What Do You Think When You See A Western Man And A Thai Woman?

[thaibebop]

It's strange, but I see post after post about what strangers think of the matching in question. I have had little problem with strangers. My problem has been with family. Many of family seems put off by the fact I didn't marry a white women, or an American, or a Christian. So, I wonder have any of you have problems with anyone closer to you about your choice in love and life?

Thats too bad, it doesn't make it any easier without family support.

My wife and I plan to move somewhere were neither of us have family and settle down with our own and start over so to speak.

No we haven't had any problems with my family. My husband is a very nice man and anyone who meets him tends to like him. Even my quite religious grandparents thought he was terrific. Never had any issues with anybody in my family. His family, well, his dad likes me. Not sure about the mom, but every woman has mother-in-law issues. Most of the extended family like me and one brother and one sister. the other brother, I am certain, doesn't but then, I don't think much of him either so it may not be a thai-farang thing, just mutual dislike

There will always be a few.

[phibunmike]

What is so amusing here is all the talk about love being of paramount importance and looks and youth being minor things. Nearly all of this is being put forth by old men who have gf/wives that are 20+ years younger. Many of these women coming from economically disadvantage backgrounds and would have much less opportunity if they had married someone who loved them that was their own age. None of these old guys looked past the physical, yet they love (no pun intended) to say oh, its all because of love.

Took the words right out of my mouth and then some. Excpet in the case of his wife aging, he says he will already be in love with her so he will not be repulsed. But, of course, she will always be at least 20+ years younger regardless of his age. Maybe what he is discussing here - and by extension what he expects of his wife - is that love is the great alchemist of age. However, his words suggest that only aging men are worthy of such a love. I guess in marriages of wide disparate backgrounds such love is worth quite a lot to some.

Kat, I always enjoy your posts, you speak with intelligence (not flattery, mere statement of fact).

But I do detect some generalisation in your post (although, I must admit, I have not read the whole thread). My wife is 20+ years youngr than myself, we love each other, and to us age is not an impediment. I know that she prefers older men (her previous husband, Thai, was also older, but not as much). She has maturity beyond her years, and, because of the cultural differences, we both learn from each other every day. I admit that initially I was attracted to her by what I consider her youthful good looks - who is not initially attracted by superficial characteristics ? Do you not admire a hunky guy with a BMW at the party ?

But on those occasions when my wife and I argue (as most couples do from time to time, epsecially when there are large cultural differences to contend with), I don't see her as a younger woman - I see her as my wife; sometimes stubborn, sometimes wrong, sometimes angry; and I love her.

She does not focus on age: nor do I; so why should anyone else ?

I would like you to consider something for a moment; can you imagine what it is like, to be with the person you have decided to spend the rest of your life with, who happens to be Thai, and happens to be younger than you, to be continually on the receiving end of assumption and inuendo ?

Ok, I have addressed this to you, Kat, but it is not an attack. It is just easier for me to write to someone than everyone.

Oh, lingyai, I suppose I fit happily into your generlisations. Please feel free to use me as an example to support your theories, its no skin off my nose

[sureerat9]

What is so amusing here is all the talk about love being of paramount importance and looks and youth being minor things. Nearly all of this is being put forth by old men who have gf/wives that are 20+ years younger. Many of these women coming from economically disadvantage backgrounds and would have much less opportunity if they had married someone who loved them that was their own age. None of these old guys looked past the physical, yet they love (no pun intended) to say oh, its all because of love.

Took the words right out of my mouth and then some. Excpet in the case of his wife aging, he says he will already be in love with her so he will not be repulsed. But, of course, she will always be at least 20+ years younger regardless of his age. Maybe what he is discussing here - and by extension what he expects of his wife - is that love is the great alchemist of age. However, his words suggest that only aging men are worthy of such a love. I guess in marriages of wide disparate backgrounds such love is worth quite a lot to some.

Kat, I always enjoy your posts, you speak with intelligence (not flattery, mere statement of fact).

But I do detect some generalisation in your post (although, I must admit, I have not read the whole thread). My wife is 20+ years youngr than myself, we love each other, and to us age is not an impediment. I know that she prefers older men (her previous husband, Thai, was also older, but not as much). She has maturity beyond her years, and, because of the cultural differences, we both learn from each other every day. I admit that initially I was attracted to her by what I consider her youthful good looks - who is not initially attracted by superficial characteristics ? Do you not admire a hunky guy with a BMW at the party ?

But on those occasions when my wife and I argue (as most couples do from time to time, epsecially when there are large cultural differences to contend with), I don't see her as a younger woman - I see her as my wife; sometimes stubborn, sometimes wrong, sometimes angry; and I love her.

She does not focus on age: nor do I; so why should anyone else ?

I would like you to consider something for a moment; can you imagine what it is like, to be with the person you have decided to spend the rest of your life with, who happens to be Thai, and happens to be younger than you, to be continually on the receiving end of assumption and inuendo ?

Ok, I have addressed this to you, Kat, but it is not an attack. It is just easier for me to write to someone than everyone.

Oh, lingyai, I suppose I fit happily into your generlisations. Please feel free to use me as an example to support your theories, its no skin off my nose

my other half is 12 years younger than me but she can be very aggresive

if i try to guide here in any direction apart from the one she has chosen

got to go she is coming back now

[brahmburgers]

I'm a middle aged man - usually go about town on my own. However, I did get a definite disgusted look once from a farang woman who saw me walking with three early teenage gals - middle of the day in downtown Chiang Rai. She had no way of knowing, but the two girls are like daughters to me. They're petitte brown-skinned immigrants from Laos and I've been close friends with them and their parents for years. The girls bop over to my house whenever they want - to do internet, to sweep the floor, to get a snack. ...and I help them out with things like buying school supplies - and we all (parents and grandparents included) sometimes go on outings together.

A couple times, the youngest gal (11) has even reached out to hold my hand while we're walking. I don't know if women can understand the immense heart-warming feeling a guy gets - when a girl does such a thing - but it's true. and has nothing to do with sex - and everything to do with love.

Even so, I can understand if an unknown person looks askance at a middle aged farang walking with a much younger gal (or two or three). Once a Thai shopowner called the girls over to ask who I was. I thought that was completely decent thing for the shopowner to do - and I don't begrudge it at all.

[kat]

What is so amusing here is all the talk about love being of paramount importance and looks and youth being minor things. Nearly all of this is being put forth by old men who have gf/wives that are 20+ years younger. Many of these women coming from economically disadvantage backgrounds and would have much less opportunity if they had married someone who loved them that was their own age. None of these old guys looked past the physical, yet they love (no pun intended) to say oh, its all because of love.

Took the words right out of my mouth and then some. Excpet in the case of his wife aging, he says he will already be in love with her so he will not be repulsed. But, of course, she will always be at least 20+ years younger regardless of his age. Maybe what he is discussing here - and by extension what he expects of his wife - is that love is the great alchemist of age. However, his words suggest that only aging men are worthy of such a love. I guess in marriages of wide disparate backgrounds such love is worth quite a lot to some.

Kat, I always enjoy your posts, you speak with intelligence (not flattery, mere statement of fact).

But I do detect some generalisation in your post (although, I must admit, I have not read the whole thread). My wife is 20+ years youngr than myself, we love each other, and to us age is not an impediment. I know that she prefers older men (her previous husband, Thai, was also older, but not as much). She has maturity beyond her years, and, because of the cultural differences, we both learn from each other every day. I admit that initially I was attracted to her by what I consider her youthful good looks - who is not initially attracted by superficial characteristics ? Do you not admire a hunky guy with a BMW at the party ?

But on those occasions when my wife and I argue (as most couples do from time to time, epsecially when there are large cultural differences to contend with), I don't see her as a younger woman - I see her as my wife; sometimes stubborn, sometimes wrong, sometimes angry; and I love her.

She does not focus on age: nor do I; so why should anyone else ?

I would like you to consider something for a moment; can you imagine what it is like, to be with the person you have decided to spend the rest of your life with, who happens to be Thai, and happens to be younger than you, to be continually on the receiving end of assumption and inuendo ?

Ok, I have addressed this to you, Kat, but it is not an attack. It is just easier for me to write to someone than everyone.

Oh, lingyai, I suppose I fit happily into your generlisations. Please feel free to use me as an example to support your theories, its no skin off my nose

No, I'm not at all offended, and I think it's a fair comment. I don't mean to generalize, but there are true generalizations for every culture and place. However, I have admitted on a recent thread that I don't think the age gap thing is an all or nothing issue, with no grey areas, contradictions, or even uncertainity on my part. I think there are the generalizations that are very common, and there are individual cases. I see both.

[girlx]

I think alot of people assume certain things about how people look at them based on their own preconceived notions; ie some people assume that all western women are giving them dirty looks because that is their own prejudice coloring their attitudes.

It is very similar to people who come and can't speak thai and assume that all Thai people are saying bad things about them. Then, once they learn thai, they realize that, in general, it just isn't true and if they are even talking about them at all it isn't something nasty.

i haven't read this whole thread but wanted to comment on this- i agree... i had an awkward moment at the airport this morning. an older farang man with his thai wife and two mixed daughters. i was staring at them because i couldn't believe how gorgeous their family was- the girls had the beautiful skin and hair of thais but the facial structure of farangs... but the guy just sat scowling at me, apparently thinking i was staring in judgement of him with his thai lady. it was pretty insulting to me actually that he would think that off the bat.

[britmaveric]

I think alot of people assume certain things about how people look at them based on their own preconceived notions; ie some people assume that all western women are giving them dirty looks because that is their own prejudice coloring their attitudes.

It is very similar to people who come and can't speak thai and assume that all Thai people are saying bad things about them. Then, once they learn thai, they realize that, in general, it just isn't true and if they are even talking about them at all it isn't something nasty.

i haven't read this whole thread but wanted to comment on this- i agree... i had an awkward moment at the airport this morning. an older farang man with his thai wife and two mixed daughters. i was staring at them because i couldn't believe how gorgeous their family was- the girls had the beautiful skin and hair of thais but the facial structure of farangs... but the guy just sat scowling at me, apparently thinking i was staring in judgement of him with his thai lady. it was pretty insulting to me actually that he would think that off the bat.

Why didnt you intro yourself and comment how beautiful his daughters were. I think that would put him at ease.

[girlx]

yeah possibly i should have but i was too busy being offended that he was offended.

[alice]

I think it's a huge generalisation that Thai/western couples are always from vastly different socio/economic groups. Most of the men I see around central Sukhumvit with dark skinned Thai women (perceived by Thais to be low class) are rough as they come. Yes, poor in the west doesn't really equate to poor in Thailand, but my perception is a lot of the farangs in Thailand are as uneducated and uncultured as their Thai lady friends. The better looking, better educated farang men tend to be with the better looking, better educated Thai women.

[kerryk]

I think it's a huge generalisation that Thai/western couples are always from vastly different socio/economic groups. Most of the men I see around central Sukhumvit with dark skinned Thai women (perceived by Thais to be low class) are rough as they come. Yes, poor in the west doesn't really equate to poor in Thailand, but my perception is a lot of the farangs in Thailand are as uneducated and uncultured as their Thai lady friends. The better looking, better educated farang men tend to be with the better looking, better educated Thai women.

I have three BA’s and one Masters degree all from highly ranked universities. In my closet in the Western world were 20 Brooks Brothers suits, 120 Italian hand made ties, four tuxedos and one set of tails. My shirts were all custom made and my white underwear (which all of my wives turned pink), cost $10 a pair.

My Thai lady is at a Wat for the week to ensure good luck of a future business venture. She was a rice farmer and believes in ghosts. She called me to say she didn’t sleep the first night at the Wat because of the ghosts (it is a Wat that is locally famous for ghosts).

I left my closet of clothes in the West because I am not trying to impress anyone in Thailand. I don’t have to impress anyone. I don’t like beautiful women because I was married to three of them with nothing but grief as a result. I don’t care if a woman is educated or not. It seems to me that when dealing with education results are more important than degrees. My rice farmer girl has money in the bank and gold on her fingers and that is a result of hard work and she can cook and is a wonderful housekeeper.

I went out today unshaven, wearing flip flops, tee shirt and 270 baht shorts with a couple of her girlfriends that are assigned the task of keeping me company (read faithful) while she is gone. What would you have thought had you seen me?

I would submit to you that your views of uncultured and uneducated might be in error. It may be in error because you base your perceptions on surface views of culture and education.

[thohts]

I think it's a huge generalisation that Thai/western couples are always from vastly different socio/economic groups. Most of the men I see around central Sukhumvit with dark skinned Thai women (perceived by Thais to be low class) are rough as they come. Yes, poor in the west doesn't really equate to poor in Thailand, but my perception is a lot of the farangs in Thailand are as uneducated and uncultured as their Thai lady friends. The better looking, better educated farang men tend to be with the better looking, better educated Thai women.

I won't even comment on this BS.

(oops.. I just did!)

[phibunmike]

I think it's a huge generalisation that Thai/western couples are always from vastly different socio/economic groups. Most of the men I see around central Sukhumvit with dark skinned Thai women (perceived by Thais to be low class) are rough as they come. Yes, poor in the west doesn't really equate to poor in Thailand, but my perception is a lot of the farangs in Thailand are as uneducated and uncultured as their Thai lady friends. The better looking, better educated farang men tend to be with the better looking, better educated Thai women.

I won't even comment on this BS.

(oops.. I just did!)

The subject of generalisation is an interesting one. At times we all generalise, because it is useful and statistically relevant. Then when someone else generalises, but we do not share their point of view, we get on our high horses and say "but not ALL....".

This reminds me of a study done many years ago in the IT industry. A company wanted to understand user complaints, and commissioned the study. I can't remember the results exactly, but, basically, if a system failed 20% of the time, users described it as "never works", "always broken", etc. Descriptions that, were it not for the study, we would probably assume meant at the very least a 50% failure rate, and probably more like 80%. I wonder what percentage is required before we say things like "Thai girls are pretty", "Thai men are unfatihful", "Falang men leave their brain at home", "western women are..." etc. I wonder if there has ever been a study on this ???

(I have tried to be fair and share my examples around, but don't flame me - they are only examples of the statements we read on TV all the time).

edit>> when I say "all the time", what I mean, of course, is about 30 seconds every day :-)

Edited August 14, 2006 by phibunmike

[britmaveric]

I think it's a huge generalisation that Thai/western couples are always from vastly different socio/economic groups. Most of the men I see around central Sukhumvit with dark skinned Thai women (perceived by Thais to be low class) are rough as they come. Yes, poor in the west doesn't really equate to poor in Thailand, but my perception is a lot of the farangs in Thailand are as uneducated and uncultured as their Thai lady friends. The better looking, better educated farang men tend to be with the better looking, better educated Thai women.

I won't even comment on this BS.

(oops.. I just did!)

darker skinned ladies are uneducated and not beautiful????

[somchai jones]

I think it's a huge generalisation that Thai/western couples are always from vastly different socio/economic groups. Most of the men I see around central Sukhumvit with dark skinned Thai women (perceived by Thais to be low class) are rough as they come. Yes, poor in the west doesn't really equate to poor in Thailand, but my perception is a lot of the farangs in Thailand are as uneducated and uncultured as their Thai lady friends. The better looking, better educated farang men tend to be with the better looking, better educated Thai women.

I won't even comment on this BS.

(oops.. I just did!)

darker skinned ladies are uneducated and not beautiful????

My thoughts exactly, Britmaveric.

Also by posting this Alice, you've betrayed the fact that you are either uneducated yourself or not very bright.

You'll actually find that the more educated Thais don't think dark = uneducated, being educated, those Thais understand what a crass notion this is.

BTW, my wife is Malaysian, beautiful, educated and dark skinned.

I am educated and (IMHO) good looking!

I suggest you think a little before making future posts, Alice.

Chock Dee my friend.

[sbk]

Must be a city thing then because out here dark skinned does equate with poor and many of the Thai women I know bemoan their dark skin. Including the educated ones.

[LaReina]

pay you mony take your choice

What exactly was your point? Why didn't you post a pic of an attractive blak female, or is that your view of all black women? Fat with big boobs who are totally unattractive?

Oh I am sorry, I suppose there are no un-attractive women from the ethnic group of the female you posted below the black lady.

Besides that, I'll bet you are no Adonis.

[Mr Jones]

somebody said.

darker skinned ladies are uneducated and not beautiful????

I gave 2 pictures 1 a blue eyed black girl with bid boobs 2 a beautiful girl from asia.

it was a Comparison not a go at fat people or black people or any other ethnic group a Comparison to the above statement.

[sbk]

Yes, well both are inappropriate here thanks. You are welcome to make comments but please refrain from posting pics such as those. Thanks

[khunandy]

Thank you ,thank you, thank you

After reading this lot of crap I realised why I have no desire to return to the western country I used to call home.

For a minute there I imagined myself being absorbed into a intellectual discussion, something I had missed. Did I say missed? Not after reading some of the dribble here, please lord buddha, please leave me alone with my beautiful, honest and simple wife from Issan.

Please leave me be, away from over educated westerners hungry for verbal battle and their selfish hunger which appears to only be satiated when they have picked over the emotional bones of free thinking people.

All that was missing was the finger pointing and arm waving and self satisfied smirks across the dinner table.

Thanks again, it is back to Issan for me where the life is simple, a man can be a man and a women can be a women. Yes men, when a man goes hunting he wants to bag the best beast, when he grows crops he wants to grow the finest cabbage, when he takes a wife he wants women who excites him on many levels.

The level he soon grows weary with is the one where that ever hungry western female species lurks. There be trouble afoot.

Good luck to you all

[sbk]

Thank you ,thank you, thank you

After reading this lot of crap I realised why I have no desire to return to the western country I used to call home.

For a minute there I imagined myself being absorbed into a intellectual discussion, something I had missed. Did I say missed? Not after reading some of the dribble here, please lord buddha, please leave me alone with my beautiful, honest and simple wife from Issan.

Please leave me be, away from over educated westerners hungry for verbal battle and their selfish hunger which appears to only be satiated when they have picked over the emotional bones of free thinking people.

All that was missing was the finger pointing and arm waving and self satisfied smirks across the dinner table.

Thanks again, it is back to Issan for me where the life is simple, a man can be a man and a women can be a women. Yes men, when a man goes hunting he wants to bag the best beast, when he grows crops he wants to grow the finest cabbage, when he takes a wife he wants women who excites him on many levels.

The level he soon grows weary with is the one where that ever hungry western female species lurks. There be trouble afoot.

Good luck to you all

Yes, well, next time read the forum rules. If you don't like it here there is no need for you to post here or even read the threads here.

Don't let the door hit you in the ass on your way out

[Boo]

Yawn, good luck with that khunandy

[LaReina]

Thank you ,thank you, thank you

After reading this lot of crap I realised why I have no desire to return to the western country I used to call home.

For a minute there I imagined myself being absorbed into a intellectual discussion, something I had missed. Did I say missed? Not after reading some of the dribble here, please lord buddha, please leave me alone with my beautiful, honest and simple wife from Issan.

Please leave me be, away from over educated westerners hungry for verbal battle and their selfish hunger which appears to only be satiated when they have picked over the emotional bones of free thinking people.

All that was missing was the finger pointing and arm waving and self satisfied smirks across the dinner table.

Thanks again, it is back to Issan for me where the life is simple, a man can be a man and a women can be a women. Yes men, when a man goes hunting he wants to bag the best beast, when he grows crops he wants to grow the finest cabbage, when he takes a wife he wants women who excites him on many levels.

The level he soon grows weary with is the one where that ever hungry western female species lurks. There be trouble afoot.

Good luck to you all

*yawn*.. ja, ja, ja.

I'll bet those words of wisdom on your part would make a wonderful mothers day card, to that wonderful "western" woman who bore you and raised you. And heck, all the other "western" women who make up your family clan.

At least they will finally know just what you think about them and any relationships they might be in.

[tourleadersi]

Thank you ,thank you, thank you

After reading this lot of crap I realised why I have no desire to return to the western country I used to call home.

For a minute there I imagined myself being absorbed into a intellectual discussion, something I had missed. Did I say missed? Not after reading some of the dribble here, please lord buddha, please leave me alone with my beautiful, honest and simple wife from Issan.

Please leave me be, away from over educated westerners hungry for verbal battle and their selfish hunger which appears to only be satiated when they have picked over the emotional bones of free thinking people.

All that was missing was the finger pointing and arm waving and self satisfied smirks across the dinner table.

Thanks again, it is back to Issan for me where the life is simple, a man can be a man and a women can be a women. Yes men, when a man goes hunting he wants to bag the best beast, when he grows crops he wants to grow the finest cabbage, when he takes a wife he wants women who excites him on many levels.

The level he soon grows weary with is the one where that ever hungry western female species lurks. There be trouble afoot.

Good luck to you all

Mate can I congratulate you on an excellent piece of chest beating that sent all the western ladies running for their lives! You da man! I am so chuffed that you represent my 'half of the world' as you see it.

I can appreciate that you may have been burned by some western women prior to you finding your true self here in the LOS but to be honest you show a remarkable lack of understanding that a 0.0000001% sample is not an accurate representation of the whole group. Tell me, how do you feel about Thai women? Are they ALL sweet innocent little play kittens? Or are they ALL something else? If you are happy to put all western women into one group then why stop there? All Germans are Nazis, all Japanese are kamikazes blah blah blah.

To walk in here and write something like that alludes to why perhaps you were burned by a few western women. You offer the ladies here good luck. In my opinion they're not the ones who need the luck.

Learn to accept that every person is different and judge them on their merits or lack thereof. That way you would be able to walk in to every encounter as a nice friendly non judgemental person. All of my friends back home are married to western women. I would like to be able to praise their intelligence (my male friends that is) in being able to find the only decent 5 women in all of England. The fact of the matter is that my friends are good, respectable men, and their wives are responding in kind. You reap what you sow, but you would know that already as you now live on a farm.

And finally if a thread is boring you, it is not a great sign of prowess to then write a long diatribe about that very fact!

[thohts]

Yes, well, next time read the forum rules. If you don't like it here there is no need for you to post here or even read the threads here.

Don't let the door hit you in the ass on your way out

For a "moderator", quite a few of your posts are quite rude (especially when you're stating the obvious, there is no need to say something like "Don't let the door hit you in the ass on your way out ")

Yes, I know it's my opinion. What have you got to say?

[somchai jones]

Must be a city thing then because out here dark skinned does equate with poor and many of the Thai women I know bemoan their dark skin. Including the educated ones.

Ho hum....if you read my post, you'll see that I didn't mention poor anywhere. I said that educated Thais know that dark skinned = uneducated is a crass notion.

You've actually proved that dark skin doesn't equal uneducated because you've mentioned your thai friends who have dark skin.

Of course I'm aware that many Thais would like lighter skins. This is not just a Thai thing , but apparant in many Asian countries.

e.g. in Malaysia dark skin is not associated with being uneducated but many Malays, including the educated ones (including my wife) say they'd like lighter skin.

The educated Malays of course know that being dark doesn't really mean you are lacking intellectualy in any way. Indeed the ex Prime Minister Mohd. Mahatir frequently told Malays and others from the developing world to be proud of their brown skin.

Ultimately, my friend, it's human nature. How many white skinned Europeans/Americans/etc. would love to have darker skin.

I ridicule my stunniningly beautiful wife when she is the only one in a European Street on a sunny day carrying an umbrella, just as she ridicules me for always choosing the table without shade when we eat outside a restaurant.

It's a funy old world........Chock Dee my friend.

[jdinasia]

Skin tone?

well ... watch the people you see in businesses and companies all over the country! North South and Central ... Banks and offices etcare highly populated by lighter skinned Thais.

Good or bad ... that is the way it tends to be in Thailand

[somchai jones]

Skin tone?

well ... watch the people you see in businesses and companies all over the country! North South and Central ... Banks and offices etcare highly populated by lighter skinned Thais.

Good or bad ... that is the way it tends to be in Thailand

Most local banks I've been into in the South have more dark skinned than light skinned workers.

I do understand what you're trying to say though.

[Huckenfell]

Must be a city thing then because out here dark skinned does equate with poor and many of the Thai women I know bemoan their dark skin. Including the educated ones.

Yep ! You might be right there, my GF is 25 Dark skinned from Mukdaharn and uni educated. She often tells me that she is not so pretty because of her dark skin, but i think she is beautiful.

[sbk]

Sorry somchai, I must be having difficulty communicating lately. Where I live, poor does mean uneducated.

My husband has been criticised for having dark skin. My Uni educated Thai neighbor woman has told me that she gets criticised for having dark skin. So, to say that educated people don't equate that may be true but you can't say it is true for all Thai people.

Maybe its just the uneducated poor ones who think so.

[somchai jones]

Sorry somchai, I must be having difficulty communicating lately. Where I live, poor does mean uneducated.

My husband has been criticised for having dark skin. My Uni educated Thai neighbor woman has told me that she gets criticised for having dark skin. So, to say that educated people don't equate that may be true but you can't say it is true for all Thai people.

Maybe its just the uneducated poor ones who think so.

Point taken SBK. I agree with your last statement.