Kremlin hits back at Thai Immigration's out-in visa ban

[BirdsandBooze]

The almost hassle free answer, as ever, is play by the rules and obtain the correct visa or choose another destination. It's that simple.

[happysanook]

So how exactly is the Russian government 'hitting back'? What a piece of garbage journalism.

I have to agree. Trash and beyond misleading. It should have read "Kremlin comments on...". Hits back literally and figuratively means doing something in retaliation.

[orosee]

So how exactly is the Russian government 'hitting back'? What a piece of garbage journalism.

Need some glasses?

According to Paragraph 1 of a bilateral intergovernmental agreement [between Russia and Thailand], Russian tourists are allowed to enter Thailand for up to 30 days, after which they must leave the country, [but] the number of entries is not limited.

i.e. they can do in and outs as many times as they wish.

Yeah that's not what most people understand when they read "hit back."

That's like literally getting hit in the face and "retaliating" by saying "you're not supposed to do that."

So the poster is quite right, a sensationalist headline with nothing to back it up in the text. Garbage journalism.

[rayw]

Watch out Thailand. Putin might annex Thailand next!

Joking apart, Putin NEVER force annexed Crimea, the Crimean people massively voted with some 85+% democratically in favour of annexing to Russia, let us all try to remember that. Facts that can be checked rather than the utter crap reported in the western presstitute media. I am neither pro Russia nor particularly now pro America either, but I do like to see some truth which is not what we are being dangerously and stupidly fed from Washington it seems these days !!!!!!!!!! I suppose if you feed folk enough false rubbish for long enough then many of course start believing it.

Personally it should be quite fair and simple, in that you should not discriminate against any race, creed, culture or religion, you judge each individual person's case on it's merits and honesty. Sure tourist visas were NEVER intended for use to stay, live and/or work in Thailand, get used to that as that is all that is now being enforced.

Only thing I will add is what I always say, is that I feel this good and sensible Government we now have here should maybe consider non-immigrant long stay visas like OA for those under 50 who can meet a reasonable financial requirement similar to what retirees over 50 now have to do. So at least folk who have made enough money to retire to Thailand at say 40 should be able to do so legally, provided they meet a predefined laid down requirement, like maybe over a million Baht income or bank account balance, or maybe more than that. Whatever figure is felt reasonable by the Thai immigration authorities for anyone to retire here at a younger age. This would not only bring valuable income into Thailand but also avoid any need and temptation for those folk under 50 to have to try to break the immigration rules just to stay here and all the massive policing complications that causes.

[BudRight]

I'm glad to see at least one government taking Thailand to task for violating its treaty obligations.

You other posters are making to much of the IO's authority to refuse entry to anyone, especially as you are acting as if such a system is really wonderful and everywhere should be like that.

No other country, except perhaps Chad, allows all discretion to fall to the IO involved. In the often derided US, refusal to subject to review by a superior and a reason is usually given.

Thailand isn't the US.

You can't compare Thailand to the US when Thailand compares favorably and then say 'Oh no, Thailand isn't the US' when it compares unfavorably.

Either;

1. Thailand is just a country in the world and should be evaluated in comparison to those other countries.

2. Thailand is exceptional and should be evaluated based on internal rather than external factors.

If you pick #1 than the Kremlin is right to criticize the in/out crackdown as being in violation of Thailand's treaty obligations.

If you pick #2 than I never want to hear again that Thailand is easy to get into and stay compared to the US, or the UK or some other place. Or that beer is cheap because in Norway it costs 10 times as much. Or that no reasonable person would expect to be able to turn up in the West and disregard local laws like Westerners (and Thais) do with regularity in Thailand, especially not overstay their visas or work illegally.

3. Thailand is Thailand and should not be compared to any other country. It is what it is in just the same way that Colombia and Yemen are what they are. If you chose to leave your homeland and live somewhere else you have no right to be surprised when that somewhere else is not the same as the place you left whether it compares favourably or not to the place you left.

That's the same as #2. Thank you for your choice.

[SteveFong]

once past 50, the retirement visa is the most likely to cause the least amount of hassle,

I recommend requesting a new passport, if there are many re-entries, even if you have half your pages left to stamp as it eliminates many questions

[HUAHIN62]

In international relations there is a rule that boils down to tit for tat (if one country change entry rules for another country's citizens, that country can return the favor). Thailand has now done the tat and Russia will do their tit.

[GAZZPA]

So how exactly is the Russian government 'hitting back'?

Well, they are saying "Citizens of the Russian Federation do not...fall under the new rules." So Russia feels that their citizens should be able to exit and re-enter Thailand as often as they like with no limit on the number of back-to-back visa exempt entries.

yes, thats exactly what they are saying. The agreement between the 2 governments does not specify a limit,, thats the whole point.

Many countries have this arrangement and people hop over the boarder and return, Thailand is not unique. The issue is that Thailand is allegedly trying to deal with illegal workers in Thailand. I personally don't think it is a huge issue and it is just another xenophobic response from Thailand.

The illegal workers that are here in abundance are from neighbouring countries, you only have to see the workers in the factories to realise that.

People from the West and Russia are not flocking to Thailand for work, at least thats what I think, they simply want to stay long term in the country so they do what is legal thing,, which is hopping over the boarder and coming back to extend their stay, as long as they are not working I see no issue with this.

[whybother]

once past 50, the retirement visa is the most likely to cause the least amount of hassle,

I recommend requesting a new passport, if there are many re-entries, even if you have half your pages left to stamp as it eliminates many questions

No country's immigration identifies you only on your passport number. If you change your passport, you will still have the same name, same date and place of birth, and the same sex.

That will be enough to accurately identify you in their system, and see how many times you have entered and on what visa.

[baboon]

good to see a western country standing up for it's citizens

wish mine would

Russia is in the west? I guess I shouldn't judge my Thai students too harshly for thinking New York is in England.

Yes, slightly less than half of Russia, including Moscow and St. Petersburg, is in Europe, which is definitely "the west", the bigger chunk is in Asia however.

There is a New York in England, near Harrogate North Yorkshire. Your Thai students are clearly better informed than their teacher *

SDM

* Sarcastic joke, offense not intended.

There is a New York in north Tyneside too.

Would the students be wrong though if they said the Sphinx and the Eiffel tower are in Las Vegas?

[Sena Dave]

I'd be careful if i were General , sorry PM P. The Russians could well back the Russian speaking separatists in Pattaya

[monkeycountry]

Putin gonna invade Thailand too?

Seems to me he already is.

Step 1: Make sure there are more Russians than Thais in Thailand (this step is already halfway completed).

Step 2: Enforce a public vote (incl. the Russians in Thailand) to see if Thailand should be part of Russia or independent.

[metisdead]

Off topic posts and replies have been removed.

[Tatsujin]

So how exactly is the Russian government 'hitting back'? What a piece of garbage journalism.

Need some glasses?

According to Paragraph 1 of a bilateral intergovernmental agreement [between Russia and Thailand], Russian tourists are allowed to enter Thailand for up to 30 days, after which they must leave the country, [but] the number of entries is not limited.

i.e. they can do in and outs as many times as they wish.

Yeah that's not what most people understand when they read "hit back."

That's like literally getting hit in the face and "retaliating" by saying "you're not supposed to do that."

So the poster is quite right, a sensationalist headline with nothing to back it up in the text. Garbage journalism.

OK, let's get this straight. For you, "hitting back" is a literal thing, not figuratively.

In "Diplomacy", publicly pointing out inaccuracies in what the people on the opposite side think/say/do IS "hitting back".

For you, "hitting back" means Putin should invade and annex Thailand in response to the Thai's ignoring a clause in an agreement made between the two countries? Is that right? Is that "hitting back" enough?

[AYJAYDEE]

Watch out Thailand. Putin might annex Thailand next!

Joking apart, Putin NEVER force annexed Crimea, the Crimean people massively voted with some 85+% democratically in favour of annexing to Russia, let us all try to remember that. Facts that can be checked rather than the utter crap reported in the western presstitute media. I am neither pro Russia nor particularly now pro America either, but I do like to see some truth which is not what we are being dangerously and stupidly fed from Washington it seems these days !!!!!!!!!! I suppose if you feed folk enough false rubbish for long enough then many of course start believing it.

Personally it should be quite fair and simple, in that you should not discriminate against any race, creed, culture or religion, you judge each individual person's case on it's merits and honesty. Sure tourist visas were NEVER intended for use to stay, live and/or work in Thailand, get used to that as that is all that is now being enforced.

Only thing I will add is what I always say, is that I feel this good and sensible Government we now have here should maybe consider non-immigrant long stay visas like OA for those under 50 who can meet a reasonable financial requirement similar to what retirees over 50 now have to do. So at least folk who have made enough money to retire to Thailand at say 40 should be able to do so legally, provided they meet a predefined laid down requirement, like maybe over a million Baht income or bank account balance, or maybe more than that. Whatever figure is felt reasonable by the Thai immigration authorities for anyone to retire here at a younger age. This would not only bring valuable income into Thailand but also avoid any need and temptation for those folk under 50 to have to try to break the immigration rules just to stay here and all the massive policing complications that causes.

who said anything about crimea?

[spectrumisgreen]

good to see a western country standing up for it's citizens

wish mine would

I want my country to 'stand up' for me if I'm being mistreated abroad and have done nothing to deserve it. Thailand can let in and kick out whoever it wants from its own country. As long as other nationals are not being abused or mistreated while they are here, then 'sticking up for its citizens' by anyone else about what the visa or any other regulations should be is basically null and void as its not their business! I wish my country (England) would stand up for its citizens, first and foremost IN England, from all the 'horror stories I keep reading about and hearing, as opposed to those who come in and DEMAND special rights. NO-ONE has a right to demand special treatment in another's country. This is something the Thais, and many other countries, do naturally tend towards, their OWN over other incoming nationals (although I do find if I act with due respect here then I am too am afforded general fairness and respect back from the authorities).. 'My House, My Rules'.. is what it all boils down to. As long as the rules are clear to be seen and there for everyone and not simply disrespectful or draconian, then is that such a bad thing?

[BwindiBoy]

In my opinion the whole point of this issue is IF the wording of the treaty agreement between Russia and Thailand is as presented ... “According to Paragraph 1 of a bilateral intergovernmental agreement [between Russia and Thailand], Russian tourists are allowed to enter Thailand for up to 30 days, after which they must leave the country, [but] the number of entries is not limited.” ... then Thailand is unilaterally reneging on the treaty without any formal discussion between the parties.

But it remains to be seen that in that referenced treaty the wording "...[but] the number of entries is not limited.”... is really there or not ... or was it just implied or inferred because no wording was including prohibiting numerous entries or otherwise limiting the number.

Even if the treat is as claimed, I doubt much could be done about it - except to stop allowing all tourist from Russia to visit Thailand. If there was enough economic impact then Thailand might change its mind. Or if Russia is supplying other services or loans or energy ... then Russia would have some sway in the matter. Or it might be that such publicity only adds to the dismal Public Relations Thailand is currently projecting and things will change.

But with Russians and all others ... I find it incongruous that Thai Immigration suddenly starts to enforce an old dusty law that they had not been enforced at all for many years ... and even facilitated the comings and goings of people across borders doing ridiculous border runs / visa runs - making the ins and outs totally allowed - and now not only wants to begin enforcement but call those who availed themselves of the NON ENFORCEMENT in past years abusers or worse ... Amazing Thailand... TiT... (let the dog out of the cage to run free - then put the dog back in the cage and call him BAD DOG)... so fricken funny. And TVF members who join in with this absurdity by Thai Immigration and call people names for doing only what was allowed and facilitated at the time are even more duplicitous than Thai Immigration.

I've highlighted in red why I believe your assertion that Thailand is reneging on the treaty is not accurate...

If they are (believed to be) working, they are not tourists. If they are not tourists, Thailand is not reneging on the deal.

[ThailandLOS]

Putin gonna invade Thailand too?

No, he doesn't have the necessary US expertise in undermining governments and staging civil wars to fully take over a country.

Btw, I wonder if the yanks would react if Russia was standing in Cuba on their doorstep. Oh right.....that already happened and we missed WWIII by an inch.

[axact]

Russians?? Hold on while I switch on part of me that gives a damn............... FAILED

When they refuse entry to citizens of your country expect the same response to your complaining post.

Actually I wonder if Thailand banned racist farangs whether there would be any members of Thaivisa left ????

I hope Immigration do read this forum, they need a laugh now & then. Must be a scream in the mornings at immigration when they see all these supposedly superior farangs complaining about everything, should be an automatic deportation for being such dickheads, most Thais if they read these forums would also agree with deportation.

As an ad for the west a lot of TV posters are doing a great job at deterring Thais from wanting to live there, a more miserable complaining whining unhappy bunch of intellectually challenged idiots give the west a bad name. Please go home and do all your complaining in a country that is yours and cares even less (if thats possible) than those here do about your misguided opinions. I will, along with many Thais will wave you goodbye from the airport.

Newsflash. No one cares about your racist opinions and as you are in a country that puts up with you do not be surprised that they dont like you, jeez most normal Westerners wouldn't like you.

[h90]

Putin gonna invade Thailand too?

Seems to me he already is.

Step 1: Make sure there are more Russians than Thais in Thailand (this step is already halfway completed).

Step 2: Enforce a public vote (incl. the Russians in Thailand) to see if Thailand should be part of Russia or independent.

Step 2: would be: Make sure that salaries, social security, pensions, hospitals, safety etc etc etc is a lot better in Russia than in Thailand so even most of the Thais vote for a better life.....

(Ukraine was total broken while Russia was doing relative well)

[whybother]

Russians?? Hold on while I switch on part of me that gives a damn............... FAILED

When they refuse entry to citizens of your country expect the same response to your complaining post.

Actually I wonder if Thailand banned racist farangs whether there would be any members of Thaivisa left ????

I hope Immigration do read this forum, they need a laugh now & then. Must be a scream in the mornings at immigration when they see all these supposedly superior farangs complaining about everything, should be an automatic deportation for being such dickheads, most Thais if they read these forums would also agree with deportation.

As an ad for the west a lot of TV posters are doing a great job at deterring Thais from wanting to live there, a more miserable complaining whining unhappy bunch of intellectually challenged idiots give the west a bad name. Please go home and do all your complaining in a country that is yours and cares even less (if thats possible) than those here do about your misguided opinions. I will, along with many Thais will wave you goodbye from the airport.

Newsflash. No one cares about your racist opinions and as you are in a country that puts up with you do not be surprised that they dont like you, jeez most normal Westerners wouldn't like you.

They are refusing entry to citizens of many countries. Russians aren't being singled out.

... and last I checked, you don't have to be in Thailand to post on ThaiVisa.

[yellowboat]

Most business people would agree that once you start upsetting customers, getting them back is very difficult. What upsets customers the most are unhappy surprises.

Turning away a few Russians could be called discretionary. Turning away more than that, implies discrimination.

Given the copious amount of accommodations in Thailand, one would think that there would be coordination between immigration, TAT and those providing accommodation.

[GentlemanJim]

<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

So how exactly is the Russian government 'hitting back'? What a piece of garbage journalism.

Need some glasses?

“According to Paragraph 1 of a bilateral intergovernmental agreement [between Russia and Thailand], Russian tourists are allowed to enter Thailand for up to 30 days, after which they must leave the country, [but] the number of entries is not limited.”

i.e. they can do in and outs as many times as they wish.

I think the point trying to be made is that this is a badly written article and the headline implies a course of action being taken by the Russian Government, when in fact there appears to be nothing other than a comment stating the obvious.

[whybother]

It's pretty simple really. If you are staying here longer term, then you need the appropriate visa. Even if you're staying here long term as a tourist, you still need the appropriate visa. Doing a number of In-Out border runs implies that you are staying in Thailand long term without the appropriate visa.

And that is relevant regardless of what nationality you are.

[joebrown]

A couple of days ago I renewed my Retirement Extension at Jomtien Immigration, as I have each Sepember for the last 3 years. My previous visit was mid July to obtain a re-entry permit. In July it seemed quieter, but this week I hardly recognised the place! No long queues, no need to squeeze in through the entrance door into a mass of bodies to get a queue card number. This was at 08.30hrs and when I collected my passport at 15.00hrs the office was barely 25% occupied. A colleague also made the same comment when he went there the previous day. I was told it's Low Season, but this was a lot, lot quiter than previous Septembers. If this trend continues, it won't be just restaurant, hotel and other tourist service staff made redundant, some of the staff in Soi 5 will soon be looking for alternative employment! Could well be that the NCPO/Immigration have 'shot themselves in the foot' with the work permit/visa crackdown

[whybother]

I wonder whether it will make any difference to the immigration officers? If someone pointed out to them that the Russian government said Russian citizens could come into Thailand as often as they want, does anyone really think that the immigration officer would change their mind?

[orosee]

So how exactly is the Russian government 'hitting back'? What a piece of garbage journalism.

Need some glasses?

According to Paragraph 1 of a bilateral intergovernmental agreement [between Russia and Thailand], Russian tourists are allowed to enter Thailand for up to 30 days, after which they must leave the country, [but] the number of entries is not limited.

i.e. they can do in and outs as many times as they wish.

Yeah that's not what most people understand when they read "hit back."

That's like literally getting hit in the face and "retaliating" by saying "you're not supposed to do that."

So the poster is quite right, a sensationalist headline with nothing to back it up in the text. Garbage journalism.

OK, let's get this straight. For you, "hitting back" is a literal thing, not figuratively.

In "Diplomacy", publicly pointing out inaccuracies in what the people on the opposite side think/say/do IS "hitting back".

For you, "hitting back" means Putin should invade and annex Thailand in response to the Thai's ignoring a clause in an agreement made between the two countries? Is that right? Is that "hitting back" enough?

Nope, you're wrong.

Also, obvious strawman is obvious strawman.

[cyborgx]

So how exactly is the Russian government 'hitting back'? What a piece of garbage journalism.

Need some glasses?

“According to Paragraph 1 of a bilateral intergovernmental agreement [between Russia and Thailand], Russian tourists are allowed to enter Thailand for up to 30 days, after which they must leave the country, [but] the number of entries is not limited.”

i.e. they can do in and outs as many times as they wish.

Yes, if they are TOURISTS! If Thai immigration believe they are not, then this sentence in their agreement does not apply.... Yawn, here we go again....

[blazes]

good to see a western country standing up for it's citizens

wish mine would

Western Country, do you need a map?

He means "white"....

[yellowboat]

It's pretty simple really. If you are staying here longer term, then you need the appropriate visa. Even if you're staying here long term as a tourist, you still need the appropriate visa. Doing a number of In-Out border runs implies that you are staying in Thailand long term without the appropriate visa.

And that is relevant regardless of what nationality you are.

Simple ? No... It has not been easy these days to get the appropriate visas. Also when stopped at immigration, officers will not or cannot tell you what visa you need.