Mani people : Ethnic ‘negrito’ tribe of Thailand

[Beetlejuice]

I don`t think the subject of the Thai negrito people has ever been covered on Thai visa? This maybe a first.

Not far from the high rise hotels of Phuket, a shy tribe of forest dwellers clings tenaciously to time-honoured ways.

Of all the different tribes of Thailand the negritos are certainly the most unique, they have the appearance of being half Thai and half African yet claim to have lived in Thailand for thousands of years and no one it appears is sure of their origins. They are the only Negrito group in Thailand and speak Maniq (also called Tonga, Kensiu or Mos), a Mon–Khmer language in the Aslian language group. They are mostly forest dwellers and live similar lives to the South American tribes of the Amazon. The negritos are spread all over Indo China in small isolated communities, yet very few outsiders have seen or met the negritos and many have not heard of them.

Here is part one and part two of an interesting documentary focused on the Thai negritos.

I created this thread for interest and educational purposes. Anyone who has strong racist views and unfounded racial theories, please skip this thread and go and tell it somewhere else.

[snottgoblin]

Interesting topic BJ

[bonobo]

I trained with the Negritos in the Philippines. I have no idea if the Thai Negritos are related. Frankly, I didn't even know of the Thai Negritos, so I have to thank the OP for a little education this evening.

[Pattszero]

The unfortunate aspect of the negritos is that they are treated appallingly by Thai society.

Racism writ large.

The OP was out of order suggesting that racism should not be discussed here. In fact, that is also appalling - when it is the single biggest issue affecting this group.

[Beetlejuice]

The unfortunate aspect of the negritos is that they are treated appallingly by Thai society.

Racism writ large.

The OP was out of order suggesting that racism should not be discussed here. In fact, that is also appalling - when it is the single biggest issue affecting this group.

I suggest you read my OP again. My meaning was about using derogatory racist terms against people and Thai bashing, not about discussing the unfair treatment of certain ethnic peoples of Thailand.

I believe there are several factors involved regarding Thai attitudes towards these people and that there is a lot more to it than just racism as we would compare the sorts of racism with that of the West, it`s much more complicated than that. This is something that has been ingrained into some third world societies for centuries against certain people who are considered as being of a lower caste and believed should have a certain place in society and kept that way. These attitudes are common place in the third world, but to understand it, one has to have good knowledge of the thinking and cultural aspects of the peoples of different cultures that us with our western values may find difficult to comprehend and accept.

[ultimate weapon]

After western treatment of supposed ppl of lower bearing like the africans who were enslaves now they suddenly become the great enlightened ones teaching 3rd world ppl on how to treat these people?

I don't see them being enslaved or thai people harrassing them in fact they are being helped. What happened to the natives of the US, canada, australia to name a few places that farang now populate.

[JDGRUEN]

I have toured about 16 cities and towns and much of rural Thailand in the Isaan region and elsewhere. My observations show that there is a scattering of 'negrito' type of people around what used to be large American Military Bases dating from about 1964 to 1974. I fully realize that these mixed race offspring (1st. and 2nd. generation) are probably not related to the negritos OP speaks of... However, in short observations of these mixed race people mostly in the North East of Thailand I did not notice any particular discrimination ... they seemed fully blended into the local society. But my observations were but a handful and for not long periods of time. The U.S. military population from 1964 through 1974 likely reached up ot one million men rotating in and out of Thailand. As a result there are many many Thais carrying genes for lighter skin, blue and green eyes, Western facial feature, lighter colored hair. I have observed many of these people too - of age early to mid 40's. They too seem to be fully accepted into Thai society. Please note my observations were just that -- what I saw on the street. I took note of these things because I was one of the about one million who was stationed in Thailand during that period. Bottom line what I saw seemed to be acceptance and integration.

I do recall that back in 1968 the local Thais referred to Cambodians (Khmer) as 'daam' ... dark or black.

[Dexlowe]

Thanks for that, BJ. Guess their traditional way of life is over.

[ultimate weapon]

This isn't just thai attitude it's more of modernization vs traditional ways of life. It happens everywhere world wide. I can say though that such traditional people well i think have it worse off in farang countries. I hear the suicide rates of native "indians" in canada were also appallingly high even though canada shouldn't have been so extreme in racism compared to the US.

[marko kok prong]

The unfortunate aspect of the negritos is that they are treated appallingly by Thai society.

Racism writ large.

The OP was out of order suggesting that racism should not be discussed here. In fact, that is also appalling - when it is the single biggest issue affecting this group.

Mate,good post,i could only thing how looked down on these people would be,in the land of skin whitenening creams,a big problem in this country is that they are told from birth,kon thai are better than any one else.

[Seligne2]

Thanks for the post/videos!. Short Wikipedia article on the Negrito including a link to the Mani people: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Negrito

[willyumiii]

very good,

very interesting!

I would love to see TV used more for educational purposes like this!

Thank you BJ!

( and I have not read a negative comment yet....love it!

[eldragon]

After western treatment of supposed ppl of lower bearing like the africans who were enslaves now they suddenly become the great enlightened ones teaching 3rd world ppl on how to treat these people?

I don't see them being enslaved or thai people harrassing them in fact they are being helped. What happened to the natives of the US, canada, australia to name a few places that farang now populate.

I get that it seems hypocritical, but the people who were participating in slave trading in the west are long gone.

I haven't watched the video yet. Hopefully Thais do help them. But there is absolutely a bad attitude towards dark skin here. Not amongst all Thai people, but it is there for sure. Dark skin is largely seen as an unattractive quality by locals. Many of my Thai friends will confess they are afraid of foreigners with dark skin. I worked in an office that flat out wouldn't hire foreigners with dark skin. And they had no shame admitting it.

[eldragon]

The unfortunate aspect of the negritos is that they are treated appallingly by Thai society.

Racism writ large.

The OP was out of order suggesting that racism should not be discussed here. In fact, that is also appalling - when it is the single biggest issue affecting this group.

I suggest you read my OP again. My meaning was about using derogatory racist terms against people and Thai bashing, not about discussing the unfair treatment of certain ethnic peoples of Thailand.

I believe there are several factors involved regarding Thai attitudes towards these people and that there is a lot more to it than just racism as we would compare the sorts of racism with that of the West, it`s much more complicated than that. This is something that has been ingrained into some third world societies for centuries against certain people who are considered as being of a lower caste and believed should have a certain place in society and kept that way. These attitudes are common place in the third world, but to understand it, one has to have good knowledge of the thinking and cultural aspects of the peoples of different cultures that us with our western values may find difficult to comprehend and accept.

I came across this concept called 'power distance'. I think it plays into the topic a bit. Interesting to see where TH ranks alongside other nations.

http://www.clearlycultural.com/geert-hofstede-cultural-dimensions/power-distance-index/

[Seastallion]

The unfortunate aspect of the negritos is that they are treated appallingly by Thai society.

Racism writ large.

The OP was out of order suggesting that racism should not be discussed here. In fact, that is also appalling - when it is the single biggest issue affecting this group.

I suggest you read my OP again. My meaning was about using derogatory racist terms against people and Thai bashing, not about discussing the unfair treatment of certain ethnic peoples of Thailand.

I believe there are several factors involved regarding Thai attitudes towards these people and that there is a lot more to it than just racism as we would compare the sorts of racism with that of the West, it`s much more complicated than that. This is something that has been ingrained into some third world societies for centuries against certain people who are considered as being of a lower caste and believed should have a certain place in society and kept that way. These attitudes are common place in the third world, but to understand it, one has to have good knowledge of the thinking and cultural aspects of the peoples of different cultures that us with our western values may find difficult to comprehend and accept.

I came across this concept called 'power distance'. I think it plays into the topic a bit. Interesting to see where TH ranks alongside other nations.

http://www.clearlycultural.com/geert-hofstede-cultural-dimensions/power-distance-index/

Perhaps you're trolling by putting up an article that places Israel as the second best country for equality. Frankly, if you're not trolling, then I don;t give much credence to your link.

[eldragon]

The unfortunate aspect of the negritos is that they are treated appallingly by Thai society.

Racism writ large.

The OP was out of order suggesting that racism should not be discussed here. In fact, that is also appalling - when it is the single biggest issue affecting this group.

I suggest you read my OP again. My meaning was about using derogatory racist terms against people and Thai bashing, not about discussing the unfair treatment of certain ethnic peoples of Thailand.

I believe there are several factors involved regarding Thai attitudes towards these people and that there is a lot more to it than just racism as we would compare the sorts of racism with that of the West, it`s much more complicated than that. This is something that has been ingrained into some third world societies for centuries against certain people who are considered as being of a lower caste and believed should have a certain place in society and kept that way. These attitudes are common place in the third world, but to understand it, one has to have good knowledge of the thinking and cultural aspects of the peoples of different cultures that us with our western values may find difficult to comprehend and accept.

I came across this concept called 'power distance'. I think it plays into the topic a bit. Interesting to see where TH ranks alongside other nations.

http://www.clearlycultural.com/geert-hofstede-cultural-dimensions/power-distance-index/

Perhaps you're trolling by putting up an article that places Israel as the second best country for equality. Frankly, if you're not trolling, then I don;t give much credence to your link.

Wow! I didn't catch that. Ridiculous.

No, not trolling. The article doesn't explain power distance very well, but it's more or less the idea that people in a specific community or nation perceive those that come from a particular level within it as actually being better or worse people. For example, a Thai once told me she was not good enough to shop at Central World. You'd be less likely to hear a comment like that in a community or nation where the power distance is lower. Although, Thailand's score seems pretty moderate, with those of Singapore and other more developed nations being higher.

[thailiketoo]

After western treatment of supposed ppl of lower bearing like the africans who were enslaves now they suddenly become the great enlightened ones teaching 3rd world ppl on how to treat these people?

I don't see them being enslaved or thai people harrassing them in fact they are being helped. What happened to the natives of the US, canada, australia to name a few places that farang now populate.

I get that it seems hypocritical, but the people who were participating in slave trading in the west are long gone.

I haven't watched the video yet. Hopefully Thais do help them. But there is absolutely a bad attitude towards dark skin here. Not amongst all Thai people, but it is there for sure. Dark skin is largely seen as an unattractive quality by locals. Many of my Thai friends will confess they are afraid of foreigners with dark skin. I worked in an office that flat out wouldn't hire foreigners with dark skin. And they had no shame admitting it.

Thats better. I almost thought we were going to have an educational experience on Thai Visa.

[Seligne2]

Hofstede, the originator of this theory, does not say that, "...Israel [is] the second best country for equality". He would say that power distance is the extent to which the less powerful members of organizations and institutions (like the family) accept and expect that power is distributed unequally within that institution. Unfortunately, this does not rule out a given institution treating those outside the institution (Palestinians, Rohingya, e.g.) like crap. I found this useful: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hofstede's_cultural_dimensions_theory

[Mr Wimpy]

"Power distance" yawn!

Great documentary about the Mani though

[bina]

interesting although thte voice over was the usual patronizing bs... hubby and others were taught to use the blow pipe for hunting, probably learned from education filtered outward...

while interesting, the article presented everything as an idyllic peaceful simple life which most of us equate with 'green' living and living in jungles but obviously there are more comlex issues here: diseases from the outside, malnutrition since 'outside' food was introduced, genetic diseases from groups that stay together and dont mix and mingle, role of women... was teh 6 month old waling already because she had too or was she really 6 mnths old since they dont measure time as we do... a million questions...

and as far as thai treatmetn of 'others'... the darker they are, the worse they get treated. and although my hsuband admires 'jungle dwellers' (he scorns westerners as 'soft' or unable to fend for themselves or feed themselvs w/o stores etc) in day to day actions he is more likely to refer to them as thieves or drug runners as many thais see the rohinga...

but it si nice to see informative posts, and i wonder how many thais are studying indegenous peoples and anthropology and how many actually look close to home as opposed to overseas at the usual studied groups.

[wellred]

Well this is an ironic thread considering he OPs behaviour in the Koh tao thread.

[claffey]

Well this is an ironic thread considering he OPs behaviour in the Koh tao thread.

???????A link perhaps??? Its perfectly to have different opinions on different topics isn't it???

[eldragon]

Well this is an ironic thread considering he OPs behaviour in the Koh tao thread.

The OP is usually spot on. I'd give him the benefit of the doubt every time. Edited November 11, 2014 by eldragon

[keestha]

Is this thread about a tribe usually being referred to as Sakai?

[Mr Wimpy]

I think sakai is another name for them

Edited November 15, 2014 by Mr Wimpy

[Baa_Mango]

is it safe?!?

[thequietman]

Just curious about the origins of the name 'negritos' ! It sounds racist from the off.

Just wondering, no offence meant to these wonderful people.

[Dtaw]

I'm interested in kayaking that river and meeting the Mani people. Two resorts are named in the videos -Narai Thong Resort and Pa Nueng (Panueng) Long Kang. However, I cannot find any information about them online. OP, do you have any contact info for the resorts for those who are interested in going down there. I read about the Mani years ago in Thom Henley's book Waterfalls and Gibbon Calls. Hopefully they can get some benefits from ecotourism if it's done right.

By the way, I think I see the kids playing with the beak of a Great hornbill near the end of the 2nd video. I'm pretty sure it's illegal to hunt them. They also mention hunting langurs (Dusky langurs, I'm guessing) numerous times. But I guess if they're only take one or two at a time it could be sustainable, though I'm not completely sure about that.

Anyway, nice job on the videos -they got me to register for ThaiVisa.

Edited November 15, 2014 by Dtaw

[Beetlejuice]

In the Jurassic period on my seventh birthday, Dad bought me my first childrens encyclopaedia and in there was a page about the negrito tribe of Thailand that stuck in my mind over the years.

Some say that the negritos are the direct descendants of the first peoples into south East Asia from the great human diaspora out of Africa, but that’s only a theory not proven as fact. Taking a guess, I think the name description of these people as Negritos is probably a Latin deviation of the term, Negros, originating from the Spanish explorers and settlers in the Philippines, although as I said; this is only a guess, but probably an educated guess at that.

Having lived in Thailand for 31 years I have taken an active interest in the Thai people and the diversity of this wonderful country. Believe me, there is much more to Thailand than just bars, noodle stalls and the local communities of the outer provinces.

As regarding tours and so on of the Negrito community, I don`t think there is any. These people prefer to be and stay elusive, unlike the ethnic tribes of northern Thailand that these days like to portray themselves as a fake culture for the purposes of being tourist attractions with all their fake finery and outfits, but of course rarely do we get to see how they actually live in their real environments.

Back in 1982 my wife’s uncle who at the time was an upcountry reserve worker, managed to sneak me into the mountain homes of the Meo tribe (Meo meaning cat) way up in the mountains somewhere up north and there I witnessed the living conditions and how these people actually live that the tourists are rarely shown, hardly ever seen and scenes you will not see published in any travel brochures. Below are some photos from a collection I took in those days back in 1982, but over the last 30 odd years since I took those photos the situations of the Hill tribe peoples has much improved and many of them have now been settled into mainstream Thai society although there is still much controversy going on over their citizenships and rights in Thailand.

Edited November 15, 2014 by Beetlejuice

[otherstuff1957]

The word Negrito did indeed come from the Spanish in the Philippines. The Thais call them Ngo-pha.

King Chula took one into his household over a century ago and wrote a short book about their customs. I'm not sure if it has been translated into English though.

An interesting website about the various negrito peoples is 'andamans dot org'. I don't know if the link is permitted, so I spelled it out.