Atheism - alive and well in Thailand?

[csabo]

The virgin birth is the one that really throws me. How can anyone believe in that?

I doubt it's impossible. Just very, very rare. Scientists refer to it as "parthenogenesis" and it can be induced in the laboratory fairly readily. The only problem with Jesus being a product of parthenogenesis is that he was male. All parthenogenetic mammals are female, having two X chromosomes.

How do you know he/she was referring to Jesus and not The Buddha? Or Horus even?

[csabo]

The fundamental difference between different religions and Buddism is that Buddism is not regarded as a religion, it is a philosofy.

Yet ones who follow are referred to as religious not philosophers.

[borrfors]

Im an atheist but have no need to advertise the fact , certainly wouldn't choose to socialise with a group purely because they were non religious. Actually I find many vocal atheists rather smug , though on balance I prefer smug to sectarian slaughter !

I agree fully with your posting. I also mwould like to quote the late and great Graucho Marx, who was invited to join a society. He replied to the offer with this genious answer:

-No thanks, I would never dream of becoming a member of a society that would have me as a member...

[fittobethaied]

"Religion = oppression of others"

Yes, Yes! For God's sake stop telling me what I can and cannot do (as long as I don't hurt others). I'm not a child.

The Apostle Paul's exhortation to the believers in Corinth:

1 Corinthians 6

12 “I have the right to do anything,” you say—but not everything is beneficial. “I have the right to do anything”—but I will not be mastered by anything. 13 You say, “Food for the stomach and the stomach for food, and God will destroy them both.” The body, however, is not meant for sexual immorality but for the Lord, and the Lord for the body.14 By his power God raised the Lord from the dead, and he will raise us also. 15 Do you not know that your bodies are members of Christ himself? Shall I then take the members of Christ and unite them with a prostitute? Never! 16 Do you not know that he who unites himself with a prostitute is one with her in body? For it is said, “The two will become one flesh.”[b] 17 But whoever is united with the Lord is one with him in spirit.[c]

18 Flee from sexual immorality. All other sins a person commits are outside the body, but whoever sins sexually, sins against their own body. 19 Do you not know that your bodies are temples of the Holy Spirit, who is in you, whom you have received from God? You are not your own; 20 you were bought at a price. Therefore honor God with your bodies.

[KarenBravo]

The Apostle Paul's exhortation to the believers in Corinth:

1 Corinthians 6

12 “I have the right to do anything,” you say—but not everything is beneficial. “I have the right to do anything”—but I will not be mastered by anything. 13 You say, “Food for the stomach and the stomach for food, and God will destroy them both.” The body, however, is not meant for sexual immorality but for the Lord, and the Lord for the body.14 By his power God raised the Lord from the dead, and he will raise us also. 15 Do you not know that your bodies are members of Christ himself? Shall I then take the members of Christ and unite them with a prostitute? Never! 16 Do you not know that he who unites himself with a prostitute is one with her in body? For it is said, “The two will become one flesh.”[b] 17 But whoever is united with the Lord is one with him in spirit.[c]

18 Flee from sexual immorality. All other sins a person commits are outside the body, but whoever sins sexually, sins against their own body. 19 Do you not know that your bodies are temples of the Holy Spirit, who is in you, whom you have received from God? You are not your own; 20 you were bought at a price. Therefore honor God with your bodies.

Cobblers!

[fittobethaied]

Well, no that's not true at all. I know plenty of muslims and none of them think or act that way. They're just normal folk- my best mate is a muslim and I'd struggle to name a smarter person I know, able to debate cheerfully and see both sides of the argument.

Dunno, maybe moslims are something different that I've never come across. Moslims who hate jews and catholics but hate intelligent people even more. Like intelligent people who spell good.

I would totally agree that on a whole Muslims are the one's who dislike atheists the most. I spend lot of time in middle-east.

Seems they take it very personally and would rather have a christian or even a Jew.

I would have a lot of trouble calling anyone smart who really believes totally in whatever religion they subscribe too.

Educated maybe-smart , no.

If for example a Muslim/Christian truly and utterly believes in what is written in the Qur'an/bible they cannot be called "smart'.

They have opted,usually because they have been brain washed at young age ( Muslims are very guilty of this) to suspend all forms of rational logic to belief in things we all know is absurdly wrong-and yet they cling to it.

Smart people do not cling like that.

They see the evidence and go where it leads. They do not cling using the weakest/lamest forms of excuses/logic/rational

They get angry quickly because that is all they can do.

As for locals, well, there is no religion here really,its a bare resemblance of what Buddhism is really all about.A philosophy that because a religion to suit the agenda of those who stil use it today to control the masses.

1 Corinthians 1:18-31New International Version (NIV) Christ Crucified Is God’s Power and Wisdom

18 For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God. 19 For it is written:

“I will destroy the wisdom of the wise;

the intelligence of the intelligent I will frustrate.”[a]

20 Where is the wise person? Where is the teacher of the law? Where is the philosopher of this age? Has not God made foolish the wisdom of the world? 21 For since in the wisdom of God the world through its wisdom did not know him, God was pleased through the foolishness of what was preached to save those who believe. 22 Jews demand signs and Greeks look for wisdom, 23 but we preach Christ crucified: a stumbling block to Jews and foolishness to Gentiles, 24 but to those whom God has called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God and the wisdom of God. 25 For the foolishness of God is wiser than human wisdom, and the weakness of God is stronger than human strength.

26 Brothers and sisters, think of what you were when you were called. Not many of you were wise by human standards; not many were influential; not many were of noble birth. 27 But God chose the foolish things of the world to shame the wise; God chose the weak things of the world to shame the strong. 28 God chose the lowly things of this world and the despised things—and the things that are not—to nullify the things that are, 29 so that no one may boast before him. 30 It is because of him that you are in Christ Jesus, who has become for us wisdom from God—that is, our righteousness,holiness and redemption. 31 Therefore, as it is written: “Let the one who boasts boast in the Lord.”[b]

[AyG]

The virgin birth is the one that really throws me. How can anyone believe in that?

I doubt it's impossible. Just very, very rare. Scientists refer to it as "parthenogenesis" and it can be induced in the laboratory fairly readily. The only problem with Jesus being a product of parthenogenesis is that he was male. All parthenogenetic mammals are female, having two X chromosomes.

How do you know he/she was referring to Jesus and not The Buddha? Or Horus even?

From the context of the original quote.

Definitely not the Lord Buddha. He wasn't of virgin birth. His mother was Queen Maha Maya, and his father Śuddhodana.

[KarenBravo]

1 Corinthians 1:18-31New International Version (NIV) Christ Crucified Is God’s Power and Wisdom

18 For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God. 19 For it is written:

“I will destroy the wisdom of the wise;

the intelligence of the intelligent I will frustrate.”[a]

20 Where is the wise person? Where is the teacher of the law? Where is the philosopher of this age? Has not God made foolish the wisdom of the world? 21 For since in the wisdom of God the world through its wisdom did not know him, God was pleased through the foolishness of what was preached to save those who believe. 22 Jews demand signs and Greeks look for wisdom, 23 but we preach Christ crucified: a stumbling block to Jews and foolishness to Gentiles, 24 but to those whom God has called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God and the wisdom of God. 25 For the foolishness of God is wiser than human wisdom, and the weakness of God is stronger than human strength.

26 Brothers and sisters, think of what you were when you were called. Not many of you were wise by human standards; not many were influential; not many were of noble birth. 27 But God chose the foolish things of the world to shame the wise; God chose the weak things of the world to shame the strong. 28 God chose the lowly things of this world and the despised things—and the things that are not—to nullify the things that are, 29 so that no one may boast before him. 30 It is because of him that you are in Christ Jesus, who has become for us wisdom from God—that is, our righteousness,holiness and redemption. 31 Therefore, as it is written: “Let the one who boasts boast in the Lord.”[b]

More cobblers!

[attrayant]

The fundamental difference between different religions and Buddism is that Buddism is not regarded as a religion, it is a philosofy.

But it still embraces a lot of magical thinking. That's just as bad in my opinion.

[Emster23]

I am an American agnostic atheist. IF there was evidence provided meeting scientific criteria for proof of God, I would accept that. Highly unlikely, but I would not cling to disbelief in face of evidence. Given none has been presented to date, you could say I am 99.9% atheist.

" What has science ever created?" was asked. Was he serious? I don't know of any religious book with instructions on how to make computers, internet and all that technology that allows poster to ask such a question. Mind boggling. The universe as being discovered and figured out by science is far more awe inspiring than any simple myth story. I wish the religious would only use technology from the time their holy books were written. Riding camels into Twin Towers would have caused no problem. Technology plus fanatics is just too dangerous a combination given they have no limits as to what they will do because their god supposedly tells them to do it.

"Only a typically brainwashed American could attribute an epithet such as "Give me a child until he's seven years old, and I'll have him for life." to a ridiculous right-wing fellow countryman who made a fortune out of religious televangelism whilst deriding Labor Unions, the Anti Apartheid Movement, Gays, and almost every other cause. The phrase most likely originated with St. Ignatius of Loyola, the founder of the Jesuits. " Ah, had to work that American bashing in somewhere.... I wish it were true only Americans could be this brainwashed, but seems to be all too common around world.

Look at hot spots, places people getting killed in numbers in current world. All except Ukraine seem to have major religious component to them.

I strongly suggest book by Chris Hitchens "God is not Great: How religion poisons everything". Also lots of him and Richard Dawkins on youtube.

[csabo]

The virgin birth is the one that really throws me. How can anyone believe in that?

I doubt it's impossible. Just very, very rare. Scientists refer to it as "parthenogenesis" and it can be induced in the laboratory fairly readily. The only problem with Jesus being a product of parthenogenesis is that he was male. All parthenogenetic mammals are female, having two X chromosomes.

How do you know he/she was referring to Jesus and not The Buddha? Or Horus even?

From the context of the original quote.

Definitely not the Lord Buddha. He wasn't of virgin birth. His mother was Queen Maha Maya, and his father Śuddhodana.

There is nothing inferring Jesus in the context of the orinal quote. An account of the Buddha immaculate conception is found in the Buddhacarita. The spirit of the Buddha appeared to Queen Maya, and entered her womb, causing an immaculate conception of sorts.

[thatguy]

The Dalai Lama jokes that he is the worlds most famous atheist. As Buddhism has no god, we leave it to those who wish to discuss head of pin dancing whether it is a religion or a philosophy.

[csabo]

I am an American agnostic atheist. IF there was evidence provided meeting scientific criteria for proof of God, I would accept that. Highly unlikely, but I would not cling to disbelief in face of evidence. Given none has been presented to date, you could say I am 99.9% atheist.

" What has science ever created?" was asked. Was he serious? I don't know of any religious book with instructions on how to make computers, internet and all that technology that allows poster to ask such a question. Mind boggling. The universe as being discovered and figured out by science is far more awe inspiring than any simple myth story. I wish the religious would only use technology from the time their holy books were written. Riding camels into Twin Towers would have caused no problem. Technology plus fanatics is just too dangerous a combination given they have no limits as to what they will do because their god supposedly tells them to do it.

"Only a typically brainwashed American could attribute an epithet such as "Give me a child until he's seven years old, and I'll have him for life." to a ridiculous right-wing fellow countryman who made a fortune out of religious televangelism whilst deriding Labor Unions, the Anti Apartheid Movement, Gays, and almost every other cause. The phrase most likely originated with St. Ignatius of Loyola, the founder of the Jesuits. " Ah, had to work that American bashing in somewhere.... I wish it were true only Americans could be this brainwashed, but seems to be all too common around world.

Look at hot spots, places people getting killed in numbers in current world. All except Ukraine seem to have major religious component to them.

I strongly suggest book by Chris Hitchens "God is not Great: How religion poisons everything". Also lots of him and Richard Dawkins on youtube.

By your own description you are an agnostic ( non believer until proven otherwise. Not an athiest (outright non believer). You can't be an "agnostic athiest". Don't worry though, your still smarter than all the theists combined!

[Frank James]

Personal opinion only, but the fact you have to join a group of those who proclaim they don't believe in anything tells volumes about your insecurity in just being yourself.

Seriously, why would you want to "join" a group of avowed non-believers anyhow.

And, also why would you "need" to assert your "non-belief" to others to try to convert them.

Frankly, non of it matters anyhow.

Why do you insist on proving you are right?

Think about it.

>>>don't believe in anything: we trust in logic and science, we have no need to "believe"

>>>insecurity: ??? quite the opposite, no need for a god to give us security

>>>convert / non of it matters: Yes it matters, religion has caused so much suffering - not only religion of course, but ALL BELIEVES, such as communism, free market, racism, male superiority, nationalism, militarism.

I detect a great deal of insecurity in atheists. Somewhat like the fundamentalist religionist they disdain, they seem to feel the need to parade their militant disbelief. I see this more and more now, with people like Christopher Hitchens (R.I.P.). Richard Dawkins, and Bill Maher. OK, you REALLY don't believe in any sort of power greater than yourself. But you have created a religion of your own.

Live and let live.

[Alwyn]

Well, no that's not true at all. I know plenty of muslims and none of them think or act that way. They're just normal folk- my best mate is a muslim and I'd struggle to name a smarter person I know, able to debate cheerfully and see both sides of the argument.

Dunno, maybe moslims are something different that I've never come across. Moslims who hate jews and catholics but hate intelligent people even more. Like intelligent people who spell good.

What's not true?

[Alwyn]

Personal opinion only, but the fact you have to join a group of those who proclaim they don't believe in anything tells volumes about your insecurity in just being yourself.

Seriously, why would you want to "join" a group of avowed non-believers anyhow.

And, also why would you "need" to assert your "non-belief" to others to try to convert them.

Frankly, non of it matters anyhow.

Why do you insist on proving you are right?

Think about it.

>>>don't believe in anything: we trust in logic and science, we have no need to "believe"

>>>insecurity: ??? quite the opposite, no need for a god to give us security

>>>convert / non of it matters: Yes it matters, religion has caused so much suffering - not only religion of course, but ALL BELIEVES, such as communism, free market, racism, male superiority, nationalism, militarism.

I detect a great deal of insecurity in atheists. Somewhat like the fundamentalist religionist they disdain, they seem to feel the need to parade their militant disbelief. I see this more and more now, with people like Christopher Hitchens (R.I.P.). Richard Dawkins, and Bill Maher. OK, you REALLY don't believe in any sort of power greater than yourself. But you have created a religion of your own.

Live and let live.

Why do you assume atheists have disdain for fundamentalist religions? I'm an atheist, I do believe in any religions, I do not believe there is a one God, nor lot's of God. I have no disdain for the religions nor the people that do believe, I just don't care because it's none of my business what you or others believe in. I live and let live - hardly "disdain". In my experience the disdain comes from the believers who think they are morally superior and think non-believers go somewhere different to them once their lives are finished. The biggest disdain coming from the Islamic people who have disdain for people that follow other religions too!!

[DavoTheGun]

Personal opinion only, but the fact you have to join a group of those who proclaim they don't believe in anything tells volumes about your insecurity in just being yourself.

Seriously, why would you want to "join" a group of avowed non-believers anyhow.

And, also why would you "need" to assert your "non-belief" to others to try to convert them.

Frankly, non of it matters anyhow.

Why do you insist on proving you are right?

Think about it.

Why are you trying to start a non sense fight here?

An Atheist talking to Theist is like Duck talking to Cat, can't agree on anything as there is no logical common ground.

Atheists are usually feel discriminated among conservative religious people so just like you gather in church, it makes sense to socialize with other logical entities thinking the same way we do. Don't confuse thinking with belief. One requires logic, the other requires blind faith.

Absolutely True Indeed!!

[noahvail]

We are all atheists, for at least 99.9% of gods.

Some of us go one god further.

Hitchens, I think?

The actual quote is:

We are all atheists about most of the gods that humanity has ever believed in. Some of us just go one god further.

-Richard Dawkins

[troysantos]

I am a Catholic

Being married 26 years to a true Buddhist ( no superstition etc..) Thai wife I bless the day that she came into my life and I believe there will be a place in heaven also for her and her 84 year old mother.

For me, I associate believing in a heaven (and possibly a hell) and superstition. It's a belief that I don't know how to articulate. Just a belief that I haven't let go of!

[Rumblecat]

Well, no that's not true at all. I know plenty of muslims and none of them think or act that way. They're just normal folk- my best mate is a muslim and I'd struggle to name a smarter person I know, able to debate cheerfully and see both sides of the argument.

Dunno, maybe moslims are something different that I've never come across. Moslims who hate jews and catholics but hate intelligent people even more. Like intelligent people who spell good.

What's not true?

The mods must have deleted the post I was replying too - just some drivel about how "moslims" hate jews and catholics but hate intelligent people even more.

Kind of wish they wouldn't delete stuff like this. Plus it ruined my fairly decent "intelligent people who spell good" joke.

[johnopolo]

Pay attention to what's happening in the sciences and you may well come to a similar realisation.

Not only is the universe stranger than we imagine, it is stranger than we can imagine. Sir Arthur Eddington
English astronomer (1882 - 1944)

[Frank James]

Jackie Mason once said:

"I used to be an atheist, but I gave it up. No holidays!"

[GuyL]

We are all atheists, for at least 99.9% of gods.

Some of us go one god further.

Hitchens, I think?

The actual quote is:

We are all atheists about most of the gods that humanity has ever believed in. Some of us just go one god further.

-Richard Dawkins

No, the actual Stephen F. Roberts' popular quotation is: "I contend that we are both atheists. I just believe in one fewer god than you do. When you understand why you dismiss all the other possible gods, you will understand why I dismiss yours."

[frollywolly]

My atheist friends always seem to gravitate to science as the answer to all man's problems...forget religion...it is for dreamers...

Yet...none seem to have an answer when presented the question...what has science ever created...?

Scientists fashion and manipulate resources which are already created...they can create nothing...which begs the question...who did create all substance and matter...?

Secular humanism...no God...humans are the center of the universe...is their answer...REALLY?

I love it when a poster really nails it like this. CHECK MATE ATHEISTS!!! 555

What the?????

Nailed what????

This post just reminds me to go and watch one of my favorite comedies: 'Dumb and Dumber'

[pitrevie]

The virgin birth is the one that really throws me. How can anyone believe in that?

I doubt it's impossible. Just very, very rare. Scientists refer to it as "parthenogenesis" and it can be induced in the laboratory fairly readily. The only problem with Jesus being a product of parthenogenesis is that he was male. All parthenogenetic mammals are female, having two X chromosomes.

I think that the virgin birth story came out of the gospels that were written later. Also it seemingly contradicts the fact that Jesus had an older brother James.

[dotpoom]

I meet with a group of people 3 or 4 times every week who have recovered from terminal illnesses through a belief in a power greater than themselves that could restore their health, because everything else had failed..... like the medical profession, family and friends and religion. We call that power whatever we like...words and names are just labels. We meet to show others, who are usually feeling the same as we used to...hopelessly demoralized ... and have the same illness...... how we came to find that power. Very positive meetings indeed and have saved millions of lives all over the world.

I can't imagine a more negative act than a bunch of people meeting together on a regular basis to discuss the non-existence of something greater than themselves in all the universes and in all the galaxies.. Would I be forgiven for thinking that one of the requirements for membership would be to have one hell of a hugh ego..

Edited August 16, 2014 by dotpoom

[Nepal4me]

My atheist friends always seem to gravitate to science as the answer to all man's problems...forget religion...it is for dreamers...

Yet...none seem to have an answer when presented the question...what has science ever created...?

Scientists fashion and manipulate resources which are already created...they can create nothing...which begs the question...who did create all substance and matter...?

Secular humanism...no God...humans are the center of the universe...is their answer...REALLY?

I love it when a poster really nails it like this. CHECK MATE ATHEISTS!!! 555

And who has created everything ? What do we know about a creator ? Nothing at all, that's why we create our creators to our liking.

And we are very creative in creating creators, that's why we have created so many of them. How many different ones in Christianity ? How many in Islam ?

Check mate, who ?

Max, it was a joke..... as suggested by my 555 aka lol.

ggt is a troll and I responded, something I rarely do but religion is so <deleted> idiotic, it just jumped out at me.

[KarenBravo]

The virgin birth is the one that really throws me. How can anyone believe in that?

I doubt it's impossible. Just very, very rare. Scientists refer to it as "parthenogenesis" and it can be induced in the laboratory fairly readily. The only problem with Jesus being a product of parthenogenesis is that he was male. All parthenogenetic mammals are female, having two X chromosomes.

I think that the virgin birth story came out of the gospels that were written later. Also it seemingly contradicts the fact that Jesus had an older brother James.

No, it was nicked from another religion (like so much of Christianity). The god Mithras from Zoroastrianism and later adopted by the Romans was also born of a virgin.

Christianity has many examples of "making" Christianity acceptable to the Romans, who were the rulers of all the lands that Christians lived. It was a tactic to make Christianity not only survive, but, flourish amongst the rulers.

The 25th December was the biggest Roman holiday of all, called Saturnalia in honour of the God, Saturn. It was a time of feasting, drinking and giving presents to family and friends. Sound familiar?

Edited August 16, 2014 by KarenBravo

[Don Aleman]

I think maybe, probably, I am one of those if it means not believing in, basically anything or anyone, to salvage my life. I recall being a Catholic for about 50 years and praying, ( begging), for some bad things to go away and , you know, they didn't, they actually got worse so I quit.

I have discovered that although alcohol and excessive sex do not "make bad things go away" , they do take my mind off them, - bad things that is ! I recently read the comment of a person who survived a horrid crash and he said, " God saved me" but,....... if that were true, why didn't God save the other 34 people ?

[csabo]

Jackie Mason once said:

"I used to be an atheist, but I gave it up. No holidays!"

Penn Jillette once said:

"Everyday is and atheist holiday"