Behind bars: Thai women pay high price for drugs

[MMarlow]

I wish they would imprison corrupt officials and police instead. Drugs should be legal for anyone that doesn't harm others.

Then by that flawed logic you would have to agree that all illegal activities are decriminalised if they don't harm other people. Are you sure that the illegal use of drugs never has effects on third parties?

[SOTIRIOS]

....prostitution...thievery....drug smuggling or dealing....

...since when are any of these people 'victims'......???

[TPI]

In Phrae where we have just over 200 women in jail over 90% are in for Yaba! Where are the husbands and boyfriends that help put them there? They're still rocking around the neighbourhoods selling the stuff "muled" by their new girlfriends!

It seems to me that most of the problems with yaba would be fixed if Thai men grew a pair and learnt to deal with their problems, instead of either running to Mother or getting their brains ripped out by drugs.............or both!!

[TPI]

3 bucks a month sewing beads and let me guess the warden has a big house and a Merc.

Well if they didn't get involved in the drug business and got jobs, let's say as a prison warden for example, then they would have a good chance of not being in prison earning 100 baht a month.

And, yes, it is only your banal guesswork about 'the warden' having a big house and a Merc.

Well Mr MM it's like this, in the big world outside, say in the north of Thailand, there is a medium sized city where the warden of the local prison has just bought himself about 2 rai near the center of town and built a mansion worth about 5 million on it where the garage is about the size of the shop he has put out the front which is almost big enough to take his brand new Merc!

To get a job as a prison warder takes about 400-500,00 baht key money......how do they get that sort of money? I know, sell drugs!

I think you have made a mistake, old chap!

[Doc Blake]

Calling for a reduction of prison terms for drugs??

Arguing that the harsh policy has failed to curb dealing?????

And you think lower sentences will do this?

Do these people not see the damges done by Yaba and ice.

HIgh sentences don't make it better, but neither wil lower ones. At least they feel the pain of their mistakes unlike Holland where sentences are ridiculously low

What is the exuse as a buddhist to try to and make a profit by ruining others or at least aiding them to ruin themselves.

A drop in the bucket are the number of people in prison compared to those who are manufacturing, dealing and using! Yet the number in prison are way too many and the punishment does not fit a victimless crime. It is illegally, LEGAL NOW, just like all Prohibitions before, you will not stop this business, never, ever! Anyone, any age can find all the drugs they want to use today, all they need are the bucks. But I guess it makes you feel good to have your interfering nose stuck up their behind?

There are customers, street addicts, students, business people, wives and they will get what they want damaged by the drugs or not, they will get it. Your Nannie thinking and the governments are not going to interfere with this business other then drive the price higher, bring in more dealers, kill more innocent people, and put more in prison, and all in all, make the situation worse.

To do what? They don't give a dam about how much you care about the damage being done? There are plenty of them, that if you were standing there between them and anything they want, trying to stop the damage they are doing. Would happily drive their car right over the top of you to get their drugs, booze, gamble, eat too much, smoke their brains out, prostitutes, use MD drugs, and on and on. Maybe being an interfering nanny, and wanting to stick your nose where it does not belong is also an addiction, I am sorry, good luck with that?

[Guitar God]

Once a year they burn the marijuana they find ?

I'd do the same thing if I found some, just in smaller quantities and over a longer period of time.

I wouldn't want to be downwind of a yaba or heroin bonfire though.

I can't imagine the seized items being destroyed considering the large gap between the monetary value of the items and policemen's salaries. so let's assume that most of it is released back into the market. Combine it with all other supplies that managed to get through (which I assume is most of the total supply, as seizures are only a tip of the iceberg), then it is clear that the rate of consumption of methamphetamine is enormous. Now how much of this consumption has led to problems? Can anyone provide drug-related crime statistics? I think that the proportion of consumption of illegal drugs that directly results in harm to society is so small that the strict and costly enforcement of drug laws may be a huge waste of taxpayers' money and may be inflicting more harm than the drugs themselves (such as imprisoned parents like those mentioned in the article not being able to properly care for their children). Please provide evidence to prove me wrong.

Even though you can't imagine it... One year ago Thursday:

Thailand destroys almost 6 tons of confiscated narcotics and marijuana

http://goo.gl/Tkg9GG

Check the photo. And even though you can't imagine it... roughly the same will happen again this June 26, which is Thursday. Imagine that!

.

[GeForce]

I can't imagine the seized items being destroyed considering the large gap between the monetary value of the items and policemen's salaries. so let's assume that most of it is released back into the market. Combine it with all other supplies that managed to get through (which I assume is most of the total supply, as seizures are only a tip of the iceberg), then it is clear that the rate of consumption of methamphetamine is enormous. Now how much of this consumption has led to problems? Can anyone provide drug-related crime statistics? I think that the proportion of consumption of illegal drugs that directly results in harm to society is so small that the strict and costly enforcement of drug laws may be a huge waste of taxpayers' money and may be inflicting more harm than the drugs themselves (such as imprisoned parents like those mentioned in the article not being able to properly care for their children). Please provide evidence to prove me wrong.

Even though you can't imagine it... One year ago Thursday:

Thailand destroys almost 6 tons of confiscated narcotics and marijuana

http://goo.gl/Tkg9GG

Check the photo. And even though you can't imagine it... roughly the same will happen again this June 26, which is Thursday. Imagine that!

.

And this dude looks like he was standing too close to the fire

[thaicookingchef]

I wonder what would happen if Thailand would legalize weed ?

Maybe less yaba users or maybe more ?

Weed would make them so sleepy that they would need more yaba to wake up maybe ?!

[Suradit69]

"We want the society to look at the prisoners as human beings ...

Roughly 42,000 women are behind bars in Thailand -- about 14 percent of the total imprisoned population."

So why not look at them ALL as human beings, including the 86% who aren't women?

It's somewhat interesting in the west the perception of guilt for those on trial or in prison is, to a large extent, dependent on how attractive the individuals appear to the public.

Maybe prisoners in Thai prisons will be regarded as more human if they're given cosmetic make-overs

Jeremy Meeks is a convicted felon, an alleged gang member and is currently being held in jail on more felony weapons charges. Bail has been set at $1,000,000.

Yet, Meeks has a Facebook page with over 120,000 fans. His mother started a fundraising page that’s attracted 145 donations and over $2500 in one day. And the hashtag #FreeJeremyMeeks is trending on Twitter.

The positive feelings are all related to his “handsome” mug shot, which was posted by the Stockton Police Department on Facebook this week, and quickly became a sensation. It is a stunning example of how the American criminal justice system — in which defendants have the right to be judged by a jury of their peers — is often influenced by superficial attributes.

http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2014/06/21/3451689/why-people-are-donating-money-to-a-convicted-felon-just-because-he-has-a-handsome-mug-shot/?elq=~~eloqua..type--emailfield..syntax--recipientid~~&elqCampaignId=~~eloqua..type--campaign..campaignid--0..fieldname--id~~

A 1975 study found “unless they have used their attractiveness to commit a crime (for example, a swindle), good-looking people are likely to receive highly favorable treatment in the legal system.” For participants in the study, “When the crime was unrelated to attractiveness (burglary), subjects would assign more lenient sentences to the attractive defendant than to the unattractive defendant.”

A more recent UK study found “attractive suspects were more likely to be acquitted, despite there being no extra evidence in their favor.”

Possibly school guidance counselors can keep this in mind and advise really ugly students not to pursue careers that are likely to result in juries of their peers weighing whether to impose lengthy prison sentences or capital punishment.

Edited June 24, 2014 by Suradit69

[kinmaew]

All over the world the prisons are full of people not working not paying tax. Seems prison time is not a deterrent and a "Short term" fix to the problems that stem from people who commit the crimes that put them inside.

[beenhere2long]

I wonder what would happen if Thailand would legalize weed ?

Maybe less yaba users or maybe more ?

Weed would make them so sleepy that they would need more yaba to wake up maybe ?!

if weed was legalized the 1st thing to happen would be tourism quadrupling..

yes maybe a drop in the use of yaba...

i believe the weed in the Thailand is a sativa, i have been informed is quiet hard to sleep on...

[lvr181]

The war on "Drugs" is a cosmic hoax. Never worked, never will. People are going to do what they do. Alcohol, Cigarettes far more destructive.

Complete waste of resources and money. Legalize.

So much easier to find a way/justification to do nothing than a reason to tackle the problem.

Yes, cigarettes and alcohol are drugs also, unfortunately legitimised but at least the authorities can try and price them, if not off the market, then making them them less desirable to purchase. Either way the taxpayer picks up the tab for those who use "drugs" and who do not/cannot cope living in the real world.

And before anyone gets a holier than thou attitude, I tried marijuana once, big deal, didn't bother again and I do drink alcohol from time to time but not to excess.

[hyperdimension]

I can't imagine the seized items being destroyed considering the large gap between the monetary value of the items and policemen's salaries. so let's assume that most of it is released back into the market. Combine it with all other supplies that managed to get through (which I assume is most of the total supply, as seizures are only a tip of the iceberg), then it is clear that the rate of consumption of methamphetamine is enormous. Now how much of this consumption has led to problems? Can anyone provide drug-related crime statistics? I think that the proportion of consumption of illegal drugs that directly results in harm to society is so small that the strict and costly enforcement of drug laws may be a huge waste of taxpayers' money and may be inflicting more harm than the drugs themselves (such as imprisoned parents like those mentioned in the article not being able to properly care for their children). Please provide evidence to prove me wrong.

Even though you can't imagine it... One year ago Thursday:

Thailand destroys almost 6 tons of confiscated narcotics and marijuana

http://goo.gl/Tkg9GG

Check the photo. And even though you can't imagine it... roughly the same will happen again this June 26, which is Thursday. Imagine that!

OK so some drugs get destroyed by a public display of burning with big colorful signs indicating the drug street name and amount. Maybe they even have free entertainment and food at such events for spectators and especially media. I still suspect that a proportion of seized items do not make it to the annual burning, and that the amount that does get burnt is still only a tiny fraction of the total amount consumed each year.

If the drugs were as dangerously toxic as the authorities and media have made them out to appear, the authorities would not be destroying them in such as a way, and instead be disposing them very carefully like radioactive waste. Can you imagine radioactive waste being publicly destroyed by burning in an open fire like is often done with seized drugs? The reality is that a lot of the illegal drugs are nowhere near as dangerous as they have been made to appear.

It was crazy to have made laws against many of the now-illegal drugs in the first place (as there were very little input from the scientific/medical community in creating the laws and they were created more out of hysteria and racial discrimination). But it's even crazier to then strictly enforce the laws with zero tolerance and continue to stubbornly do so for so long (around half a century) when the evidence has been clear that they haven't been working and have instead resulted in many other negative unintended consequences that may be causing more harm than the drugs themselves would cause.

I suggest all of you to read The Alternative World Drug Report to gain a wider picture of the the costs that are associated with the enforcement of the stupid drug laws. Here is their conclusion of the chapter "Wasting billions, undermining economies":

Drug law enforcement is exceptionally poor value for money. At a time of great economic stricture, spending billions of dollars a year of scarce public resources on demonstrably ineffective and counterproductive drug policies appears impossible to justify.

But it is not just about the poor value for money of current spending, and its opportunity costs in terms of investment in health and social development. These policies, and the criminal markets they have created, have a direct negative impact on the economies of producer and transit countries – by deterring investment, harming legitimate businesses, and undermining governance through corruption and violence. In a globalised world, this has a knock-on effect for any company – or country – seeking to do business in affected regions.

Despite well-intentioned attempts to restrict access to drugs, it is now clear that with easily cultivated agricultural commodities grown in a world with no shortage of poor and marginalised people willing to produce, transport or sell them in order to survive, short of ending global poverty and drug demand, there is no realistic hope of eliminating supply.

The emotive nature of the public debate, fuelled by populist drug-war rhetoric, has pushed meaningful evaluation and rational debate of alternative approaches to the margins. But it is important to recognise that the war on drugs is a policy choice. That is why political leaders across the world are beginning to call for other options – including less punitive enforcement, decriminalisation and models of legal market regulation – to be debated and explored using the best possible evidence and analysis. Without question this should include assessing the economic impacts.

[hyperdimension]

I wonder what would happen if Thailand would legalize weed ?

Maybe less yaba users or maybe more ?

Weed would make them so sleepy that they would need more yaba to wake up maybe ?!

if weed was legalized the 1st thing to happen would be tourism quadrupling..

I'm quite sure that tourism would definitely increase. If many tourists want to come and relax on beaches every day of their holiday with the aid of some cannabis, what is so wrong with that? Where is the harm?

[hyperdimension]

I wish they would imprison corrupt officials and police instead. Drugs should be legal for anyone that doesn't harm others.

Then by that flawed logic you would have to agree that all illegal activities are decriminalised if they don't harm other people. Are you sure that the illegal use of drugs never has effects on third parties?

Consumption of illegal drugs can cause harm, but:

Consumption of legal drugs, such as tobacco and ethanol, can also cause harm

Strict enforcement of laws that forbid some drugs can also cause harm.

What matters are the amounts of harm in each of the above, and I think in the big picture, the second and third far outweigh the first.

[TallPalm]

Well there you go, Thailand has just admitted that it runs a Prison Slave Industry - very lucrative.

No,

All prisons have similar schemes.

Not for 100 baht a month - barely enough to buy adequate toiletries for that amount of time.

[chrisinth]

<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

The war on "Drugs" is a cosmic hoax. Never worked, never will. People are going to do what they do. Alcohol, Cigarettes far more destructive.

Complete waste of resources and money. Legalize.

Whereas I would agree that the war on drugs is never going to eradicate the problem, alcohol and cigarettes by definition come under the same banner.

Only difference is that they are legally sold over the counter to support every government's coffers in tax.

You suggest legalizing Meth/Ya-Ba? As what, a recreational drug?

Might want to think that one out again...............

[hyperdimension]

The war on "Drugs" is a cosmic hoax. Never worked, never will. People are going to do what they do. Alcohol, Cigarettes far more destructive.

Complete waste of resources and money. Legalize.

Whereas I would agree that the war on drugs is never going to eradicate the problem, alcohol and cigarettes by definition come under the same banner.

Only difference is that they are legally sold over the counter to support every government's coffers in tax.

You suggest legalizing Meth/Ya-Ba? As what, a recreational drug?

What is wrong with having methamphetamine available as a legal recreational drug? Tobacco and ethanol have been available as legal recreational drugs for decades despite all the various problems they cause.

Don't blindly believe all the scare-mongering stories and anecdotes. Instead stick with science and statistics. Where are all the damning statistics of deaths and crime that have been caused by people who have consumed illegal drugs? Millions of doses are possibly being consumed every week in Thailand.

Amphetamines have been available as prescription drugs for ADHD treatment (i.e. they have medicinal value) yet in Thailand they are listed in Category 1 (supposedly the most "dangerous" drugs) of the Thai Narcotics Act. (See Table of controlled Narcotic Drugs under the Thai Narcotics Act B.E. 2522 (1979) (substances updated as of 22/05/2012)).

Why should drugs only ever be consumed to treat ailments? Some drugs can be used for enhancement of one's life experience. Silenafil ("Viagra") is one example of a drug that is used recreationally or for enhancement without much problem, and is produced in Thailand by the Government Pharmaceutical Organization and sold as "Sidegra".

Edited June 25, 2014 by hyperdimension

[Guitar God]

And interestingly enough, the Netherlands doesn't have a meth problem.

Calling for a reduction of prison terms for drugs??

Arguing that the harsh policy has failed to curb dealing?????

And you think lower sentences will do this?

Do these people not see the damges done by Yaba and ice.

HIgh sentences don't make it better, but neither wil lower ones. At least they feel the pain of their mistakes unlike Holland where sentences are ridiculously low

What is the exuse as a buddhist to try to and make a profit by ruining others or at least aiding them to ruin themselves.

[chrisinth]

<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

The war on "Drugs" is a cosmic hoax. Never worked, never will. People are going to do what they do. Alcohol, Cigarettes far more destructive.

Complete waste of resources and money. Legalize.

Whereas I would agree that the war on drugs is never going to eradicate the problem, alcohol and cigarettes by definition come under the same banner.

Only difference is that they are legally sold over the counter to support every government's coffers in tax.

You suggest legalizing Meth/Ya-Ba? As what, a recreational drug?

What is wrong with having methamphetamine available as a legal recreational drug? Tobacco and ethanol have been available as legal recreational drugs for decades despite all the various problems they cause.

Don't blindly believe all the scare-mongering stories and anecdotes. Instead stick with science and statistics. Where are all the damning statistics of deaths and crime that have been caused by people who have consumed illegal drugs?

Amphetamines have been available as prescription drugs for ADHD treatment (i.e. have medicinal value) yet in Thailand they are listed in Category 1 (the most dangerous drugs) of the Thai Narcotics Act. (See Table of controlled Narcotic Drugs under the Thai Narcotics Act B.E. 2522 (1979) (substances updated as of 22/05/2012)).

Why should drugs only ever be consumed to treat ailments? Some drugs can be used for enhancement of one's life experience. Silenafil ("Viagra") is one example of a drug that is used recreationally or for enhancement without much problem, and is produced in Thailand by the Government Pharmaceutical Organization and sold as "Sidegra".

Where Meth is concerned, I'm not talking about statistics, I'm talking about personal experience.

With statistics, you have control with what you want the numbers to say. Get the Meth coursing through the system, the numbers say what they want.

[lvr181]

I can't imagine the seized items being destroyed considering the large gap between the monetary value of the items and policemen's salaries. so let's assume that most of it is released back into the market. Combine it with all other supplies that managed to get through (which I assume is most of the total supply, as seizures are only a tip of the iceberg), then it is clear that the rate of consumption of methamphetamine is enormous. Now how much of this consumption has led to problems? Can anyone provide drug-related crime statistics? I think that the proportion of consumption of illegal drugs that directly results in harm to society is so small that the strict and costly enforcement of drug laws may be a huge waste of taxpayers' money and may be inflicting more harm than the drugs themselves (such as imprisoned parents like those mentioned in the article not being able to properly care for their children). Please provide evidence to prove me wrong.

Even though you can't imagine it... One year ago Thursday:

Thailand destroys almost 6 tons of confiscated narcotics and marijuana

http://goo.gl/Tkg9GG

Check the photo. And even though you can't imagine it... roughly the same will happen again this June 26, which is Thursday. Imagine that!

OK so some drugs get destroyed by a public display of burning with big colorful signs indicating the drug street name and amount. Maybe they even have free entertainment and food at such events for spectators and especially media. I still suspect that a proportion of seized items do not make it to the annual burning, and that the amount that does get burnt is still only a tiny fraction of the total amount consumed each year.

If the drugs were as dangerously toxic as the authorities and media have made them out to appear, the authorities would not be destroying them in such as a way, and instead be disposing them very carefully like radioactive waste. Can you imagine radioactive waste being publicly destroyed by burning in an open fire like is often done with seized drugs? The reality is that a lot of the illegal drugs are nowhere near as dangerous as they have been made to appear.

It was crazy to have made laws against many of the now-illegal drugs in the first place (as there were very little input from the scientific/medical community in creating the laws and they were created more out of hysteria and racial discrimination). But it's even crazier to then strictly enforce the laws with zero tolerance and continue to stubbornly do so for so long (around half a century) when the evidence has been clear that they haven't been working and have instead resulted in many other negative unintended consequences that may be causing more harm than the drugs themselves would cause.

I suggest all of you to read The Alternative World Drug Report to gain a wider picture of the the costs that are associated with the enforcement of the stupid drug laws. Here is their conclusion of the chapter "Wasting billions, undermining economies":

Drug law enforcement is exceptionally poor value for money. At a time of great economic stricture, spending billions of dollars a year of scarce public resources on demonstrably ineffective and counterproductive drug policies appears impossible to justify.

But it is not just about the poor value for money of current spending, and its opportunity costs in terms of investment in health and social development. These policies, and the criminal markets they have created, have a direct negative impact on the economies of producer and transit countries – by deterring investment, harming legitimate businesses, and undermining governance through corruption and violence. In a globalised world, this has a knock-on effect for any company – or country – seeking to do business in affected regions.

Despite well-intentioned attempts to restrict access to drugs, it is now clear that with easily cultivated agricultural commodities grown in a world with no shortage of poor and marginalised people willing to produce, transport or sell them in order to survive, short of ending global poverty and drug demand, there is no realistic hope of eliminating supply.

The emotive nature of the public debate, fuelled by populist drug-war rhetoric, has pushed meaningful evaluation and rational debate of alternative approaches to the margins. But it is important to recognise that the war on drugs is a policy choice. That is why political leaders across the world are beginning to call for other options – including less punitive enforcement, decriminalisation and models of legal market regulation – to be debated and explored using the best possible evidence and analysis. Without question this should include assessing the economic impacts.

And that report would not be biased?

Perhaps it does show that "crime pays" (despite what some people say), look at the many people employed e.g. enforcement authorities and the judicial system et al.

[hyperdimension]

Where Meth is concerned, I'm not talking about statistics, I'm talking about personal experience.

With statistics, you have control with what you want the numbers to say. Get the Meth coursing through the system, the numbers say what they want.

So should laws be made and dropped using decisions that are based on science and statistics, or anectdotes and personal experience and media hype?

Based on my occasional personal consumption experience of methamphetamine in my youth, I didn't have any problems whasoever. It was just relatively harmless fun. I didn't feel like I needed it nor have I ever felt any craving for it ever since. So I don't see much problem with methamphetamine from my personal experience.

It's OK to hear a few emotionally-charged stories as they still have some value, but I think it's far better to also look at the bigger picture by doing large epidemiological studies and coming up with solid data from which hypotheses can be made which may then become foundations for policy changes. Much of the existing drug laws were not created from such an empirical process.

[hyperdimension]

I suggest all of you to read The Alternative World Drug Report to gain a wider picture of the the costs that are associated with the enforcement of the stupid drug laws.

And that report would not be biased?

Of course it's biased, how can such a report not be? There's nothing wrong with that if they can provide data that support their biased statements.

Was the popular documentary Reefer Madness biased, and is there much solid data that support the statements that were made in it?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=54xWo7ITFbg

Edited June 25, 2014 by hyperdimension

[Robby nz]

I wonder what would happen if Thailand would legalize weed ?

Maybe less yaba users or maybe more ?

Weed would make them so sleepy that they would need more yaba to wake up maybe ?!

if weed was legalized the 1st thing to happen would be tourism quadrupling..

yes maybe a drop in the use of yaba...

i believe the weed in the Thailand is a sativa, i have been informed is quiet hard to sleep on...

Do you really think there are that many idiots in the world that would come here just to do drugs ?

There are places they can go now where that crap is legal, let them go there we don't need them here.

[socksy01]

'DUMB AND DUMBER' She's inside for the second time for drugs related offences, the boyfriend is inside, so yet again someone else is holding the baby.

[lovelomsak]

Well there you go, Thailand has just admitted that it runs a Prison Slave Industry - very lucrative.

No,

All prisons have similar schemes.

You are right I have heard that prisons in America produce cheap goods for companies like Walmart.

[hyperdimension]

I wonder what would happen if Thailand would legalize weed ?

Maybe less yaba users or maybe more ?

Weed would make them so sleepy that they would need more yaba to wake up maybe ?!

if weed was legalized the 1st thing to happen would be tourism quadrupling..

yes maybe a drop in the use of yaba...

i believe the weed in the Thailand is a sativa, i have been informed is quiet hard to sleep on...

Do you really think there are that many idiots in the world that would come here just to do drugs ?

People may not come only to consume drugs, but it can be just a part of the whole travel experience, just as many already come to Thailand to party and/or relax around the beach with the aid of ethanol.

People from all over Europe (and many from even further) travel to Netherlands, and visiting some of the coffeeshops there in which cannabis is available may be part of their planned activities.

There may be many people who would prefer (for many possible reasons, including health) to be allowed to consume drugs other than ethanol during their travels.

let them go there we don't need them here.

What does it matter whether or not you "need" them here? Do you say the same about people who come with the plan to consume large amounts of ethanol?

Edited June 26, 2014 by hyperdimension