and i'm not talking about katoeys.

i sometimes hear women say khap when talking way down, to say a child. can anyone clarify the rules for this and men saying ka?

khop khun ka, steve

If they're saying it to a child, you'll likely notice that they're using the correct word that matches the child's gender. In this case they're teaching the child to say the correct word, since children are good mimics. Adults often say ครับ to small boys, and a ค่ะ to small girls regardless of the adult's gender.

I actually get 'khrap' every now and then from my wife and her friends. Guessing that as a farang speaking (at least attempting to speak) Thai, I am bundled in with boys who need to be reminded of which particle to use - not that I have ever mistakenly used 'kha'...

I suppose then that it's not only teaching them which particle to use, but also helping them to remember to use it consistently. That makes sense.

In my case though, it is a bit funny in that I actually overuse 'khrap', a result of having learned Thai in a setting where the only native Thai conversation partner was my Ajarn to whom I of course should show respect... so there is really no need to remind me to use it further.

Not entirely sure why they do this.

Some guys also say "ka" to adult women as well, to be extra polite. Some gals say "klrab" to adult men as well, to be polite and a bit playful as well. Guys shouldn't say "ka" to adult men, unless they themselves are gay; and any girls (strangers) that you were previously being 'extra polite' to will likely assume the same. Gals can say "klrab" or "ka" interchangeably with adult men or women and still be straight.

My Thai wife (60 +) usually uses "Khap" - as distinct from "Khrap" ........... to my ear anyway - when addressing one particulay nephew. He's now over 35 but lived with us for several years when he was quite young and she feels herself a sort of surrogate mother to him even now.

Patrick

Extra polite? Is that really the only factor? Can you describe a more specific situation where someone would feasibly do this? I must admit I'm a bit dubious without further details.

Also, this wouldn't explain the Meadish scenario. Perhaps they're playfully mocking your overuse of ครับ by using it themselves?

Also, using *both* l and r is probably a bit overkill for transliterating ครับ, seeing as it's commonly rendered คับ, and it is a mark of extra politeness simply to speak the word with a clear ร.เรือ (and I've rarely heard ล.ลิง substituted in ครับ--since คลับ is common parlance for a nightclub, and even then the ล can be dropped as usual).

I asked wifey, and she said the reason she is using khrap with me is playfulness and nothing else.