Heated opinions as locals debate future of Phuket’s Surin Beach

[Lite Beer]

Heated opinions as locals debate future of Phuket’s Surin Beach

Anthika Muangrod

V/Gov Jamroen and Mr Ma'an in discussions with the beach masseuses.

PHUKET: Vice-Governor Jamroen Thippayapongthada, Cherng Talay OrBorTor chief executive Ma’an Samran and other relevant officials went to Surin Beach today (June 27) to check how things going on on the beach. Almost 100 per cent of the west side was cleared.

There is yet some resistance to change. There are still some plots on the beachside with concrete edges to mark territory, and one restaurant this morning had yet to demolish six one-metre-high concrete posts.

When police and the deputy chief of Thalang District approached the owner to tell him to get rid of the posts he shouted at them but eventually ordered his staff to knock the posts down.

Loudly, he ordered his waitresses to take some water to the officials. The officials told him, “No thanks.”

“People say I’m influential,” the restaurant owner told The Phuket News, “But I’m not.”

V/Gov Jamroen said the fate of the businesses and buildings on the east side of the beach path is still being discussed.

“We are discussing the public land document for Surin Beach at the moment because, in the past, some budget was approved to build on the land. We are discussing what should we do with the land now.

“We are thinking about how the buildings looked before the Tsunami [of 2004] and how they look now.

“Also, we want to establish the true status of the land. If it has been changed [from the original purpose of giving local people a chance to make a living], it must be returned to the way it was before that. It must all be return it to the state.

“The people we helped before don’t need help anymore [because they are rich]. I heard that the buildings have changed hands four or five times.

“As to reports that businesses have been paying an annual ‘rent’ of B5 million a rai, I have already asked the head of OrBorTor Cherng Talay to check the information. Then we will follow the due process of the law.

“The issue is being discussed with the Attorney-general of Thailand and the Office of the Council of State. We will reach a conclusion as soon as possible.”

OrBorTor boss Ma’an could not immediately confirm whether the buildings on the east side were safe from demolition or not.

“We don’t have a conclusion yet. We handed a letter to Office of the Council of State to see how we can use public land or how to systematise it.”

An old local approached the officials and said, “Take them down, dig them out! We have been giving them opportunities for business for a long, long time.”

Plainly passionate about the topic, the old man pointed out that Surin Beach was visited in 1959 by HM King Bhumibol and HM Queen Sirikit, who called it “Golden Sand Beach”. It should be returned to the King, he said. He pointed to some pine trees that had appeared in pictures taken of Their Majesties.

Sutee Lienudom, a former member of the Provincial Council and former Kamnan (chief of a group of villages) in Cherng Talay, told The Phuket News that Phuket initially had many planned projects such as coast roads around the island and a tunnel in Koh Kaew, but the plans took too long and in the meantime, the land intended for these projects had been illegally occupied.

“I want to see clean beaches all over Phuket because Phuket’s selling points are its beaches, the sea and the natural environment.

“We must organise the beaches for the better. We must work for local people, not for business people. Before, the province and an international aid fund contributed B13 million as far back as 1996, the intention being to build these buildings for local. Right now we have businesses occupying three or four buildings each. This is not right. They should be for local people only.

“I don’t agree with these people building things up like this. The buildings are hiding the landscape.

“The taxi drivers are not only the only group of people [involved in criminal activity at Surin Beach]. The people who are encroaching on public land are the real ‘influential’ people.

“Our country has good natural resources and good tourism but it is not protected properly.

“If no one helps to keep an eye on it, it’s going to be destroyed one day. Then no one is going to come and visit us. Where will our income come from then?” he asked.

The cleaning of the beach has hit one group of local entrepreneurs: the masseuses. Some 30 of them, too, barged into the assembly on the beach, demanding to know where they could place the massage beds where they do business.

They asked Mr Ma’an and V/Gov Jamroen to provide a solution for them.

V/Gov Jamrern listened and gave his approval to a plan to allocate five points along the beach, each with enough room for 10 massage beds.

Jaw Sittidech, 60, a representative of the masseuses, said, “We don’t know where exactly the beds will be placed. We are still waiting for OrBorTor to make that clear.

“I have been massaging people since I was a young woman until now. In the past, there were no massage beds; just mattresses,” she added.

Source: http://www.thephuketnews.com/heated-opinions-as-locals-debate-future-of-phuket%E2%80%99s-surin-beach-47096.php

-- Phuket News 2014-06-27

[sscsamui]

I wish they would go to Koh Samui and start a Clean up there... It is Bad and Getting worse. Mafia Taxi Over pricing and not turning the meters on. Plus a big Russian thug environment on the rise... HELP Samui

[Oziex1]

Cue the General, again! They just dont get it do they!

[oldsailor35]

Be Patient ! I am sure Samui's turn will come.

[simon43]

V/Gov Jamrern listened and gave his approval to a plan to allocate five points along the beach, each with enough room for 10 massage beds.

And so the backsliding already begins...

[AJBangkok]

It would be simple to ask the current land occupants to show documented proof of their right to occupy the land and follow the paper/money trail. The solution is simple if it's public land then they shouldn't be there. It only becomes complex When someone influential or in an official position is receiving 5mln baht per year per rai ( or par of it) which if it became public knowledge could really upset the apple cart.

[oneday]

“People say I’m influential,” the restaurant owner told The Phuket News, “But I’m not.”

Yes, it would seems many "influential" people have lost their "influence" under the NCPO...as it should be.

[renaissanc]

Thank you, NCPO! Also remove the restaurants on the Karon beach sand.

[iReason]

V/Gov Jamrern listened and gave his approval to a plan to allocate five points along the beach, each with enough room for 10 massage beds.

And so the backsliding already begins...

Along with typical TV pessimism...

[simon43]

Along with typical TV pessimism...

Realism I would suggest.

The VG has publically committed to allowing 50 massage beds on the beach. How he can now deny the beach hawkers, the sun lounger guys etc etc?

That beach (and all beaches in Phuket) should be cleared of ALL businesses. Want a massage? Go and have one in a massage shop or on private land that a massage lady rents for the purpose.

There seems to be an outdated 'entitlement' by locals to do what they want on the public beaches, whether it be running a business or 'selling' a beach plot to a foreign-controlled business.

It is that entitlement that has caused all the current problems

[Oziex1]

Along with typical TV pessimism...

Realism I would suggest.

The VG has publically committed to allowing 50 massage beds on the beach. How he can now deny the beach hawkers, the sun lounger guys etc etc?

That beach (and all beaches in Phuket) should be cleared of ALL businesses. Want a massage? Go and have one in a massage shop or on private land that a massage lady rents for the purpose.

There seems to be an outdated 'entitlement' by locals to do what they want on the public beaches, whether it be running a business or 'selling' a beach plot to a foreign-controlled business.

It is that entitlement that has caused all the current problems

One step forward two steps back. If these decisions are in the hands of those responsible for the whole damn mess in the first place, then nothing has been gained.

However I believe this will be sorted by a higher authority and sense will prevail.

[BadBouy]

I agree they were there illegally and should be removed, but you are still putting a lot of people out of business (making a living) Why not clear a field away from the beach and set up another market and process for them to restart another business. You've given them the stick how about a little bit of a carrot. The object should be to get them off the beach not to end them making a living. Some will make it some will fail but at least they will get a chance to succeed.

[tingtongteesood]

“People say I’m influential,” the restaurant owner told The Phuket News, “But I’m not.”

I esecially liked that part. I am assuming the corrupt official who allowed you to get away with what you were doing was quite powerful. Now the army are insisting on honesty and transparency you no longer have the 'influential figure' to back you up so you are once again a nobody. Very funny.

Keep up the good work boys ( and girls ), the majority of the country is saluting you for it ! A few mis-steps so far but a 95% positive vote from me.

[Oziex1]

I agree they were there illegally and should be removed, but you are still putting a lot of people out of business (making a living) Why not clear a field away from the beach and set up another market and process for them to restart another business. You've given them the stick how about a little bit of a carrot. The object should be to get them off the beach not to end them making a living. Some will make it some will fail but at least they will get a chance to succeed.

Dont be fooled by their moaning they made a killing from these illegal businesses, you didn't notice the gold that guy was wearing, greedy people who just couldn't get enough and still feel entitled.

[BadBouy]

I agree they were there illegally and should be removed, but you are still putting a lot of people out of business (making a living) Why not clear a field away from the beach and set up another market and process for them to restart another business. You've given them the stick how about a little bit of a carrot. The object should be to get them off the beach not to end them making a living. Some will make it some will fail but at least they will get a chance to succeed.

Dont be fooled by their moaning they made a killing from these illegal businesses, you didn't notice the gold that guy was wearing, greedy people who just couldn't get enough and still feel entitled.

I do not dispute your point one bit. What I am suggesting is giving them a token opportunity to restart legally and get them to become legit and pay taxes. They are free to say no and move on but if you did what I said they could not cry about not being given an alternative. Part of the job of government is to help facilitate business so they can collect tax money to better the community, well in a perfect world.

[stevenl]

I agree they were there illegally and should be removed, but you are still putting a lot of people out of business (making a living) Why not clear a field away from the beach and set up another market and process for them to restart another business. You've given them the stick how about a little bit of a carrot. The object should be to get them off the beach not to end them making a living. Some will make it some will fail but at least they will get a chance to succeed.

Dont be fooled by their moaning they made a killing from these illegal businesses, you didn't notice the gold that guy was wearing, greedy people who just couldn't get enough and still feel entitled.

I do not dispute your point one bit. What I am suggesting is giving them a token opportunity to restart legally and get them to become legit and pay taxes. They are free to say no and move on but if you did what I said they could not cry about not being given an alternative. Part of the job of government is to help facilitate business so they can collect tax money to better the community, well in a perfect world.

Agree with your ultimate goal to make them law abiding and tax paying.

But after they have had an unfair advantage over competition in terms of rent and location, because they were encriuching, why should they be alowed to kep an advantage on at least one of these points? Yhere should at least be some kind of punishment, not another advantage.

[patongphil]

I agree they were there illegally and should be removed, but you are still putting a lot of people out of business (making a living) Why not clear a field away from the beach and set up another market and process for them to restart another business. You've given them the stick how about a little bit of a carrot. The object should be to get them off the beach not to end them making a living. Some will make it some will fail but at least they will get a chance to succeed.

Dont be fooled by their moaning they made a killing from these illegal businesses, you didn't notice the gold that guy was wearing, greedy people who just couldn't get enough and still feel entitled.

I do not dispute your point one bit. What I am suggesting is giving them a token opportunity to restart legally and get them to become legit and pay taxes. They are free to say no and move on but if you did what I said they could not cry about not being given an alternative. Part of the job of government is to help facilitate business so they can collect tax money to better the community, well in a perfect world.

TAX MONEY 5555555 welcome to Thailand.

[khunsiam]

I wish they would go to Koh Samui and start a Clean up there... It is Bad and Getting worse. Mafia Taxi Over pricing and not turning the meters on. Plus a big Russian thug environment on the rise... HELP Samui

I don't think they will start a clean up in Suthep's backyard.

[simon43]

What I am suggesting is giving them a token opportunity to restart legally and get them to become legit and pay taxes.

Can I very politely suggest that you must be living on Mars? IMHO, I do not believe any of them want to play 'by the book', with a registered business that pays its dues. They have had years of breaking and flaunting the rules, getting something for nothing, squatting on illegal land, not registering their business, not paying OrBorTor or national taxes etc.

Suggest that they register their business, pay rent and pay taxes and they will run a mile!!!

PS - I wonder why they are not asked for proof of tax payments for all their years of illegal business.

PPS - In fact, thinking on this point, perhaps the OrBorTor should only offer a solution to those businesses who have or are willing to pay all taxes due on their ill-gotten gains over the years.... That new (huge?) income can be used to beautify the beach, provide public toilets with paid cleaner etc etc.

Edited June 28, 2014 by simon43

[stevenl]

What I am suggesting is giving them a token opportunity to restart legally and get them to become legit and pay taxes.

Can I very politely suggest that you must be living on Mars? IMHO, I do not believe any of them want to play 'by the book', with a registered business that pays its dues. They have had years of breaking and flaunting the rules, getting something for nothing, squatting on illegal land, not registering their business, not paying OrBorTor or national taxes etc.

Suggest that they register their business, pay rent and pay taxes and they will run a mile!!!

PS - I wonder why they are not asked for proof of tax payments for all their years of illegal business.

PPS - In fact, thinking on this point, perhaps the OrBorTor should only offer a solution to those businesses who have or are willing to pay all taxes due on their ill-gotten gains over the years.... That new (huge?) income can be used to beautify the beach, provide public toilets with paid cleaner etc etc.

Yes, thjey have been encroaching, but why the conclusion they were illegal businesses and have not been paying taxes?

[sscsamui]

I wish they would go to Koh Samui and start a Clean up there... It is Bad and Getting worse. Mafia Taxi Over pricing and not turning the meters on. Plus a big Russian thug environment on the rise... HELP Samui

I don't think they will start a clean up in Suthep's backyard.

I don't think General Prayuth care who's backer he goes into, fortunately... He only care for the good of the Thai people and the Country

[keestha]

One thing which hasn't been mentioned yet - there are different sources of legal rules. Number 1 are the written rules. But number 2 is customary law, a situation becoming legal because of having existed in full public view for a very long time. Think about the right of way principle: in many legal systems, if you have allowed the public to pass through your private land for say 30 years, you are not legally allowed to close it off anymore. The right of way principle is usually backed up by a written legal rule, but as far as customary law is concerned, this does not always have to be the case.

In many legal systems, a decision to demolish a beach restaurant which has been there for 30 years wouldn't hold up in court, even though its presence is contrary to written legal rules.

Edited June 29, 2014 by keestha

[khunsiam]

I wish they would go to Koh Samui and start a Clean up there... It is Bad and Getting worse. Mafia Taxi Over pricing and not turning the meters on. Plus a big Russian thug environment on the rise... HELP Samui

I don't think they will start a clean up in Suthep's backyard.

I don't think General Prayuth care who's backer he goes into, fortunately... He only care for the good of the Thai people and the Country

it has always been bad, you know what some police officers are up to there

[ZigZagMan]

I wish they would go to Koh Samui and start a Clean up there... It is Bad and Getting worse. Mafia Taxi Over pricing and not turning the meters on. Plus a big Russian thug environment on the rise... HELP Samui

I don't think they will start a clean up in Suthep's backyard.

I don't think General Prayuth care who's backer he goes into, fortunately... He only care for the good of the Thai people and the Country

We can test his integrity pretty easily.

If he is fair he will investigate Thai Airlines Board & the missing 200 million Bt. that goes to service somebody's personal 737 jet.

The auditors were told "never mind" when it was discovered.

No, you won't see that story in The Nation. You will need to go off shore to read all about it.

In fact, an investigation into the people that run the 50 or more state enterprises would be enlightening.

[JetsetBkk]

As to reports that businesses have been paying an annual 'rent' of B5 million a rai, I have already asked the head of OrBorTor Cherng Talay to check the information.

That's a bit like asking Guy Fawkes if he's got any gunpowder.