher 4 weeks here as evidence you have sent 7 photos of you together
appparently taken on 4 separate occasions. i acknowledge that your
husband says you have also spent significant time on line getting to
know each other bet the 28 pages of internet chats you have sent
contain littel of any substance and do not appear to show the
development of a relationship to the point of marrage. i acknowledge
that you have you applied for a visa to the uk to see this
sopnsor. but you have very littel proof of sort of relationship
togetter and have not adequaately explained why. haveing spent only 7
weeks togetter .you decided to marry. there is no proof of how this
relationship developed to the point of marriage or of why.having spent
only a short time togetther. you decided to marry so quickly.
partcularly as your sponsor has 2 yonung children living with him who
you have not met . iam minful that your husband has visited thailand
and supports this application.but the motvation for this union is not
clear .and on balance.given all of the above factors,i amnot satified
your relationship with your sponsor is genuine and subsisting or that
you intend to live togetter permanently in the uk .i therefore refuse
you r aplication under paragraph e cp 1 1

financial requirements
your sponser is exempt from meeting the requrements of paragraph e
ecp.3.1 as he is in receipt of disability living allowance.in order to
meet the requirements of these rules you and your sponser must be abel
to maintain and accommodate yoursevlves and any dependents adequately
in the uk with out recourse to public funds. your sponser receives 74
each week in dla .he also receives employment support allowance, child
tax credit,child benefit and housing benefit however esa ,child tax
credit, child benefit and hb are in come related benefits and as such
are not premissible for inclusion in any financial year.

caculations in these rules he does however receive 1o every 2 week
from his childens mother wich is permissible income under these rules,
whilst he says this income including all the a bove is 487.83 per week
i am unabel to include esa, child tax credit, child benefit and hb in
my calculations

as the rules hibit this appendix fm se section d 2a 21 this mean that
for the purposes of these rules his income level is as per his dla of
74 a week 52 week = 3848 ayear and his maintenance of 10 every 2 week
= 260 a year as the other benefits are income related and excluded for
any calculations in these rules , this means that with regard to these
rules your sponser in come is 4108 a yesr/342 a month .he say s that
his ernt and rates are 97.68 a week although it apprars these are piad
for by housing benefit and he has 2 chidren of 7 and 4 year old to
support .the dwp income suport rate for a couple as his children are
british have excluded them in this calculation is 482.95 pm after
housing and council tax costs have been paid. your sponser has 342pm
before any housing costs whilst i ama ware that you would be alloweed
to work in the uk there is no proof that you have any education or
qualifications and you speak only very basic english .as such i am not
satisfied that your will readily obtain obtain employment in the uk .

THIS IS NOT CORRECT AS CLEARLY IN MY SPONSER LETTER IT WAS SAID AND EVIDENCE PROVIDED BY FLIGHTS ETC THAT IN APRIL I WENT OUT FOR 6 WEEKS AND RETURNED TO THE UK FOR 3 WEEKS THEN I RETURN TO THAILAND 4 WEEKS IN JUNE AND AGAIN I WAS OUT NEARLY 3 WEEKS FEB.. ALL TICKETS BOARDING CARDS WHERE PROVIDED

ALSO I AM NOT CONVINCED THAT WHAT THE ECO IS SAYING IS CORRECT ABOUT ME NOT BEING ABLE TO USE MY ESA AND OTHER BENEFITS AS ADEQUATE MANTAINANCE.

I WOULD GREATFULLY APPRICIATE ALL FEEDBACK AND THANKYOU FOR YOU HELP.

[Tywais]

Inflammatory posts and replies removed.

[r4b]

SORRY GUYS JUST TO PUT EVERYTHING ORDER HERE IS THE FULL LETTER

REFUSAL FOR RELATIONSHIP

you say that you met your soponsor in 2012 when he was in thailand on

holiday . you say that you began a relationship with him when he

returned in 2013 when he come to see his father who was in hospitata.you say that you spent 6 weeks togetter in that time and

your husband says he returned afew weeks later in the year and spent a

futher 4 weeks here as evidence you have sent 7 photos of you together

appparently taken on 4 separate occasions. i acknowledge that your

husband says you have also spent significant time on line getting to

know each other bet the 28 pages of internet chats you have sent

contain littel of any substance and do not appear to show the

development of a relationship to the point of marrage. i acknowledge

that you have you applied for a visa to the uk to see this

sopnsor. but you have very littel proof of sort of relationship

togetter and have not adequaately explained why. haveing spent only 7

weeks togetter .you decided to marry. there is no proof of how this

relationship developed to the point of marriage or of why.having spent

only a short time togetther. you decided to marry so quickly.

partcularly as your sponsor has 2 yonung children living with him who

you have not met . iam minful that your husband has visited thailand

and supports this application.but the motvation for this union is not

clear .and on balance.given all of the above factors,i amnot satified

your relationship with your sponsor is genuine and subsisting or that

you intend to live togetter permanently in the uk .i therefore refuse

you r aplication under paragraph e cp 1 1

financial requirements

your sponser is exempt from meeting the requrements of paragraph e

ecp.3.1 as he is in receipt of disability living allowance.in order to

meet the requirements of these rules you and your sponser must be abel

to maintain and accommodate yoursevlves and any dependents adequately

in the uk with out recourse to public funds. your sponser receives 74

each week in dla .he also receives employment support allowance, child

tax credit,child benefit and housing benefit however esa ,child tax

credit, child benefit and hb are in come related benefits and as such

are not premissible for inclusion in any financial year.

caculations in these rules he does however receive 1o every 2 week

from his childens mother wich is permissible income under these rules,

whilst he says this income including all the a bove is 487.83 per week

i am unabel to include esa, child tax credit, child benefit and hb in

my calculations

as the rules hibit this appendix fm se section d 2a 21 this mean that

for the purposes of these rules his income level is as per his dla of

74 a week 52 week = 3848 ayear and his maintenance of 10 every 2 week

= 260 a year as the other benefits are income related and excluded for

any calculations in these rules , this means that with regard to these

rules your sponser in come is 4108 a yesr/342 a month .he say s that

his ernt and rates are 97.68 a week although it apprars these are piad

for by housing benefit and he has 2 chidren of 7 and 4 year old to

support .the dwp income suport rate for a couple as his children are

british have excluded them in this calculation is 482.95 pm after

housing and council tax costs have been paid. your sponser has 342pm

before any housing costs whilst i ama ware that you would be alloweed

to work in the uk there is no proof that you have any education or

qualifications and you speak only very basic english .as such i am not

satisfied that your will readily obtain obtain employment in the uk .

THIS IS NOT CORRECT AS CLEARLY IN MY SPONSER LETTER IT WAS SAID AND EVIDENCE PROVIDED BY FLIGHTS ETC THAT IN APRIL I WENT OUT FOR 6 WEEKS AND RETURNED TO THE UK FOR 3 WEEKS THEN I RETURN TO THAILAND 4 WEEKS IN JUNE AND AGAIN I WAS OUT NEARLY 3 WEEKS FEB.. ALL TICKETS BOARDING CARDS WHERE PROVIDED

ALSO I AM NOT CONVINCED THAT WHAT THE ECO IS SAYING IS CORRECT ABOUT ME NOT BEING ABLE TO USE MY ESA AND OTHER BENEFITS AS ADEQUATE MANTAINANCE.

I WOULD GREATFULLY APPRICIATE ALL FEEDBACK AND THANKYOU FOR YOU HELP.

Chapter 8, Section FM 1.7A – Family – Maintenance at paragraph 5.1(a). IT SAYS EVERYTHING I HAVE BEEN SAYING ALL ALONG THAT ALL BENEFITS CAN BE USED.. DOES ANYONE HAVE ANY KNOWLEDGE AS TO WHY THE ECO WOULD SAY IT DOES NOT.

[robertthebruce]

I hear your concern, why not YOU move to ''Thailand'', if you love her, that not solve the problem ????

[hotrod4098]

I hear your concern, why not YOU move to ''Thailand'', if you love her, that not solve the problem ????

benefits would stop if out side the uk except child benefit..so not a option i would think..

[r4b]

I hear your concern, why not YOU move to ''Thailand'', if you love her, that not solve the problem ????

Yes indeed it would but having two small children whos education comes first doesnt make this an option, thanks.

[robertthebruce]

I hear your concern, why not YOU move to ''Thailand'', if you love her, that not solve the problem ????

Yes indeed it would but having two small children whos education comes first doesnt make this an option, thanks.

There is some excellent private schools over here in Thailand....

[r4b]

I hear your concern, why not YOU move to ''Thailand'', if you love her, that not solve the problem ????

Yes indeed it would but having two small children whos education comes first doesnt make this an option, thanks.

There is some excellent private schools over here in Thailand....

Unfortunately not within 100 miles of my wives home town and im 100% positive they are not in the same class as those in the North of Ireland. Their education is of utmost importance and i cant take a chance with something like this. but thanks for ur reply

[MAJIC]

I am aware of what you posted, but the actual wording of the refusal notice can aid greatly in advising you of the way forward.

Can't she email a copy to you?

thank you for your reply. Im not sure of the actual wording only the basic reasons i have said. i think it would take her a week to type it down and send it to me. I only know That they have said i cannot use my esa and other benefits towards adequate maintainence. That she wont find work due to her basic english. she passed the test and her english is really good although following instructions is a problem. however she passed. really i would like to know if they are wrong that i cannot use my benefits for adequate maintaince and if i want to ask for an immediate review to the entry clearence officer where do i send this to

mayn thanks f

"i think it would take her a week to type it down and send it to me."

She could always get the local IT Shop to Scan it in and Email it to you as an attachment,at a guess they must charge all of 50 baht!

[r4b]

I am aware of what you posted, but the actual wording of the refusal notice can aid greatly in advising you of the way forward.

Can't she email a copy to you?

thank you for your reply. Im not sure of the actual wording only the basic reasons i have said. i think it would take her a week to type it down and send it to me. I only know That they have said i cannot use my esa and other benefits towards adequate maintainence. That she wont find work due to her basic english. she passed the test and her english is really good although following instructions is a problem. however she passed. really i would like to know if they are wrong that i cannot use my benefits for adequate maintaince and if i want to ask for an immediate review to the entry clearence officer where do i send this to

mayn thanks f

"i think it would take her a week to type it down and send it to me."

She could always get the local IT Shop to Scan it in and Email it to you as an attachment,at a guess they must charge all of 50 baht!

Hi yes i posted her email already on this thread. so all information from the letter is here now. thanks

[MAJIC]

I am aware of what you posted, but the actual wording of the refusal notice can aid greatly in advising you of the way forward.

Can't she email a copy to you?

thank you for your reply. Im not sure of the actual wording only the basic reasons i have said. i think it would take her a week to type it down and send it to me. I only know That they have said i cannot use my esa and other benefits towards adequate maintainence. That she wont find work due to her basic english. she passed the test and her english is really good although following instructions is a problem. however she passed. really i would like to know if they are wrong that i cannot use my benefits for adequate maintaince and if i want to ask for an immediate review to the entry clearence officer where do i send this to

mayn thanks f

"i think it would take her a week to type it down and send it to me."

She could always get the local IT Shop to Scan it in and Email it to you as an attachment,at a guess they must charge all of 50 baht!

[r4b]

TAKEN FROM THE UKBA WEBSITE

Chapter 8, Section FM 1.7A – Family – Maintenance at paragraph 5.1(a).

5.1 Assessing the adequacy of the funds available

In calculating whether the applicant can be adequately maintained, the decision

maker should follow the following steps:

(a) Establish the sponsor’s and/or applicant’s (if they are in the UK with

permission to work) current net income. The net income should be established

and if the income varies, an average should be calculated. Income from

benefits can be included as income.

( Establish the sponsor’s current housing costs from the evidence

provided.

© Deduct the housing costs from the net income.

(d) Calculate how much the sponsor and his family would receive if they

were on Income Support.

March 2013 CH8 SECT FM 1.7A – FAMILY MEMBERS - MAINTENANCE

(e) Compare the sponsor’s net income after deduction of housing costs with

the equivalent Income Support rate.

Details on current benefit and tax rates (means and non-means t

[MAJIC]

I hear your concern, why not YOU move to ''Thailand'', if you love her, that not solve the problem ????

benefits would stop if out side the uk except child benefit..so not a option i would think..

The child and you has to be resident in the UK for you to claim. Which incidently applies to most benefits.

[rhodie]

I may be wrong here, and I am not sure what e cp 1 1 says, but I do not see anything in the letter that refers

to your ability to support your wife. It just seems to have been refused on the grounds that you have not been

in a relationship long enough to know each other properly for marriage.

[r4b]

I hear your concern, why not YOU move to ''Thailand'', if you love her, that not solve the problem ????

benefits would stop if out side the uk except child benefit..so not a option i would think..

The child and you has to be resident in the UK for you to claim. Which incidently applies to most benefits.

Hi yes i reside in the uk and my children are british citizens who reside with me. they are from a prior relationship here in the uk, thanks

[r4b]

I may be wrong here, and I am not sure what e cp 1 1 says, but I do not see anything in the letter that refers

to your ability to support your wife. It just seems to have been refused on the grounds that you have not been

in a relationship long enough to know each other properly for marriage.

Hi and thanks for your reply. it says in the letter yes that esa and my other benefits cannot be taken in consideration as they are means tested. i posted the appendex from the ukba website just earlier and it says you can use benefits..

As for our relationship. there is no guildlines saying you have to know someone x amount of time before u marry or apply for a visa x amount of time after u marry. ONly evidence of genuine and subsisting relationship.. i have done this everything they ask. it states clearly u have to have meet in person. we have on 4 occasions. the ECO also says we where only together 7 weeks in all and at no time in any document was 7 weeks mentioned. IN all we spent 12 weeks in each others company. when not no less than 4/5 hOURS on skype/fb chatting by camera etc everyday without fail... We included 28 pages of skype alone with records. more than i assum they would ask..

Edited March 27, 2014 by r4b

[rhodie]

I think you need to scan the letter and post it.

I am unable to find anything in the letter about refusal on financial grounds.

But, others may understand better.

Good luck.

[r4b]

<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

I may be wrong here, and I am not sure what e cp 1 1 says, but I do not see anything in the letter that refers

to your ability to support your wife. It just seems to have been refused on the grounds that you have not been

in a relationship long enough to know each other properly for marriage.

Hi and thanks for your reply. it says in the letter yes that esa and my other benefits cannot be taken in consideration as they are means tested. i posted the appendex from the ukba website just earlier and it says you can use benefits..

As for our relationship. there is no guildlines saying you have to know someone x amount of time before u marry or apply for a visa x amount of time after u marry. ONly evidence of genuine and subsisting relationship.. i have done this everything they ask. it states clearly u have to have meet in person. we have on 4 occasions. the ECO also says we where only together 7 weeks in all and at no time in any document was 7 weeks mentioned. IN all we spent 12 weeks in each others company. when not no less than 4/5 hOURS on skype/fb chatting by camera etc everyday without fail... We included 28 pages of skype alone with records. more than i assum they would ask..

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/279661/Immigration_Rules_-_Appendix_FM.pdf

I THINK IT APPEARS THE ECO HAS BEEN USING THE OLD GUILDLINES AND NOT THE NEW ONES

[r4b]

I think you need to scan the letter and post it.

I am unable to find anything in the letter about refusal on financial grounds.

But, others may understand better.

Good luck.

your sponser receives 74

each week in dla .he also receives employment support allowance, child

tax credit,child benefit and housing benefit however esa ,child tax

credit, child benefit and hb are in come related benefits and as such

are not premissible for inclusion in any financial year.

caculations in these rules he does however receive 1o every 2 week

from his childens mother wich is permissible income under these rules,

whilst he says this income including all the a bove is 487.83 per week

i am unabel to include esa, child tax credit, child benefit and hb in

my calculations

[rhodie]

OK, I see you posted that in a separate post. I would try to get your wife to scan the letter and email it so you can post it here in full. Will be a lot more use to the guys in the know.

Good luck.

Edited March 27, 2014 by rhodie

[r4b]

JUST SO YOUS ALL KNOW GUYS IT APPEARS TO ME BY RESEARCH AND DETERMINATION THAT THE ENTRY CLEARANCE OFFICER IN BANGKOK IS STILL USING THE OLD GUIDELINES. CORRECT ME IF I AM WRONG BUT THIS APPENDEX IS OLD AND A NEW ONE HAS BEEN DRAFTED IN 2013

https://www.gov.uk/g...Appendix_FM.pdf

[r4b]

OK, I see you posted that in a separate post. I would try to get your wife to scan the letter and email it so you can post it here in full. Will be a lot more use to the guys in the know.

Good luck.

yes this is the full copy she wrote from the letter. the eco has been using out of date guidelines and the evidence is in the refusal letter.. namely the paragraphs he quoted c p 1 1 or something.. new appendex dont have this. these are taken from

OLD....... https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/279661/Immigration_Rules_-_Appendix_FM.pdf

and not

NEW https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/279482/maintenance.pdf

[wooloomooloo]

r4b - take a step back and consider your next steps. You and your wife don't have long to mount an appeal.

Reading between the lines of the refusal, I can see what the ECO is getting at given your circumstances. I can't comment on whether the judgement is correct as it's not my job.

I should advise to seek urgent immigration advice as I'm not certain you would overturn this decision on your own. I've read much of Tony M's advice for over four years here and elsewhere and he might be a good place to start.

Up to you.

[r4b]

r4b - take a step back and consider your next steps. You and your wife don't have long to mount an appeal.

Reading between the lines of the refusal, I can see what the ECO is getting at given your circumstances. I can't comment on whether the judgement is correct as it's not my job.

I should advise to seek urgent immigration advice as I'm not certain you would overturn this decision on your own. I've read much of Tony M's advice for over four years here and elsewhere and he might be a good place to start.

Up to you.

Thanks for you reply. its clear the EMO is using old rules for my visa refusal by the paragraph quotes and section quotes from appendex.. this is the old rules before the changes. he has entered these and stated clearly this as his reasoning for his refusal. So he in basically not fit to work as an eco if he can not go by the new rules.. now i would ask myself how many other people has had a refusal by this guy when the guidelines have changed... for me a very strong letter to the manager of the eco is in order.

[beano2274]

be careful about your comments about ECO"s, they approve or disapprove a visa, and some of them do know Thaivisa.

[r4b]

be careful about your comments about ECO"s, they approve or disapprove a visa, and some of them do know Thaivisa.

Hi point taken thank you for the advise. but im sure you can understand my frustration now finding out and KNOWING 100% THAT THE ECO HAS USED THE OLD GUIDELINES WHEN LOOKING AT MY WIFES VISA... £900 I PAID FOR SERVICE WHICH I EXTENSIVELY RESEARCHED NOT ONLY HERE BUT EVERY WEBSITE ON THE INTERNET. TO FIND OUT I HAVE BEEN DEALT A BLOW FOR SOMETHING I KNOW TO BE INCORRECT DOES MAKE YOU WONDER..

[wooloomooloo]

With due respect, r4b, you're not exactly clear on points of law either.

Don't waste time arguing the toss. Get a move on and get specialist help.

Up to you.