How Much To Live Reasonable?

[manjara]

Here's a few expenses I have found from living here (married) for 3 years.

- Apartment in Sathorn; 30m studio 8k, 65m 2bed - 17k (with pool and gym, close to Surasak)

- Internet 600/month, phone 300/month

- Mobile phone (400/month, plus 500 month for unlimited GPRS and WiFi - could replace your internet? - that's with True, but need a Work permit)

- Beer 360 baht per week for a case of Chang at Tesco

- Food, about 100-150 baht per day if you eat Thai ( you can eat well on less!)

- Electricity, water etc (2500/month if you have A/C on all night/day in a 65m apartment)

- Medical about 800/month

- Moped - 36k (I just bought one for the maid!)

- Maid (6k/month - if you want English spoken then double that)

- Taxi to Sukhumvit (70-100 baht)

- Motosai to Skytrain (20 baht - if you insist)

- Massage for 2 hrs (250 baht ++

- Haircut 120baht

- Polo shirt on Sukhumvit - 150 baht

- DVDs (100 - 120 baht)

- Jeans (200 baht)

- Shoes (300 baht)

- Visa run (2k to Cambodia on the farang bus, I used to go to Mae Sae for around 1,000)

And the little luxuries...

- Water Buffalo 15k - 20k

- Total knee arthroplasty 250k

- Baby delivery 45k (Bumrungrad - cheaper elsewhere)

- Starting a Thai company (80k)

- monthly costs of running a thai company (10k)

- bottle of wine that won't kill you (550 baht)

- Bottle of whisky (JW Black) in a bar, 1600 baht (they keep it for you for multiple visits - mixers free)

- 1 ngarn of land in BKK (4 million)

- 1 ngarn of land in the provinces (4 thousand)

- Starbucks cup of coffee 75 baht!! Bag of ground coffee 90 baht

- Desktop computer 12k, laptop 26k

- Dinner for 4 at a Thai seafood place (not the farang ones!) - 1000 baht - try Phra Pra Dang

- Taxi to Pattaya (1000 baht - but varies enormously)

- My information on short and long time is WAY out of date!

[Lacoste]

we are currently renting a large house for B90,000 per month whilst looking for a house to buy.

School fees for two children are around B75,000 per month plus the occasional donation.

Mortgage on an appartment in London and a cottage in the lake district in England is a further B190,000.

Car payments (2 cars) B82,000

Electricity/water around B7,000

Maid B10,000

Food and fuel around 40,000

Entertainment around 35,000

Total outgoings per month around B529,000 per month or 7,500 GBP, 14,000 USD

[percy2]

Here's a few expenses I have found from living here (married) for 3 years.

- Apartment in Sathorn; 30m studio 8k, 65m 2bed - 17k (with pool and gym, close to Surasak)

- Internet 600/month, phone 300/month

- Mobile phone (400/month, plus 500 month for unlimited GPRS and WiFi - could replace your internet? - that's with True, but need a Work permit)

- Beer 360 baht per week for a case of Chang at Tesco

- Food, about 100-150 baht per day if you eat Thai ( you can eat well on less!)

- Electricity, water etc (2500/month if you have A/C on all night/day in a 65m apartment)

- Medical about 800/month

- Moped - 36k (I just bought one for the maid!)

- Maid (6k/month - if you want English spoken then double that)

- Taxi to Sukhumvit (70-100 baht)

- Motosai to Skytrain (20 baht - if you insist)

- Massage for 2 hrs (250 baht ++

- Haircut 120baht

- Polo shirt on Sukhumvit - 150 baht

- DVDs (100 - 120 baht)

- Jeans (200 baht)

- Shoes (300 baht)

- Visa run (2k to Cambodia on the farang bus, I used to go to Mae Sae for around 1,000)

And the little luxuries...

- Water Buffalo 15k - 20k

- Total knee arthroplasty 250k

- Baby delivery 45k (Bumrungrad - cheaper elsewhere)

- Starting a Thai company (80k)

- monthly costs of running a thai company (10k)

- bottle of wine that won't kill you (550 baht)

- Bottle of whisky (JW Black) in a bar, 1600 baht (they keep it for you for multiple visits - mixers free)

- 1 ngarn of land in BKK (4 million)

- 1 ngarn of land in the provinces (4 thousand)

- Starbucks cup of coffee 75 baht!! Bag of ground coffee 90 baht

- Desktop computer 12k, laptop 26k

- Dinner for 4 at a Thai seafood place (not the farang ones!) - 1000 baht - try Phra Pra Dang

- Taxi to Pattaya (1000 baht - but varies enormously)

- My information on short and long time is WAY out of date!

- Baby delivery 45k (Bumrungrad - cheaper elsewhere)

Was that for the maid aswell

[PeaceBlondie]

If a person is about to retire with a pension or superannuation income (or living off of capital), you do not want to run to the other side of the world and immerse yourself into a thousand uncertainties, with only $1,200 US per month. Unless you really do live cheaply, your pension receives COLA's for inflation, and you already know how much you spent last year, down to the last dollar. Too many imponderables: pension law changes, interest rate fluctuations, currency exchange rates, different inflation in the target country, etc.

I thought I could live in Mexico for $1,200 per month in 1998-2001. The peso strenghthed against the dollar by 10%. Interest rates plummeted. I had all kinds of unpredictable expenses, large and small. My COLA didn't match Mexico's inflation.

I came to Chiang Mai in 2003, expecting that I could almost live on pensions of $1,400 and salary of $620. Well, the salary wasn't paid in many months; my visa runs cost me 100,000 baht per year; and my short time expenses were astronomical. Oh, and I had more than the usual share of wrecks and surgeries because of a dumb dog in the middle of my lane on the highway. However, rent has always been cheap, and the people very nice, except for the staff at the last place that stole 62K baht of our stuff.

Be careful. It's better to bring twice as much, than to bring only 100% of what you only thought you needed. It's a great place to live in more comfort than what the same income brings you back home. It can, however, be more expensive to live in Thailand than you first thought.

[jimmy5L]

Total outgoings per month around B529,000 per month or 7,500 GBP, 14,000 USD

14.000 USD per month?? yes sure! (Careful with smoking dope here Lacoste!!)

[crocodilexp]

my visa runs cost me 100,000

I assume there are places closer than the USA for a visa run... from BKK you can get 2 or 3 r/t tickets to practically anywhere on Earth for 100k (without shopping much). Of course, you probably had a good reason to visit the U.S. 2 times a year, but it'd misleading to call it a "visa run".

It's odd how people like to quote outrageous figures for living in Thailand (assuming for a single person)... I get by fine on $2500/mo in the USA (living near a major city, and paying off the Benz). In BKK prices of almost anything are *at least* factor of 4 lower (food, transportation, housing, you name it). Of course, there's much more temptation, but that taken into account, $1300 sounds just about right.

Of course, if you're supporting a wife whose main expertise is burning through cash, the outlook is a bit different.

Edited July 22, 2006 by crocodilexp

[jimmy5L]

Maybe Blondie makes a visarun to the Bahamas

[PeaceBlondie]

Thais and Mexicans taught me that a real family man sees his family at least once a year. How many Thais do you know, who like their family, would go for years without seeing their extended relatives?

So yes, I cheated by calling them 100,000-baht visa runs. The point is, you have to go, usually, to a country where the natives speak English, such as your own passport country. Unless the Malaysian offices are feeling nice. As long as your employer gives you the right letter. Or, if your employer keeps providing you with a work permit. Nah, none of the above applied to me.

How about the visa run on my motorbike, totally unnecessary if my employers had been reasonable, which so far has cost me 135,000 baht, and a year out of work?

Okay, so we're off topic. You can live in Thailand, cheaply, for $1,200 per month. Let's see, that's 48,000 - no, 46,000 baht per month. Oops, that isn't enough for a long term visa, is it? Visa runs, mad dogs in the middle of the road, pedantic immigration officials....not to mention greedy bar employees.

[Lacoste]

Total outgoings per month around B529,000 per month or 7,500 GBP, 14,000 USD

14.000 USD per month?? yes sure! (Careful with smoking dope here Lacoste!!)

Read the breakdown of expences.

Why do you find this unbelievable?

[jimmy5L]

Why do you find this unbelievable?

No sorry, I'm wrong, sorry, Guess it's normal, maybe it's just me - 14.000 USD per month - I think i'm living in an other world here,

You work for Lacoste?? I always liked the polo's Lacoste,

[Beavis and Butthead]

If a person is about to retire with a pension or superannuation income (or living off of capital), you do not want to run to the other side of the world and immerse yourself into a thousand uncertainties, with only $1,200 US per month. Unless you really do live cheaply, your pension receives COLA's for inflation, and you already know how much you spent last year, down to the last dollar. Too many imponderables: pension law changes, interest rate fluctuations, currency exchange rates, different inflation in the target country, etc.

I thought I could live in Mexico for $1,200 per month in 1998-2001. The peso strenghthed against the dollar by 10%. Interest rates plummeted. I had all kinds of unpredictable expenses, large and small. My COLA didn't match Mexico's inflation.

I came to Chiang Mai in 2003, expecting that I could almost live on pensions of $1,400 and salary of $620. Well, the salary wasn't paid in many months; my visa runs cost me 100,000 baht per year; and my short time expenses were astronomical. Oh, and I had more than the usual share of wrecks and surgeries because of a dumb dog in the middle of my lane on the highway. However, rent has always been cheap, and the people very nice, except for the staff at the last place that stole 62K baht of our stuff.

Be careful. It's better to bring twice as much, than to bring only 100% of what you only thought you needed. It's a great place to live in more comfort than what the same income brings you back home. It can, however, be more expensive to live in Thailand than you first thought.

I totally agree with this dude. The ones who quote outrageous figures are the ones who quote the low ones. You need extra cash here. I might be able to get by on $2500/mo plus backup cash for emergencies and luxuries. The US is far cheaper on all fronts in my book

[mittheimp]

I think this thread was asking for genuine advice about how much is needed to live a reasonable life in Thailand.

I don't believe the OP said can you please tell me how much money you earn and how you spend it so you can feel really superior and self important. Lacoste do you feel better now?

[calibanjr.]

Mit, I was thinking the same thing. If I had that kind of cake, I'd be enjoying it instead of talking about it. I'm from New England, where (usually), people who are well-to-do don't let on about it. One benefit is, just about everybody drives old cars where I'm from, so there's little "arms race" in who can have the flashest new car. Thus, you can still pick up girls with your '65 Dodge Dart (my first car). Actually amongst the oldest money, there's almost a competition to be the most discreet and surreptitious about it, sometimes comic.

[calibanjr.]

Anyway, since manjara's list seemed the most informative and relevant, I thought I'd do my CM version, moved here on 1/1/06, so I'm kind of new (lived in Sukhumvit 1 BKK for two years).

Serviced 1 BR apt. 12-14k-ish

I live in a stand-alone 1BR with a HUGE garden 1km from the moat (downtown) 6k/mo. For CM lifestyle, I'd really recommend a house with a garden and then hire a maid (I don't have one,though) as opposed to a serviced apartment. Maid for daily clean and laundry only should be 3-4kish, not full time or anything like that.

Electric 8hrs of aircon a day, 1100/mo.

Water (shower daily, when the GF isn't away!) 300/mo

TOT (rarely used) 250/mo.

True Cable Internet 1mb/512kb 890/mo.

Mobile 12Call unlimit daytime 400/mo.

Scooter (indispensible for me) bought used Honda125 WaveR 20k km. on it for 22k, Monthly rent previously for a Honda 100 was 1900/mo.

Visa Run to Mae Sai with drive should be 1000THB max (I do it once every 3 mo.), you can do the bus thing and knock that down, but it will turn into a full day vs. a long half-day with a driver.

Eat mostly Thai, eat out (farang) maybe twice a week at 500 THB for me and the GF, she'll always eat Thai no matter where I take her.

Movies, DVD rental, any outings etc. any groceries, and the money she sends home to the in-laws adds up to a BASIC outlay of 25-30k, so if you move the in-law money into the drinking column, you can live a fine, low-key life for 30-35k, so your 40k should do you in CM, but not with a ton left over.

Edited July 24, 2006 by calibanjr.

[jimmy5L]

Anyway, since manjara's list seemed the most informative and relevant, I thought I'd do my CM version, moved here on 1/1/06, so I'm kind of new (lived in Sukhumvit 1 BKK for two years).

Serviced 1 BR apt. 12-14k-ish

I live in a stand-alone 1BR with a HUGE garden 1km from the moat (downtown) 6k/mo. For CM lifestyle, I'd really recommend a house with a garden and then hire a maid (I don't have one,though) as opposed to a serviced apartment. Maid for daily clean and laundry only should be 3-4kish, not full time or anything like that.

Electric 8hrs of aircon a day, 1100/mo.

Water (shower daily, when the GF isn't away!) 300/mo

TOT (rarely used) 250/mo.

True Cable Internet 1mb/512kb 890/mo.

Mobile 12Call unlimit daytime 400/mo.

Scooter (indispensible for me) bought used Honda125 WaveR 20k km. on it for 22k, Monthly rent previously for a Honda 100 was 1900/mo.

Visa Run to Mae Sai with drive should be 1000THB max (I do it once every 3 mo.), you can do the bus thing and knock that down, but it will turn into a full day vs. a long half-day with a driver.

Eat mostly Thai, eat out (farang) maybe twice a week at 500 THB for me and the GF, she'll always eat Thai no matter where I take her.

Movies, DVD rental, any outings etc. any groceries, and the money she sends home to the in-laws adds up to a BASIC outlay of 25-30k, so if you move the in-law money into the drinking column, you can live a fine, low-key life for 30-35k, so your 40k should do you in CM, but not with a ton left over.

Thanks for the info Calibanjr,

I liked Chiang Mai 10 years ago, but last time I was there (January) the noise of the tuktuk’s was really getting too me, also the guest house was noisy! so after 5 days I was happy to be back in “quiet” BKK, the noise isn’t bothering you??

I know Chiang Mai is cheap, or, cheaper then BKK, can you give me the same list like what you where spending in BKK, I would really appreciate that! Just gives me a view what a normal person bills are, looks like you got the same life style is me!

And thanks again!

[Arsenal]

Total outgoings per month around B529,000 per month or 7,500 GBP, 14,000 USD

14.000 USD per month?? yes sure! (Careful with smoking dope here Lacoste!!)

Read the breakdown of expences.

Why do you find this unbelievable?

Just to say I don't find any of your expenses unreasonable although you probably should exclude UK mortgage payments for this exercise.In fact your local expenses seem a little light since you don't include travel/medical/insurance/savings (though I suppose UK mortgages could substitute for the latter).

But overall a spending pattern of say Bt 350, 000 up is fairly typical of multinational employed Bangkok expats with appropriate visa/work permit.It may seem high but that's really because this type of expatriate is not that well represented on this forum.But that's another story.

[calibanjr.]

Thanks for the info Calibanjr,

I liked Chiang Mai 10 years ago, but last time I was there (January) the noise of the tuktuk’s was really getting too me, also the guest house was noisy! so after 5 days I was happy to be back in “quiet” BKK, the noise isn’t bothering you??

I know Chiang Mai is cheap, or, cheaper then BKK, can you give me the same list like what you where spending in BKK, I would really appreciate that! Just gives me a view what a normal person bills are, looks like you got the same life style is me!

And thanks again!

Well, your guesthouse was probably close to the moat, I'm guessing. Outside of the moat area, the noise drops off quickly, unless, again, you're near a major road. My house and street are quiet, though I'm only 1km off the moat. Inside Hillside Condos, it's pretty quiet.

If you really want to just chill out, you can go further afield, say 10-15km out of town and live in a Moo Baan, basically a housing community, very cheap I looked at one for 6k for a 2BR house with a nice yard. The main community building/clubhouse had a great restaurant and an enormous pool. Definitely a cheap alternative, though you'll need a scooter for sure, as you're at least 2km from the nearest shop, Tesco is about 7km.

I lived in Suhkumvit Soi 1 in BKK, which luckily was a strange little quiet neighborhood behind Bumrungrad Hospital, surrounded by screeching chaos of Nana, etc. if you wandered out. My expenses were pretty much in line with manjara's post. My rental cost doesn't compute for you though as my business partner and I rented a huge townhouse with 4 BR's and two offices for 40k. When we moved business up here, we got separate housing so that we wouldn't kill each other.

I saw some just manageable studio (not serviced) and 1BR apartments around Sukhumvit for 11-14k or so, but really had no charm, I like a bit of yard and neighborhood.

I suppose it depends on where you've lived previously and what you've found enjoyable. I assume you're American. I'm flexible, grew up in suburb/semi-rural (30 mi. from Boston) and lived mostly in cities, but went to school in Santa Fe NM, so I like a bit of everything. My personal taste here, but if I were you, I might do short term, see how you like living in BKK, see the sights, take some 4-5 day trips to wherever to fact find, then, when you get tired of BKK, and believe me, odds are, you will, you can move on from there.

[calibanjr.]

BTW, just forgot to address your last point from your opening post. We have a small condo (for biz purposes) 1br with a large closet that does for a bedroom in a pinch, not serviced, nothing special but a great view of the river with pool at the Chao Praya View condos, near RiverCity and the Sheraton Orchid, basically Chinatown, 10 min. walk to river ferry. 14k rent, 3k Phone/electric/water, 17-18k a month all in. Think that's pretty typical, started that lease on 1/1/06, so the pricing shouldn't be too old.

[jimmy5L]

I suppose it depends on where you've lived previously and what you've found enjoyable. I assume you're American. I'm flexible, grew up in suburb/semi-rural (30 mi. from Boston) and lived mostly in cities, but went to school in Santa Fe NM, so I like a bit of everything. My personal taste here, but if I were you, I might do short term, see how you like living in BKK, see the sights, take some 4-5 day trips to wherever to fact find, then, when you get tired of BKK, and believe me, odds are, you will, you can move on from there.

Thanks again Calibanjr,

You’re right; my guesthouse (Lai Tai Guesthouse) was on to the street in CM, so much noise off the tuktuk’s day and night!

BTW - I’m Dutch but live on the French Riviera and own a small apartment 200 meters away from the see! Went to school in southern California begin 80’s!

[Storekeeper]

If I had Peaceblondie's money I'd burn mine. Must be nice living high on th hog with all that dough. Spending all that extra dosh to play with little things on the beach in HH. I'm stuck moving into the sticks on a pauper's pension. If I could afford 2K for room rent I'd move to BKK too.

Edited July 28, 2006 by Storekeeper

[jbowman1993]

Hi, I have a question. Can I live comfortably in Thailand? I just sold my company to a Singapore firm in January, and made a nice profit (78 billion baht). How much will I need to spend on a nice studio apartment downtown? How much on food (if I eat Thai food everyday)?

I have some expenses that our unavoidable. I have to spend 10 billion baht to bribe people regularly, from farmers to government officials to judges, but aside from that, I can use the rest of my money for my purpose.

Thank you.

Dr. T

Edited July 28, 2006 by jbowman1993

[jimmy5L]

Hi, I have a question. Can I live comfortably in Thailand? I just sold my company to a Singapore firm in January, and made a nice profit (78 billion baht). How much will I need to spend on a nice studio apartment downtown? How much on food (if I eat Thai food everyday)?

I have some expenses that our unavoidable. I have to spend 10 billion baht to bribe people regularly, from farmers to government officials to judges, but aside from that, I can use the rest of my money for my purpose.

Thank you.

Dr. T

I don’t get it! What has mr T. too do with me? You don’t like him cause he is rich? Or you don’t like his political stuff?

Stop smoking!! It aint no good for your brains!

[Ijustwannateach]

My first year in Thailand, at a fairly poor job where they were cheating me, I was living on a little more than 22,000 a month, once you subtracted for visa runs and lies about my supposedly "paid" holidays. I was located in a suburban area, in a province outside Bangkok.

On that much money, I lived comfortably, bought small furnishings & kept clothed, dated occasionally, could see the doctor or get a massage, see movies, buy a few books, and have a weekend "in town" in Bangkok every week, and I usually had 1-2K left at the end of the month, as well.

Strangely, Thai teachers at my school who made less, officially, than I did, were able to afford BMV's, jewelry, shopping at Emporium... go figure.

Anyway, even at that level of expense I wasn't unhappy or unhealthy. I'm doing considerably better these days, but that first year was still one of my happiest in Thailand, except for being cheated.

[jimmy5L]

Thanks teacher for your reply! I know the English teachers in Thailand don’t get much money! But they all seem to live happily on like around 40.000 bht, and then some retired farang can’t live on 100.000 bht! Strange world!

Anyway I got around 50.000 a month too live on, now I’m sure it’s possible, I guess it’s up too me how comfortable it will be! My next problem will be “where” to live?