Confusion over extension of stay, permission of stay, and stamps with Non-O Visa

[digitalchromakey]

Sorry guys for responding so late but I'm currently on the other side of the World at the moment and it is Easter here and the community I'm in really celebrates today - Easter Sunday (been a real cultural blast).

MikeandDow - I've seen your posts on other topics on TV and one which went something like "I know I'm right. Isn't that arrogant" - so I fearfully correct you. The requirement to have children "legitimized" in a court is being considered in Thailand but according to my informants in Immigration this has not been passed into law yet - I've just remembered you are strong on that point and demand to be quoted the relevant Legal statue (I can't). I gather the delay is partly caused by the current political impasse but you are right the Department is hoping to fully implement this requirement later in 2014. This provision, when implemented will require (for your information) a formal declaration before a court that you take full financial responsibility for your children as long as they remain minors. This court documentation will provide a level of legal protection for the child (and their legal guardians) to take legal action against their father (or their fathers estate) in another country - in other words their mothers will even be able to get maintenance orders in for example the UK. This "new requirement" will have to be done before a 'high court' (not sure how the court system works) - and the previous lower level village court process already done by some and simple documentation drawn up by local lawyers will have to be formalised at this higher level. But this is not yet applied and is not being applied to me.

My two sons are already "legitimised" to an extent fully accepted by Immigration in that I have registered them with my Embassy (for future dual citizenship rights and getting them included on my passport). This process has involved a number of legal documents and lawyers drawing up swore statements / affidavits etc. including those from their mother. Those signed by me undertake responsibility for them in a way acceptable to the laws of my country's legal system which are much more demanding of children's and maternal right than Thailand. But you are right that when the new regulations are formally implemented I'll have to get these document officially translated into Thai and go through getting them authorised by the local Court system (another gravy train for Thai lawyers in the pipeline).

Now there will I'm sure be a lot of debate on this on TV when this does become law because currently Thai birth certificates are acceptable "proof" of parenthood especially accompanied by an official conversion of the fathers name into Thai characters by a certified Government translator - which in my case is used on both birth certificates with my ID number.

Now before you jump all over me again - you and others have already ruled that I've been lied to / incorrectly informed / given wrong information by Immigration and the information above (about a change in requirements in the pipeline) comes from the same source who has ruled that I had insufficient time (only 14 days) on my current Visa to process an application for a year extension to stay on the basis of being responsible for my children. AND that they can't now process my application because I have a Single entry Visa. So before you start insisting I'm some dumb idiot who doesn't understand - just accept that some offices and officers in Immigration and in Thai embassies across this world have a different interpretation of the immigration law and how it is implemented.

By the way to remind you guys - this is what Canadian Girl 2 originally posted about - the confusing state of how the Immigration law is applied to people wanting to legally stay in Thailand with out having to do endless Visa runs.

As I've promised I'll keep you informed on TV about my progress.

Must go I have an Easter party tonight and a full public Holiday tomorrow to recover.

BVM, funny you should write that the Thai Law re Paternity Legitimization is not yet extant due to the 'current political impasse', since a good friend of mine was in front of a Thai Judge just last week doing precisely that for his two kids.

I guess you will post that Thai law is different in Phuket where I live from Samut Prakan..

Please don't expect a reply.

.

[thepool]

The "permission to stay" period is determined by an immigration officer and is not usually a topic for debate or negotiation .

The length of time covered by a "permission to stay" is dependent on the type of visa held.

[MikeandDow]

The "permission to stay" period is determined by an immigration officer and is not usually a topic for debate or negotiation .

The length of time covered by a "permission to stay" is dependent on the type of visa held.

I have to agree with the pool post #53 But I don't think you are well informed and you do not know what you are talking about, and its obvious you know best, so good luck.

[CanadianGirl2]

I went to my local immigration yesterday and applied for my 12 month extension of stay. Thank you for the information, everything was straight forward and I was in and out in 30 minutes. The officer said that she’ll be visiting me at my residence in a few weeks.

My only problem now is the 90 day report. I asked about this and they said that there is no need for me to report to them at all. They said that they used to require a report every 90 days but not anymore. This is in line what they originally said to me: either do an extension of stay or border runs, there is no 90 day reporting.

So, do not all immigration offices require 90 day reports for those on an extension of stay?

Edit. spelling.

Edited April 22, 2014 by CanadianGirl2

[KevinB]

Canadian Girl - it's great that things have sorted out for you. I'm sure the "guardians" of all things to do with Visas and Immigration will also celebrate with you (if they believe what you now report and don't argue that you are confused). And I hope they will be able to answer your question about the 90 day report requirement. On my last visit to a very crowded Samut Prakan immigration office - I sat next to a farang who had been waiting for ages (his number at least 20 ahead of mine) after seeing the immigration officer he return to where I was sitting because he had forgotten his briefcase - "Can you believe it?" he said "they say I don't need to do a report every 90 days!!!!!" - he was pissed off at a wasted trip and wasted time and his next comment summed it up - "the biggest bummer is you can never be sure what you are told in these Offices is the TRUTH - and represents a change in procedures or you end up worrying that on your next visit you will be told you failed to report at the last report point and are going to be penalised " - they had refused to stamp that he had actually been there.

PS when the lady comes to your home from Immigration make sure you have brewed up a nice cup of tea and have some cake.

[Lite Beer]

As the rule stands everyone who stays more than 90 days has to report their address to Immigration.
Maybe there was a misunderstanding somewhere.

The fine for not reporting is usually 2,000 Baht.

Notification of staying in the Kingdom over 90 days

Procedure and notification
The foreigner makes the notification in person, or
The foreigner authorises another person to make the notification, or
The foreigner makes the notification by registered mail.
The notification must be made within 15 days before or after 7 days the period of 90 days expires.
The first application for extension of stay by the foreigner is equivalent to the notification of staying in the Kingdom over 90 days.

http://bangkok.immigration.go.th/en/base.php?page=90days

[MikeandDow]

Canadian Girl - it's great that things have sorted out for you. I'm sure the "guardians" of all things to do with Visas and Immigration will also celebrate with you (if they believe what you now report and don't argue that you are confused). And I hope they will be able to answer your question about the 90 day report requirement. On my last visit to a very crowded Samut Prakan immigration office - I sat next to a farang who had been waiting for ages (his number at least 20 ahead of mine) after seeing the immigration officer he return to where I was sitting because he had forgotten his briefcase - "Can you believe it?" he said "they say I don't need to do a report every 90 days!!!!!" - he was pissed off at a wasted trip and wasted time and his next comment summed it up - "the biggest bummer is you can never be sure what you are told in these Offices is the TRUTH - and represents a change in procedures or you end up worrying that on your next visit you will be told you failed to report at the last report point and are going to be penalised " - they had refused to stamp that he had actually been there.

PS when the lady comes to your home from Immigration make sure you have brewed up a nice cup of tea and have some cake.

me thinks its the other way around can not believe any thing YOU post, nobody believes what you post, just a troll.

[MikeandDow]

I went to my local immigration yesterday and applied for my 12 month extension of stay. Thank you for the information, everything was straight forward and I was in and out in 30 minutes. The officer said that she’ll be visiting me at my residence in a few weeks.

My only problem now is the 90 day report. I asked about this and they said that there is no need for me to report to them at all. They said that they used to require a report every 90 days but not anymore. This is in line what they originally said to me: either do an extension of stay or border runs, there is no 90 day reporting.

So, do not all immigration offices require 90 day reports for those on an extension of stay?

Edit. spelling.

I hope you have plenty of money because if you don't report you will be fined.

[partington]

"Can you believe it?" he said "they say I don't need to do a report every 90 days!!!!!" - he was pissed off at a wasted trip and wasted time and his next comment summed it up - "the biggest bummer is you can never be sure what you are told in these Offices is the TRUTH - and represents a change in procedures or you end up worrying that on your next visit you will be told you failed to report at the last report point and are going to be penalised " - they had refused to stamp that he had actually been there.

Again this is a confusion. There is no stamp for 90 day reports, and never has been. You fill in a form, hand it in, and then you are given a small white form back that tells you the date when you next need to report. Your passport is not stamped.

It is so unlikely that 90 day reports have been discontinued at certain immigration offices around the country without a general change in policy that in the absence of other confirmation, I would advise everyone to obtain form TM47, the 90 day report form, fill it in, and go to your immigration office with the form whenever you have been in the country for 90 days, and attempt to make the report.

Edited April 22, 2014 by partington

[gzu88bv]

I am myself interested how this thing will turn out for KevinB.

It is not always very clear what visa KevinB uses to enter LOS, and then again he is not a newbie to this country either when I read his messages.

We all know that you have to be flexible in Thailand and info from immigration can vary from office to office. Could it not be that he indeed obtaines and operates with Non-O-Visas (multiple or single) from the Thai Embassy in Nigeria? I am referring here i.e. to post #54 where everybody would assume that we are talking about a Tourist Visa.

I write this because I once received a Non-O-Visa for three entries from a Swiss Thai Consulate and when I mentioned this here everybody incl. the experts on this forum said that this is not possible, but it is.