moving to thailand now or later

[ATF]

Boris another option maybe given your skills is to buy a house in Southern Europe that you can fix up and sell for a good profit later. When their economies get back on track.

You will get the benefit of good weather, healthcare and schooling plus your kids will learn a foreign language.

If your wife is a good cook maybe consider a Thai Restaurant also. Lots of properties in these areas going for about 50% discount now and your trade should be in demand.

Just a thought and you should still be able to travel to Thailand every year.

[Jasun]

On your projected income, your realistic options are home schooling or local schooling for the kids, unless one of you can land a gig at a private school for discount on tuition.

[geronimo]

If your heart says yes, go for it!

[meatboy]

"You paid for the land that I gather is in your Thai wife`s name and come across as if breaking the laws of Thailand should be acceptable if there are no other means for foreigners of little wealth to financially support themselves. It is people like you who are abusing the system with intentions to continue abusing the system that has created the tightening up of the rules for all of us.

Under Thai law the said land unless under certain circumstances has be financed by your Thai wife`s money with back up documentation and paperwork to prove it."

BJ I don't know why you always beat the same drum but your information isn't always 100% accurate. First of all there is nothing illegal for a married couple to build a house for themselves. Buying property for one's wife isn't illegal. They line is drawn when it is a shell for investment purposes. When someone says I bought land, he means that his wife bought it for the family. He has no claim on the land but since he has children, they obviously do.

There is no abuse. It isn't like he was investing money for developing land but using his wife to do it for him. Shell companies that are just created for that purpose are illegal but giving your wife money to buy land for the family isn't.

Working as a carpenter is illegal. Owning a construction company and training Thai staff to do the work is not. Overseeing the construction of one's house isn't illegal either. Doing repairs and maintaining your home isn't illegal either.

I wish people would just give this guy a break. The real issues are education, providing a steady income for his family and not going crazy living in Chumpon.

I think that you are much better off doing extended holidays than a total relocation until you really get an idea of what living in that area is like permanently.

Personally, I would go insane there. Not much in Chumpon.

cheers for the support. not much other than great beaches , waterfalls, caves,windsurfing,diving, fresh seafood on beachfront resturants, golf courses, bit of nightlife in town, , island s nearby including samui ,ko tao, and more. it aint no pattaya but that suits me

don't forget boris your not going to be a tourist,so what you are describing above is ok.but in very very small doses.after 30yrs.experiance of Thailand I wouldn't have it any other way,FAR AWAY from it.it is becoming very hard to live on a budget here in Thailand there is always something which crops up unexpected so you have to be prepared.you do need whats been suggested,rent first,check out where you want to live,the area around you,as you could end up with a dozen karaoke bars on your door-step.you will find education is dam right expensive here,with you having to pay a lump sum just to get in the chosen school.i love where we are,but as I am retired and don't have to rely on earning an income,but for you do your homework,feel out the cost of just about everything,going into stores and pricing all your needs,there is a lot you can bring in eg.good kitchen equipment,pans ect.which for good quality are very expensive here.there is so much you need to read up on so don't rush into something you might regret.

good luck.ps.whats your fav.tipple?

[CiaranO]

its easy to be rude and slag people off when your hiding behind a computer screen, keep on about my plans having no chance of succeeding, who the .k are u to tell me that , u know nothing about me , so im not a responsible parent . is this what u do all day look down your nose at people who might want to try something different and tell them they have no chance . well done in being so successfull . i like it when people tell me what o dont want to hear but theirs no place for rudeness and labelling them bad parents mr high and mighty

I am not being rude or slaging you off, this is not personal, I am telling you how it is, giving the facts.

I am also saying that you have no chance of succeeding and sustaining yourself and your family in Thailand regarding your situation as it is according to how you have described your circumstancies so far, plus you would not be living strictly by the laws of Thailand. I also said that you should research further prior to considering moving here especially where your children are concerned, and I mentioned that you should consider leaving your children in the UK while you are trying to establish yourself in Thailand. I asked if you have made any arrangements for your retirement such as insurance policies and pensions? And gave you an estimate of how much cash you will require for yourself and family per month and an estimate of how long your savings will last in Thailand on the amounts you have quoted as having.

So getting straight to the point, my answer to your question; Thailand now or later? Is without a shadow of a doubt, later, much later in fact.

These are the facts, otherwise in what other ways would you like me to explain this and what else would you prefer to hear?

Bj - sorry but you are a condescending ####. I reckon your just jealous.

And all this bs about his wife owning land - of course she can. Honestly you need to take your head out of the sand.

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[mrtoad]

I am not being rude or slaging you off, this is not personal, I am telling you how it is, giving the facts.

I am also saying that you have no chance of succeeding and sustaining yourself and your family in Thailand regarding your situation as it is according to how you have described your circumstancies so far, plus you would not be living strictly by the laws of Thailand. I also said that you should research further prior to considering moving here especially where your children are concerned, and I mentioned that you should consider leaving your children in the UK while you are trying to establish yourself in Thailand. I asked if you have made any arrangements for your retirement such as insurance policies and pensions? And gave you an estimate of how much cash you will require for yourself and family per month and an estimate of how long your savings will last in Thailand on the amounts you have quoted as having.

So getting straight to the point, my answer to your question; Thailand now or later? Is without a shadow of a doubt, later, much later in fact.

These are the facts, otherwise in what other ways would you like me to explain this and what else would you prefer to hear?

BJ, more patronizing drivel as per form.

Clarify, how he would not be strictly living to the laws of Thailand? If this is about his wife buying land, then that is quite frankly ridiculous.

Let me guess, you have never , ever broken any law at all?

How can you suggest that he "has no chance of succeeding in Thailand"? I'm curious, as I certainly know of a few people who have arrived in Thailand with hardly a pot to piss in, and have become very successful, despite the odds - care to enlighten me BJ, on why the OP couldn't be successful in his own right?. I'm not suggesting that it is easy, and there are pitfalls, but the OP doesn't seem to be an idiot, and he's asked some valid questions and got some valid answers. This whole thing about having all the savings etc in place before doing something, would probably mean that 90% of people never move to another country. Of course you've been here a longtime, and have your views which is fine, but they are pretty dated.

Edited August 11, 2014 by mrtoad

[Gumballl]

Bj - sorry but you are a condescending ####. I reckon your just jealous.

And all this bs about his wife owning land - of course she can. Honestly you need to take your head out of the sand.

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Of course wife can own land. Even if money came from farang husband. Semantics aside, it is the wife that owns the land.

The OP has two choices... think of his future, or think of his children's.

Let's just leave it at this.

[AnotherOneAmerican]

How can you suggest that he "has no chance of succeeding in Thailand"? I'm curious, as I certainly know of a few people who have arrived in Thailand with hardly a pot to piss in, and have become very successful, despite the odds - care to enlighten me BJ, on why the OP couldn't be successful in his own right?. I'm not suggesting that it is easy, and there are pitfalls, but the OP doesn't seem to be an idiot, and he's asked some valid questions and got some valid answers. This whole thing about having all the savings etc in place before doing something, would probably mean that 90% of people never move to another country. Of course you've been here a longtime, and have your views which is fine, but they are pretty dated.

For every foreigner you know who made a success, I know one hundred that failed miserably.

And that was when a military Junta wasn't looking to rid Thailand of illegal workers.

Why OP couldn't be successful,

1. Works in a restricted job.

2. no previous management skills.

3. No previous experience of running his own business.

4. Limited education (so can't work as a teacher)

IMHO it doesn't look promising.

[mrtoad]

I know the successes and the failures - however, I'm not going to write the bloke off. He needs to do the research, and see if he thinks he has a workable plan. Personally, If I was him, I'd look at doing a year our sabbatical, so as to speak and test the waters. Living here is a lot different than being here on holidays. Having a good Exit plan, is an absolute must, as is not over comitting himself initially. I would certainly have done things differently 10 years ago, knowing what I know now,although If I knew that then, I probably would have never come here.

[ATF]

There's no problem for Boris getting a visa. He's married and has kids. Owning land in his family's name is not a problem and if he wants to build his own house with his own hands he can do that too.

I know plenty of Falungs who build houses and then sell them but they have their own companies and pay tax. But there is no law saying you can't build your own house.

[zeichen]

"cheers for the support. not much other than great beaches , waterfalls, caves,windsurfing,diving, fresh seafood on beachfront resturants, golf courses, bit of nightlife in town, , island s nearby including samui ,ko tao, and more. it aint no pattaya but that suits me"

That is what people do on a holiday not what we do everyday. The restaurants in that region are subpar, the food is 40% more expensive than other provinces. The islands are filled with young party crowds and not family oriented. There are less than 40% Thai people on those islands. My wife has to speak English in her own country going there. The waterfall, caves are not as impressive as other regions.

If you are comparing Pataya, then yes, but there are more places in Thailand than BKK, Pataya and Chumpon. After living here for more than 1/2 my life I have seen quite a bit of the country. I also know as an expat you will need a mixture of local culture and western luxuries. For long term living your mindset is not right. You still think that living here is a long holiday. Until you change that attitude, just come for 2-3 months a year when your work slows down.

Watch the videos of that fat guy in BKK and his family. People that are ill planned have fun but suffer.

[mrtoad]

What was the name of that Fat Guy and Family in Bangkok? I forget the idiot, his rantings were quite legendary.

[Franky Bear]

If your heart says yes, go for it!

Very wrong. A life changing decision should be made by the head not the heart

[chrisinth]

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Another point to note:

Anyone planning to live in Thailand long term needs to understand the Retirement Visa requirements - The OP, like a lot of guys who move to Thailand, is a long way off retirement, but retirement and old age will eventually come (if you are lucky). At that point you need to have sufficient capital/income to meet the retirement rules (which have never gone down).

An income that covers daily costs but does not allow for retirement savings is in reality a path to returning home in old age penniless.

If he is married to a Thai then there would be no requirement for a retirement visa.

But that is only an assumption that his wife is Thai as they bought land here a few years ago.

[Franky Bear]

Be aware he's said he could go back to work and earn three month of the year.

In reality it's similar to use 28/28's

[theguyfromanotherforum]

I read the thread title and thinking.... come now man... don't wait until you are old and ugly.

But then I opened the thread and saw you have 2 kids. How disappointing.......

Stay in UK would be my advice.

Also.... sure there are a lot of members here who like to point fingers and dish out advice, but the fact is doing carpentry job in Thailand can get you in a lot of trouble.... especially now.

The most important part, however, is that UK has one of the best medical systems in the world. I am from Canada and even though I have money here I still find the hospitals expensive..... comparing to.... you know..... free

[ZAKY]

Thailand is not the right place for anyone to move at this time.

It's getting harder for foreigners to stay here.

It's very hard for most foreigners to earn money here (legally).

The Junta is getting more repressive.

Inflation is runaway.

I can't imagine anyone would want to move here now.

I wish I hadn't (and I'm not a foreigner).

Besides you can get married to a thai have kids, buy property and stay here 100 years, you will still be a foreigner and do your visa just like a tourist, if you are caught washing your car, do your lawn or do some volontary work you can be deported for working without work permit.

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[GTNZ]

hi rolandrat, its true housing is the biggest expense and with 2 million think i could get a half decent place. a happy home is important for a happy life. im a carpenter and i know i could get work in samui for 10000 baht a week if needed to, have friends and family living and working there, but like i said i really wouldnt mind coming back to uk every 6 months or so and save a mil then come back. cheers

You bought land a few years ago in Thailand, which is illegal, you have broken the law and legally cannot own it. Now with the Junta in power here all these back door and Thai upfront name methods to buy land will soon be clamped down upon and you stand a chance of losing the said land in the future.

You intend to create some sort of small business here with your wife. What sort of business? Considering you have by your own admission illegally financed land in your Thai wife’s name, would this be the same scenario regarding any businesses you intend to finance, own and run in Thailand?

£80000 at today’s bank exchange rates = just over 4 million baht. Out of this you intend to have a home built up to 2 million baht on land you purchased illegally and cannot own, but hoping that the law will turn a blind eye and no one will notice, probably the same regards if you were working as a carpenter. And then pay for International school education for 2 children for the next 14 years until the children reach 18 years old and probably another 4 years University education for the children after they graduate from high school, then throwing in the purchase of a couple of motorbikes just for good measure.

F'me the guy is not in court give it a rest you old far#

Also he never said the land was in HIS name did he. Of course they can own land legally if it's in his wife's name. Doh!!

Mate if it was me I would go for it, get the hell out of the dump in the UK and enjoy life with your kids. Why do they need to be in an international school anyway? There's plenty of other ways to get a decent education. How about home schooling or online.

[JB300]

Boris, I've obviously no idea how much money you earn, but 1Million THB (£18,000) after tax/expenses in 3-4 months would be a pretty impressive feat for most people & if you're earning that kind of money it makes sense to rack as much of it up as you can whilst you're still able to.

Instead of going "Big Bang", have you considered moving over there gradually, extended holidays whilst getting your house built (paid for out of your earnings rather than your savings).

[user82374298374]

If you love your children and care about their education, stay in the UK - no matter how crappy it is, it sure beats subjecting one's children to the Thai educational system.

[geronimo]

If your heart says yes, go for it!

Very wrong. A life changing decision should be made by the head not the heart

We are seeing the same thing from different perspectives.

[larsjohnsson]

hi rolandrat, its true housing is the biggest expense and with 2 million think i could get a half decent place. a happy home is important for a happy life. im a carpenter and i know i could get work in samui for 10000 baht a week if needed to, have friends and family living and working there, but like i said i really wouldnt mind coming back to uk every 6 months or so and save a mil then come back. cheers

Wait until you can afford retirement. Illegal work is the wrong way to support wife and children. Let the children have their education in the UK.

[zeichen]

"Besides you can get married to a thai have kids, buy property and stay here 100 years, you will still be a foreigner and do your visa just like a tourist, if you are caught washing your car, do your lawn or do some volontary work you can be deported for working without work permit."

Crock of total &lt;deleted&gt;. More Fearmongering at its best from some disgruntled sexpat who got overcharged for last nights onenighter.

There are 1000's of people who have assimilated here and live very good lives and are treated equally and fairly.

If you are married, have a decent business, you will not do a visa like a tourist. There are 1000's of people who have extended their visa for decades. You can wash your own car, etc. Show me a link to a Thai newspaper that shows any deportation for said offenses. The only time anyone is actually deported is when they commit a crime and usually only felonies not misdemeanors.

[phuketrichard]

not enough money

house with land will cost ya that much

international school/kid 200,000-450,000/year

living expenses for 4 just about anywhere in Thailand ( excluding school) will be at least 50,000/month

[Tony125]

hi rolandrat, its true housing is the biggest expense and with 2 million think i could get a half decent place. a happy home is important for a happy life. im a carpenter and i know i could get work in samui for 10000 baht a week if needed to, have friends and family living and working there, but like i said i really wouldnt mind coming back to uk every 6 months or so and save a mil then come back. cheers

You bought land a few years ago in Thailand, which is illegal, you have broken the law and legally cannot own it. Now with the Junta in power here all these back door and Thai upfront name methods to buy land will soon be clamped down upon and you stand a chance of losing the said land in the future.

You intend to create some sort of small business here with your wife. What sort of business? Considering you have by your own admission illegally financed land in your Thai wife’s name, would this be the same scenario regarding any businesses you intend to finance, own and run in Thailand?

£80000 at today’s bank exchange rates = just over 4 million baht. Out of this you intend to have a home built up to 2 million baht on land you purchased illegally and cannot own, but hoping that the law will turn a blind eye and no one will notice, probably the same regards if you were working as a carpenter. And then pay for International school education for 2 children for the next 14 years until the children reach 18 years old and probably another 4 years University education for the children after they graduate from high school, then throwing in the purchase of a couple of motorbikes just for good measure.

You are not taking into account inflation, bank exchange rates and interest rates that can fluctuate greatly, plus Immigration could raise the imposed amounts of Thai bahts required as savings in a Thai bank account to obtain your annual visa and after that your yearly visa extensions and of course health care for yourself and family.

To survive in Thailand for a family of four, including International school education for your children, you are probably looking at needing an income of at least 50000 baht per month, if you’re lucky, and on that amount you certainly would not be eating Champaign dinners every day and definitely living a lifestyle of absolute basics. If you were left with even 2 million baht after your house building and other expenditure to set yourself up here, your savings at 50000 baht per month would be depleted within three and a half years, that’s if nothing else crops up in the meantime. So how do you suppose to financially support yourself and family after you reach 40 years old?

I would like to ask, do you have any Insurance policies or guaranteed pensions to claim on your retirement? As you are only 36 years old the normal retirement ages for those claiming their pensions in the next 30 years may have increased to 70 years old or older, that is of course if you have been or continue to pay into a pension scheme and UK Government NI credits while you are living in Thailand, which on your limited savings would be a struggle, or more likely impossible.

Sorry my friend, but you are living in cloud cuckoo land, you would be moving here on a hope and a prayer that everything works out. I first suggest that you do some more research prior to even considering packing everything up in the UK and moving permanently to Thailand and especially not subjecting your children to such an ordeal and placing their futures at risk, as that would be totally irresponsible and an act of extreme foolishness of the first degree. I speak as someone who has a Thai wife and brought up 3 children here for over 30 years.

Whatever you decide to do, you do so at your own risk and discretion and suggest that you arrange a proper guardian for your children in the UK if not able to support them there and not bring them to Thailand with you as a part of your grand ideas that do not have any chance of succeeding while you`re in your present situation on the details you have given.

Giving his wife money to buy land in Thailand in her name is NOT illegal ! He could even buy/build a "house" in his name ,he would need a seperate deed for the house or get a usufruct. Don't belive me check this site for How to Own Property in Thailand or Google it or ask one of the moderators. If willing to go back to UK part of year to work I don't see a problem with having the finances to live here. Would need to check out the costs of international school though and save for 400,000 baht for retiring when he is 50 plus unless he has 40,000 baht per month pension when he retires. good luck.

[ZAKY]

"Besides you can get married to a thai have kids, buy property and stay here 100 years, you will still be a foreigner and do your visa just like a tourist, if you are caught washing your car, do your lawn or do some volontary work you can be deported for working without work permit."

Crock of total . More Fearmongering at its best from some disgruntled sexpat who got overcharged for last nights onenighter.

There are 1000's of people who have assimilated here and live very good lives and are treated equally and fairly.

If you are married, have a decent business, you will not do a visa like a tourist. There are 1000's of people who have extended their visa for decades. You can wash your own car, etc. Show me a link to a Thai newspaper that shows any deportation for said offenses. The only time anyone is actually deported is when they commit a crime and usually only felonies not misdemeanors.

There is a limit where you should be considered as being part of the population not like when for example you divorce, you have to leave the country immediately. This open the door to many abuses.

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[steven23]

thanks for all the replys. sure is food for thought . my wife already has a small business plan and without too much of a set up cost. and it s a pretty good idea, small but could pay the billls etc. like i said in first post i d always put off the idea of living in thailand once i had kids , but now ive got an inner urge to give it a go and it wont go away. we are not coming to thailand to get rich just live a simple , happy life in a nice house in a nice enviroment. chumphon . or i just forget about it and let the urge go away and be sensible and safe

Dear Boris,

I would like to disagree with some of advice that fellow members from Thai visa stated. First is that Thai international school cost 200,000 per kid.

That is false, you can check at any web site , for example Dara academy.or contact them via email, you have many choices.

Also community schools are not that bad.

Universities, depending if they are private or state can be from 50 000 to 700,000 THB per year, depending on program, location and status.

Its true that you cannot work for Thai company as carpenter, but that doesnt mean you cannot own 49% of firm that is doing carpenters jobs, anyway you are young, which is pretty positive, since you can easy find part time jobs in Australia or New Zealand, Its 6h of flight from Thailand, but you can safe more money, while your children and wife is at thailand, Carpentry jobs are on priority list for skilled immigration. if your wife doesnt have problem with you going abroad to work, I think its much clever than staying in UK,

About building a house, I suggest you to choose location that is in cheaper part of thailand, unless your wife job is related to tourism, then you should choose more "attractive" location.

You have many options, money are solid that you have, but If you are really skilled and good, plus you are young, dont hesitate to combine living in thailand with working in australia,

[Quack]

You only live once, go for it Just make sure you have a plan to make some $$$$

[Mister T]

No reason why it can't work as long as you are prepared.

Is the land you bought, family land, if so do they live nearby? Would make it easier for her and the kids, therefore, easier for you.

As said before, rent for a year and check the whole area for possible future problems.

No reason why you can't live here and return to UK for a bit each year to earn some money, plenty of guys do.

Some of the schools in this country are as good as anywhere else for basic education. Check out the schools in your area and interview the foreign teachers.

Assume the kids have dual citizenship - they can do primary level here and go back for high school if need be. I know a few people who home schooled here quite well, so why not send them to an English/bilingual program school and top it up yourself.

Keep a million in the bank at all times, have accident and health insurance for the whole family, enjoy it while you are young enough, run away if it turns to crap.

[khunerik]

thanks for all the replys. sure is food for thought . my wife already has a small business plan and without too much of a set up cost. and it s a pretty good idea, small but could pay the billls etc. like i said in first post i d always put off the idea of living in thailand once i had kids , but now ive got an inner urge to give it a go and it wont go away. we are not coming to thailand to get rich just live a simple , happy life in a nice house in a nice enviroment. chumphon . or i just forget about it and let the urge go away and be sensible and safe

Boris the Road to Hell is paved with good intentions. Given your present financial circumstances it would be very difficult. That's just an observation don't take it personally.

Why don't you plan extended holidays every year and get a feel for it first.

hi atf , extended holidays each year only in the past have teased me into wanting to give it a go. it depend s what drives you i suppose, im not one who needs loads of money to make me happy, its not all about finances , i understand a little financial security but 4 million baht isnt a bad starting point is it ?

4 million aht would be a good start if you came here alone. But with a family and two small kids, it's not much money. Just remember how much School and University will cost the next 10-15 years for those two kids.