Visa Overstayer Crackdown & What Bugs Me the Most

[GOLDBUGGY]

I keep reading over and over again about how they want to squash these Overstayers like a bug and now banish them from coming back here, after paying a fine first, but for the life of me I can't figure out why. I mean I know it is a crime, like driving without a motorbike helmet, but that certainly doesn't warrant huge fines, possible imprisonment, or being Blacked Listed.  

 

What Bugs me the most is they talk about these Overstayers like they are Harden Criminals, Drug Dealers, Child Molesters, Murderers, or Rapists. Or wanted by Interpol. But the reality is, most all just overstayed as they wanted to stay in Thailand longer, and spend more money and time here, but it is too difficult to get a Visa Extension without having to travel home again. I did it myself once. 

 

So what is the Big Deal about all this anyway? What do you guys think and why the big push to get these guys out. Border Hoppers to!

 

Haven't they got enough to do trying to catch real hardened criminals here instead of stopping a Tourist on the street and bothering him for his Passport. Just to check if he has overstayed?

 

You would think from recent news that Overstaying in Thailand is the Crime of the Century here.       .

[Bung]

What is difficult about going home and getting a proper visa?

Seems quite simple to me.

[schweizer]

And I am sure you would love to have your own country swamped with "illegal aliens"

 

answer is if you want to be in ANY country abide by the laws

[Rumblecat]

I don't even think they're portraying them all as hardened criminals or drug dealers, I think they're just portraying them as people living in the country illegally, which is probably seen as a more serious crime than driving with a motorbike helmet.

I suppose I wonder what the OP's solution is then? Make every country in the world free to live in, without visas or passports? While I love the idea, I do think it would just result in chaos. 

It was never hard to stay here legally before the recent crackdown- people had been doing it for years with border runs- so the pretty much everybody who overstayed chose to do so deliberately and willingly. As a result harsher penalties have had to be introduced. If people hadn't taken the piss before, maybe this wouldn't have happened, I don't know. You take advantage of a system like that, sooner or later the system is going to be toughened up, for better or worse. 

[pinkpanther99]

When visiting any country rule number 1 is to abide by the laws.

 

If you overstay you ain't abiding by the laws.

 

I abide by the laws in Thailand as I would expect people to abide by the laws if they were to visit my home country.

 

Why should Thailand let people overstay, no other country in the world would.

 

 

[bendejo]

psssst!

Let me tell you a secret: they don't want you to overstay your visa.  They're upping the consequences to deliver a message, and that message is don't violate your visa.

 

In western countries repeat offenders usually get harsher punishments, that's the way it works.  Drink driving once, they put you through the wringer before they let you drive again.  Second time forget about driving for a long while.  We kind of forget this principle when living in Asia, where most legalities are cleared up with cash, and to the extent that you can continue to break the same law as long as you keep paying the fine.  The only situation I can think of where I saw things working that way in the US was there was this guy in San Francisco who ran an advertising agency, used to park his fancy Range Rover on the sidewalk in front of his vintage office building, and he was ticketed every day, my guess was at least US$100 in fines per day.  I worked in that neighborhood for six months, the car was there every day, tickets under the wiper.  I don't think he was ever given an ultimatum "if you park here again you'll get towed."  I'm sure the city appreciated the revenue, maybe they'll give him a bronze plaque for his generous contribution.

 

I always thought deliberately overstaying with the idea of "No worries, I'll just pay off when I leave" was pretty dumb, as all it takes is a check of papers to get yourself nailed and introduced to the Thai penal system. 

 

 

[brucegoniners]

Quite frankly, I don't understand why it should be so hard to keep track of how long you've been in town and log it on your calendar, so you check in before you overstay.

 

Before when it was just a fine I was a bit lax myself and had to pay twice for short overstays.

 

But now that I know they're serious about it, I will be damn sure to get down there and check in prior to the 90 day mark.

 

We're all adults here (or at least I think so).  Let's act like adults and take care of our responsibilities.

 

We are guests in Thailand and we have to follow the rules.

 

If you break the law then you have to pay the consequences.

 

What I have never understood is people who overstay for months and years.  That's just plain irresponsible and those people deserve to get tossed from the country and not be asked back.

[Soutpeel]

is the crackdown not a response to the blase/arrogant attitude and contempt shown by over stayers to Thailands laws ? 

 

ie "it ok  to overstay not a problem, only going to pay 20k, leave and come back next week no big  deal"

 

so could we suggest this crackdown has been caused by the very people who are complaining about it now

 

Well the times are changing it seems, by all means overstay, but the consequences go beyond a 20k fine now

[bertty]

Quite frankly, I don't understand why it should be so hard to keep track of how long you've been in town and log it on your calendar, so you check in before you overstay.

 

Before when it was just a fine I was a bit lax myself and had to pay twice for short overstays.

 

But now that I know they're serious about it, I will be damn sure to get down there and check in prior to the 90 day mark.

 

We're all adults here (or at least I think so).  Let's act like adults and take care of our responsibilities.

 

We are guests in Thailand and we have to follow the rules.

 

If you break the law then you have to pay the consequences.

 

What I have never understood is people who overstay for months and years.  That's just plain irresponsible and those people deserve to get tossed from the country and not be asked back.

 

Sorry, are having a go at over stayers yet admit to doing it yourself. But it was only for a little while so it doesn't matter.

So when in your opinion does a crime become a crime ? a week, a month, a year ?

We are guests and have to follow their rules !! is this a new way of thinking? You have admitted to being a criminal in Thailand, why shouldn't you be thrown out of the country.

.

[Suradit69]

but for the life of me I can't figure out why

 

 

Oh good. Here's thread # 1001 on this topic.

 

 

[Soutpeel]

 

Quite frankly, I don't understand why it should be so hard to keep track of how long you've been in town and log it on your calendar, so you check in before you overstay.

 

Before when it was just a fine I was a bit lax myself and had to pay twice for short overstays.

 

But now that I know they're serious about it, I will be damn sure to get down there and check in prior to the 90 day mark.

 

We're all adults here (or at least I think so).  Let's act like adults and take care of our responsibilities.

 

We are guests in Thailand and we have to follow the rules.

 

If you break the law then you have to pay the consequences.

 

What I have never understood is people who overstay for months and years.  That's just plain irresponsible and those people deserve to get tossed from the country and not be asked back.

 

Sorry, are having a go at over stayers yet admit to doing it yourself. But it was only for a little while so it doesn't matter.

So when in your opinion does a crime become a crime ? a week, a month, a year ?

We are guests and have to follow their rules !! is this a new way of thinking? You have admitted to being a criminal in Thailand, why shouldn't you be thrown out of the country.

.

 

 

A crime is a crime the second you break the law, the only variable is the consequence of you breaking that law

 

steal a penny or steal GBP 1.0 million, its still theft

[Docno]

Be happy you don't (over)stay in Singapore... the penalty can be jail time and a caning. Thailand has a distance to go before it can be considered hard on overstayers...

[brucegoniners]

 

Quite frankly, I don't understand why it should be so hard to keep track of how long you've been in town and log it on your calendar, so you check in before you overstay.

 

Before when it was just a fine I was a bit lax myself and had to pay twice for short overstays.

 

But now that I know they're serious about it, I will be damn sure to get down there and check in prior to the 90 day mark.

 

We're all adults here (or at least I think so).  Let's act like adults and take care of our responsibilities.

 

We are guests in Thailand and we have to follow the rules.

 

If you break the law then you have to pay the consequences.

 

What I have never understood is people who overstay for months and years.  That's just plain irresponsible and those people deserve to get tossed from the country and not be asked back.

 

Sorry, are having a go at over stayers yet admit to doing it yourself. But it was only for a little while so it doesn't matter.

So when in your opinion does a crime become a crime ? a week, a month, a year ?

We are guests and have to follow their rules !! is this a new way of thinking? You have admitted to being a criminal in Thailand, why shouldn't you be thrown out of the country.

.

 

I'm not going to get into a pissing contest with you.

 

Read what I wrote and it's very clear.

 

I admitted to forgetting a couple times, but for a matter of days, not weeks and months.

 

Now that it's considered a serious offense it will never happen again.

 

Now one day is a crime I guess and I'll make sure it doesn't happen.

 

So yes, I guess I'm a criminal.

 

Happy?

 

[Mango Bob]

What is the penalty in your country for people who overstay?

[Rumblecat]

Pretty sure in the UK they just get deported without a fine- under 28 days they can apply to remain in the UK and extend a visa, more than 90 is usually a ban of a year from returning. Thailand is way harsher, but probably easier to get a visa for initially so it's balances out.

 

[bertty]

 

 

Quite frankly, I don't understand why it should be so hard to keep track of how long you've been in town and log it on your calendar, so you check in before you overstay.

 

Before when it was just a fine I was a bit lax myself and had to pay twice for short overstays.

 

But now that I know they're serious about it, I will be damn sure to get down there and check in prior to the 90 day mark.

 

We're all adults here (or at least I think so).  Let's act like adults and take care of our responsibilities.

 

We are guests in Thailand and we have to follow the rules.

 

If you break the law then you have to pay the consequences.

 

What I have never understood is people who overstay for months and years.  That's just plain irresponsible and those people deserve to get tossed from the country and not be asked back.

 

Sorry, are having a go at over stayers yet admit to doing it yourself. But it was only for a little while so it doesn't matter.

So when in your opinion does a crime become a crime ? a week, a month, a year ?

We are guests and have to follow their rules !! is this a new way of thinking? You have admitted to being a criminal in Thailand, why shouldn't you be thrown out of the country.

.

 

I'm not going to get into a pissing contest with you.

 

Read what I wrote and it's very clear.

 

I admitted to forgetting a couple times, but for a matter of days, not weeks and months.

 

Now that it's considered a serious offense it will never happen again.

 

Now one day is a crime I guess and I'll make sure it doesn't happen.

 

So yes, I guess I'm a criminal.

 

Happy?

 

 

Why would I be happy ? makes no odd's to me.

But I don't get why you would have a go at someone for doing something you have done yourself.

Why not be happy you both managed to get way with it, rather than slagging the other guy off ?

[Maestro]

Just for the record, here is what the English translation of the  Immigration Act says about the penalty for overstaying:

 

Section 81 : Any alien who stay in the Kingdom without permission or with permission expired or revoked

shall be punished with imprisonment not exceeding two years or a fine not exceeding 20,000 Baht or

both.

Section 84 : In all offenses under this Act, except the provisions of Section 62 Para.1 Section 63 , 64, 71

and 82 Para.2. The settlement Commission ,consisting of the Police Department’s Director General or

Representative, the Public Prosecution Department’s Director General or Representative, and the

Immigration Division’s Commander or Representative, as the, members shall have the authority to assign

duty of settlement to the Inquiry Official or the competent official by fixing a settlement rule or any

conditions as the Settlement Commission my deem proper.

When the offender has paid the fine as stipulate, the case shall be deemed settled under the

Criminal Procedure Code.

 

The Immigration Act makes no mention of blacklisting. Therefore, if and when a new rule providing for blacklisting overstayers is introduced, most likely in the form of a Ministerial Order, it will have to be based on another law.

 

 

[Bernard Flint]

Quite frankly, I don't understand why it should be so hard to keep track of how long you've been in town and log it on your calendar, so you check in before you overstay.

 

Before when it was just a fine I was a bit lax myself and had to pay twice for short overstays.

 

But now that I know they're serious about it, I will be damn sure to get down there and check in prior to the 90 day mark.

 

We're all adults here (or at least I think so).  Let's act like adults and take care of our responsibilities.

 

We are guests in Thailand and we have to follow the rules.

 

If you break the law then you have to pay the consequences.

 

What I have never understood is people who overstay for months and years.  That's just plain irresponsible and those people deserve to get tossed from the country and not be asked back.

 

The long overstayers i know about, spoke to, heard mates talking etc etc, live here hand to mouth, doing illegal work,selling football tops,kamagra,commisiion on things, even drug selling.Most of them cant even afford a ticket back to blighty.These type of people ruin it for everyone else, now enforcing laws will help to catc these parasites.

[Bernard Flint]

 

Quite frankly, I don't understand why it should be so hard to keep track of how long you've been in town and log it on your calendar, so you check in before you overstay.

 

Before when it was just a fine I was a bit lax myself and had to pay twice for short overstays.

 

But now that I know they're serious about it, I will be damn sure to get down there and check in prior to the 90 day mark.

 

We're all adults here (or at least I think so).  Let's act like adults and take care of our responsibilities.

 

We are guests in Thailand and we have to follow the rules.

 

If you break the law then you have to pay the consequences.

 

What I have never understood is people who overstay for months and years.  That's just plain irresponsible and those people deserve to get tossed from the country and not be asked back.

 

Sorry, are having a go at over stayers yet admit to doing it yourself. But it was only for a little while so it doesn't matter.

So when in your opinion does a crime become a crime ? a week, a month, a year ?

We are guests and have to follow their rules !! is this a new way of thinking? You have admitted to being a criminal in Thailand, why shouldn't you be thrown out of the country.

.

 

ERRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR

 

Because he did it before the crackdown

[smedly]

quote from the OP ............ What Bugs me the most is they talk about these Overstayers like they are Harden Criminals, Drug Dealers, Child Molesters, Murderers, or Rapists. Or wanted by Interpol.

 

TBH and I know this doesn't apply to all but my personal experience is that everyone I have ever known on long term overstay in the past 10 years has been one or more of the above, further-  almost all news items concerning falangs being caught for serious crime here including all of the above have been on long term overstay

 

What seems to happen  is that people come for a holiday sometimes after getting  divorced (shared assets) - losing their job (getting a limited redundancy payment) - on the run from authorities in their home country (career criminals) etc etc and they find they like it here and want to stay - but after a while the money runs out so they need to work (usually illegally) to sustain their stay, they will literally do anything to get by, I personally know of 5 that started to sell drugs and they eventually got caught, 2x died in prison 2x did a runner while on bail and another got caught again for selling drugs while on bail and did a runner owing a lot of money to people they borrowed from.

 

I have other various stories were for one reason or another they shafted friends with massive loans and did a runner - one is in prison in the UK for being caught selling drugs and another is wanted for same reason - these are specifically to do with drugs - I could tell you many more stories of various criminals but I think you get the picture  

 

 

Do a little research and it might not be bugging you so much and maybe the Thai authorities are also aware of this pattern, then consider the increased influx of various nationalities from Russia, India, Africa, Middle East who it seems are also fitting this pattern to possibly a greater extent - I can fully understand why the Thai Authorities are concerned and are trying to gain some control before it gets any worse

[KhnomKhnom]

To be blunt, it is difficult to control a foreigner population if you do not know where they live.

A 30dayer in/out need not report a real place to stay, ever.

 

Every nation has the right to control its borders and to know where non-citizens stay or live.  It is basic for all nations I have heard about.  USA tries vainly to do same.

 

All this is mostly about being able to find you.  It also explains the 90day ADDRESS REPORT, which is what that is really.

 

You should be able to think of many reasons any nation wants to keep track of foreigners.

 

Ask why would a person enjoying Thailand hospitality want to DISAPPEAR into the nation?  That is, not exist via NO visa of any kind.  What is the advantage?  Why should Thailand want that kind of foreigner here?

[Maestro]

Removed an off-topic post and the reply to it.

[Sarana]

I have met one long term overztayer and be was from UK and came and ran out of money, so has worked illegally for ten years and cannot afford a ticket home...What bugs me is that if he was not a Farang noone would notice him.

[Rorri]

Bung, on 07 Aug 2014 - 14:27, said:

What is difficult about going home and getting a proper visa?

Seems quite simple to me.

You're the first to reply and the first to miss the point.... Guess you just couldn't think of anything else.

[wabothai]

It is ridiculous to overstay, i don't see why. Lazyness? Well, the consequences await you.

[antsrule]

Not everone overstays on purpose. I started working for an agency as a teacher. When I asked them how come I could teach at so many different schools on the same work permit they told me as long as I was teaching no problem. That was true but what they didn't tell me was the work permit was tied to the agency not the schools. Not blaming them, they were and are an excellent agecncy. However, after that I went to an international school to teach high school physics, chemistry and biology. They got me a new work permit. After one year I left (at 66 I found the workload onerous) and went to a really nice government matayom school to teach high school mathematics. I was going through a new agency that had some ethical issues. My work permit was to expire in October after the first semester. They were aware of that but didn't say anything and I wasn't worried because of my misunderstanding. So I get the maximum overstay fine and a big stamp in my passport and the agency gets nothing. Yes I know its my fault for not familiarizing myself with the everchanging and arbitrary regulations. I know that if a Thai person goes to Canada and rents a car, they won't make it thtough the day without a sizeable penalty. So we all have to be careful. At least in Canada the rental agent will get thr police in their face as well.

[Chillout101]

Everyone, absolutely everyone that overstays do it on purpose, either by their own will or just because they are plain stupid.

I have no symphaty with those who break the law in a country they visit, why this forum touches them with silk gloves is beyond my comprehension. They are the ones making it tougher for all the rest who follow the law.

My myanmar girlfriend got in trouble renewing her ED visa at uni due to some weird rules at the school itself ( you need 9 points to renew ED visa but can in no way obtain them before after 4 months), but did she overstay? No, we did the right thing and left country to obtain a new ED visa for her, case closed.

 

My point is that if you do NOT have money in backup when abroad, then you should not be abroad in the first place!

Edited August 7, 2014 by Chillout101

[Just1Voice]

Went to Chiang Mai Imm today to pick up my Certificate of Residency.  They handed me a stack of blank forms and told me to fill out and sign.  It's a form stating that you have read the penalties for overstaying, which are printed on the form, and you agree to abide by them.  Name, age, date, signature.  No big deal.

 

[belg]

a thousand miles walk start with the first step...

 

you want to be here legit, there are choices

 

how long can tourists stay in your home country ?  yes ... many overstay overthere, and it is to claim benefits, housing, welfare ... and in thailand, you get nothing, but fined or jailed ...

 

 

[BestBitterPhuket]

Overstaying is illegal, while traveling in and out on a visa exemption is not.