Rights group arranges lawyers for Myanmar men

[draftvader]

I was somewhat sure they had used Singapore because they came back with the declaration that the Semen was Asian. which indicates a high tech lab was involved, also the results were not instant like the other results later on.

It really seems to me that they started out with a genuine investigation but when the headman's family became implicated. Things changed around pretty fast.

Not so. RTP Forensics Lab came up with Asians (2). Police, declining FBI help, then said samples would be sent to Singapore for further testing to determine skin,hair, eye colour and height

Did they ever send them? Possibly not. What is the name of the Singapore Lab??

RTP haven't really been forthcoming with information that might put them back on the hook.

[jimbeam1]

Come on everyone on TV .. if you want to be sure about this then we need 10,000 sigs to move on it to petition the British Embassy and British government for another independent investigation, all people want is real justice and closure for David and Hannahs families, that means 100% without doubt .... get enough voices and the UK gov will have to open an investigation if they havnt already behind closed doors.

We can make a difference for once, all it takes are for good people to do something....

https://www.change.org/p/the-government-of-the-united-kingdom-independently-investigate-the-horrific-murders-of-hannah-witheridge-and-david-miller#share

Please Moderators im asking you on behalf of many do the right thing and let this link stay.

When I attempt to get to change.org site, it comes up in Thai, not sure what the fields are for, I want to sign but not sure how to get the petition bit in English? Can somebody pls tell me, thanks, Commo

There is a dropdown-box at the bottom right of the page, there you can select the language.

I had the same problem. Sorted it by going into addons and downloading google translator. I use firefox. Worked OK for me.

Don't give up.

jb1

[StealthEnergiser]

I have read every post in every thread Re this topic but haven't posted as I have had nothing concrete to contribute.

However my wife (Thai) has just now read on social media, in Thai script, that an employee of the Samuii airport has found a record of the village headman (pooyai baan) catching a plane on the morning of the murder, but as we know he was always on the island. They believe that it was the son, Worat, the psycopathic murderous rapist and that the police actually advised him to do this (and not too clever an idea, as usual). It is posted on CSI LA, facebook.

If this is the case then someone should be able to get hold of cctv footage from that airport, the airport of arrival, Donsak pier or any other point on Samuii. And his phone records would also show his location; can phone records be accessed by subpeona? I do know PI's in Thailand can and do bribe phone company employees regularly to obtain phone records so hopeful that defense lawyers of the accused will get them one way or another.

The outrage amongst normal, honest and law-abiding Thais is palpable and I am hopeful some in the know will put aside their fear of gangsters and put evidence out there.

When the truth is known I do hope RTP (and all things Thai) apologists such as beetlejuice will take off their rose tinted specs and see past their family member's police connections and see how rotten the Thai system is.

Cheers.

let's hope some video evidence is found .

[jimbeam1]

Rights group arranges lawyers for Myanmar men
Pravit Rojanaphruk,
Suwannee Bunditsak
The Sunday Nation

Putting all bickering aside for a while and to save me going through 20+ pages. Do we have any positive news on the OP, which is what this post is supposed to be about.

jb1

[heyexile]

Rights group arranges lawyers for Myanmar men

Pravit Rojanaphruk,

Suwannee Bunditsak

The Sunday Nation

Putting all bickering aside for a while and to save me going through 20+ pages. Do we have any positive news on the OP, which is what this post is supposed to be about.

jb1

Yes news we have but not positive. See #568

Mission could not gain access to accused migrants today as Samui Prison visits not poss after 3 pm. They will try again 2mrw am. .

More Myanmar workers now reporting police violence during interrorgations.

Khaosed Eng editorial requests independent DNA tests.

All the above and more, see link:

http://twitter.com/Atomicalandy

[lausie]

If they do manage to get access to the men tomorrow morning, is there any chance they would be able to take a DNA sample from them? Perhaps unofficially if necessary (here, blow your nose into this hanky, kind of thing).

I'll be damned if UK forensics didn't take their own swabs from Hannah's body once it was repatriated...this could be an opportunity to cross reference.

[Anthony5]

If they do manage to get access to the men tomorrow morning, is there any chance they would be able to take a DNA sample from them? Perhaps unofficially if necessary (here, blow your nose into this hanky, kind of thing).

I'll be damned if UK forensics didn't take their own swabs from Hannah's body once it was repatriated...this could be an opportunity to cross reference.

Of course they will able to do that, and without doubt that will also be their priority, but I wonder how the conspiracy theorists on this forum will respond IF the DNA results match.

They will also be granted access tomorrow since the eyes of the whole world are pointed on this.

Keep in mind, Thailand is known for corruption, but they are not comparable with Iran or N-Korea regarding human rights.

Edited October 6, 2014 by Anthony5

[i claudius]

While not trusting the police here ,we must remember the whole world is watching ,and a large amount of tourism is riding on this ,do we think the govt (army) would be stupid enough to allow a stich up to be perputrated? bearing in mind that i am sure the British govt will want to make sure all is above board its one thing not doing anything about the red bull guy who "only" killed a Thai policeman ,while two tourists were killed and if it was done by some "mafia" guys son ,who in the scope of things is ,nothing to those in charge and the vast amount of tourist cash at stake.

[lausie]

If they do manage to get access to the men tomorrow morning, is there any chance they would be able to take a DNA sample from them? Perhaps unofficially if necessary (here, blow your nose into this hanky, kind of thing).

I'll be damned if UK forensics didn't take their own swabs from Hannah's body once it was repatriated...this could be an opportunity to cross reference.

Of course they will able to do that, and without doubt that will also be their priority, but I wonder how the conspiracy theorists on this forum will respond IF the DNA results match.

They will also be granted access tomorrow since the eyes of the whole world are pointed on this.

Keep in mind, Thailand is known for corruption, but they are not comparable with Iran or N-Korea regarding human rights.

If UK forensics are satisfied that the DNA found inside the victim was not tampered with post-mortem, and if they are satisfied that it matches the DNA of the Burmese acused, then I will accept they have caught the rapist(s). They will then need to prove beyond reasonable doubt that they are also guilty of the murder.

Personally, I don't think it will be a match but, if it is, I'll stand corrected.

[Smurkster]

I was very encouraged today by reading that a lot of my Thai friends had posted links for this petition on their Facebook....the smart informed Thais are sickened by this situation as well

[inutil]

If they do manage to get access to the men tomorrow morning, is there any chance they would be able to take a DNA sample from them? Perhaps unofficially if necessary (here, blow your nose into this hanky, kind of thing).

I'll be damned if UK forensics didn't take their own swabs from Hannah's body once it was repatriated...this could be an opportunity to cross reference.

Of course they will able to do that, and without doubt that will also be their priority, but I wonder how the conspiracy theorists on this forum will respond IF the DNA results match.

They will also be granted access tomorrow since the eyes of the whole world are pointed on this.

Keep in mind, Thailand is known for corruption, but they are not comparable with Iran or N-Korea regarding human rights.

I would imagine theyd say "oh, wow... how the hell... but... theyre like half the size of him?... what?... how on earth did they even do this? and seriously? They raped her and did that to her face because they saw them kissing and cuddling?... what the hell kind of motive is that? These dudes are clearly psychopaths. Glad theyre locked up"

Now how about your turn, what would the hang en high brigade say when it turns out that the DNA (at the second bite) was falsified (if at all tested), and that these guys clearly, despite all the prompting for the media didnt in fact have a clue what the hell they were supposed to be doing in that reconstruction despite the clear guiding hand of the RTP?

Will it be something like

Well of course they didnt do it. Did you see the size of them? What kind of ridiculous fantasist scenario would have these two tiny dudes take on a dude twice their size because they got 'horny' whilst the girl lay there completely passive and not in any way attempting to escape or raise an alarm? Was she drugged or something? Who the hell drugged her? Obviously not these dudes since this was apparently an opportunist spur of the moment thing if you believe the laughable notion that rape is about sex and not at all about power. And what kind of power would they have against what appears to be a GIANT of a man (if we're talking stature)? Lucky that hoe was around to bash his head in (despite no dna being present from the male victim on the 'murder weapon') and rape the stranger girl theyd never met instead of maybe picking on a couple of random girls or just going home like most people and having a wank because theyre not psychopaths who respond to their sexual urges with an orgy of unrestrained violence. Was this the first time they got horny? Obviously not. How strange then that anyone could or would choose to believe such complete and total bullshit based on nothing more than some kind of Stanley Millgram knee jerk response that because someone in a uniform told them it was true, it must be true. Did they not apply that education they received as a child or were they just always that stupid?

I ask out of deep contrition because i cant for the life of me understand why i would swallow such a bag of ridiculous ? I must have been on drugs or trolling. I was probably just trolling though because who the hell cares if two innocent people end up dead based on the flimsiest of fabricated stories. Its just the internet. Im off to laugh at my genius in suckering you morans into some spurious debate about how youre all obsessed about phones, motives, weapons, fingerprints, dna tests, stories about people fleeing from the BiB who actually turned out to be standing in a queue smiling as they submitted their DNA for testing in the first few days of this investigation. How stupid you all must feel for even listening to me. Thus i win the internet!

Edited October 6, 2014 by inutil

[Anthony5]

If they do manage to get access to the men tomorrow morning, is there any chance they would be able to take a DNA sample from them? Perhaps unofficially if necessary (here, blow your nose into this hanky, kind of thing).

I'll be damned if UK forensics didn't take their own swabs from Hannah's body once it was repatriated...this could be an opportunity to cross reference.

Of course they will able to do that, and without doubt that will also be their priority, but I wonder how the conspiracy theorists on this forum will respond IF the DNA results match.

They will also be granted access tomorrow since the eyes of the whole world are pointed on this.

Keep in mind, Thailand is known for corruption, but they are not comparable with Iran or N-Korea regarding human rights.

If UK forensics are satisfied that the DNA found inside the victim was not tampered with post-mortem, and if they are satisfied that it matches the DNA of the Burmese acused, then I will accept they have caught the rapist(s). They will then need to prove beyond reasonable doubt that they are also guilty of the murder.

Personally, I don't think it will be a match but, if it is, I'll stand corrected.

When they have the rapists, they have the murderers as well, there is no doubt around that.

If the DNA tests match or not will have to be seen, but I guess it will not take very long anymore before those results will show up.

The only thing that angers me is those ridiculous conspiracy theories about the phones.

Do those people really think the police doesn't recall anymore what they have reported about the phones 3 weeks ago ?

To think that the police today will claim they found a phone somewhere which they 3 weeks ago reported with pictures and all that they handed it over to the family, one must be really brain dead.

[inutil]

Would that be the same phone that was caught on camera in the room with the evidence? So your turn, whose phone was that in the clip then that looks exactly like David's phone and i believe was stated as such by the friend standing in the background of that report and who left the island long before it turned up again smashed by a dude who clearly didnt comprehend that a) it was evidence against him, and it was worth money to him unsmashed if thats why he took it? Riddle me this batman.

[littlebw]

<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

If they do manage to get access to the men tomorrow morning, is there any chance they would be able to take a DNA sample from them? Perhaps unofficially if necessary (here, blow your nose into this hanky, kind of thing).

I'll be damned if UK forensics didn't take their own swabs from Hannah's body once it was repatriated...this could be an opportunity to cross reference.

Of course they will able to do that, and without doubt that will also be their priority, but I wonder how the conspiracy theorists on this forum will respond IF the DNA results match.

They will also be granted access tomorrow since the eyes of the whole world are pointed on this.

Keep in mind, Thailand is known for corruption, but they are not comparable with Iran or N-Korea regarding human rights.

If UK forensics are satisfied that the DNA found inside the victim was not tampered with post-mortem, and if they are satisfied that it matches the DNA of the Burmese acused, then I will accept they have caught the rapist(s). They will then need to prove beyond reasonable doubt that they are also guilty of the murder.

Pers

When they have the rapists, they have the murderers as well, there is no doubt around that.

not necessarily

what happens if it was a group and 2 of them were invited to rape Hannah by say 1 other group member who had lost face due to Hannah and David , who then with helped killed then both?

what happens if the 2 Burmese raped Hannah when she was dead?

Just cos they raped her doesnt mean they killed her

[heyexile]

If they do manage to get access to the men tomorrow morning, is there any chance they would be able to take a DNA sample from them? Perhaps unofficially if necessary (here, blow your nose into this hanky, kind of thing).

I'll be damned if UK forensics didn't take their own swabs from Hannah's body once it was repatriated...this could be an opportunity to cross reference.

Of course they will able to do that, and without doubt that will also be their priority, but I wonder how the conspiracy theorists on this forum will respond IF the DNA results match.

They will also be granted access tomorrow since the eyes of the whole world are pointed on this.

Keep in mind, Thailand is known for corruption, but they are not comparable with Iran or N-Korea regarding human rights.

If you visit a Thai prison or Thai Police Detention facility you will know that any physical contact or exchange of items is not allowed. They don`t stick you in a cosy little office for a nice private chat!

The Myanmar consular officials may have more chance as they cant be denied access.

Don`t be too sure UK has original samples. Corpses were reportedly frozen prior to repatriation which could degrade evidence anyway. David`s funeral has already taken place, RIP. The mystery Lab in Singapore? Right, what is its name again?

Do you include Mr Hall in with Conspiracy Theorists? Or chairman of Thai NHRC? Or Thai Chairperson of CCF?Or BBC SE Asean Correspondent? Khaosod English running an editorial calling for independent tests now. With confessions who needs DNA evidence anyway. If it can be reliably and independently proven to match, then I will applaud the RTP who have been working under pressure and with more media attention than usual.

http://twitter.com/Atomicalandy

[intune53]

Does this video contain statements from the official pathologist confirming a third as yet unidentified (at least publically anyway) suspect?

Posted by dogmatix on #272 in http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/766048-police-address-criticisms-over-koh-tao-arrest-of-myanmar-suspects/page-11#entry8494264

This puts into question who did what and must be pivotal for the two suspects currently detained.

video here:-

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iZ_1WfVs7RY

Dogmatix says (the pathologist) "said that DNA of B and a third person C was found on Hannah's nipples. The third person was not David. The policeman didn't explain who the police thought C was or how he came to deposit his DNA on Hannah's nipples."

[bunglebag]

If they do manage to get access to the men tomorrow morning, is there any chance they would be able to take a DNA sample from them? Perhaps unofficially if necessary (here, blow your nose into this hanky, kind of thing).

I'll be damned if UK forensics didn't take their own swabs from Hannah's body once it was repatriated...this could be an opportunity to cross reference.

Of course they will able to do that, and without doubt that will also be their priority, but I wonder how the conspiracy theorists on this forum will respond IF the DNA results match.

They will also be granted access tomorrow since the eyes of the whole world are pointed on this.

Keep in mind, Thailand is known for corruption, but they are not comparable with Iran or N-Korea regarding human rights.

If UK forensics are satisfied that the DNA found inside the victim was not tampered with post-mortem, and if they are satisfied that it matches the DNA of the Burmese acused, then I will accept they have caught the rapist(s). They will then need to prove beyond reasonable doubt that they are also guilty of the murder.

Personally, I don't think it will be a match but, if it is, I'll stand corrected.

When they have the rapists, they have the murderers as well, there is no doubt around that.

If the DNA tests match or not will have to be seen, but I guess it will not take very long anymore before those results will show up.

The only thing that angers me is those ridiculous conspiracy theories about the phones.

Do those people really think the police doesn't recall anymore what they have reported about the phones 3 weeks ago ?

To think that the police today will claim they found a phone somewhere which they 3 weeks ago reported with pictures and all that they handed it over to the family, one must be really brain dead.

Why do you say there is no doubt that the rapists are also the murderers?

Edited October 6, 2014 by bunglebag

[i claudius]

Littlebw

"what if they raped her after she was dead"?

so these two guys came on her bloodied corpse and decided to have sex with it?

can i have some of what your smoking?

[Dogmatix]

Littlebw

"what if they raped her after she was dead"?

so these two guys came on her bloodied corpse and decided to have sex with it?

can i have some of what your smoking?

If you look at the pictures of Hannah's body, there seem to be three possibilities. One of them killed her immediately after the second (or third) one had raped her. One of them killed her before both (or all) of them raped her. One of them killed her while the second (or third) was in process of raping her. Her body is left spread eagled which makes it clear that rape had just taken place either posthumously or otherwise, unless they took pleasure in arranging her like that after killing her. May they both (all) burn in hell.

Edited October 7, 2014 by Dogmatix

[changnaam]

I am guessing that the lawyers will have to be from Thailand, but represent the Myanmar "suspects" ( I use this word rather lightly). Will it be Thai lawyers with Myanmar Lawyers observing?

Also have they pushed for access to the 3rd suspect, who I imagine is either a very bad way and they cannot reveal him, or they are trying to find someone else to take his place as they went too far?

[Asiantravel]

Amnesty International demands inquiry into allegations of torture of suspects

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/asia/thailand-murders-amnesty-demands-inquiry-into-allegations-of-torture-of-suspects-9780876.html

[GanDoonToonPet]

The video is available to watch on the csi la Facebook page. You'll see a few copies of the video including one where the contrast has been altered which makes it much clearer. There is definitely someone in front.

The question is who is that person and why was the video cut (albeit badly) so as to remove him?

When the police, in any country, release CCCV footage of a suspect they only show footage of the suspect. They don't show footage before & after of people who are not of interest to the investigation. I would have thought this to be obvious, to a westerner, from both experience & education.

[lausie]

The video is available to watch on the csi la Facebook page. You'll see a few copies of the video including one where the contrast has been altered which makes it much clearer. There is definitely someone in front.

The question is who is that person and why was the video cut (albeit badly) so as to remove him?

When the police, in any country, release CCCV footage of a suspect they only show footage of the suspect. They don't show footage before & after of people who are not of interest to the investigation. I would have thought this to be obvious, to a westerner, from both experience & education.

Is that right? Are you trained in law and/or policing or did you just make up this crock of sh*t?

Oh, and I assume you mean CCTV.

[bertty]

The video is available to watch on the csi la Facebook page. You'll see a few copies of the video including one where the contrast has been altered which makes it much clearer. There is definitely someone in front.

The question is who is that person and why was the video cut (albeit badly) so as to remove him?

When the police, in any country, release CCCV footage of a suspect they only show footage of the suspect. They don't show footage before & after of people who are not of interest to the investigation. I would have thought this to be obvious, to a westerner, from both experience & education.

Is that right? Are you trained in law and/or policing or did you just make up this crock of sh*t?

Oh, and I assume you mean CCTV.

Actually that is quite funny. Removing footage of someone who has come from the same direction at the same time. Because they are not considered a suspect.

And indeed how can one be a suspect when one was in Bangkok at the time of the incident.. To much Doctor Who.

[lausie]

For anyone interested, the CSI LA page spotted that Sean McAnna uploaded two songs to Soundcloud on 4th October, so it looks like he's alive, unless someone has access to his stuff - https://soundcloud.com/seanmcanna

There are some interesting lyrics in the track 'Johnny' - 1:38 "I'm still waiting at the hotel bar. They beg of you, but they don't need you, still they won't let you go. And I, I, so near so far...'. Might be nothing, but could be a message in there somewhere.

[SLESQ]

This morning, MWRN's international affairs advisor Andy Hall, accompanied by HRDF's Mahachai project coordinator Aye Mar Cho and also Heidi Anna, visited Koh Tao case defendants Zaw Lin and Wei Phyo at Koh Samui prison.

This visit was MWRN's first since 12th January during which past time MWRN however continued to organise, supported by MWRN's Justice: Koh Tao case fundraiser, for 3 visits a week to the guys by our Koh Samui network.

Today we met Zaw Lin and Wei Phyo primarily as a humanitarian visit to check their health and welfare, so as to give them a chance to engage outsiders and provide them emotional support. But we could also update them on the ongoing and extensive work of the Koh Tao defence team lawyers in Bangkok and the situations of their families, especially Wei Phyo's father, in Myanmar. We informed Wei Phyo that his father and mother were being provided a lot of support and all operation costs for his sick father, who is now conscious, eating and speaking, were covered. We could also inform both guys of how the Rakhine migrant community in Thailand is currently supporting both of their families with money every month to make up for the temporary loss of a child breadwinner.

After the visit, MWRN was able to deposit some donated books, Facebook support messages and letters for the guys. In addition, we could show the guys all the Facebook letters and donated books during the visit. MWRN also deposited funds into the guys prison bank accounts, one of which was running quite low in cash, and we purchased for them water, mama and canned fish.

During today's visit, both guys looks visibly healthy and strong. Both smiled and laughed throughout. In contrast to the other prisoners around, both wore new matching Lanna style clean and smart looking shirts they said they purchased inside the prison recently for 120 baht each. Wei Phyo had sown on the left side of his new t-shirt a beautiful dove, and when asked about it, said it was a symbol of hope and also joked with smiles that it was too a symbol that he wanted to fly away from his existing situation. Zaw Lin had sown on the left hand side of his shirt only his name.

Today we had a good chance to chat and exchange with both of the accused on their feelings and reflections.

Zaw Lin and Wei Phyo have now been incarcerated for almost 150 days in Koh Samui prison and, although they said they remained strong and healthy in body and mind and they said prison is not a big deal for men like them, they both said they still find the incarceration challenging at times and they want to be out of the prison as soon as possible, particularly as both insist that even though they were not perfect sons, they were not involved in any way in the heinous Koh Tao murders. Both said being in prison was the worst experience in their lives.

However, both guys said that because of all the support and regular visits they have received since their initial incarceration from so many different people, and all the letters, drawings, pictures and Facebook print outs they received, as well as Myanmar reading books and learning English language books, stationary and note pads, they had managed to avoid too much depression or stress inside the prison and keep up hope and strength for a future with their families back in Myanmar.

Both Zaw Lin and Wei Phyo said today they would never give up hope of freedom, truth and justice and would indeed fight both for the dignity especially of their parents but also their country. Both said that if not for the support they had received, they would surely have already lost hope in ever returning to see their families and country again. Both insisted they are sure they will soon be free of this existing nightmare when justice is achieved in their case.

Zaw Lin and Wei Phyo today talked about poor translators during their arrest and interrogation by police as well as physical abuse as being the main cause of their wrongful detention and prosecution. However, both insisted it was their karma to be in this poor position and they importantly did not want to blame any particular individual for the wrong that has already befallen them.

Both Zaw Lin and Wei Phyo said they longed for the day to be able to tell the truth and speak up by themselves, as for now they have been wrongfully silenced. They said they are dedicated to find justice from this case and their recent challenging experiences.

Both guys said that whilst some people strongly believed in their innocence and some may think they were actually guilty, they were both certain that a greater being knows for certain they were not involved in the killings.

Zaw Lin and Wei Phyo said that in jail, they had also met and spoke to people, including many from Myanmar, who were not bad people and heard stories from prisoners who alleged it was actually bad people outside of prison that resulted in them being incarcerated and unable to speak out for truth and justice too. Both guys said they received as much important support from people inside the prison as they did from people outside.

Zaw Lin and Wei Phyo both stressed how grateful they both were for all the support and understanding they have in the past and still now received from others.=