E-cigarettes just as deadly as normal smokes, experts warn

[Lite Beer]

SPECIAL REPORT
E-cigarettes just as deadly as normal smokes, experts warn
Pantipa Jitrawutthiporn
The Sunday Nation

BANGKOK: -- The Public Health Ministry plans to push through a law to include electronic cigarettes in existing laws controlling the sale of ordinary cigarettes, amid concern that users face the risk of heart disease and cancer. The draft should be sent to Parliament for consideration soon.

With more and more smokers trying to kick the habit, many merchants decided to start smuggling e-cigarettes and sell them as devices that will help smokers quit.

E-cigarettes - with attractive packaging, different flavours and prices ranging from a few hundred to several thousand baht - were prohibited in Thailand five years ago, but that did not stop the smugglers. They are openly sold alongside other China-made products at markets such as Khlong Tom and Saphan Lek areas in Bangkok as well as at some shopping malls and second-hand shops. They are also sold online and through social networks.

Other than sellers' claim that the e-cigarettes are safe for secondary smokers and that they do not leave an odour behind, these devices became even more popular when smokers began realising that these were cheaper in the long run than an ordinary pack of cigarettes.

But Khatha Bundithanukul, a member of the Smoking Cessation Pharmacist Volunteers' Network, warned that this product could be more hazardous to health.

Khatha dismissed claims that e-cigarettes had nothing but nicotine, compared to normal cigarettes that contain 6,000 toxins. He said e-cigarettes burned propylene glycol and produced carcinogenic residue. Nicotine content in e-cigarettes was also higher and could cause palpitations and an increase in blood pressure, he pointed out.

Studies have also shown that e-cigarettes do not really help smokers quit, but actually keep them addicted to nicotine and make the cravings worse, he said.

Dr Wanchat Supajaturas, director of the Thai Health Professional Alliance against Tobacco Office, said both types of cigarettes posed the same risks, but people believe that the electronic version is safer because inhaling through a liquid appears less harmful.

He also warned that the Food and Drug Administration (FDA) did not control the liquids used in e-cigarettes and that the Thai Industrial Standards Institute had not tested them.

The liquids used in e-cigarettes contain concentrated nicotine and residues such as propylene glycol, lead, manganese, zinc, mercury, arsenic and cadmium - which could destroy smokers' respiratory system and cause cancer if used in excess over a prolonged period, he said.

Wanchat said Thai youngsters were keen on e-cigarettes because they were fashionable and came in different flavours, adding that a Prathom 3 student was found to be addicted to e-cigarettes after copying his guardian's habits. He also called on the authorities to quickly find measures to tackle this issue.

Dr Nopporn Cheunklin, deputy chief of the Public Health Ministry's Disease Control Department, said that since e-cigarettes were popular despite being prohibited, the ministry had decided to draft a law and put them under the same controls applied to normal cigarettes and tobacco products.

E-cigarettes are currently prohibited under three laws:

l The 1992 Tobacco Products Control Act, which prohibits the import and sale of cigarette-like products, with violators facing a fine of up to Bt20,000;

l The 1967 Medicine Act, which prohibits the manufacturing, sale and import of modern medical products, with violators facing up to five years in prison and a Bt10,000 fine;

l The 1926 Customs Act, which prohibits persons from bringing untaxed products into the Kingdom and is punishable with a fine that is four times the value of the product plus import tax and/or up to 10 years in jail.

Since these laws have not been that strictly enforced, smugglers continue taking chances. An online seller, who commented on condition of anonymity, said that though he knew it was illegal, the business was lucrative enough to be worth the risk. His customers were youngsters who keep returning to purchase liquids to top up their e-cigarettes.

He said that though one of his friends, who opened a shop in a Bangkok mall, was arrested, he managed to get away with a Bt20,000 bribe. Since then, he had not been arrested thanks to tip-offs ahead of police raids.

-- The Nation 2014-05-04

[bobl]

Here we go again...

Sent from my i-mobile IQ 6.2 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[Thai at Heart]

There is absolutely zero proof globally of what this bloke says.

E cigarettes are by many magnitudes safer than normal cigarettes. This was quoted this week by the BMA in the UK. There is no tar and no carbon monoxide for a very basic start.

The carcinogenic compounds in tar are in the hundreds. Lies like this are very dangerous.

[Emptyset]

Nicotine isn't particularly harmful as far as these things go, it may even have benefits. There's even some evidence it could help prevent Alzheimer's and other neurodegenerative illnesses. It's the tobacco smoke which contains the carcinogens - not the nicotine. One British expert suggested that e-cigs were about as dangerous as a cup of coffee - and, of course, coffee has been found to have many benefits in recent years, despite 'experts' warning against it. It's also the combination of the smoke and nicotine which is particularly addictive, not the nicotine in itself.

I don't care too much about this one way or the other, having given up smoking altogether. But I often wonder if vested interests - big tobacco, big pharma, or whatever - are trying to muddy the waters on e-cigarettes. After all, if they're as dangerous as ordinary cigarettes, you might as well keep on smoking your regular Marlboros or quit using the usual (often expensive) smoking cessation aids, nicotine patches etc... in any case, imo, anyone who says that an e-cigarette is as dangerous as a tobacco cigarette is either ill-informed or deliberately disingenuous.

[Thai at Heart]

Nicotine isn't particularly harmful as far as these things go, it may even have benefits. There's even some evidence it could help prevent Alzheimer's and other neurodegenerative illnesses. It's the tobacco smoke which contains the carcinogens - not the nicotine. One British expert suggested that e-cigs were about as dangerous as a cup of coffee - and, of course, coffee has been found to have many benefits in recent years, despite 'experts' warning against it. It's also the combination of the smoke and nicotine which is particularly addictive, not the nicotine in itself.

I don't care too much about this one way or the other, having given up smoking altogether. But I often wonder if vested interests - big tobacco, big pharma, or whatever - are trying to muddy the waters on e-cigarettes. After all, if they're as dangerous as ordinary cigarettes, you might as well keep on smoking your regular Marlboros or quit using the usual (often expensive) smoking cessation aids, nicotine patches etc... in any case, imo, anyone who says that an e-cigarette is as dangerous as a tobacco cigarette is either ill-informed or deliberately disingenuous.

Well no reasonably logical person could say what this doctor has said. There is a big issue for taxation.

The industry has found a way around cigarette taxes,.and even better the product is safer. The govt can't reasonably ban it or tax it. Its relatively safe, and so their policy of putting up taxes on fags has been broken..

But lying about safety like this is immoral I the extreme

[retell]

Yep we dont want the thai tabacco monopoly lose money ,

The biggest danger lies in the cheap e sigarettes batteries that tend to explode now and then

!

For the liquid itself indeed believe its less damaging , but still no good

But hey , walk in bkk on a sunny day isnt that good for your lungs also,

Nicotin isnt that bad , its actually found in many common vegetables also

I smoke myself , and have used those e smokes also , its a pretty good alternative

[FATOZ]

Independent research from Boston University shows that electronic cigarettes have up to 1000 times less carcinogens than traditional cigarettes. This research suggests that you would need to use ecigs for three years to ingest the same amounts of carcinogens found in one pack of traditional cigarettes.

Propylene glycol is the same substance used in night club smoke machines, Are they going to ban them as well?

I suspect the Thai Government motivation for banning e-cigs is the same as the Australian Government, they will lose huge amounts of tax revenue, and party donations from the tobacco companies

[Payboy]

Someones worried about the monopoly.

[noitom]

Thailand has three laws on the books which are pretty clear. When Thailand starts to enforce these jail terms for tarfficking, selling and distributing these products, then they start to marginalize their use. If there is no jail time, Thailand will never change. The fines are petty and bargained away with corrupt dealing. Jail time is needed to be enforced for trafficking in these products. Flip the bustees to get at the Thai Mr. Bigs. When we see a Thai Mr. Big being hauled off on charges of trafficking and read about it when he is sent to jail, that will be a good start. Until then, Thais can expect this trade to expand massively.

[WitawatWatawit]

It's political (read "backhanders") and nothing to do with tax - after all, studies by anti-smoking groups have often said the loss of tax revenue from tobacco is made up by broader spending and lower health costs. Besides, governments are at their creative best when it comes to finding new ways to tax us minions.

(BTW, tried the e-cigs but just couldn't get into them for some reason. It took a medical check to kick my sorry ars* into action.)

[phosphorescent]

There is more evidence for carcinogens in talcum powder than in e cigarettes. Guess there's no money to be made from banning talc.

[Prbkk]

Yes, all about tax revenue, nothing to do with public health...

[haybilly]

Unbelievable--people finally find a viable option for getting long term nicotine addicts of 'Analogue', or 'normal' cigarettes and the Big Government lobbyists start getting their show on the road to crush this 'insolent upstart'--how dare they threaten their monopoly on Tobacco Taxation receipts???

I suppose, now, we will start to get hassled at Airports [not smoking these devices, of course] but merely having them in our luggage--they will soon have a reason to take them away from us since they are 'Banned' in the Kingdom.

I have smoked an E-Cigarette device since August 2011--yes, yes, I know it shows that they are not a 'cessation' device, but my lungs are clearer on Annual Health Checkup X-Rays, my breathing and lungs feel better--the evidence from 'sensible civilized' countries and their Health Departments all point to these being 'less harmful'[ admittedly none say totally safe] than real tobacco based cigarettes--and what does the Thai health Ministry do--caves in to pressure from Big Tobacco.

Total crap.

[boomerangutang]

How about comparing them to taking a walk in Bangkok? I was waiting for a bus along a regular road in Bkk, and nearly passed out from fumes. You can taste the smog. A Canadian friend, in his 50's, died within five years of moving to Bkk, of lung failure. He didn't smoke and didn't have a history of lung problems. Another buddy would have to wipe black residual stuff off his face, each time he traveled by bus in Bangkok.

I think all users of ciggs, pseudo ciggs, caffeine drinks, msg, white sugar and fermented sugar drinks (alcohol) should pay premium taxes - to offset jacked up prices the rest of us are required to pay via taxes (to take care of their ill-health) and higher health insurance.

A person should have the right to debilitate him/herself, but don't require that others (who live cleanly) pay for it, directly or indirectly.

Edited May 4, 2014 by boomerangutang

[Thai at Heart]

How about comparing them to taking a walk in Bangkok? I was waiting for a bus along a regular road in Bkk, and nearly passed out from fumes. You can taste the smog. A Canadian friend, in his 50's, died within five years of moving to Bkk, of lung failure. He didn't smoke and didn't have a history of lung problems. Another buddy would have to wipe black residual stuff off his face, each time he traveled by bus in Bangkok.

I think all users of ciggs, pseudo ciggs, caffeine drinks, msg, white sugar and fermented sugar drinks (alcohol) should pay premium taxes - to offset jacked up prices the rest of us are required to pay via taxes (to take care of their ill-health) and higher health insurance.

A person should have the right to debilitate him/herself, but don't require that others (who live cleanly) pay for it, directly or indirectly.

They do pay already. Quite handsomely....

Just imagine though if everyone stopped smoking and switched to e cigs. Everyone would pay higher taxes to fill the gap. Smokers are subsidising your pension and your health care. Duh....

[doremifasol]

I easily quit smoking 7 months a go after 30 +++ years.

Best decision ever.

[bobl]

I think all users of ciggs, pseudo ciggs, caffeine drinks, msg, white sugar and fermented sugar drinks (alcohol) should pay premium taxes - to offset jacked up prices the rest of us are required to pay via taxes (to take care of their ill-health) and higher health insurance.

A person should have the right to debilitate him/herself, but don't require that others (who live cleanly) pay for it, directly or indirectly.

In most countries where tobacco products are heavily taxed, under the guise of paying for health care, the tax revenues exceed the estimated costs the health services incur due to tobacco related illnesses, by a very significant amount.

In other words, smokers are subsidising health care, not the other way round as you suggest... Your "jacked up prices" are a direct result of the insatiable greed of big pharma and insurance companies.

Sent from my i-mobile IQ 6.2 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[phosphorescent]

I've seen people who I thought would never be able to quit smoking, give up with the aid of e cigarettes. I managed to give up 'cold turkey' after smoking for 20 years but everyone is different and I know many just find it impossible.

My mother is one case in point. She is 67 years old (would never admit it) and began smoking at the age of 12. She smoked 40-60 per day until she discovered e cigarettes 3 years ago and was able to switch immediately after trying and failing to give up numerous times before.

While smoking cigarettes her health was pretty bad, she wheezed and coughed a lot an often found herself out of breath and out of energy. Since switching to e cigarettes, she has found a new lease on life. She now goes out dancing 2-3 times a week, takes a daily 5 km walk and has taken up cycling too which she says she really enjoys. She started doing these things within a year of switching to e cigarettes because her health drastically improved and she found herself with so much more energy.

She is one of three people I know personally with pretty much the same story. Of course, There are people like myself, who have gone 'cold turkey', but most of them replaced cigarettes with food and gained weight as a result which inhibited them from feeling the health benefits from giving up.

For me, seeing is believing and the fact that unscrupulous people are trying to take e cigarettes off the market shows blatant favoritism towards tobacco companies and it is an utter disgrace.

[Thai at Heart]

I've seen people who I thought would never be able to quit smoking, give up with the aid of e cigarettes. I managed to give up 'cold turkey' after smoking for 20 years but everyone is different and I know many just find it impossible.

My mother is one case in point. She is 67 years old (would never admit it) and began smoking at the age of 12. She smoked 40-60 per day until she discovered e cigarettes 3 years ago and was able to switch immediately after trying and failing to give up numerous times before.

While smoking cigarettes her health was pretty bad, she wheezed and coughed a lot an often found herself out of breath and out of energy. Since switching to e cigarettes, she has found a new lease on life. She now goes out dancing 2-3 times a week, takes a daily 5 km walk and has taken up cycling too which she says she really enjoys. She started doing these things within a year of switching to e cigarettes because her health drastically improved and she found herself with so much more energy.

She is one of three people I know personally with pretty much the same story. Of course, There are people like myself, who have gone 'cold turkey', but most of them replaced cigarettes with food and gained weight as a result which inhibited them from feeling the health benefits from giving up.

For me, seeing is believing and the fact that unscrupulous people are trying to take e cigarettes off the market shows blatant favoritism towards tobacco companies and it is an utter disgrace.

Its all about the taxes

[Briggsy]

Thai govt either very concerned about loss of tax revenues & profits from the Govt Tobacco Monopoly and are inventing lies to push through laws to protect it

or

they are simply inventing scientific data off the top of their heads.

They have a strong track record of both. I would go with 80% of reason 1 and 20 % of reason 2 as the real story behind this.

[phosphorescent]

I've seen people who I thought would never be able to quit smoking, give up with the aid of e cigarettes. I managed to give up 'cold turkey' after smoking for 20 years but everyone is different and I know many just find it impossible.

My mother is one case in point. She is 67 years old (would never admit it) and began smoking at the age of 12. She smoked 40-60 per day until she discovered e cigarettes 3 years ago and was able to switch immediately after trying and failing to give up numerous times before.

While smoking cigarettes her health was pretty bad, she wheezed and coughed a lot an often found herself out of breath and out of energy. Since switching to e cigarettes, she has found a new lease on life. She now goes out dancing 2-3 times a week, takes a daily 5 km walk and has taken up cycling too which she says she really enjoys. She started doing these things within a year of switching to e cigarettes because her health drastically improved and she found herself with so much more energy.

She is one of three people I know personally with pretty much the same story. Of course, There are people like myself, who have gone 'cold turkey', but most of them replaced cigarettes with food and gained weight as a result which inhibited them from feeling the health benefits from giving up.

For me, seeing is believing and the fact that unscrupulous people are trying to take e cigarettes off the market shows blatant favoritism towards tobacco companies and it is an utter disgrace.

Its all about the taxes

Yes, that is one of the reasons for favoritism towards tobacco companies.

[Bluespunk]

All through this article I was wondering, what's this guy's problem. The things are banned. Then I read this at the end

"Since these laws have not been that strictly enforced, "

Enlightenment descending.

[55Jay]

Ecig users and suppliers are in the "smuggler" category. Sounds pretty evil. Notice how it's repeated a few times. Love the social engineering by mass media.

If the government cares so much about people, why not ban all tobacco products? Yeah, when pigs fly.

I would expect another "crack down" but the Caretaker Gov is a bit preoccupied at the moment. LOL.

I have been off cigs 5 months using ecig. I tapered down to Low strength liquid and can leave my ecig at home when I go out for the day. I have no cravings, unlike when I smoked a handful of cigarettes every hour for 25 years. I feel better, don't stink, can smell and taste better and my dentist noticed the difference. I'll probably drop the ecig in time as well but for now, happy I'm off the real cigs and my Mrs is over the moon about it as well.

[haybilly]

"If the government cares so much about people, why not ban all tobacco products? Yeah, when pigs fly"

Absolutely--makes sense.....but then again, when does the Government here ever do things that 'Make sense'?

There are a whole shed-load of measures that they could implement if the Health and Safety of the Thai People really was their primary concern--we could start on the roads, in the Building Industry, Farming, Garment Manufacture Industry, etc... plenty of room for safety initiatives in all these areas.

[WoopyDoo]

Someones worried about the monopoly.

You can say that again....

The health minister actually has the monopoly on ALL nicotine replacement products, he is the only person with the license... No way will anyone else be allowed to apply for a license either.

The government also has the monopoly on ALL tobacco products imported into the country, again if you want to import and store tobacco based products you need a 'special; pharmaceutical license and again... You will NEVER be granted one.

The government want to stop e-cig use... they know they are all but harmless, and so far are lying through their teeth to the public to justify protection of their monopolies and all the money that comes from them.

Once again.... lies and corruption in full evidence.

Even the EU can't find anything wrong enough to ban it, and the Philip Morris group are already working on e-juice manufacturing and have bought out related companies already....

E-cigs are the future.... I use one and have tried all the nic replacement products that have failed one by one.... but my e-cig has kept me off my 2 pack a day habit for over 3 months now and I love it.... As far as respiratory damage goes... it is utter boll-ox.... Since not smoking real cigs I have no smokers cough now..... ever, my breathing has improved dramatically, and my sense of smell and taste have vastly improved... So if anything, my resparation has almost returned to none smoker status, and I was a 35 year smoker.

I also feel a lot fitter and a lot more healthy..... e-cigs are the best thing that have happened to my life, I started on 18 mg/ml strength nicotine and in 3 months have weened myself down to 10 mg/ml.... Also when you smoke a real cig, you are pretty much committed to smoking the whole thing, but with an e-cig you can just pick it up, have a couple of puffs and put it back down for half an hour.... so in reality you are ingesting far less nicotine with an e-cig.

This move is purely cynical and all about money and greed as usual.

I am really pissed off because I was also going to start a major website selling e-cigs and components.... without nicotine... just modules, tanks and batteries etc....

Looks like I now have to wait to see what the legislation will be... but looks like they will ban all accessories and everything to do with e-cigs whether they come with nicotine or not.

[WoopyDoo]

Looking deeper into this, e-cig devices without nicotine in them are not really subject to these regulations.

l The 1992 Tobacco Products Control Act, which prohibits the import and sale of cigarette-like products, with violators facing a fine of up to Bt20,000; .........It is not a tobacco product..... period...... It is also NOT 'cigarette-like'...... It is 10 inches long and nowt like a real cig.

l The 1967 Medicine Act, which prohibits the manufacturing, sale and import of modern medical products, with violators facing up to five years in prison and a Bt10,000 fine;.......... e-cigs with no nicotine are not modern medical products.

l The 1926 Customs Act, which prohibits persons from bringing untaxed products into the Kingdom and is punishable with a fine that is four times the value of the product plus import tax and/or up to 10 years in jail ........... Only applicable where no import duty is paid, and importer can import on the same tarrif as a hookah or a simple tobacco pipe which are freely available in Thailand.

So I can't see where this can affect me if I only import devices that contain no nicotine at point of entry.

Edited May 4, 2014 by WoopyDoo

[upena]

I quit smoking analog cigarettes after 49 years and have now been vaping 9 1/2 months and reducing the level of nicotine to where I will be down to zero next month. This is all about lost tax revenue in Thailand and around the world.

[hyperdimension]

The article appears to list Propylene glycol as a harmful substance when it doesn't seem to be the case. Here are some excerpts from Propylene glycol:

Propylene glycol is considered generally recognized as safe (GRAS) by the U.S. Food and Drug Administration, and it is used as an humectant (E1520), solvent, and preservative in food and for tobacco products, as well as being one of the major ingredients of the "e-liquid" used in electronic cigarettes along with vegetable glycerin. Vaporizers used for delivery of pharmaceuticals or personal care products often include propylene glycol among the ingredients they are filled with.^[4] Propylene glycol is used as a solvent in many pharmaceuticals, including oral, injectable and topical formulations, such as for diazepam and lorazepam which are insoluble in water.^[7]

The acute oral toxicity of propylene glycol is very low, and large quantities are required to cause perceptible health damage in humans

Serious toxicity generally occurs only at plasma concentrations over 1 g/L, which requires extremely high intake over a relatively short period of time.^[20] It would be nearly impossible to reach toxic levels by consuming foods or supplements, which contain at most 1 g/kg of PG.

[bigbamboo]

I wish they'd ban the sale of P-Beer in Thailand too.

[marko kok prong]

Hard to start a fire with e cigs too.