Children: Thai culture/european culture

[Som wat]

Kids are how you raise them.

However educational systems play a large part.

If you cannot afford a decent international school here then compare 8am-4pm in a crappy, baking hot classroom being forced to sit and be quiet all day with 50 others. And when you can go outside to do something you can't because it is 40 degrees celsius in the shade. Your body is putting so much effort into keeping itself cool it robs energy that should be going into learning.

That's no sort of educational life to put your child through.

[wym]

Not to mention clueless teachers, fear-based management, useless curriculum, time wasted on empty rituals etc etc

[recycler]

My 50-50, 10 year old daughter has been home schooled from 7 years old.

With the emphasis on being happy when she finishes her education.

I include Yoga, Meditation and Taekwando.

The results speak for themselves.

Homeschooling sounds a bit lonely, school is a place where kids learn together, interact socially, cooperate, make friends, play with other kids, etc. These are essential parts of a good education.

I don't like the Thai system but I don't think homeschooling is the solution.

How do you compensate for the lack of interaction with other kids?

[soalbundy]

I raise my kids to be entrepreneurs.

How do you do that?

Give the kid a fake police uniform and a gun,my kid makes more than i do

[brit1984]

Absolutely time is much more important than money.

But decent schooling is IMO very important for THEIR economic future, and available for free back home at a level that would cost millions per year here.

i know what you mean but it's really not that simple as living in the catchment area for a good free school doesn't come cheap, and the equation also needs to factor in relative income and other living costs (and all the non-financial factors)... it really depends on the family's circumstances

IMO sacrifice must be made or you're not being a responsible parent sorry but I calls it how I see it.

God forbid my kids feel more at home in Thailand or stoop to getting their tertiary here. If either is ambitious I want them prepared to succeed in a top career in HK London NYC wherever they might choose.

Obviously universities in Thailand are all awful (including Chula) but lots of high schools here are better than the average free school in the west (not that the average really means anything as each kid can only go to 1 school).

For example, Shrewsbury in Bangkok sends around 10 kids to Oxbridge every year. Some schools in UK haven't done that in the last 100 years.

At the extreme cases for very poor parents, the west (certainly Europe) is probably better (because at leas the basics are available for free) and if the parents are super rich then again the West is better because there is nothing here that compares to the really top high schools (e.g. Westminster School / Eton / etc). but for everyone else it really depends.

[lostmebike]

My 50-50, 10 year old daughter has been home schooled from 7 years old.

With the emphasis on being happy when she finishes her education.

I include Yoga, Meditation and Taekwando.

The results speak for themselves.

Homeschooling sounds a bit lonely, school is a place where kids learn together, interact socially, cooperate, make friends, play with other kids, etc. These are essential parts of a good education.

I don't like the Thai system but I don't think homeschooling is the solution.

How do you compensate for the lack of interaction with other kids?

Agreed.

Essential to a kid's development is not only a good, stable home but also outside, one on one interaction with their peers. IMO, school-life is where children learn their 'street knowledge' and experience first hand the myriad of demo-graphs and attitudes in today's society.

[Som wat]

My 50-50, 10 year old daughter has been home schooled from 7 years old.

With the emphasis on being happy when she finishes her education.

I include Yoga, Meditation and Taekwando.

The results speak for themselves.

Homeschooling sounds a bit lonely, school is a place where kids learn together, interact socially, cooperate, make friends, play with other kids, etc. These are essential parts of a good education.

I don't like the Thai system but I don't think homeschooling is the solution.

How do you compensate for the lack of interaction with other kids?

Agreed.

Essential to a kid's development is not only a good, stable home but also outside, one on one interaction with their peers. IMO, school-life is where children learn their 'street knowledge' and experience first hand the myriad of demo-graphs and attitudes in today's society.

Sorry, but your very common misconceptions with regards to homeschooled children are totally incorrect.

No need to respond and highjack the thread, just do some research on the topic itself, with it being such a common misconception there is lots out there.

[Som wat]

at the end they will be aliens in both societys .not accepted by Thais and looked down in the west.i know a nice lady who got brought up in the west and now try work here.all misbehavior we farangs are doing are( more or less) over looked by the Thais because we are just stupid long noses,but for the poor girl a westerner in a Thai body- nothing get's excused they purely hate her...

I have witnessed this a lot here.

The absolute hatred of a half Thai half Westerner returning to Thailand as an adult, by full Thais here.

Of course with the hatred came the petty abuse, razor blades in tires, shoes thrown in the bin etc. that many Thais do to people they disdain, resent and need to 'get' to feel better in themselves.

[Krataiboy]

Education – like charity – begins at home. And I’m not talking the 3R’s, though I have nothing personally against home schooling to a set curriculum.

Schools here and elsewheree, whether private or public, tend to churn out malleable cogs of various sizes for the capitalist machine (the bigger ones are entrepreneurs!).

But the objective, surely, is to turn out great adults who have fulfilled their potential in terms of more than simply the size of their salary or bank balance. And here parents have the edge on teachers.

It helps to start young. Our youngest is six yet she already and speaks fluent English (Dad) as easily as Thai (Mum).

In both languages, the word she has been actively encouraged to use ad nauseum is one which is almost taboo in most Thai classrooms and across much of Thai society generally – the word “Why?”

Teaching a child to question anything and everything, including authority and the status quo, is key in our view to giving them, ultimately, control over their own lives and – who knows? – enabling them eventually to help make the world a better place.

Of course, she is also gradually being initiated into the mysteries of lots of other scary stuff she will need to know about as she matures - the power of love, the value of relationships, the need to respect and compassion for others, irrespective of their race, creed or religion, the importance of individual freedom. . .

Time is short and the list very long. But right at the top there will always be that important little, three-letter word.

[Krataiboy]

Education – like charity – begins at home. And I’m not talking the 3R’s, though I have nothing against home schooling

Formal schooling, whether private or public, is fine for churning out malleable little cogs for the capitalist machine (yes, and even slightly bigger ones like entrepreneurs!).

But the real need is to produce great adults – and here is where parents have the edge on teachers.

It also means starting young. Our daughter is only six yet i already speaks English (Dad) as easily as Thai (Mum).

In both languages, the word she is actively encouraged to use ad nauseam is one which is practically taboo in Thai classrooms and across Thai society generally – the word “Why?”

Teaching a child to question everything and anything, including authority and the status quo, is key to enabling her or him eventually to gain control over of their own lives.

Of course, we are also gradually initiating our little girl into the mysteries of other important stuff she will need to know about as she grows and develops - love and relationships, the need to respect and compassion for others, irrespective of their race, creed or religion, the importance or individual liberty and personal responsibility.

Time is short and the list scarily long. But right at the top will always be that important little, three-letter word.

[Thai at Heart]

Left 'Land of Stupidity' two years ago. My daughter doing well in school, mastering music fine, and has great outside interest clubs like judo and brownies and athletics. Most importantly, school and society strongly support initiatives like anti-bullying and anti-racism. In a nutshell, she is learning right from wrong. Thailand is no place to bring up a child if you aspire to them having the chances and opportunities that you yourself had.

Left 8 months ago. Kids are bilingual and was hilarious to watch them chatting with a woman in IKEA the other day in Thai. She was flabbergasted.

The schooling is so much broader and varied I am over the moon I did it. Kids are doing well in school, son is in the school rugby team and top sets for.most things.

Daughter has been chosen to represent school in a church event. It is just beyond anything Thailand could ever do. We are sitting here right now watching a BBC programming about scientists studying the wildlife in Myanmar.

[tim armstrong]

Wym said it - what about the kids part in their own development ? For me if kids grow to be reasonable people with good values, compassion for others and awareness of the world, and are happy in themselves, then so much else is a bonus. As 'The Prophet' says - we don't own our children - we just borrow them for a while.

[Scarpolo]

Funny, in another forum there was talk about Thailand is no longer LOS.

Im sitting in Cha Am on beach. Most expats know this is pretty much Thai holiday joint. OK my point. Today had minor spill off the bike . so many Thai rushed to help me. More detail but too long. As I sit drinking families walk by with big smiles to me as I smile back. Sitting with very young kids I guess most are uni or school kids.

My gf just asked if I want another drink. With a big smile.

I LOVE THAILAND.

you was trying to run down my soap star with your bike, werent you JacK?

karma / ;-)

[wym]

Homeschooling sounds a bit lonely, school is a place where kids learn together, interact socially, cooperate, make friends, play with other kids, etc. These are essential parts of a good education.

I don't like the Thai system but I don't think homeschooling is the solution.

How do you compensate for the lack of interaction with other kids?

Agreed.

Essential to a kid's development is not only a good, stable home but also outside, one on one interaction with their peers. IMO, school-life is where children learn their 'street knowledge' and experience first hand the myriad of demo-graphs and attitudes in today's society.

School is one such place.

Yes it's a challenge, but if you do take the home-school route - entirely valid IMO and MUCH better than a Thai-run school - then you just find a way to give them that.

Ideally living in a community where the kids run free-range around the moobahn after school.

Also sport and learning activities after school time and on weekends, scouts stuff like that.

Strong social ties to other parents, arranging trips during holidays, sleepovers on weekends etc.

But even if this area is a compromise better than sending them to a Thai-run school and having them completely socialized into "the Thai way" of doing things.

[wym]

Absolutely time is much more important than money.

But decent schooling is IMO very important for THEIR economic future, and available for free back home at a level that would cost millions per year here.

i know what you mean but it's really not that simple as living in the catchment area for a good free school doesn't come cheap, and the equation also needs to factor in relative income and other living costs (and all the non-financial factors)... it really depends on the family's circumstances

IMO sacrifice must be made or you're not being a responsible parent sorry but I calls it how I see it.

God forbid my kids feel more at home in Thailand or stoop to getting their tertiary here. If either is ambitious I want them prepared to succeed in a top career in HK London NYC wherever they might choose.

Obviously universities in Thailand are all awful (including Chula) but lots of high schools here are better than the average free school in the west (not that the average really means anything as each kid can only go to 1 school).

For example, Shrewsbury in Bangkok sends around 10 kids to Oxbridge every year. Some schools in UK haven't done that in the last 100 years.

At the extreme cases for very poor parents, the west (certainly Europe) is probably better (because at leas the basics are available for free) and if the parents are super rich then again the West is better because there is nothing here that compares to the really top high schools (e.g. Westminster School / Eton / etc). but for everyone else it really depends.

Absolutely right, lots of kids go to Ivy League in the US as well from these excellent international schools.

Problem is the 800,000++ PER CHILD annual tuition fees.

I can only dream of how much more pleasant our life would be here in nearly all ways if my income could justify those education costs, unfortunately many times more than my total income.

And once you get past that list of say a dozen top schools, all around the same price bracket, the quality drops off so sharply that you might as well just be sending them to a Thai-run "international programme" - and I've taught in both environments and let me tell you a government school back home is light-years better.

[Thai at Heart]

Absolutely time is much more important than money.

But decent schooling is IMO very important for THEIR economic future, and available for free back home at a level that would cost millions per year here.

i know what you mean but it's really not that simple as living in the catchment area for a good free school doesn't come cheap, and the equation also needs to factor in relative income and other living costs (and all the non-financial factors)... it really depends on the family's circumstances

IMO sacrifice must be made or you're not being a responsible parent sorry but I calls it how I see it.

God forbid my kids feel more at home in Thailand or stoop to getting their tertiary here. If either is ambitious I want them prepared to succeed in a top career in HK London NYC wherever they might choose.

Obviously universities in Thailand are all awful (including Chula) but lots of high schools here are better than the average free school in the west (not that the average really means anything as each kid can only go to 1 school).

For example, Shrewsbury in Bangkok sends around 10 kids to Oxbridge every year. Some schools in UK haven't done that in the last 100 years.

At the extreme cases for very poor parents, the west (certainly Europe) is probably better (because at leas the basics are available for free) and if the parents are super rich then again the West is better because there is nothing here that compares to the really top high schools (e.g. Westminster School / Eton / etc). but for everyone else it really depends.

Absolutely right, lots of kids go to Ivy League in the US as well from these excellent international schools.

Problem is the 800,000++ PER CHILD annual tuition fees.

I can only dream of how much more pleasant our life would be here in nearly all ways if my income could justify those education costs, unfortunately many times more than my total income.

And once you get past that list of say a dozen top schools, all around the same price bracket, the quality drops off so sharply that you might as well just be sending them to a Thai-run "international programme" - and I've taught in both environments and let me tell you a government school back home is light-years better.

Indeed. 10 per year. How many does shrewsbury in the UK manage every year. Lest we forget that these days, only about 50%, of the entry is from private school. Would be interested if it is 10 though. That means its doing better than 90% of the private schools in the UK.

[wym]

Remember foreign students pay full boat, subsidize the locals.

[brit1984]

Only the top 5-10 high schools in Thailand are any good, but equally not many of the free schools back home are decent (and those are in areas that are expensive to live)... every family has to choose the best (or most suitable for your kids) from what's reasonably available... which depends on circumstances... for some that will be in Thailand, for some back home and for some in a third country... for some even home schooling is best... it really depends

[Thai at Heart]

Well my kids were in bilingual private school and that was fine up to 12. But there was no way of was doing the English program rubbish at the local high school.

As for the top 5, even that is debateable.

[lostmebike]

My 50-50, 10 year old daughter has been home schooled from 7 years old.

With the emphasis on being happy when she finishes her education.

I include Yoga, Meditation and Taekwando.

The results speak for themselves.

Homeschooling sounds a bit lonely, school is a place where kids learn together, interact socially, cooperate, make friends, play with other kids, etc. These are essential parts of a good education.

I don't like the Thai system but I don't think homeschooling is the solution.

How do you compensate for the lack of interaction with other kids?

Agreed.

Essential to a kid's development is not only a good, stable home but also outside, one on one interaction with their peers. IMO, school-life is where children learn their 'street knowledge' and experience first hand the myriad of demo-graphs and attitudes in today's society.

Sorry, but your very common misconceptions with regards to homeschooled children are totally incorrect.

No need to respond and highjack the thread, just do some research on the topic itself, with it being such a common misconception there is lots out there.

Who hijacked highjacked the thread? I believe you've posted more replies than I have. I was giving MY OPINION ('IMO' I highlighted it for you) which is what one does on a forum, don't you know?

I stand by my opinion too. My son attends a private school here, not the best but better what his parents can offer him in regards to educating him as we both work but that's not the point, even if we could home school him, we would rather he experienced everyday school life. He does well academically, excels at sport and is extremely popular. Could he achieve all this at home? No way!

I wholly agree that Thai schools generally just aint up to scratch, that's why we searched and visited all the private schools in the city and then made a choice based on our findings.

I have a good friend back home that was home schooled and he's a decent, intelligent person so not sure that I'm as in the dark as you think I am. No misconceptions here, just preferences.

[Berkshire]

Left 'Land of Stupidity' two years ago. My daughter doing well in school, mastering music fine, and has great outside interest clubs like judo and brownies and athletics. Most importantly, school and society strongly support initiatives like anti-bullying and anti-racism. In a nutshell, she is learning right from wrong. Thailand is no place to bring up a child if you aspire to them having the chances and opportunities that you yourself had.

Is your wife Thai? If so, she was raised in the society that you call "stupid," which makes her stupid. Why would you marry a stupid woman?

[Berkshire]

This could be an interesting topic, considering that the OP is raising Thai daughters. I know many farangs in Thailand (and on TV) who go on and on about the negatives of western women. You know the deal, the lost of femininity, too demanding, too critical, in short, feminazis. At the same time, these same guys go on and on about why they prefer Thai women, usually because of Thai women's acceptance of traditional feminine roles (in theory).

So you would think most farangs in Thailand would want their daughters to grow up to be the same sort of women that they prefer? Hmmm, doesn't seem to be the case, which is somewhat hypocritical. But then the farang attitude in Thailand is typically hypocritical.

[This is not a knock on the OP as he seems to want the best of both worlds (whatever that means). But sometimes, the line is quite clear: modern/independent woman, or traditional woman. Don't worry, they will choose themselves in the end.]

[HooHaa]

most difficult and most selfless decision i have ever made was to let my daughter study at her mother and stepdad's in the US while i continue to work in asia.

it nearly killed me, after raising and living with her alone for her first 7 years, but she loves it.

[benalibina]

This could be an interesting topic, considering that the OP is raising Thai daughters. I know many farangs in Thailand (and on TV) who go on and on about the negatives of western women. You know the deal, the lost of femininity, too demanding, too critical, in short, feminazis. At the same time, these same guys go on and on about why they prefer Thai women, usually because of Thai women's acceptance of traditional feminine roles (in theory).

So you would think most farangs in Thailand would want their daughters to grow up to be the same sort of women that they prefer? Hmmm, doesn't seem to be the case, which is somewhat hypocritical. But then the farang attitude in Thailand is typically hypocritical.

[This is not a knock on the OP as he seems to want the best of both worlds (whatever that means). But sometimes, the line is quite clear: modern/independent woman, or traditional woman. Don't worry, they will choose themselves in the end.]

Mumbling in general plattitudes again. Mr no know it all. U never waver though with ur utter biassed opinions. Just ask anyone who has posted on this topic and who has kids if ur above generalisations are apllicable to him/her.

[HooHaa]

i think he is right, given the general attitude to western females displayed here it is indeed ironic that so many caring fathers would want their daughter to have a western education.

[benalibina]

i think he is right, given the general attitude to western females displayed here it is indeed ironic that so many caring fathers would want their daughter to have a western education.

We will know if he asks, wont we !

[Som wat]

Left 'Land of Stupidity' two years ago. My daughter doing well in school, mastering music fine, and has great outside interest clubs like judo and brownies and athletics. Most importantly, school and society strongly support initiatives like anti-bullying and anti-racism. In a nutshell, she is learning right from wrong. Thailand is no place to bring up a child if you aspire to them having the chances and opportunities that you yourself had.

Is your wife Thai? If so, she was raised in the society that you call "stupid," which makes her stupid. Why would you marry a stupid woman?

Nonsense Thai logic.

Are you Thai, Berkshire?

[Som wat]

This could be an interesting topic, considering that the OP is raising Thai daughters. I know many farangs in Thailand (and on TV) who go on and on about the negatives of western women. You know the deal, the lost of femininity, too demanding, too critical, in short, feminazis. At the same time, these same guys go on and on about why they prefer Thai women, usually because of Thai women's acceptance of traditional feminine roles (in theory).

So you would think most farangs in Thailand would want their daughters to grow up to be the same sort of women that they prefer? Hmmm, doesn't seem to be the case, which is somewhat hypocritical. But then the farang attitude in Thailand is typically hypocritical.

[This is not a knock on the OP as he seems to want the best of both worlds (whatever that means). But sometimes, the line is quite clear: modern/independent woman, or traditional woman. Don't worry, they will choose themselves in the end.]

You're confusing femanism and education, Somehow thinking that they are the same.

[Berkshire]

This could be an interesting topic, considering that the OP is raising Thai daughters. I know many farangs in Thailand (and on TV) who go on and on about the negatives of western women. You know the deal, the lost of femininity, too demanding, too critical, in short, feminazis. At the same time, these same guys go on and on about why they prefer Thai women, usually because of Thai women's acceptance of traditional feminine roles (in theory).

So you would think most farangs in Thailand would want their daughters to grow up to be the same sort of women that they prefer? Hmmm, doesn't seem to be the case, which is somewhat hypocritical. But then the farang attitude in Thailand is typically hypocritical.

[This is not a knock on the OP as he seems to want the best of both worlds (whatever that means). But sometimes, the line is quite clear: modern/independent woman, or traditional woman. Don't worry, they will choose themselves in the end.]

You're confusing femanism and education, Somehow thinking that they are the same.

Am I? So it's education? Does that mean that a Thai with a PhD will be more or less traditional than a Thai with a high school education? Or even better, a Thai with a PhD married to a Thai, or a Thai peasant girl married to a farang? I think you're confusing education with west vs. east values.

If one is raised in the west, one will be raised with western values. What part of that do you not understand?

[Berkshire]

Left 'Land of Stupidity' two years ago. My daughter doing well in school, mastering music fine, and has great outside interest clubs like judo and brownies and athletics. Most importantly, school and society strongly support initiatives like anti-bullying and anti-racism. In a nutshell, she is learning right from wrong. Thailand is no place to bring up a child if you aspire to them having the chances and opportunities that you yourself had.

Is your wife Thai? If so, she was raised in the society that you call "stupid," which makes her stupid. Why would you marry a stupid woman?

Nonsense Thai logic.

Are you Thai, Berkshire?

No, it's western logic. I'm an American.